Endgame PVPers: I challenge you

[Yich]

Time and time again I see Endgame PvP regulars claiming how hard their level is to PvP at. I respectfully disagree. I trust it is difficult to be the best, but no less difficult than low level. If you don't agree, think about it.

To be the VERY best endgame PVP regular for your level, you must beat everyone who claims to be better, in a fair fight. The same goes for low level. If you want to be the best, you have to beat the best. Once you beat the best you have to keep getting better to stay the best. If your level is so much more difficult, you should be able to come to low level and destroy everyone, no?

Oh but it COSTS soooo much more. I call BS on that. I have a free angel set that most endgamers use. Free. There are no good free items in low level. GF on the cost portion.

Oh but we have soooo many skills to use! An endgame player can miss one, two and if they are lucky three skills from range and still win the fight. Generally, when a low level player misses from range, it's game over. Nice button jamming, endgame. (that means you just press a bunch of buttons).

Endgame IS difficult but do not think that you do the hardest. No level is the hardest.

If you disagree, come try out level 17. We shall see how easy it is. Quit knocking the twinks, endgame.

[zappaxe]

ahem…challenge accepted. add extracting ;)

[DanielRH]

Accepted, add hostilian, wyldwood, twinkking, jadetwink and angeliceaglet :-)

[Lowlyspy]

You just opened a can of worms you are going to regret. I'll prepare the funeral service.

[Matutd]

I wish I still had chubbyarcher -.-

[Subscriber]

Yeah, endgame is easy right?

[Advicatus]

Oh mai gawd! Endgamerzz are 1337 d00d. Low lvl iz 4 n00bs! *slurp swallow*
Derp endgame isn't easy, but low level is insane to just jump into.
Challenge accepted.
Vveird, snakke, call, swag, and 16 other twinks.

[Whirlzap]

Sunblawks.

GG.

[TruePlayer]

Time and time again I see Endgame PvP regulars claiming how hard their level is to PvP at. I respectfully disagree. I trust it is difficult to be the best, but no less difficult than low level. If you don't agree, think about it.

To be the VERY best endgame PVP regular for your level, you must beat everyone who claims to be better, in a fair fight. The same goes for low level. If you want to be the best, you have to beat the best. Once you beat the best you have to keep getting better to stay the best. If your level is so much more difficult, you should be able to come to low level and destroy everyone, no?

Oh but it COSTS soooo much more. I call BS on that. I have a free angel set that most endgamers use. Free. There are no good free items in low level. GF on the cost portion.

Oh but we have soooo many skills to use! An endgame player can miss one, two and if they are lucky three skills from range and still win the fight. Generally, when a low level player misses from range, it's game over. Nice button jamming, endgame. (that means you just press a bunch of buttons).

Endgame IS difficult but do not think that you do the hardest. No level is the hardest.

If you disagree, come try out level 17. We shall see how easy it is. Quit knocking the twinks, endgame.

I like a good challenge but if you want to challenge a
Pro endgame pvper. You prob need wait for one more upate. Endgame mostly r players who been around and is suited with the best vanities and gear. So its a 50% vanities 50% skill vs a no vanities you prob wont just win with your skills alone. also for endgame player to go down to a low lvl pvp prob wont be that hard for them because if your pro in endgame you r use to kiting rushing high damage etc. endgame pvp is prob the best most strategy use so honest i dont even bother with twinks because less skills mean less strategy. There alot stuff about low lvl twinks being best pvpers in game is basicly just nonsense and kids who just self promote. Here a challenge for you cap every lvl and come to endgame and pvp then you see what pvp really is.

[Noodleleg]

I'm ready!
Ign: Noodlelef
Already beating people with this angel set =) People bullying me with crafted sets (I had l61 Lilth Wand Set) is now over! Equal gear! Fair fight!

[DanielRH]

Guys, he's not challenging for end game, he's challenging for 17 pvp.

And while twinkking is hard, end game is also. To do it correctly takes some work. I believe their hard in different ways. Being active in both, their equally as hard I think.

[Rare]

Ahhh. Anyone want to raise their kill count? Maybe I'll try it again.

I have an awesome 2/1 D/K

[Arsenal]

honestly ive never seen anyone say endgame is harder than twinking, but why dont you lvl a char to max and see what you can do at endgame?

[Ixillicus]

^^

You call out end-gamers and say come fight me at this level. Return the favor.

[Piosidon]

The reason why endgame pvp is hard is because it relies entirely on luck and according to your statement, twinking relies on hit.

[CrimsonTider]

Does it really matter??

"I'm the best!!" "I'm the richest!!" "I have more plat!!" "I have more teeth!" "I spend more of my parent's money!!"

Blah... blah.... blah...

[Glad]

Who says end-game PvP is hard? It's easy. As Crim says, does it matter? Blah, blah, blah.

[Glad]

^^

You call out end-gamers and say come fight me at this level. Return the favor.

Yup, what a newb.

[plmafiaboss]

Guys, he's not challenging for end game, he's challenging for 17 pvp.

And while twinkking is hard, end game is also. To do it correctly takes some work. I believe their hard in different ways. Being active in both, their equally as hard I think.in that case ...

