!!! Al trade manipulation explained !!!

[dangibg]

Its long but read it if you want to know whats really going on in AL.


Repeat a lie 100 times and it will become truth, just keep making more posts “Sell ghost 15b” or “Sell Bugface 12b” some fish will bite eventually, or maybe it will be someone related to them (maybe friend) and they will pretend deal is done, seller will say ghost sold 15b when nothing happened and seller will try sell again from alt in 2 month and ask 18b because “last sold 15b”

People do that all the time, I’ve been long enough in the market (almost 4 years no breaks) to know that. Most obviously manipulated items rn are Rhine and Frank, its not ultimately rare, its just few people have few sets/auras and some are friends with each other and help each other increase the price.

I know i will get crucified here by the owners of these items for exposing what was known to few, but if its known to at least few ppl more its worth it :)

!!! Here are some facts about Frank recent sales, I’ve been personally interested so i kept record- I’m not going to say names but i have screenshots with ign for EVERYTHING i list below



Frank seller 7b at 20th May

Frank seller 8.5b or Rhine + 3b 19th June (fake) , ends up pretending selling for few pcs bs items that are worth 6 but they also own many of these and try to manipulate both prices simultaneously. Other details :
1 - fake seller tells me to go buy rhine from his friend who sells rhine and buy his frank after (probably disappear after i buy rhine)
2 - fake seller wants 8.5b, fake buyer says he paid 11.5b in items, refuses to tell what items (fake seller tells me the items anyway, a bit of bad team work here)

Frank seller 10b, 17th July (fake) - tells me he want only pure ! ends up pretending selling for.. wait for it.. few pcs of exactly the same bs item that they pretended to sell Frank for on 19th June too!!
Weird? Keep in mind we talk about Mage Godfire lmfao how more obvious it can be? Everybody knows that 1-2 ppl have 80% of Godfire mage sets, we all know that nobody offers shjt for this set too, and how come 2 Frank sellers decide to take these few of these sets and value them like 2.5-3b each more than x2 normal price. Note that both Frank sellers were alt acc lvl 7-10 no pve, nothing only Frank. Can’t be more eye opening. And these people do this thing for years, and yes, thats very bannable.

Btw if sts are interested in seeing the screenshots and fixing one of the main aspects of the game let me know below or pm me il send all the chats i have.


Ign ~ Danrog

[Itzmemohsin]

Tbh trade manipulation is a part of the game and everyone should be aware of it and that's a part of the strategy in game , they can't just keep banning people who indulge in such activities [pretty sure most people attempt to indulge in some kind of manipulation in game ], what you are talking is vanities that are rare , the part of those items being rare , old and costly is what makes them extremely desirable, just good looks don't matter as much .

[QuaseT]

Everybody who has the gold to buy stuff like this knows about it. I honestly do not care about their pricing, manipulation or whatever they are doing. People who do this land on my ignore and I won't buy items from them no matter the price.
It's just annoying to see the so many identical threads about someone selling one and the same item on forums over and over again (Bc obviously nobodys gonna buy it). Maybe sts could just advance the ignore option so that threads of these people are hidden even in the overview list of traders market. That way we can just completely ignore those threads/people.

[asommers]

Tough topic, but I won't shy away from it. I don't really see an easy way to prevent this. It doesn't make sense to ban players for lying, and we have no way of knowing if players are telling the truth on various claims.

If we removed player trade and replaced it with an auction bidding system, players would then be able to see auction history and make their own determination, but then we'd have to implement an auction bidding system.

As long as there's anonymous free trade, you'll have to put up with this. Pay what you think the item is worth, not what someone else says it's worth.

-ALS

[HappyDINO]

-1 to trade removal ,
suggestion to auc bidding . how about a new button in current auc that is named ( items price check ) . by pressing this button players be able to type name of the specific item they wanna know about through a search bar . and then they get the info about previous 30 days info about the said item .
i think this would be a much healthy solution to the issue .

another thing we can add is another option with buy , sell , REQUEST : in request u get a search bar and u search the item u need ( in case of gear u can specify a discription e.g 20%move movemnt speed awake ) . and then it will post an item request list just like an item listed in ( buy ). this will cost then 5% fee of price they wanna offer . and sellers can chose a listed request and post there item in it .. person who requested will get notified ( request met x1 , 2 ,3 etc ) then they can come and chose one request they want and pay the gold ( provided when they make request e.g xxx item for 1m gold 1m gold + tax be taken and stored in auc . and if the request is cancelled they lose tax and get 1m back , and in case they chose an option from seller sale is made instently .

