Zodias Weapon Nerf Discussion

[Cinco]

In the interest of transparency: I am posting to announce that the Zodias Mythic weapons will very likely be nerfed in the near future.

For instance: the case has been made very clearly that proper use of the Neptaris sword makes it far better than its Arcane counterpart.

Zodias' power comes from a time when the activation methods were deemed too burdensome by the community. Now that players are in full command of these powers it is time to step back and rebalance.

[Valkiirye]

RIP Neptaris, was good old days <3


ψ(｀∇´)ψ Chivalrous Union ᕦ(ಠ_ಠ)ᕤ

[Cinco]

RIP Neptaris, was good old days <3


ψ(｀∇´)ψ Chivalrous Union ᕦ(ಠ_ಠ)ᕤ

While it is standard overreaction for us here to think that items are either OP or Useless... there is a place in-between.

Neptaris only needs to be adjusted to fit within the realm of "Mythic" power.

Forum users have clearly indicated that it overpowers the Warrior's Arcane weapon.

[iTemSell]

Rip nepta, i guess needed nerf
Also tysm cinco for the gold loot buff map 4, excited to see how u buffed the lair bosses [emoji3]

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[Synergia]

Yeah it def needed a nerf..
but don't go too far to the point where it will be really weak

[mikesito]

You're just ruining this game, NERF KRAKEN GUN, special colour for mages, op weapons for mages you should name this game mage legends.

-rogue

[mikesito]

You're just ruining this game, NERF KRAKEN GUN, special skin colours for mages, op weapons for mages you should name this game mage legends.

-from a rogue
Bdmdkskenwnb

[Tekila]

A nerf on nepta is fair enough since it dmg output seems to outclass the kraken sword by little, I would have opted for a dmg buff for the kraken sword but yeah why not.
I just hope that you don’t make Nepta so weak that it will be useless.


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[Cinco]

You're just ruining this game, NERF KRAKEN GUN, special colour for mages, op weapons for mages you should name this game mage legends.

-rogue


Bdmdkskenwnb

Try to stay on topic. This thread is about the War Mythic / Arcane weapons comparative balance.

[Lionzone]

Am kinda disappointed to the fact that things always getting nerf they need to create a new system that eliminates this are the game is gonna be ruin I love this game and I don’t want to see it go down
So in the future try to adjust things a way that nerf isn’t always gonna happen

[Hexame]

Glad I finished all the Zodias Content such as 1k/1k portals using the Nepataris. Never complained and glad I used it.

Any idea when the new expansion will be out?

[Nexior]

In the interest of transparency: I am posting to announce that the Zodias Mythic "Neptaris" blade will be nerfed in the near future.

The case has been made very clearly that proper use of the sword makes it far better than its Arcane counterpart.

Neptaris' power comes from a time when the activation methods were deemed too burdensome by the community. Now that players are in full command of its powers it no longer needs the devastating damage on Marked targets.They trolled you like baby , none even use it lol cus need 100000 attempts


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[Cinco]

Am kinda disappointed to the fact that things always getting nerf they need to create a new system that eliminates this are the game is gonna be ruin I love this game and I don’t want to see it go down
So in the future try to adjust things a way that nerf isn’t always gonna happen

The only way to avoid nerfs is to never update the game (to never have level cap increases and to never introduce new gear).

The introduction of new gear is one of the key reasons that equipment must be rebalanced.

When Arcane Legends cap was 16 there was no way to balance for 'Artifacts' because they didn't exist.

Hope that makes sense :-)

[Tekila]

In the interest of transparency: I am posting to announce that the Zodias Mythic "Neptaris" blade will be nerfed in the near future.

The case has been made very clearly that proper use of the sword makes it far better than its Arcane counterpart.

Neptaris' power comes from a time when the activation methods were deemed too burdensome by the community. Now that players are in full command of its powers it no longer needs the devastating damage on Marked targets.

But the activation method is still a pain tho if you rework it instead of just nerfing it would give warriors a new experience :)
Since it’s still in process I’d suggest to make it like a Pisces/Aquaris proc on charged or normal attack give it some dmg boost and boss dmg boost so we can have fun as warrior maybe.
In that way it will not do the same thing as kraken sword.
Anyway the choice is yours since kraken is still so expensive it’s hard to have fun as warrior in my point of view people prefer mage and rogue now.


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[Pac]

Lol and here I was asking around how to use it haha

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[Cinco]

But the activation method is still a pain tho if you rework it instead of just nerfing it would give warriors a new experience :)
Since it’s still in process I’d suggest to make it like a Pisces/Aquaris proc on charged or normal attack give it some dmg boost and boss dmg boost so we can have fun as warrior maybe.
In that way it will not do the same thing as kraken sword.
Anyway the choice is yours since kraken is still so expensive it’s hard to have fun as warrior in my point of view people prefer mage and rogue now.


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I agree that the Neptaris in the context of the Zaarus Set is good and that it compares well with Polaris and with the other class' weaponry.

Seems like the big obvious problem is the fact that the new Kraken Battle Shell overdrives the Mythic weapons effects to extreme degrees. This is where I plan to start my review.

[spityful17]

So how about those players who use nepta that cant afford krak weaps?


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[snakeeyes]

Now what old warior user how about the our new player that the only bugget to buy is mythic? Because of cyring warior complain the new warior player suffer.