Yich whats ur low lvls ign ill fight. Add namelesssbird and truebadd

[Yich]

^^

You call out end-gamers and say come fight me at this level. Return the favor.
Free power leveling to 17. Trust me it doesn't take long. If they want to claim it's easy, then half the challenge is getting gear. If they can't get that half down than they have no chance and therefore no reason to say they have the hardest level to PVP at. I personally think every level is difficult to be good at, but with the new free gear for nearly every level 66, endgame just lost half the challenge it had. Getting the gear. Unfortunately, low level did not receive free gear. I DO have a high level account, but if you wish to challenge me to come to high level, make your own thread...

and @Piosidon if it relies on luck, then they are entirely in the wrong when they say it is "hard". That's like saying it's hard to flip a coin and land on heads...

[Yich]

Plmafiaboss my level seventeen is named "Imp". I am commonly underrated, but I do not mind. I also use "Improving". Entertaining, I would like to put a few endgamers in their place, specifically Hateraptor, is he ever tries to succeed in low level... If quite a few endgamers do accept the challenge, I will try out Endgame PVP with my level 66 mage.

EDIT: double post... sorry.

[Entertaining]

Low level pvp definitely takes more skill...end of story...gf

[WarTornBird]

Ya know yich you should never use specifics on the forums with the whole name thing. Who cares if hateraptor is talking trash? I'm PRETTY sure none of us do and besides calling out people only leads to the flames.
Be sure to keep whatever business you have with hateraptor to your self and him. Like I said 95% of DON'T care.

[Walkhardd]

Low level pvp definitely takes more skill...end of story...gf

I'm really curious to hear your reasoning.

[Zeus]

Low level pvp definitely takes more skill...end of story...gf

Surviving many high damage skills takes more skill. End of story, Gf.

I twink on my twinks for a week or two at most before I get bored and leave that level.

[Yich]

I was attempting to remember an example Wartornbird, as someone said they were pretty sure no one says Endgame is more difficult. With your logic though, a list of names of anyone to talk down low level would be counter-productive... Hmmmm....

[Entertaining]

I'm really curious to hear your reasoning.

In endgame pvp you could use 2 skills and kill the oponent...gf

[Entertaining]

Surviving many high damage skills takes more skill. End of story, Gf.

I twink on my twinks for a week or two at most before I get bored and leave that level.

Ya it takes alot of skill to equip angel gear and have 250 armor...gf

[Walkhardd]

I'm really curious to hear your reasoning.

In endgame pvp you could use 2 skills and kill the oponent...gf

you got 2 shotted at endgame, and went back to twinking?

[Entertaining]

you got 2 shotted at endgame, and went back to twinking?

Many people have gotten "2 shotted" which doesn't require skill. 7 drain and fire.....gf

[plmafiaboss]

Plmafiaboss my level seventeen is named "Imp". I am commonly underrated, but I do not mind. I also use "Improving". Entertaining, I would like to put a few endgamers in their place, specifically Hateraptor, is he ever tries to succeed in low level... If quite a few endgamers do accept the challenge, I will try out Endgame PVP with my level 66 mage.

EDIT: double post... sorry.i fought u back on my 15 ipvphavocpvpi .__. U dont remember me? And u wanna fight my 17?... Lol XDadd me already

[JTZ]

To everyone who thinks lower level pvp is harder, it's not. At higher levels you need to know how to do certain combos, have a good build, and use more strategy. At lower levels you have less skill points (less builds to choose from), cheaper items, and rely on luck. Thats why there are so many more rushers at lower levels than endgame. And I'd like to see you twinks who think lower level is harder go to level 70 and try to pvp. :)

[Zeus]

Ya it takes alot of skill to equip angel gear and have 250 armor...gf

Weapon and skill damage easily overcome the defense.

[Hahahahabirdy]

Many people have gotten "2 shotted" which doesn't require skill. 7 drain and fire.....gf

Im sorry to burst your little bubble but every single endgame pvper is not a mage.

[Zeus]

One more thing, twinking NEVER moves forward. It's like you're Peter Pan, stuck at L17 forever. How boring is that? Same game play, same weapons, no excitement. I think THAT is a majority of the reason of all the bitterness in low level PvP.

I don't want to play a game that never changes, if I wanted to, I'd play CoD all day for that.

[Entertaining]

Is it my fault that STS did not give every level a free set of armor. Also, new little tricks and builds are found all the time. New groups of players form and disband. Strategies are crafted and new players come in. Perhaps low level have less skills to focus on, but Endgame can't waltz on in to low level and succeed. I see it often, really.

[Zeus]

Is it my fault that STS did not give every level a free set of armor. Also, new little tricks and builds are found all the time. New groups of players form and disband. Strategies are crafted and new players come in. Perhaps low level have less skills to focus on, but Endgame can't waltz on in to low level and succeed. I see it often, really.

But those who PvPed from ground up can. I'll admit, twinking teaches you your skills, but end game teaches you to use them efficiently, all at the same time.

And bro, I used to twink too, for a while, I come back 6 months later and not much has changed. It changes A LOT slower than end game does. :/

[Advicatus]

Oh apollo!
Remember awhile back you played hero and rushed me on your 18 bird while I was rushing someone else. Then I brought my L20 bear Vveird and kept rushing you. So you asked for a 1v1. On that 1v1 I beat you 7-1 before you left. This is the prime example of endgame people thinking they're always best. I respect you apollo, but every now and again you find an endgame person that has money and tries pvp but doesn't work. If you don't believe me I'll name names haha.

