[EXPLAINED] Intelligence vs Stats Increase (with GRAPHS)

[Felora]

Intelligence vs Stats Increase by Felora

This study is for INT increase vs Stats increase. From 15 Int to 135 Int (then I stopped plotting). Str and Dex remained untouched.

I have realised that there are alot of debates going on regarding the stats and attributes. I have spent time to do my research on my Enchantress Character and plot some graphs for sharing. I gathered these data through taking screen shots every point of INT I add to my character after paying for respec. Over 135 screen shots were taken on the 8th of April 2010. :eek:

Disclaimer: These are just for reference and I spent my time and tried my best to make things accurate. I am not trying to say that things are unbalanced or anything so no flames here and don't criticize on the errors please.

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/1876/excelr.jpg:cool:


http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/158/intvsmana.jpg
You get 2 points of extra mana every other 2 INT increase. :rolleyes:


http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/5222/intvsmanareg.jpg
This is for Mana Regen. Just 3 MP/s at about 110 INT! (without item bonus) :(:(


http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/795/intv****.jpg
You get only about 11% with about 135 INT... :(


http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/2278/intvsdps.jpg
About 5 points of DPS increase with 135 INT :eek:


http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/8966/intvsdmg.jpg
Damage is relative since I cannot totally disarm. But the increments are the same for all weapons. :p


http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/6455/intvscrit.jpg
You get 8% Crit chance at 135 INT. :(


http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/9274/intvsall.jpg
Just all of the stuff added together. Other stats are NOT affected by INT. :eek:

Feel free to share your constructive comment. :)

[Felora]

Forgot to say I am not sure if this should go to Enchantress Forum but I think INT stats are the same for other classes as well :)

[Deathshock]

Great job here. If only somebody could do this for str and dex as well... haha

[Splurd]

Damage is relative since I cannot totally disarm. But the increments are the same for all weapons.


Why not? click the item equipped and there should be a un equip button.

for the hit%, how many int did you add for 1% increase? Same for the damage.

And why is there a spike in the dps and damage? o.O or is it a graphics thing?

And lastly, mass kudos for the hard work on this. And the $0.99.

[Splurd]

Great job here. If only somebody could do this for str and dex as well... haha

Maybe if Felora shares her excel file so I dont have to go make all the graphs and tables xD
I might be respec-ing my archer.

[Deathshock]

Maybe if Felora shares her excel file so I dont have to go make all the graphs and tables xD
I might be respec-ing my archer.

Wait just to be clear, dex affects crit, dodge, hit, and a small amount of damage right?

And nothing else really, right?

[nerdherd]

Wow, this is great! We need more of this kind of quality info!

[Felora]

Why not? click the item equipped and there should be a un equip button.

for the hit%, how many int did you add for 1% increase? Same for the damage.

And why is there a spike in the dps and damage? o.O or is it a graphics thing?

And lastly, mass kudos for the hard work on this. And the $0.99.

Right. I didn't realize that you can unequip... To be absolutely accurate. I suggest someone to try do this with all equipment unequipped. I did not touch the damage. The only thing I edited were the MP/s and crit which my equipment gave a bonus when I was at base INT. The bonus are constant so they didn't affect the charts.

As for Damage. That is the min damage range. The increments for max damage range are exactly the same but I do not know why there are spikes. The equipments remained untouched. I would draw a straight trend line along the chart for estimation until someone does this again unequipped to be most accurate.

As for Hit%. You get 1% increase in Hit% every 10 INT.

{---My Opinion---}

MP Regen: You need around 110 INT to get to 3M/s Regen (without item bonus). You already get 2M/s at 20 something INT.

Crit, Hit chance, Damage, DPS: are very slowly increased.

How much INT is enough? I don't see a reason why you need very high INT (Especially maxed out INT). The INT you need would be the TOTAL MANA you think is enough for you after you have EQUIPPED your equipment (For me I have 8M/s in total for this build equipped. So the base of 2M/s is enough for me!!!! May be I am going to respec and put alot of the INT to DEX or something). Also, you only get about 60-70 more Mana when you go from 20 INT to 140INT.

Conclusion is that the High INT is ONLY FOR wearing INT EQUIPMENT that boost your mana related stats needed by your casting. If you mainly prefer normal attacks, you are better off with some DEX i think.

I am thinking of doing DEX analysis for my Archer. But I am not sure if the DEV will change the stats in the next few days...

[Splurd]

something abit wasted, should have casted spells with 1 int, and compared the damage at every 10 int, to see if spells are affected.

[Felora]

something abit wasted, should have casted spells with 1 int, and compared the damage at every 10 int, to see if spells are affected.

Damage is not constant. Given that you have a min and max range of damage. You have to pick the very same enemy to attack him for over a hundred of times, logging the damage and averaging it out every 10 INT change. That would take forever given that the enemies are not all of the same type. At least they don't look the same.