[Cinco]

So how about those players who use nepta that cant afford krak weaps?


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Now what old warior user how about the our new player that the only bugget to buy is mythic? Because of cyring warior complain the new warior player suffer.

Neptaris will still be a great weapon. We just need to look at why it's so OP compared to the more expensive, more rare weapon that's meant to be a lot more powerful.

[SS Falcon]

In the future, is it possible to move away from charged attacks procs? I feel weapons should always be proc on damage. For instance, for Polaris it takes forever to proc.. then you have to charge attack. I think it should proc, then on damage release.

[Cinco]

In the future, is it possible to move away from charged attacks procs? I feel weapons should always be proc on damage. For instance, for Polaris it takes forever to proc.. then you have to charge attack. I think it should proc, then on damage release.

Yeah. That's how the Arcane Kraken Battle aoe type weapons function.

[SS Falcon]

I was speaking more for us casual players who can’t afford kraken >.>. I guess I should be a bit more specific. Can you look into changing the mythics to proc on damage?

[Tekila]

Maybe it is the kraken battle sword who’s too weak.


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[Cinco]

I was speaking more for us casual players who can’t afford kraken >.>. I guess I should be a bit more specific. Can you look into changing the mythics to proc on damage?

Appreciate your point here but I am not going to change the activation method for these weapons.

[umarrahim]

Appreciate your point here but I am not going to change the activation method for these weapons.I think Neptaris will always be a problem in combination with Warrior 6x STR ultimate. As long as it can nuke any boss with it, it will always be a better option than Kraken.

But if you nerf it to a point where it can barely kill a boss with ult, the damage without ult will barely tickle anything.

Maybe look at Warrior Ult instead of nerfing the damage of weapons?

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[Cinco]

I think Neptaris will always be a problem in combination with Warrior 6x STR ultimate. As long as it can nuke any boss with it, it will always be a better option than Kraken.

But if you nerf it to a point where it can barely kill a boss with ult, the damage without ult will barely tickle anything.

Maybe look at Warrior Ult instead of nerfing the damage of weapons?

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Even without the Ultimate we've got a balance problem with the Mythic / Arcane Warrior weapons' damage output.

Warrior Ultimate makes the problem a lot worse - and I'm not opposed to reviewing it.

[umarrahim]

Even without the Ultimate we've got a balance problem with the Mythic / Arcane Warrior weapons' damage output.

Warrior Ultimate makes the problem a lot worse - and I'm not opposed to reviewing it.As from what I know, you said every class is damage class. So I think the best way to balance warrior currently would be:

1) Increase Kraken Sword Damage to match other classes output.

2) Nerf the Warrior ultimate to grant 2x or 3x STR.

As currently, only warrior sword seems to benefit with ulti as opposed with Mage gun with their ult and Rog bow with their ult.

This way all classes would have similar damage output without ult, but Warrior will be stronger with their ult at killing single target however its not too gamebreaking.

Also, this way. The neptaris won't have to be nerfed and poor players will still be able to be relevant with it.

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[mamaubear]

Why? Iam poor player, I only have neptaris sword for my weapon :(
I Can't buy other "op" weapon for my war...

[Cinco]

As from what I know, you said every class is damage class. So I think the best way to balance warrior currently would be:

1) Increase Kraken Sword Damage to match other classes output.

2) Nerf the Warrior ultimate to grant 2x or 3x STR.

As currently, only warrior sword seems to benefit with ulti as opposed with Mage gun with their ult and Rog bow with their ult.

This way all classes would have similar damage output without ult, but Warrior will be stronger with their ult at killing single target however its not too gamebreaking.

Also, this way. The neptaris won't have to be nerfed and poor players will still be able to be relevant with it.

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I'll keep the Warrior ultimate in the mix as this change unfolds. 6x damage is pretty OP :-)

This suggested change does not address the gear issue with Neptaris and the Kraken Battle Shell armor proc.

[Mucsi]

My suggestion is just to scale the neptaris with damage limitations, for example if warriors using their kraken armor proc with the rage ulti, neptaris will have limitless damage on targetted enemies (damage output based on str, boss dmg, elit dmg), so just make a limit to neptar to deal 2-3m tick damage on target in the full gear of buffs. So basically, neptar will be able to deal high damage still, but no more than 2-3m/tick.

Btw I prefer kraken sword, just because one huge advantage. 100% proc on first charged hit. Makes much much easier the farming process.

I beg for mercy to warriors. @cinco please, do not nerf the Rage ultimate skill, this is the only way for warriors to kill the bosses whom are left alone in a map.

[umarrahim]

My suggestion is just to scale the neptaris with damage limitations, for example if warriors using their kraken armor proc with the rage ulti, neptaris will have limitless damage on targetted enemies (damage output based on str, boss dmg, elit dmg), so just make a limit to neptar to deal 2-3m tick damage on target in the full gear of buffs. So basically, neptar will be able to deal high damage still, but no more than 2-3m/tick.

Btw I prefer kraken sword, just because one huge advantage. 100% proc on first charged hit. Makes much much easier the farming process.

I beg for mercy to warriors. @cinco please, do not nerf the Rage ultimate skill, this is the only way for warriors to kill the bosses whom are left alone in a map.Warrior Ultimate shouldn't be able to combine with their Sword proc then.

Rogue and Mage ult cambine with Gun/Bow proc.