[Zeus]

Oh apollo!
Remember awhile back you played hero and rushed me on your 18 bird while I was rushing someone else. Then I brought my L20 bear Vveird and kept rushing you. So you asked for a 1v1. On that 1v1 I beat you 7-1 before you left. This is the prime example of endgame people thinking they're always best. I respect you apollo, but every now and again you find an endgame person that has money and tries pvp but doesn't work. If you don't believe me I'll name names haha.


You used a L20 bear to kill a L18 bird and you rushed me originally. Please keep the theatrics in game. If you'd like to 1v1 on L20 bears, hit me up in game.

Also, a seasoned twinker vs one who just came out of retirement? Go figure.

Come to me end game, if you'd like. I'd rather not have my gaming life revolve around rage, stomp, hs, SMS.

How do I put this, advi? End game is more...sophisticated.

If you notice, nobody besides yourself and the OP is name calling. I don't know what your post was supposed to prove, but it's a pretty immature stance, not to mention a shallow one.

[Advicatus]

Apollo we did 1v1 on 20 bears.... Also I'm not "seasoned" at L20 bear. It's been basically retired since UT died.

[Zeus]

Apollo we did 1v1 on 20 bears.... Also I'm not "seasoned" at L20 bear. It's been basically retired since UT died.

And I'm retired since everybody switched to crossbows, way before.

[Entertaining]

But those who PvPed from ground up can. I'll admit, twinking teaches you your skills, but end game teaches you to use them efficiently, all at the same time.

And bro, I used to twink too, for a while, I come back 6 months later and not much has changed. It changes A LOT slower than end game does. :/
The rate at which pvp changes has nothing to do with the amount of skill it takes to kill your oponent...low lvl requires moreskill...end of story...gf


Oh an your little comment "end game teaches to use them efficiently" is false. In endgame pvp if you choose to use a certain skill at the wrong time it generally doesn't effect you as much as it does in low level.

[Zeus]

The rate at which pvp changes has nothing to do with the amount of skill it takes to kill your oponent...low lvl requires moreskill...end of story...gf

How does it take skill? You use your weapon, kite kite kite, stun with stomp, then you're done?

Twinking is popular because of aesthetics & accessibility.

[gundamsone]

This is entertaining and yich's strategy.

Team ---> Talk Big ---> Recruit Followers ---> Rush those who oppose

That's how I view them @ low lvl pvp.

No Skill Whatsoever, just 2 guys with big egos.

[Entertaining]

I would love to see you do that against me.

[Advicatus]

Never see you in game so, hey ent! Lawl.

Apollo, your L20 bears name?

[Entertaining]

This is entertaining and yich's strategy.

Team ---> Talk Big ---> Recruit Followers ---> Rush those who oppose

That's how I view them @ low lvl pvp.
Lol?....i don't "talk big"
And yes i do team people but it's not like I don't get teamed as well
As for "recruit followeres".....wtf?
No Skill Whatsoever, just 2 guys with big egos.

Lol?....I don't "talk big"
And yes i do team people at times but it's not like i don't get teamed as well
As for "recruit followers".....who are my "followers" exactly?...the guild i'm in has only 3 active members (including me)

[Entertaining]

Never see you in game so, hey ent! Lawl.

Apollo, your L20 bears name?

You don't see me in-game?....

[Zeus]

Never see you in game so, hey ent! Lawl.

Apollo, your L20 bears name?

Twinkilicious, I believe.

[Advicatus]

Ahh perfect, then I have the screenshot of the right person. And it's your bear in this 1v1, not your 18 bird.

[Zeus]

Ahh perfect, then I have the screenshot of the right person. And it's your bear in this 1v1, not your 18 bird.

Like I said, crossbow age. :)

Feel free to rematch if you'd like as I was rose wand and you were crossbow (6mm range vs 13mm)

[Advicatus]

No you never used rose, you used talon, and anyone who knows me knows I use sbl 90% of the time on 20. Then you swapped to xbow so I did too.

Plus roses are 10m

Plus plus why is it my fault what weapon you used?

Plus plus plus I even gave you my xbow at the end cause you were still using snipers haha.

[Walkhardd]

Why don't you guys take up drinks challenge, and fight him st different levels? Or do you only pvp with the nerd raging pre teens at <20 pvp?

end game "pros" would have a way easier time competing with you twinkers. Challenge anyone from unity or revelation. I'd be willing to bet you would lose 10-0.

[Mageprodigy]

Endgame is all on luck and gear :/

[Zeus]

No you never used rose, you used talon, and anyone who knows me knows I use sbl 90% of the time on 20. Then you swapped to xbow so I did too.

Plus roses are 10m

Plus plus why is it my fault what weapon you used?

Plus plus plus I even gave you my xbow at the end cause you were still using snipers haha.

Everybody knows I use rose. How are rose 10mm when you could kite with a SBL?

[Walkhardd]

Endgame is all on luck and gear :/

Then why do the same ppl always win? How did ghost own everyone using the crappy green plat set? How did I kill ppl using a 61 sang xbow? Luck? Lol.

[zappaxe]

I am quite a good lvl 15 pvper and I have to say endgame Pvp is LOADS harder than twinking
You say endgame is luck but the things that win you twinking is ALMOST all luck. Ex- crits, it is crits that usually win or lose a game in twinking. -combo, the bears combo with sbl is luck and is extremely powerfull and usually wins the game for you.
You are probably saying "dafuq iz dis nub talkin bout dees r in endgame too" but endgame requires skill, timing your heal,combos debuffs and more. I'm not bashing twinking. I twink more than endgame Pvp but I believe endgame requires more finesse and skill.

