Dodge or armor?

[Superdexme]

For a lvl 35 bear with a shield (copper,swamp etc) is it better to have as much armor (+30 buff) or the 2 dodge buffs... What's better?

[Blind]

dodge

no need to elaborate

[Chickenrunnn]

Definitly dodge :)

[Back]

Dodge

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[Bunnyshoota]

For a lvl 35 bear with a shield (copper,swamp etc) is it better to have as much armor (+30 buff) or the 2 dodge buffs... What's better?

Dodge. With copper, ring, dodge face, buffs, (taunt and evade) you can have well over 40 dodge. Would you rather get hit multiple times at maybe 20 less damage or just not get hit?

[cookiez]

Dodge

[Superdexme]

Based on everyone's answer.....I'm going with armor. JK lol dodge it is :) thanks for the help

[Bunnyshoota]

Based on everyone's answer.....I'm going with armor. JK lol dodge it is :) thanks for the help

Np :)
If you need help with gear or skills, shoot me a pm

[FluffNStuff]

This is an interesting question. Out of curiosity, what is your current armor, and what is the average damage that level 35 Player would hit you with?

[Zapoke]

This is an interesting question. Out of curiosity, what is your current armor, and what is the average damage that level 35 Player would hit you with?

Copperhead set has about 80 armor (Without an armor ring).

[FluffNStuff]

Copperhead set has about 80 armor (Without an armor ring).

I assume the point of this bear is to fight a VooDoo mage, so does anyone know what their general damage is, say from skills?

[FluffNStuff]

Actually, we can run the numbers, and put up a damage barrier for when one would be better.

So Bear has 80 Armor to start.
Mage Average Damage = X
Iron Armor = 30 Armor
Evade = 12 Dodge
Taunt = 16 Dodge when used effectively
(Will run em separate, since they are 6 skill points against six skill points)

The effect of Iron armor is obvious, it is 30 points of damage reduction.

Now for the dodge.
Dodge effect = Chance to wipe out ACTUAL damage (after current armor, since that part would have been absorbed anyway)
Evade = .12 * (X - 80)
Taunt = .16 * (X - 80)

So, for these to be better then Iron Armor:
Evade, X > 330
Taunt, X > 267.5

If You did want to compare them together, then X > 187

[Zapoke]

Actually, we can run the numbers, and put up a damage barrier for when one would be better.

So Bear has 80 Armor to start.
Mage Average Damage = X
Iron Armor = 30 Armor
Evade = 12 Dodge
Taunt = 16 Dodge when used effectively
(Will run em separate, since they are 6 skill points against six skill points)

The effect of Iron armor is obvious, it is 30 points of damage reduction.

Now for the dodge.
Dodge effect = Chance to wipe out ACTUAL damage (after current armor, since that part would have been absorbed anyway)
Evade = .12 * (X - 80)
Taunt = .16 * (X - 80)

So, for these to be better then Iron Armor:
Evade, X > 330
Taunt, X > 267.5

If You did want to compare them together, then X > 187

Not sure how to get the "average" Voodoo damage, but I can give you the spell damage/auto damage from my voodoo mage (all level 6 spells) with 67 dex/112 int using the voodoo set with a brainfreeze eye.
Auto damage: 99-124
Frostbite (6): 132-171
Drain (6): 187-292
Fire (6): 157-238
Lightning: (6): 152-246

Pre-Forgottens, this was the "average" voodoo set up. (not the spell damage, obviously). Blessing of Might adds approx. 35 damage to all spells as well.

[FluffNStuff]

Not sure how to get the "average" Voodoo damage, but I can give you the spell damage/auto damage from my voodoo mage (all level 6 spells) with 67 dex/112 int using the voodoo set with a brainfreeze eye.
Auto damage: 99-124
Frostbite (6): 132-171
Drain (6): 187-292
Fire (6): 157-238
Lightning: (6): 152-246

Pre-Forgottens, this was the "average" voodoo set up. (not the spell damage, obviously). Blessing of Might adds approx. 35 damage to all spells as well.

Taking crits into account ... it is a toss up. But since there is another part of the equation that did not really come in because the bear has little starting dodge, the more dodge you have, the less armor you need (no need to block dodged shots) and the more armor you have the less dodge (only dodge the difference). So what does this mean? Get both and alternate.

[Whirlzap]

Pure INT/Part DEX Voodoo Mages are capable of hitting ~200-350 damage critical hits.
Since L6 Crit Buff adds 60% Crit, assume it'll be criticals most of the time.
Your bear should stack dodge, since armor doesn't help when a mage is doing 200+ almost all of the time.

[Zeus]

I prefer armor, here's why:

When you're a debuff bear at L35 PvP, your armor buffs grow exponentially powerful.

Why? When you land that crushing blow and hell scream, you're looking at more than -80 damage. Okay, so a copperhead bear has 80 armor unbuffed, right? Iron Blood should be maxed at 6, giving +32 armor or something (it's been a while, correct me if I'm wrong). THEN, without taking debuffs into account, you're at 112 armor buffed, along with a little dodge to help out here and there (given from the set and attributes).

112 armor & damage of a voodoo mage is 190-200ish. Then counter in those debuffs...

Consider debuffs to act as an armor booster, to make it simpler to understand...

-80 damage means, if you're 192 armor (112+80 due to the negative damage rebuffs) & a mage does 200 damage or so per spell? What's the difference? 200-192? That's 8 damage per spell, hardly anything.

The thing about this build is this though...

YOU HAVE TO LAND THOSE DEBUFFS on the mage, or else it is all gone to waste. Now, back when I used to L35 PvP, that was pretty easy for me to do.

Suggestion:

Forgotten bow has a negative hit percent debuff with it's auto attack proc, known as blinding proc. Use this to your advantage.

Since you're low on armor while wearing a bow, a slight armor boost won't help, it'll only help if you're already high in armor such as in the copperhead build.

Then, go for a dodge build, coupled with a strong debuff build. You should see how effective it is with voodoo mages if used correctly.

[Twinklaser]

Some general pair of defense skills you want to try and factor.

Evade+Taunt

Iron Blood+Crushing Blow

Taunt+Iron Blood

Taunt+Crushing Blow



Crushing Blow is better than iron blood in close range due to the higher damage deductability, is unhealable, and has a quick cooldown.

One often overlooked feature of taunt is that the 16 dodge stays with you even after ll the other buffs worn off.