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[SS Falcon]

Please do not change war ult.

[umarrahim]

I'll keep the Warrior ultimate in the mix as this change unfolds. 6x damage is pretty OP :-)

This suggested change does not address the gear issue with Neptaris and the Kraken Battle Shell armor proc.Did you consider that all the stars must align for Neptaris + Arcane Armor to proc together? It's not very consistent.

I really feel Neptaris is fine as it is. I feel it does similar damage to Hyperos.

Hyperos + Arcane Armor would have similar damage outout, no?

My suggestion above still stands. Arcane Sword damage should be increased to match other classes, but the Ult should be nerfed in compensation so the Sword doesn't isn't broken.

Arcane Sword is better than Neptaris as it's easier to Proc Armor with it.

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[Xmap-AL]

Correct nepta vs krak sword i prefer using nepta than useless kraken sword dodge 90% for all mini and boss [emoji14]

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[Corviss the Lich]

Did you consider that all the stars must align for Neptaris + Arcane Armor to proc together? It's not very consistent.

I really feel Neptaris is fine as it is. I feel it does similar damage to Hyperos.

Hyperos + Arcane Armor would have similar damage outout, no?

My suggestion above still stands. Arcane Sword damage should be increased to match other classes, but the Ult should be nerfed in compensation so the Sword doesn't isn't broken.

Arcane Sword is better than Neptaris as it's easier to Proc Armor with it.

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That might be Neptaris' problem, it scales with damage and stats multiplier too much unlike other weapons. Because with just Neptaris alone it sucks. And yep 6x STR will be a problem the further this ult stays the same. Stat multiplier is too broken in more future expansions, it might get to the point it multiply into giving warriors 6 digit STR as it scales further with more STR.

[Cinco]

Did you consider that all the stars must align for Neptaris + Arcane Armor to proc together? It's not very consistent.

I really feel Neptaris is fine as it is. I feel it does similar damage to Hyperos.

Hyperos + Arcane Armor would have similar damage outout, no?

My suggestion above still stands. Arcane Sword damage should be increased to match other classes, but the Ult should be nerfed in compensation so the Sword doesn't isn't broken.

Arcane Sword is better than Neptaris as it's easier to Proc Armor with it.

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Other Class Mythics need to be reevaluated in context with the Arcane armors.

How about this: I’ll see about the Ultimate balance first :-)


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[Nocturnus]

Neptaris will still be a great weapon. We just need to look at why it's so OP compared to the more expensive, more rare weapon that's meant to be a lot more powerful.

Just make it capped at damage, or unable to stack with kraken items or other items.
By itself, with its zaurus set, it's not that broken.
A nerf would render her useless, even at her level, which wouldn't make sense.

[Cinco]

Just make it capped at damage, or unable to stack with kraken items or other items.
By itself, with its zaurus set, it's not that broken.
A nerf would render her useless, even at her level, which wouldn't make sense.

I hear you. Adjusting its interaction with the Arcane Armor would definitely count as a nerf. I’m looking at these factors first as opposed to just the weapon in and of itself (or in the Zaarus set).


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[Nocturnus]

It would certainly be a nerf.
But you will have less chance of breaking the weapon, however, maybe a cap on damage is better.
Because in the future, if you cast other items with proc, you would have to adjust it again.

[Cinco]

It would certainly be a nerf.
But you will have less chance of breaking the weapon, however, maybe a cap on damage is better.
Because in the future, if you cast other items with proc, you would have to adjust it again.

A damage cap is one of the tools that I have. It’s very likely to be used with these weapons.


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[Cinco]

Updated OP to indicate that it’s not just War gear that is going to be looked at.


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[Xmap-AL]

Hope you buff the sword and aegis
Warrior getting nab at this time
Always get nerfed and how about rog and mage?

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[caabarader]

I'll keep the Warrior ultimate in the mix as this change unfolds. 6x damage is pretty OP :-)

This suggested change does not address the gear issue with Neptaris and the Kraken Battle Shell armor proc.I don't know if it really happens, But I think that the ult is so op that's why wars kraken sword didnt't got the damage of kraken gun/bow.(even tho mostly runs at zodias can be done so fast without It)

Getting out of Topic, Just curious: when creating a New weapon for war, obviously ult is taken in consideration, but u ever needed to make the weapon less powerful for fit And not so broken well with ult?

This is a ask that i always wondered, and probably Wars procs could get same damage on weapons proc's at the Future If a Nerf on ult gotta be adressed.


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[Hexame]

The Warrior Ultimate doesn't need any changes at all.

The Nep Sword and Kraken Sword comparison was clearly known for sometime now, but with the adjustments that happened today, it does seem much better.

The Nep Sword just needs a nerf on the damage that the "Eel Shocks" are doing just so it's not dominating the Arcane Type Kraken Sword.

This way there will be a clear power comparison on what "Mythic Tier" equipment should be while being compared next to the "Arcane Tier" equipment such as the Kraken Sword

[Itzmemohsin]

The Warrior Ultimate doesn't need any changes at all.

The Nep Sword and Kraken Sword comparison was clearly known for sometime now, but with the adjustments that happened today, it does seem much better.

The Nep Sword just needs a nerf on the damage that the "Eel Shocks" are doing just so it's not dominating the Arcane Type Kraken Sword.