If there were any spelling mistakes I'm sorry I'm on iPhone sts app on an iPad -.-
And if anyone wants to challenge me 15-17 Pvp your welcome to. Add extracting

-Zappaxe

[Zeus]

Why don't you guys take up drinks challenge, and fight him st different levels? Or do you only pvp with the nerd raging pre teens at <20 pvp?

end game "pros" would have a way easier time competing with you twinkers. Challenge anyone from unity or revelation. I'd be willing to bet you would lose 10-0.

Lol, so during the L10 tourney, Bud vs Entertaining, guess who was winning? :D

[Walkhardd]

Why don't you guys take up drinks challenge, and fight him st different levels? Or do you only pvp with the nerd raging pre teens at <20 pvp?

end game "pros" would have a way easier time competing with you twinkers. Challenge anyone from unity or revelation. I'd be willing to bet you would lose 10-0.

Lol, so during the L10 tourney, Bud vs Entertaining, guess who was winning? :D

Lol..id like to see him fight bud at endgame. XD


Edit- I do agree it takes a TON of skill to auto>kite>stomp>sms>kite....

[Hahahahabirdy]

Lol, so during the L10 tourney, Bud vs Entertaining, guess who was winning? :D

At least 8 out of the 11 people left are endgame for sure.

[Mothwing]

I agree with pretty much everything Parth has said. Too bad there's not a "thank all of Parth's posts" button.

Yeah, Lowlyspy hit it. You are REALLY going to regret it :D

[Entertaining]

Why don't you guys take up drinks challenge, and fight him st different levels? Or do you only pvp with the nerd raging pre teens at <20 pvp?

end game "pros" would have a way easier time competing with you twinkers. Challenge anyone from unity or revelation. I'd be willing to bet you would lose 10-0.
I guarantee that i can beat any <unity> member in a game to 10

[Yich]

Lol, so during the L10 tourney, Bud vs Entertaining, guess who was winning? :D

Bud Vs. Entertaining. Very interesting. Let's take someone with +5 damage and +5 armor, put them at level 10 and pretend like they aren't completely overpowered. To say that the allowing of founder's in the tournament wasn't completely unfair is just lying. How about you bump that level 10 up to level 17, keep the founder's helmet on and see how it ends. Or after their tournament match they can play to 4 without a founders, to be sure no funny business goes on with screenshotting...

and @ hahahahabirdy, i think it's pretty obvious why... Endgame has more founders... If any endgame players wish to brag themselves up because they can use a founder's helmet to destroy any non founder at level 10, that is their choice but they must know how ridiculous they appear to anyone else.

As for my original post, anyone who would like to accept my challenge and show me what Endgame may or may not have as far as skill goes, may add "Imp" and message me in game. I really would like to see some good Endgamers show me what's up/get destroyed.

[Hahahahabirdy]

and @ hahahahabirdy, i think it's pretty obvious why... Endgame has more founders... If any endgame players wish to brag themselves up because they can use a founder's helmet to destroy any non founder at level 10, that is their choice but they must know how ridiculous they appear to anyone else.



okay so.. If you take out the amount of founders in the tournament (a whopping amount of 2), 6 out of 9 of the people left are endgame.

[Otukura]

I guarantee that i can beat any <unity> member in a game to 10

There's your problem. Take a look at <Revelation>.

[Zeus]

Bud Vs. Entertaining. Very interesting. Let's take someone with +5 damage and +5 armor, put them at level 10 and pretend like they aren't completely overpowered. To say that the allowing of founder's in the tournament wasn't completely unfair is just lying. How about you bump that level 10 up to level 17, keep the founder's helmet on and see how it ends. Or after their tournament match they can play to 4 without a founders, to be sure no funny business goes on with screenshotting...

and @ hahahahabirdy, i think it's pretty obvious why... Endgame has more founders... If any endgame players wish to brag themselves up because they can use a founder's helmet to destroy any non founder at level 10, that is their choice but they must know how ridiculous they appear to anyone else.

As for my original post, anyone who would like to accept my challenge and show me what Endgame may or may not have as far as skill goes, may add "Imp" and message me in game. I really would like to see some good Endgamers show me what's up/get destroyed.

We returned the favor by competing at your level, as shown in the tourney, why don't you return the favor by attempting to compete at end game? Or are you going to complain it's just luck?

I swear, twinking has some of the most egotistic people I've seen, not to mention immature.

End game is more sophisticated, twinking is basic, which is why you see basic gear, basic procs, basic combos, and rely more on your weapon/who can kite more to win.

Please, tell me L10-20 PvP is not just that. I left at after the crossbow age not because I couldn't adapt, but because if I wanted to shoot my weapon all day, I'd rather rely on a level 1.

You have, what, 3 skills to rely on? That's not more than 9 possible scenarios of approach, pretty easy to memorize.


End game has 70 skills to rely on? That's 4,830 ways to approach. Numbers don't lie.

Also, those stats are derived from just the same class vs same class. End game has A LOT more variety as to the types of classes, and you need to know how to beat all of them, not just a dex bear.

[Swimmingstar]

To be the VERY best endgame PVP regular for your level, you must beat everyone who claims to be better, in a fair fight. The same goes for low level. If you want to be the best, you have to beat the best. Once you beat the best you have to keep getting better to stay the best. If your level is so much more difficult, you should be able to come to low level and destroy everyone, no?