[Splurd]

Damage is not constant. Given that you have a min and max range of damage. You have to pick the very same enemy to attack him for over a hundred of times, logging the damage and averaging it out every 10 INT change. That would take forever given that the enemies are not all of the same type. At least they don't look the same.

I didnt play enchantress, so I cant comment on their skills,

but for archer and their skills like blastshot, the damage is quite stable, give or take 5 dmg.

[Deathshock]

Allright, I respec'd putting everything into strength.

Before adding str
Str:15
Dex:3
Int:1
Hit%: 69
crit:2
dodge:4
health: 308
regen:1
mana:200
regen:0
damage:41-45
dps:50
armor:64

After adding Str:
Str:160
Dex:3
Int:1
Hit%: 77
crit:2
dodge:4
health: 380
regen:3
mana:200
regen:0
damage:44-48
dps:54
armor:71

Differences:
Str: 145
Hit%: 8%
Health: 72
Regen: 2
Damage: 3
dps: 4
Armor: 7


Although these may not seem like a lot (I basically moved 40 dex from what I had before into strength) I did notice a change in my ability to tank in Lost expedition. A tank with full str, evade, iron blood, hell scream, and taunt can tank lost expedition with little or no damage done to them at all.

[Azrael]

Amazing work Felora!!! By far one of the best write ups that has been done on the forum. My hat is off to you sir!

I am so glad to know that i was wrong about crit bonuses given to mages through Intelligence, though it would seem dex gives more crit per point. I am very glad i saw this information before i posted a second Enchantress walkthrough (a sequel to the Hurs guide now that he is a warrior) that i have been working on!

What i am now left wondering is if Intelligence gives a bonus to spell damage and spell effects. The graph made it pretty clear that the Damage (and by result the DPS) bonus is negligible. However it remains unclear if for example, my FireStorm spell's damage is increased by the amount of intelligence my Enchantress has. My healing spell for instance, has not improved past a max of 84 points of heal, with my heal being generally in the 60s-70s, regardless of my intelligence. This is pre-patch as a side note.

Come by http://theappradar.com if you ever want to talk chantress Felora, i'm in the shoutbox when i play.

Edit: and seriously, this eases my frustration with enchantress quite a bit, i will be updated a few key posts i made to better reflect the intelligence stats. I still think we need some love, but knowing int at least give a little bit of hit and crit is a good thing.

[Shebee]

I was about to do some theorycrafting on the warrior class but cba until they conplete the game.

[Viruz]

Thanks Fel for the Awesome info.

[Splurd]

Amazing work Felora!!! By far one of the best write ups that has been done on the forum. My hat is off to you sir!

I am so glad to know that i was wrong about crit bonuses given to mages through Intelligence, though it would seem dex gives more crit per point. I am very glad i saw this information before i posted a second Enchantress walkthrough (a sequel to the Hurs guide now that he is a warrior) that i have been working on!

What i am now left wondering is if Intelligence gives a bonus to spell damage and spell effects. The graph made it pretty clear that the Damage (and by result the DPS) bonus is negligible. However it remains unclear if for example, my FireStorm spell's damage is increased by the amount of intelligence my Enchantress has. My healing spell for instance, has not improved past a max of 84 points of heal, with my heal being generally in the 60s-70s, regardless of my intelligence. This is pre-patch as a side note.

Come by http://theappradar.com if you ever want to talk chantress Felora, i'm in the shoutbox when i play.

Edit: and seriously, this eases my frustration with enchantress quite a bit, i will be updated a few key posts i made to better reflect the intelligence stats. I still think we need some love, but knowing int at least give a little bit of hit and crit is a good thing.

As silly as this sounds, Azrael, try equipping no weapon and comparing the heal effect. Just curious.
This is because my archers blast shot is affected by weapon damage. Was doing around 40 damage difference with and without my bow.

[Druc]

Wow Felora, well done. If you need a guinea pig for archer as well I'd be willing to lend a hand.

Cya in game

[Felora]

Thanks for the support guys. The DEX writeup will be done soon.

However, it is more difficult to spot and quantify the spell/skill damages because it is affected by the enemy type, armor, weapon equipped. I also think that the spell damages are not constant even if the above factors are held fixed. My speculation is that weapons may affect the skill/spell damages and the STATS after equipment. But not directly by the Attributes (Int, Str, Dex).

I respec and tested my Enchantress to use a Bow with Dex and my spells seem to do the same damages. We need to find some way to confirm this.

I will finish the DEX write up first and I will try to make it more accurate this time :)

[Splurd]

Thanks for the support guys. The DEX writeup will be done soon.

However, it is more difficult to spot and quantify the spell/skill damages because it is affected by the enemy type, armor, weapon equipped. I also think that the spell damages are not constant even if the above factors are held fixed. My speculation is that weapons may affect the skill/spell damages and the STATS after equipment. But not directly by the Attributes (Int, Str, Dex).

I respec and tested my Enchantress to use a Bow with Dex and my spells seem to do the same damages. We need to find some way to confirm this.