This way there will be a clear power comparison on what "Mythic Tier" equipment should be while being compared next to the "Arcane Tier" equipment such as the Kraken Sword
@Cinco

Do rarities even make any sense , just look at the pets some mythics are better than arcanes or heroics and vice versa , it's very messed up , that needs a more urgent fix. Rarities make literally no sense in the pets section atleast that's what I fell. And in overall the pets section is pretty messed up and confusing.

[umarrahim]

The Warrior Ultimate doesn't need any changes at all.

The Nep Sword and Kraken Sword comparison was clearly known for sometime now, but with the adjustments that happened today, it does seem much better.

The Nep Sword just needs a nerf on the damage that the "Eel Shocks" are doing just so it's not dominating the Arcane Type Kraken Sword.

This way there will be a clear power comparison on what "Mythic Tier" equipment should be while being compared next to the "Arcane Tier" equipment such as the Kraken SwordIf Neptaris + Ult can nuke bosses, what's the point of buying Kraken Sword? See the point?

You don't understand the problem with 6x STR ult. Right now the average warr has 2k STR, 6x that is 12k which is an increase of 10k STR correct?

Imagine in the future average Warr has 5k STR, 6x that is 30k STR. That's a 25k extra STR!

And when the average STR is 10k, 6x that is 60k, that's a 50k extra STR from the ultimate.

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[snakeeyes]

If Neptaris + Ult can nuke bosses, what's the point of buying Kraken Sword? See the point?

You don't understand the problem with 6x STR ult. Right now the average warr has 2k STR, 6x that is 12k which is an increase of 10k STR correct?

Imagine in the future average Warr has 5k STR, 6x that is 30k STR. That's a 25k extra STR!

And when the average STR is 10k, 6x that is 60k, that's a 50k extra STR from the ultimate.

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Now kraken sword is much better because of buffs see the difference, short cd, aoe damage on charge, 3 enemy hit by proc,

[mikesito]

Nerf kraken gun

[Perw]

are mage and rog weapons going to get a nerf? they not very good now, i dont want to imagine if they get nerfed

[Hexame]

If Neptaris + Ult can nuke bosses, what's the point of buying Kraken Sword? See the point?

You don't understand the problem with 6x STR ult. Right now the average warr has 2k STR, 6x that is 12k which is an increase of 10k STR correct?

Imagine in the future average Warr has 5k STR, 6x that is 30k STR. That's a 25k extra STR!

And when the average STR is 10k, 6x that is 60k, that's a 50k extra STR from the ultimate.

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This Ultimate was designed for a very long time now and I'm wondering why all of a sudden this Ultimate needs rework all of a sudden now.

I don't think STS will release a boss in the future that will get nuked so easily by a mere Warrior's Ultimate. I know players that finished up the entire Zodias Campaign before the Level 81 Arcane equipment even released and they haven't complained about Warrior's Ultimate at all

This Ultimate Skill is used in PvE and only in PvE where your working together with other players. Players should be glad a Warrior can do that and help out in damaging bosses. Your in PvE and your able to work together with that warrior.

This Ultimate Skill provides Hardcore Mode Warriors the damage they need to keep going and finishing up difficult maps in Hardcore Mode as well.

I'd agree that this Ultimate is really good compared to the other class Ultimates. I get what your trying to say but I don't think it really needs to be so nerfed to the point that us warriors feel like we just lost our best ultimate. I just don't think there needs to be any changes on this Ultimate since your going to be working with a warrior in a map eventually.

[Perw]

quick maths

[spityful17]

If Neptaris + Ult can nuke bosses, what's the point of buying Kraken Sword? See the point?

You don't understand the problem with 6x STR ult. Right now the average warr has 2k STR, 6x that is 12k which is an increase of 10k STR correct?

Imagine in the future average Warr has 5k STR, 6x that is 30k STR. That's a 25k extra STR!

And when the average STR is 10k, 6x that is 60k, that's a 50k extra STR from the ultimate.

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Fyi Warriors can't use ult all the time before we can use ult the boss is already dead killed by mage or rogue especially on portal zone


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[Thewolfbull]

Even without the Ultimate we've got a balance problem with the Mythic / Arcane Warrior weapons' damage output.

Warrior Ultimate makes the problem a lot worse - and I'm not opposed to reviewing it.

If you want to make kraken sword more useful make it able to do good damage without needing ultimate. Right now on portal bosses like ekenta and rahabkor a good mage/rogue party with kraken gear can do elite ekenta in 20-30 seconds which isn't enough time for ultimate to be ready so warrior doesn't do much there.

[will0]

Kraken gun is not aiming the boss proper on charge please take a look !

[Taughtmage]

In the interest of transparency: I am posting to announce that the Zodias Mythic weapons will very likely be nerfed in the near future.
For instance: the case has been made very clearly that proper use of the Neptaris sword makes it far better than its Arcane counterpart.

Zodias' power comes from a time when the activation methods were deemed too burdensome by the community. Now that players are in full command of these powers it is time to step back and rebalance.