What about other people? Inactive, banned, people who won't take the challenge... there is no best, best is an opinion.

Oh but it COSTS soooo much more. I call BS on that. I have a free angel set that most endgamers use. Free. There are no good free items in low level. GF on the cost portion.

It wasn't free, you either spend a whopping amount of time leveling, $50, or spend money to get level faster.

Oh but we have soooo many skills to use! An endgame player can miss one, two and if they are lucky three skills from range and still win the fight. Generally, when a low level player misses from range, it's game over. Nice button jamming, endgame. (that means you just press a bunch of buttons).

You can button jam anywhere!

If you disagree, come try out level 17. We shall see how easy it is. Quit knocking the twinks, endgame.

17 is full of people who call themselves the best by joining L12 games. And I have to say... it's worse than 10-15

Just have to argue with... some points.

[Swimmingstar]

We returned the favor by competing at your level, as shown in the tourney, why don't you return the favor by attempting to compete at end game? Or are you going to complain it's just luck?

I swear, twinking has some of the most egotistic people I've seen, not to mention immature.

End game is more sophisticated, twinking is basic, which is why you see basic gear, basic procs, basic combos, and rely more on your weapon/who can kite more to win.

Please, tell me L10-20 PvP is not just that. I left at after the crossbow age not because I couldn't adapt, but because if I wanted to shoot my weapon all day, I'd rather rely on a level 1.

You have, what, 3 skills to rely on? That's not more than 9 possible scenarios of approach, pretty easy to memorize.


End game has 70 skills to rely on? That's 4,830 ways to approach. Numbers don't lie.

Also, those stats are derived from just the same class vs same class. End game has A LOT more variety as to the types of classes, and you need to know how to beat all of them, not just a dex bear.
Good points!

[KingFu]

And the word of the day today kids, is ego!

[Yich]

I fail to see where your numbers are coming from... In what does endgame have 70 skills in that low level has 3?... Hmmm... If twinking is basic, surely endgame can beat me at it, since they are so elite. I offered free power leveling to anyone who tries. Did you want to level me to 70? I don't think you do... Now if you want to talk approaches, let's have some fun with that. At level 17, I have 16 skill points, and 9 skills to choose from... At level 70, you have 69 (hehe (only to prove your point about low level immaturity)) points to spend on 12 different skills. That leaves nearly every skill you would get to use in your short 1v1s used, correct me if I'm wrong. Now, at my level, I use EVERY LAST SKILL POINT that I have. Shocker, right? Building off of Entertaining's point, Endgamers often use their buffs and maybe 3 skills before the die a horrible and quick death. Thats maybe 42 point at the most. How difficult to approach endgame, when you only need to use half of your points anyway (sometimes). What I will say makes Endgame difficult is the perfect combination of Strength, Dexterity and Intelligence. That is nearly limitless, but I'm sure you can just ask an experienced player for a good starter build, as nice as everyone sounds up there... Once again, I did not want to make an argument thread, my goal was to call out the end game regulars in hopes that they come quietly :)

[KingFu]

It's funny how you say at end game you only buff and use 3 skills, while at level 10-15 you pretty much only have 3 skills.

[Yich]

The difference is, the 3-4 skills you choose GREATLY affect the 1v1, while in endgame both sides can nuke each other at the start of the fight with just half of the skills they have...

[CrimsonTider]

Wow. Is this thread still going? Let me pose a question to those of you who can't seem to let this die. Do you go to school/work and brag about your bird/bear/mage? I think not. Why? Because we all know that bragging about a game gets you nowhere, maybe even laughed at. In some cases, laughing as hard as I am about these "I'm better" posts.

And before someone cones in and talks about my pvp ability: I stink at it and I could care less. I play a game for fun, no to satisfy my ego.

[Zeus]

I fail to see where your numbers are coming from... In what does endgame have 70 skills in that low level has 3?... Hmmm... If twinking is basic, surely endgame can beat me at it, since they are so elite. I offered free power leveling to anyone who tries. Did you want to level me to 70? I don't think you do... Now if you want to talk approaches, let's have some fun with that. At level 17, I have 16 skill points, and 9 skills to choose from... At level 70, you have 69 (hehe (only to prove your point about low level immaturity)) points to spend on 12 different skills. That leaves nearly every skill you would get to use in your short 1v1s used, correct me if I'm wrong. Now, at my level, I use EVERY LAST SKILL POINT that I have. Shocker, right? Building off of Entertaining's point, Endgamers often use their buffs and maybe 3 skills before the die a horrible and quick death. Thats maybe 42 point at the most. How difficult to approach endgame, when you only need to use half of your points anyway (sometimes). What I will say makes Endgame difficult is the perfect combination of Strength, Dexterity and Intelligence. That is nearly limitless, but I'm sure you can just ask an experienced player for a good starter build, as nice as everyone sounds up there... Once again, I did not want to make an argument thread, my goal was to call out the end game regulars in hopes that they come quietly :)

Sorry, made a mistake in my calculations. There isn't 71 skills, LOL, but, that doesn't detract from my point of more variety to choose from. You have 3 skills to choose from, it's Neanderthal, doesn't take much to memorize those skills ranges, the combos are still the same, no different approaches because you only have 3 skills.

And do you really think end game fights are short? LMAO! You truly haven't grasped the concept of end game then, because a match pro v pro takes a good half hour or more? If you know how to survive, fights aren't short at all. I'd dare say fights last longer.