I will finish the DEX write up first and I will try to make it more accurate this time :)

my archer does the same damage to all the monsters he shoots. Never seen it differ in my testings.

[HectorCruz]

I love you Felora.

[Royce]

Just some updated numbers with the new total points available.

Mana continues to follow the same pattern. Raises by one for two Int points, then none for two. So an average of 1/2 mana per Int.

I hit the 4th mana regen point at 161 Int.

Hit% and Crit continue their slow rise, hitting 10 Crit at 164 Int, and 90% Hit at 165 Int. Hit maxes at 91% at Int 175.

DPS hits 16 at 162 Int. (Whoopdeedoo)

BTW, I have a spreadsheet with all the stats from 7 Int up to 177. I just don't have time to do anything with them right now.

[flaimdude]

You get 2 M/s at 60 int, I respec'd and that's what it is afaik. :) Could be dif for dif people.

[Royce]

I'm gonna respec again soon to find out a bit about secondary dex. I'll see what happens then. Might be different for different people, but I also could have missed it appearing at 60 ;)

[Nerit]

You get 2 M/s at 60 int, I respec'd and that's what it is afaik. :) Could be dif for dif people.

Flaimdude apparently didn't get 2 m/s until 60 int. Yet our beloved graph points toward twenty-something. Any other testimonials? I'd like to know exactly how much int it takes, if there can be any consensus on the issue. My character isn't interested in being any smarter than she has to be.

[Royce]

I have 61 Int for 2 M/s in my spreadsheet but suspect it may be a bookkeeping error and that the actual number is 60. I don't have the data with me, but I believe these are the critical values.

11 Int = 1 M/s
61 Int = 2 M/s
110 Int = 3 M/s
161 Int = 4 M/s

I also wonder whether stretching to reach one of these plateaus is necessary or not. What I am beginning to suspect is that it may be a gradient. Meaning for example, that 15 Int would give you something like 0.94 M/s and the value displayed onscreen is rounded down to an integer. I have not rigorously tested this, so it is only a suspicion at this point, but I'd be interested to know if anyone knows how it works for certain.

[Cascade]

very informable thank you for Doing this!:D

[Diz]

I also wonder whether stretching to reach one of these plateaus is necessary or not. What I am beginning to suspect is that it may be a gradient. Meaning for example, that 15 Int would give you something like 0.94 M/s and the value displayed onscreen is rounded down to an integer. I have not rigorously tested this, so it is only a suspicion at this point, but I'd be interested to know if anyone knows how it works for certain.

This is almost certainly the case - I discovered quickly while leveling my first mage that regen is definitely not whole numbers [although it is on gear]. I distinctly recall gaining back mana faster while grinding with every 10 or so INT points I gained. If you don't believe me, sit on auto-attack with a wand at 0 mana, and watch the regen rates while specced with odd INT rates. But for all practicality, round numbers are better because it's easier to theorcraft and gear around.

[Nerit]

Thanks. This is very good to know and I appreciate that the game works this way.

[Royce]

This is almost certainly the case - I discovered quickly while leveling my first mage that regen is definitely not whole numbers [although it is on gear]. I distinctly recall gaining back mana faster while grinding with every 10 or so INT points I gained.
Thanks for that. I really want to figure out exactly how this works now. If anyone has any ideas on how to find thresholds, if there are any, please post them. This means all the people getting their characters to exactly 16 Int for 1 M/s or exactly 110 for 3 M/s may want to rethink their setup since losing a fraction of a regen point may be worth it. In my case, I am thinking now of boosting my Int again after having capped it at 112. 160 is not worth it to me for additional regen, but going to 125, to pick a number out of the air, might be worth it.


But for all practicality, round numbers are better because it's easier to theorcraft and gear around.

Critical values where a stat increments make determining the division of attribute points easier. However, they also lead to everyone having the same exact stats. This, if true (not that I think you're wrong), would probably lead to more diversity in setups.

[flaimdude]

So the devs are sneakier than it first appears... :)

[TheBaconKing]

I'm gonna respec again soon to find out a bit about secondary dex. I'll see what happens then. Might be different for different people, but I also could have missed it appearing at 60 ;)

I guess I am bumping an old(er) thread.. But I am wondering if you ever did this?
My enchantress just hit 24 so I payed for, and did the repec... Everything is just sitting at the default while I do some research.

Does dexterity affect your spell damage? I was planning on doing something similar to my warrior with hitting gear requirements for int gear, and then pumping the rest into dex for hit and crit.

From reading this thread I assume you would get more out of dex after you hit 112 int (gear requirements). So please correct me if I assumed incorrectly.

[Obliteration]

For an enchantress don't worry about strength they are paper anyway and will die if attacked heavily.
So just get 112 int and dump rest in dex for more dps. Or just dump all in int for better m/s and a higher mana pool.

[TheBaconKing]

Or just dump all in int for better m/s and a higher mana pool.

From what I have read, you only gain 1 extra m/s with all points into int. Wouldn't the added crit and hit% benefit you more?