We all agree neptaris should be worse than the kraken sword. That being said, right now kraken sword is the warriors only source of damage in elite zodias maps (without ultimate). This makes it very hard for warriors to get into good parties for gold farming (especially since the elite zodias maps don’t need tanking to be done). A group of 2-4 mages/rogues with kraken items can easily clear these maps, especially since so much of the damage is reflection / % of health based). This lack of ability for wars to deal good damage, especially to elite zodias bosses, creates an environment where only mages/rogues get invited to good parties for gold farming. This creates a distinct disadvantage and lack of playability for the warrior class at this point. Currently, all we have (since krak sword damage isnt enough), is neptaris. Neptaris is very hard to use in order to make it “op”. You need damage elixirs, haste pets, hotbars for switching to proc nept, then armor, then nept again. All this while mages and rouges just charge attack and the health of all bosses in the game disappear. Lot of words but basically, I think a neptaris nerf is uncalled for unless it comes with a kraken sword boss damage buff. There are a lot of ways you can make the kraken sword relevant in endgame, maybe an idea like a “kraken set bonus” that is specific to each class. Maybe like warriors get 50% boss damage in zodias maps. Or maybe make the bonuses that come from ring/belt/arti more helpfully for warrior when it comes to killing bosses. Maybe give the krak sword 1 main lightning strikes that does way more damage than the other few, smaller lightning strikes. I like the idea of “charging the sword procs 1 large lightning strike that deals massive single target damage” and “basic uncharged sword swipes have a chance to proc something similar to the AoE smaller lightning chains.” A lot of typing but i hope you consider my ideas. Thanks.


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[umarrahim]

If you want to make kraken sword more useful make it able to do good damage without needing ultimate. Right now on portal bosses like ekenta and rahabkor a good mage/rogue party with kraken gear can do elite ekenta in 20-30 seconds which isn't enough time for ultimate to be ready so warrior doesn't do much there.This is what I suggested. Increase the damage on Kraken Sword, in return Nerf the Warrior 6x STR ultimate.

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[Taughtmage]

2nd line fix *That being said, the only source of damage in elite zodias maps is neptaris, not kraken.

[Vvaffe]

We all agree neptaris should be worse than the kraken sword. That being said, right now kraken sword is the warriors only source of damage in elite zodias maps (without ultimate). This makes it very hard for warriors to get into good parties for gold farming (especially since the elite zodias maps don’t need tanking to be done). A group of 2-4 mages/rogues with kraken items can easily clear these maps, especially since so much of the damage is reflection / % of health based). This lack of ability for wars to deal good damage, especially to elite zodias bosses, creates an environment where only mages/rogues get invited to good parties for gold farming. This creates a distinct disadvantage and lack of playability for the warrior class at this point. Currently, all we have (since krak sword damage isnt enough), is neptaris. Neptaris is very hard to use in order to make it “op”. You need damage elixirs, haste pets, hotbars for switching to proc nept, then armor, then nept again. All this while mages and rouges just charge attack and the health of all bosses in the game disappear. Lot of words but basically, I think a neptaris nerf is uncalled for unless it comes with a kraken sword boss damage buff. There are a lot of ways you can make the kraken sword relevant in endgame, maybe an idea like a “kraken set bonus” that is specific to each class. Maybe like warriors get 50% boss damage in zodias maps. Or maybe make the bonuses that come from ring/belt/arti more helpfully for warrior when it comes to killing bosses. Maybe give the krak sword 1 main lightning strikes that does way more damage than the other few, smaller lightning strikes. I like the idea of “charging the sword procs 1 large lightning strike that deals massive single target damage” and “basic uncharged sword swipes have a chance to proc something similar to the AoE smaller lightning chains.” A lot of typing but i hope you consider my ideas. Thanks.


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well said. thumbs up. 100% agreeing to that one. Thanks for your comment!


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[Cinco]

What an excellent discussion! Congratulations on a thoroughly well-considered, respectful and insightful conversation. Here are my takeaways:

1. You've enlightened me to the fact that there are many important economic and social dimensions that must be considered before making adjustments to any of the Zodias Mythic weaponry. Extreme care must be taken with any 'nerfs' so that we don't disenfranchise players (or exacerbate existing rivalries that are causing bad player friction).

2. Zodias Mythic weapons + Kraken Battle Shell armor can align to be super OP. However this alignment is unreliable and strategically inferior to the Zodias Kraken Battle weapons' 100% proc on charge after cool-down. TBH I'm rather pleased that the Mythics have continued to be relevant so long after their release.

3. The most popular suggestion (and indeed the most fun) is to crank up the damage on the Kraken Battle Sword, making the weapon's initial hit much more powerful. The gap in DPS and Max Damage for Zodias 'Boss Killer' weapons for Rogues and Sorcerers is rather narrow. On the other hand, the gap between Warriors and Rogues and Sorcerers is rather large so there is room to buff Kraken Battle Sword damage without overtaking either of the other Class' gear (even with Rage Ultimate activated).

So TLDR; a modest Kraken Battle Sword damage buff will happen soon. Changes to Mythic 81 Weapons are not going to happen anytime soon. And assuming that everything goes well with our development schedule, Ultimate Skills for all Classes will be reviewed as part of our overall Class Skill Rework later this year.

Best wishes!

[Vvaffe]

What an excellent discussion! Congratulations on a thoroughly well-considered, respectful and insightful conversation. Here are my takeaways:

1. You've enlightened me to the fact that there are many important economic and social dimensions that must be considered before making adjustments to any of the Zodias Mythic weaponry. Extreme care must be taken with any 'nerfs' so that we don't disenfranchise players (or exacerbate existing rivalries that are causing bad player friction).