[Gaunab]

The difference is, the 3-4 skills you choose GREATLY affect the 1v1, while in endgame both sides can nuke each other at the start of the fight with just half of the skills they have...

Believe it or not, but if you are good at endgame you will be able to survive/counter nukes and get to use even more than 3 skills. How amazing is that!?

I have countless different combos and approaches on my bird, depending on opponent, class, spec, situation etc. 9 different skills + buffs that all have to be timed precisely and in the right order. A missed/dodged hellscream or stomp is not the end of every battle.
If your understanding of endgame PvP is pure "button jamming" I'm not surprised that you die within one nuke and prefer to stick to <20.

[Yich]

Actually, I'm yet to try endgame, hence offering to try it if anyone tries low level. There is no need to be rude about it Gaunab, and it is no surprise to me that yet another person has come by, attempted to convince me endgame is tough, and left my thread without the name of their level 1 for power leveling. If endgame is as difficult as you all make it, SURELY you could pop into low level, destroy me, and post screenshots of it? Why is this yet to happen?

[Entertaining]

There's your problem. Take a look at <Revelation>.

I will also beat any <revelation> member..

[Sryyoulose]

I found that level 17 isn't super hard... It takes some skill... However endgame isnt run for the money gogo either I takes skill... So don't tell us we're bs just because you don't appreciate that lvl of pvp... The only lvl I haven't pvped at yet is 45 and 1... So don't say endgamers haven't tried other stuff to...

[Yich]

Apollo you are really under exaggerating alot. I told you I have 9 skills to choose from, and the obviously huge variety of weapons and armor to choose from. At endgame, everyone recieved the EXACT same sets. Every little stat point can and will affect the fight in low level, and playing to your strengths is also important. To get the edge on other players, countless new strategies are developed in BOTH levels of game play. Perhaps it was simple when you were there. To maintain my edge, I will refrain from explaining every last hidden game mechanic and strategy for low level. Once again, I am yet to see any of you in low level. Obviously both levels of PVP are difficult, as stated in the OP.

[Glad]

There's your problem. Take a look at <Revelation>.

I will also beat any <revelation> member..

Fight me.

[Sryyoulose]

Apollo you are really under exaggerating alot. I told you I have 9 skills to choose from, and the obviously huge variety of weapons and armor to choose from. At endgame, everyone recieved the EXACT same sets. Every little stat point can and will affect the fight in low level, and playing to your strengths is also important. To get the edge on other players, countless new strategies are developed in BOTH levels of game play. Perhaps it was simple when you were there. To maintain my edge, I will refrain from explaining every last hidden game mechanic and strategy for low level. Once again, I am yet to see any of you in low level. Obviously both levels of PVP are difficult, as stated in the OP.
Sewers.... It's the variety that made it the best cap!

[Zeus]

Apollo you are really under exaggerating alot. I told you I have 9 skills to choose from, and the obviously huge variety of weapons and armor to choose from. At endgame, everyone recieved the EXACT same sets. Every little stat point can and will affect the fight in low level, and playing to your strengths is also important. To get the edge on other players, countless new strategies are developed in BOTH levels of game play. Perhaps it was simple when you were there. To maintain my edge, I will refrain from explaining every last hidden game mechanic and strategy for low level. Once again, I am yet to see any of you in low level. Obviously both levels of PVP are difficult, as stated in the OP.

Now, I agree that both levels of PvP are difficult, but I maintain my stance that end game PvP takes slightly more skill.

I will fight your twink at your level IF you fight me at end game, deal? If so, my twink is PlatGen, but contact me on Apollo first since I'm mainly on him. :)

[Entertaining]

Fight me.

With pleasure..add me on entertaining

[Kraze]

Ok first and foremost I am not a "pro" pvp player as at this point nobody has sent me a check for a CTF score( still have my fingers crossed) however as someone who did play at end game just wanted to share some observations. At end game every time a new pack came out new gear combos and extra skill/attribute points changed things dramatically. Literally a build would hold its own one day and be obsolete the next.

What was really rare however would be to see a lower level player join a game and see a group of level cap players rush them in a 3v1 attack. However after reading this thread I logged on 8 different low level alts ( I can't stand the "T" word but I'll save that rant for a different thread") ranging from 55 down to 10.

Without fail within minutes 2-3 players 4-5 levels above the rest of the players would jump in rush kill leave and reset. Now I'll conceded, that the actions of a few do not represent the actions of many, if you are so skilled at what ever "1337" low level pvp you decided to set up shop at why wouldn't you go play at end game and not deal with these shannagins. Aside from these players jumping in to lower level games all I could find where players using only the most very basic gear and obviously still learning pvp. Again if I were "pro" and sponsored by the fnord shoe company I would think I would want to fight the best and most experienced players and that's at end game....

But that's just my 2 plat

[brodiniozo]

I will also beat any <revelation> member..

Lol.....

[Renovate]

IMO:

Both of them is hard. Using birds and mages from lv5-20 is hard. Using birds and bears from lv22-35 is not easy. For endgame birds, mages and bears are almost equal. PvP has never been easy.

[Glad]

Fight me.

With pleasure..add me on entertaining

Yeah on end-game, not twinking. :)

[GoodSyntax]

I would love to see some screen shots of PVP results after all the challenges and nerd raging so we can finally get this pissing match settled.

[Kraze]

So after my last post I decided I needed to get a feel for level 15 pvp. So I logged in on a level 10 and played 10 matches. Saw a range of levels from 12-17, for the most part they were all bears equipped with Holliday gear and used the complex strategy of max rage and a stomp now and then.

Got me thinking with two little fixes low level pvp may show the variety and strategy that end game sees:

1: scale skills,
We already see this with level 7 Skills locked until 65. Why not apply a similar example to all levels? Example 1-15 max skill level 2 16-25 skill level 3. May lead to some fights that are a little more than buff and auto attack

2: Scale damage,

I saw a lot of toons with names like "prothis" and "pvpthat" that would rush someone at a lower level and brag but when tables would be turned they would rage quit. Any easy fix would be to scale the damage by 10% per level difference. Example a level 15 attacking a level 10 would now see a 50% drop in DMg dealt while the level 10 would see a 50% bump in the DMg they could do therefore leveling the playing field and requiring a pulse to get a kill.

Thoughts?

[NotYoCookiez]

Wow. Is this thread still going? Let me pose a question to those of you who can't seem to let this die. Do you go to school/work and brag about your bird/bear/mage? I think not. Why? Because we all know that bragging about a game gets you nowhere, maybe even laughed at. In some cases, laughing as hard as I am about these "I'm better" posts.

And before someone cones in and talks about my pvp ability: I stink at it and I could care less. I play a game for fun, no to satisfy my ego.

You sirr deserve a noble prize!

[Yich]

Wow. Is this thread still going? Let me pose a question to those of you who can't seem to let this die. Do you go to school/work and brag about your bird/bear/mage? I think not. Why? Because we all know that bragging about a game gets you nowhere, maybe even laughed at. In some cases, laughing as hard as I am about these "I'm better" posts.

And before someone cones in and talks about my pvp ability: I stink at it and I could care less. I play a game for fun, no to satisfy my ego.
Argument invalid. Is this a thread on a forum made for a school? No. Do you go on Pocket Legends and brag about how smart you are? No. If you have to resort to telling people how good you are at a game in proving... anything outside of this game... Then that's just bad. It goes the opposite way too. If you have to brag up something not related to PvP in a discussion/argument about PvP, something is wrong.

I am actually practicing at 66 PvP and I am doing much better than I thought I would be. I'm still pretty bad, but I'm coming for you Apollo...

It would be cool if a dev tried PvP with regular stats... I wonder if they would be any good.

Once again if you see me online, just message me and tell me you noticed my thread and wanted to fight me. I use "Imp".

[Otukura]

I will also beat any <revelation> member..

You need a new troll detector.

[KingFu]

You need a new troll detector.

http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/zz133/therealdavid/Snapbucket/57b57a0f.jpg

[CrimsonTider]

Argument invalid. Is this a thread on a forum made for a school? No. Do you go on Pocket Legends and brag about how smart you are? No. If you have to resort to telling people how good you are at a game in proving... anything outside of this game... Then that's just bad. It goes the opposite way too. If you have to brag up something not related to PvP in a discussion/argument about PvP, something is wrong.

I am actually practicing at 66 PvP and I am doing much better than I thought I would be. I'm still pretty bad, but I'm coming for you Apollo...

6It would be cool if a dev tried PvP with regular stats... I wonder if they would be any good.

Once again if you see me online, just message me and tell me you noticed my thread and wanted to fight me. I use "Imp".



The point of my post is.... nevermind. Enjoy your "big boy" status.

[Yich]

C'mon now... I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to be the best at a game, and I'm not even doing that... The OP was to get at least one person to try out low level and find out that maybe there are a few hidden game mechanics out there that they are yet to learn and master. At endgame, it's nearly impossible to see some of the small boosts and things that appear in low level...

[Zeus]

C'mon now... I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to be the best at a game, and I'm not even doing that... The OP was to get at least one person to try out low level and find out that maybe there are a few hidden game mechanics out there that they are yet to learn and master. At endgame, it's nearly impossible to see some of the small boosts and things that appear in low level...

That's why the pros at end game stand out, because they learned those mechanics and put them to use. Twinking, IMO, is great if you want to fully understand PvP. Please note, I'm not saying twinking isn't tough, because it is.

[CrimsonTider]

C'mon now... I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to be the best at a game, and I'm not even doing that... The OP was to get at least one person to try out low level and find out that maybe there are a few hidden game mechanics out there that they are yet to learn and master. At endgame, it's nearly impossible to see some of the small boosts and things that appear in low level...

You do realize that the "pros" at endgame were once "pros" at what are considered "twinking" levels now. A lot of the endgame pvper's wrote the book on twinking. Remember (or you may not have been around that long), you level of expertise use to be "endgame".

Kinda like an awesome little league pitcher calling out Nolan Ryan or Roger Clemmons. They've "been there, done that". Don't need a youngster asking them to prove themselves.

[Kixxler]

C'mon now... I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to be the best at a game, and I'm not even doing that... The OP was to get at least one person to try out low level and find out that maybe there are a few hidden game mechanics out there that they are yet to learn and master. At endgame, it's nearly impossible to see some of the small boosts and things that appear in low level...

I still remember the times when you were such a wimp, but after seeking help from a friend you try to act all tough.

[Yich]

I still remember the times when you were such a wimp, but after seeking help from a friend you try to act all tough.