2. Zodias Mythic weapons + Kraken Battle Shell armor can align to be super OP. However this alignment is unreliable and strategically inferior to the Zodias Kraken Battle weapons' 100% proc on charge after cool-down. TBH I'm rather pleased that the Mythics have continued to be relevant so long after their release.

3. The most popular suggestion (and indeed the most fun) is to crank up the damage on the Kraken Battle Sword, making the weapon's initial hit much more powerful. The gap in DPS and Max Damage for Zodias 'Boss Killer' weapons for Rogues and Sorcerers is rather narrow. On the other hand, the gap between Warriors and Rogues and Sorcerers is rather large so there is room to buff Kraken Battle Sword damage without overtaking either of the other Class' gear (even with Rage Ultimate activated).

So TLDR; a modest Kraken Battle Sword damage buff will happen soon. Changes to Mythic 81 Weapons are not going to happen anytime soon. And assuming that everything goes well with our development schedule, Ultimate Skills for all Classes will be reviewed as part of our overall Class Skill Rework later this year.

Best wishes!

thanks!


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[Taughtmage]

What an excellent discussion! Congratulations on a thoroughly well-considered, respectful and insightful conversation. Here are my takeaways:

1. You've enlightened me to the fact that there are many important economic and social dimensions that must be considered before making adjustments to any of the Zodias Mythic weaponry. Extreme care must be taken with any 'nerfs' so that we don't disenfranchise players (or exacerbate existing rivalries that are causing bad player friction).

2. Zodias Mythic weapons + Kraken Battle Shell armor can align to be super OP. However this alignment is unreliable and strategically inferior to the Zodias Kraken Battle weapons' 100% proc on charge after cool-down. TBH I'm rather pleased that the Mythics have continued to be relevant so long after their release.

3. The most popular suggestion (and indeed the most fun) is to crank up the damage on the Kraken Battle Sword, making the weapon's initial hit much more powerful. The gap in DPS and Max Damage for Zodias 'Boss Killer' weapons for Rogues and Sorcerers is rather narrow. On the other hand, the gap between Warriors and Rogues and Sorcerers is rather large so there is room to buff Kraken Battle Sword damage without overtaking either of the other Class' gear (even with Rage Ultimate activated).

So TLDR; a modest Kraken Battle Sword damage buff will happen soon. Changes to Mythic 81 Weapons are not going to happen anytime soon. And assuming that everything goes well with our development schedule, Ultimate Skills for all Classes will be reviewed as part of our overall Class Skill Rework later this year.

Best wishes!

Approve of this greatly! What do you think of what I said about maybe different types of procs for the arc sword? Single target massive damage proc when charged, AoE lesser damage proc possibility when basic attacking (worse than aegis so aegis still has a role). I feel like having 2 possible procs on 1 weapon would be interesting


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[recilencia123]

Approve of this greatly! What do you think of what I said about maybe different types of procs for the arc sword? Single target massive damage proc when charged, AoE lesser damage proc possibility when basic attacking (worse than aegis so aegis still has a role). I feel like having 2 possible procs on 1 weapon would be interesting


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk-1 all good, just hope good damage buff

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[Cinco]

Approve of this greatly! What do you think of what I said about maybe different types of procs for the arc sword? Single target massive damage proc when charged, AoE lesser damage proc possibility when basic attacking (worse than aegis so aegis still has a role). I feel like having 2 possible procs on 1 weapon would be interesting


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Certainly would be interesting if done correctly - however, it's going to be extremely hard to balance such a similar proc between these two Arcanes. For it to be fair we'd need to come up with some sort of high-damage single target function for the Aegis... otherwise we're back to having one War weapon to rule them all :-)

I'm happier with the Sword and the Aegis having distinct roles for now. Thanks for the suggestion nevertheless!

[yerrisin]

This Ultimate was designed for a very long time now and I'm wondering why all of a sudden this Ultimate needs rework all of a sudden now.

I don't think STS will release a boss in the future that will get nuked so easily by a mere Warrior's Ultimate. I know players that finished up the entire Zodias Campaign before the Level 81 Arcane equipment even released and they haven't complained about Warrior's Ultimate at all

This Ultimate Skill is used in PvE and only in PvE where your working together with other players. Players should be glad a Warrior can do that and help out in damaging bosses. Your in PvE and your able to work together with that warrior.

This Ultimate Skill provides Hardcore Mode Warriors the damage they need to keep going and finishing up difficult maps in Hardcore Mode as well.

I'd agree that this Ultimate is really good compared to the other class Ultimates. I get what your trying to say but I don't think it really needs to be so nerfed to the point that us warriors feel like we just lost our best ultimate. I just don't think there needs to be any changes on this Ultimate since your going to be working with a warrior in a map eventually.exactly. This is what any warrior who knows what he is talking about would say.

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[umarrahim]

Certainly would be interesting if done correctly - however, it's going to be extremely hard to balance such a similar proc between these two Arcanes. For it to be fair we'd need to come up with some sort of high-damage single target function for the Aegis... otherwise we're back to having one War weapon to rule them all :-)

I'm happier with the Sword and the Aegis having distinct roles for now. Thanks for the suggestion nevertheless!I believe the sword buff without reducing anything in compensation was just a win-win, and not balance.

Warrior's shouldn't be doing same damage as other classes without ultimate on top of nuking bosses in 1 sec with their ult ready.