Well, you are close to the truth on that. Unlike most players, I was pretty much never a noob. I was introduced into the game by someone who knew it pretty well. He taught me how to do low level PvP, power leveled me to 65 on another character and gave me a perfect set of gear for twinking. So, you are close to the truth. I didn't have to "seek" any help at all. I have easily earned twice the value that was given to me when I first started, all given to the one who introduced me to the game. I never was a wimp, I simply didn't know who to and not to befriend. I don't think I am trying to appear tough, but I have picked up a few things since I've started, things many others seem to have not noticed. Perhaps you would like a 1v1? I prefer level 17, if you haven't picked up on that yet.

[TruePlayer]

Well, you are close to the truth on that. Unlike most players, I was pretty much never a noob. I was introduced into the game by someone who knew it pretty well. He taught me how to do low level PvP, power leveled me to 65 on another character and gave me a perfect set of gear for twinking. So, you are close to the truth. I didn't have to "seek" any help at all. I have easily earned twice the value that was given to me when I first started, all given to the one who introduced me to the game. I never was a wimp, I simply didn't know who to and not to befriend. I don't think I am trying to appear tough, but I have picked up a few things since I've started, things many others seem to have not noticed. Perhaps you would like a 1v1? I prefer level 17, if you haven't picked up on that yet.

Honestly i been following this thread and i have to agree with this guy on some points. Its is a
Fact that there not alot talent in end game pvp. To be honest i can beat 99% archer in end game as dex or str. Vs mage prob 95% because mage do have
A advantage over birds. And bears r really non existing in end game pvp only a handful of bears pvp at a high lvl. I hope this updat will draw more people to pvp at end game. It would make it more
Competitive rather then just the handful of people who will join together when tourniment time. Usely i never want be on the so call pro team when vs a noob team it just not challenging or fun. Maybe thats why the talent in end game is bad everybody just want play when on the stronger team rather then try harder to win.

[Phoenixking]

Actually, I'm yet to try endgame, hence offering to try it if anyone tries low level. There is no need to be rude about it Gaunab, and it is no surprise to me that yet another person has come by, attempted to convince me endgame is tough, and left my thread without the name of their level 1 for power leveling. If endgame is as difficult as you all make it, SURELY you could pop into low level, destroy me, and post screenshots of it? Why is this yet to happen?
1) you didn't try endgame, how can you say it's easy
2) you are the one being rude look at your original post

You don't have a reason to judge endgame unless you try it, I tried Level 26 twinking and yeah it's fun but it isn't so hard, I used a combo that works on almost everything, and I killed a good amount, I wasn't the best but I was good just for my first day, I got so bored of it there was no variety
endgame isn't complicated either, it's almost like twinking but more options in skills. with more options of skills you'll have to know what each skill does and can do, the range of the skill, the damage, and if it goes with any proc or other skill
a pro pvper could easily jump into twinking atleast kill good people in their first day. Of course it'll be tougher to beat someone who is "pro" in twinking because it's their area
i don't see your point as well
i have around 8 different combos for endgame, in twinking I have 2 combos


I also forgot to mention that twinking does have some things that count for being difficult like playing the other "pro" twinks who are actually just 4-5 level above you
I still think that endgame is ore difficult then twinking and that twinking can be difficult at times, but mostly at high end

[XghostzX]

Hmm, I really don't want to read this whole thread, but uhm Yich, I welcome you to a locked 1v1 match for end game. Tell me how easy end game is then.

Or try some real CTF end game, that's real strategy.

[Kixxler]

Well, you are close to the truth on that. Unlike most players, I was pretty much never a noob. I was introduced into the game by someone who knew it pretty well. He taught me how to do low level PvP, power leveled me to 65 on another character and gave me a perfect set of gear for twinking. So, you are close to the truth. I didn't have to "seek" any help at all. I have easily earned twice the value that was given to me when I first started, all given to the one who introduced me to the game. I never was a wimp, I simply didn't know who to and not to befriend. I don't think I am trying to appear tough, but I have picked up a few things since I've started, things many others seem to have not noticed. Perhaps you would like a 1v1? I prefer level 17, if you haven't picked up on that yet.
And I prefer 20, 25, 30, and 35. I'm not making a 17 just to satisfy you're ego, madame.

[Advicatus]

Lol everytime I see "Last post by: Kixxler" its like Christmas day. xD

[Zeus]

Yich, when would you like to do an end game match? :)

[SuperGotenks]

Challenge excepted. The twink era is coming!
19 bird, supahhgotenkz

[Roberto077]

Low level dex bears are really easy.
Low level archers are dead
Low level mages are gone from PvP

Endgame archers are half and half depending on your set
Endgame mages don't die
Endgame bears are ehhhh idk never played as one

[Advicatus]

Birds and mages arent dead in low lvl pvp :P

[Bous]

yah bird and mages actually take some skill in low pvp. bears are a peice of cake :)

[XghostzX]

yah bird and mages actually take some skill in low pvp. bears are a peice of cake :)

Try going up against Gladiator and Hotdream, their bears but they nuke hella hard.

[Dynastu]

Try going up against Gladiator and Hotdream, their bears but they nuke hella hard.

I believe he meant low level pvp (levels 10-20 or so). He was saying birds & mages at that range require more skill than using a bear.

[Advicatus]

^ that

[Glad]

yah bird and mages actually take some skill in low pvp. bears are a peice of cake :)

Try going up against Gladiator and Hotdream, their bears but they nuke hella hard.

So does Ghost ;)