It just makes them the best without any downside?

If all classes should be balanced then warrior ultimate needs to be looked at right now. Big changes can be made later.

Kraken Sword is the only 'Boss Killer' kraken weapon that benefits from Warrior Ult.

I believe testing a 4x STR ultimate would be a good place to start in compensation for the Kraken Sword plain buffs.

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[mikesito]

I have a question for the mage/rogue that r crying in what does 6x ult affects you? It help us lol you guys just hate war for no reason. Can't you think about the hardcore wars?

[capeo]

I find it hilarious people care that with an ultimate wars can kill bosses. 90% of the time my ultimate isn't even charged for the boss. Never in portals. I am only able to use it if I run solo anyway. So why does it bother people? If I run a map solo it's 4x as long as a rogue or mage. So it's not a timed map issue. It's irrelevant in pvp so it's not direct competition. So even with this op ulti it takes me longer and has no effect on anyone else in a competitive way. What is the downside to the other classes? Would they trade 75% of their damage for an eventual ultimate that allows them to nuke a boss? It makes no sense at all.

I was running rahab and all I did is kill the mini. Rogues and mages killed the boss. It's hit or miss with procs and pet aa if I can get through a stage but the rogues and mages brought his health to 0 before he reset for the next stage. My ulti never charged so i was useless. Where is the balance in that?

Honestly I'm so sick of it idc if they nerf the ultimate. It's not like I can keep up anyway. Wars aren't needed to actually tank or keep a party alive and in pvp can't survive the massive damage the other classes do with similar stats. Oh and I don't do enough damage to actually kill anyone.

So God forbid I can nuke a boss running solo after taking 10 minutes to clear a map....

[snakeeyes]

Imagine you can tank, heal, pull mobs and kill easily, short cd skill because of haste, kill boss without rage because of buffs weapon with 12sec cd big advantage to new map, lets all change to warior class.

[snakeeyes]

Certainly would be interesting if done correctly - however, it's going to be extremely hard to balance such a similar proc between these two Arcanes. For it to be fair we'd need to come up with some sort of high-damage single target function for the Aegis... otherwise we're back to having one War weapon to rule them all :-)

I'm happier with the Sword and the Aegis having distinct roles for now. Thanks for the suggestion nevertheless!

@Cinco warior after buffs is just a sven GOD STRENGTH mode maybe the buffs that you put on kraken sword just like a dusk sword that sacrifice - hp and -armor at least 50% so they feel the pain of a rogue when running on a hard map?

[Cinco]

@Cinco warior after buffs is just a sven GOD STRENGTH mode maybe the buffs that you put on kraken sword just like a dusk sword that sacrifice - hp and -armor at least 50% so they feel the pain of a rogue when running on a hard map?

I don't understand what you're saying. Can you rephrase? Thanks.

[snakeeyes]

I don't understand what you're saying. Can you rephrase? Thanks.

If kraken sword will buffs equivalent to bow and gun they can do all they want without the help of other class, all of warior player want to be just like assasin tank, i remember 1 sword that has a sacrifice the armor and healt (dusk sword) powerful sword but weak on armor because of minus armor when you equip maybe you can make the buffs just like that, sory for the bad english.

[Cinco]

If kraken sword will buffs equivalent to bow and gun they can do all they want without the help of other class, all of warior player want to be just like assasin tank, i remember 1 sword that has a sacrifice the armor and healt (dusk sword) powerful sword but weak on armor because of minus armor when you equip maybe you can make the buffs just like that, sory for the bad english.

Thank you for rephrasing!

To be clear: they're not going to be equivalent to the bow and gun.

I wrote details of what I'm planning a few posts up ^

Best wishes!

[snakeeyes]

Thank you for rephrasing!

To be clear: they're not going to be equivalent to the bow and gun.

I wrote details of what I'm planning a few posts up ^

Best wishes!

Oh i see thanks for clarifying, we agree to buffs for that krak sword. Ik you do all to the class balance just like we achieve now. Thanks.

[Taughtmage]

I believe the sword buff without reducing anything in compensation was just a win-win, and not balance.

Warrior's shouldn't be doing same damage as other classes without ultimate on top of nuking bosses in 1 sec with their ult ready.

It just makes them the best without any downside?

If all classes should be balanced then warrior ultimate needs to be looked at right now. Big changes can be made later.

Kraken Sword is the only 'Boss Killer' kraken weapon that benefits from Warrior Ult.

I believe testing a 4x STR ultimate would be a good place to start in compensation for the Kraken Sword plain buffs.

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Lol this argument is void because rogues and mages don’t even need ulti to wipe elite zodias boss health. They do it with 1500 stats alone. Warrs on the other hand need to get enough kills for ultimate, or have like 3k str and use nept proc switching (very hard to do consistently in zodias maps). And warrs are dying just as much as mages and rogues in these zodias maps because so much damage is %health based or reflected from damage dealt. Warriors are a little bit more survivable than rogues and mages (thanks to heal, which mages also have for rahabakor ending so warr isnt needed there) but WAY less effective at clearing maps. This is why warr gear is the cheapest AND why decent warriors cant get invited to good endgame parties to farm. Legit people stand in town and say “pt elite rahabakor kraken bow or gun.” Warriors don’t even get considered. We don’t want to 1 shot bosses, we just want to be able to farm with the mages and rogues. Having to farm mob kills to build ultimate to be able to kill the boss in a map is not a fun or efficient experience. Nerfing the ultimate on top of that just doesnt make sense imo.


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[Taughtmage]

I find it hilarious people care that with an ultimate wars can kill bosses. 90% of the time my ultimate isn't even charged for the boss. Never in portals. I am only able to use it if I run solo anyway. So why does it bother people? If I run a map solo it's 4x as long as a rogue or mage. So it's not a timed map issue. It's irrelevant in pvp so it's not direct competition. So even with this op ulti it takes me longer and has no effect on anyone else in a competitive way. What is the downside to the other classes? Would they trade 75% of their damage for an eventual ultimate that allows them to nuke a boss? It makes no sense at all.

I was running rahab and all I did is kill the mini. Rogues and mages killed the boss. It's hit or miss with procs and pet aa if I can get through a stage but the rogues and mages brought his health to 0 before he reset for the next stage. My ulti never charged so i was useless. Where is the balance in that?

Honestly I'm so sick of it idc if they nerf the ultimate. It's not like I can keep up anyway. Wars aren't needed to actually tank or keep a party alive and in pvp can't survive the massive damage the other classes do with similar stats. Oh and I don't do enough damage to actually kill anyone.

So God forbid I can nuke a boss running solo after taking 10 minutes to clear a map....

IKR lol. “Its no fair warrior kills boss 1.5 seconds faster than me when they have their ult”

Meanwhile: warrior taking 90 seconds longer in the map in order to build up that 1.5 second advantage on killing the boss.

The proof is in the pudding. Warrior gear costs the least by far for a reason. It’s not because there is “more warrior gear” (we would expect based on probability for there to be the same amount items in the game for each class, ie. 1/6 of kraken weapons are swords). It’s the slowest and least efficient class. Rogues and mages clear maps way faster, as proven by leaderboard parties, therefore they make more gold per min/hour. All of this coupled with the lack of need for a tank in an endgame party because of how invincible mages and rogues are with krak procs, and we have a class that definitely needs some buffs to keep up.


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[Taughtmage]

If kraken sword will buffs equivalent to bow and gun they can do all they want without the help of other class, all of warior player want to be just like assasin tank, i remember 1 sword that has a sacrifice the armor and healt (dusk sword) powerful sword but weak on armor because of minus armor when you equip maybe you can make the buffs just like that, sory for the bad english.

Imo, in the current endgame state (boss damage/elite damage is the most important factor in your efficiency for running), a warrior with 2.5k str and 60% of damage elixirs with an arc sword should do as much damage to bosses as a 2k dex/int rog/mage with no elixirs. Right now, arc sword even with way 25% more stats and 60% more dmg with elixirs, does like 1/3 of what bow/gun do. If warriors have to buff themselves and get way better awakes to do just 1/3-1/2 of the damage that mages and rogues are doing, the classes are imbalanced.


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[Rasor]

Imo, in the current endgame state (boss damage/elite damage is the most important factor in your efficiency for running), a warrior with 2.5k str and 60% of damage elixirs with an arc sword should do as much damage to bosses as a 2k dex/int rog/mage with no elixirs. Right now, arc sword even with way 25% more stats and 60% more dmg with elixirs, does like 1/3 of what bow/gun do. If warriors have to buff themselves and get way better awakes to do just 1/3-1/2 of the damage that mages and rogues are doing, the classes are imbalanced.


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+100


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[Cherybom]

Please value rogue characters now. While there are vigilant effects for warrior and kershal vanity effects for mage, there are no special effects for rogue characters. Also an effect for kraken artif can be nice.

[recilencia123]

Imo, in the current endgame state (boss damage/elite damage is the most important factor in your efficiency for running), a warrior with 2.5k str and 60% of damage elixirs with an arc sword should do as much damage to bosses as a 2k dex/int rog/mage with no elixirs. Right now, arc sword even with way 25% more stats and 60% more dmg with elixirs, does like 1/3 of what bow/gun do. If warriors have to buff themselves and get way better awakes to do just 1/3-1/2 of the damage that mages and rogues are doing, the classes are imbalanced.


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkNah u wrong, test first then comment

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[Rasor]

This “buff” of the sword should have been done when it first came out, damage buff is needed on the sword forsure and I’m fr curious do devs just not play warrior class at all?( not being toxic or anything just being realistic like do y’all just ignore warrior class?)


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[Taughtmage]

Nah u wrong, test first then comment

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I test warrior daily unfortunately! You can pt me if u wanna see how much dmg krak sword does with 185% dmg elixirs and 2.2k str :). It’s very disappointing.


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[Epm2701]

Am I the only one thinking, just do the upgrade on "Kraken Sword"... instead of taking steps to lower the ability of "Neptaris" ??? Your move obviously made "Warrior" even more useless than before. Aren't you satisfied to see that the "warrior" doesn't get party friends to do farming???

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[Cinco]

Am I the only one thinking, just do the upgrade on "Kraken Sword"... instead of taking steps to lower the ability of "Neptaris" ??? Your move obviously made "Warrior" even more useless than before. Aren't you satisfied to see that the "warrior" doesn't get party friends to do farming???

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No. Several players aren’t bothering to read my more recent summary / comments. You’re not alone :-)


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[Cinco]

Closing to give you a chance to read my verdict on this.

Best wishes!


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