Happydino

[tapsykrete]

for me i buy what i want i dont care what is worth or price. Just keep grinding, gold easy to hunt now :)

[tripexxx]

History of Auction sales for Everyone to see would be nice
+1

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[Tekila]

Its long but read it if you want to know whats really going on in AL.


Repeat a lie 100 times and it will become truth, just keep making more posts “Sell ghost 15b” or “Sell Bugface 12b” some fish will bite eventually, or maybe it will be someone related to them (maybe friend) and they will pretend deal is done, seller will say ghost sold 15b when nothing happened and seller will try sell again from alt in 2 month and ask 18b because “last sold 15b”

People do that all the time, I’ve been long enough in the market (almost 4 years no breaks) to know that. Most obviously manipulated items rn are Rhine and Frank, its not ultimately rare, its just few people have few sets/auras and some are friends with each other and help each other increase the price.

I know i will get crucified here by the owners of these items for exposing what was known to few, but if its known to at least few ppl more its worth it :)

!!! Here are some facts about Frank recent sales, I’ve been personally interested so i kept record- I’m not going to say names but i have screenshots with ign for EVERYTHING i list below



Frank seller 7b at 20th May

Frank seller 8.5b or Rhine + 3b 19th June (fake) , ends up pretending selling for few pcs bs items that are worth 6 but they also own many of these and try to manipulate both prices simultaneously. Other details :
1 - fake seller tells me to go buy rhine from his friend who sells rhine and buy his frank after (probably disappear after i buy rhine)
2 - fake seller wants 8.5b, fake buyer says he paid 11.5b in items, refuses to tell what items (fake seller tells me the items anyway, a bit of bad team work here)

Frank seller 10b, 17th July (fake) - tells me he want only pure ! ends up pretending selling for.. wait for it.. few pcs of exactly the same bs item that they pretended to sell Frank for on 19th June too!!
Weird? Keep in mind we talk about Mage Godfire lmfao how more obvious it can be? Everybody knows that 1-2 ppl have 80% of Godfire mage sets, we all know that nobody offers shjt for this set too, and how come 2 Frank sellers decide to take these few of these sets and value them like 2.5-3b each more than x2 normal price. Note that both Frank sellers were alt acc lvl 7-10 no pve, nothing only Frank. Can’t be more eye opening. And these people do this thing for years, and yes, thats very bannable.

Btw if sts are interested in seeing the screenshots and fixing one of the main aspects of the game let me know below or pm me il send all the chats i have.


Ign ~ Danrog

I totally confirm that.
They are people with no ethic that shamelessly lie to your face to overprice their gear using methods that are truly unhealthy and unfriendly.
Same goes to the force sword wep for war, I can tell by just reading the thread that the guy selling it uses 2 accounts or just a friend to fake bid to 200 then 250m for a bad awak one and spamming « still selling » because none offered the same lol (I can bet that if I offer 249 he will sell it as fast as possible). Once I got a guy ingame shamelessly using my friend’s name telling that he offered him 300m for his one this methods involving lying should be bannable and highly tracked for the ethic in game just by getting his message history would be enough for devs to know if he tried lies. But maybe it is too much efforts for one ethical value that is not that important for everyone.

I understand that In one hand the issue is due to the open trades market that lacks of regulation to give more freedom to players but on another hand it is because the game lacks on supply for those items.

Moreover one item above 100 million is already a big joke but items above 1 billions are just a proof that the economy is a mess.
It would be cool that we impose limitation to how much gold people can save because it is too easy. Big whales will stay big whales forever. Like 1b gold max in an account would be fine forcing people to invest in items instead of keeping it in stash and inventory.
Big whales are also a reason why price manipulation works, because we know that there are players that are able to afford those irrational prices they may think that they are possible or even common so they try it. I would say it’s time to nerf their method to stay over rich for more fairness.


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[asommers]

There have been many threads on item auction history (latest (https://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?709101-Transaction-History)), but even that can be manipulated with a quick listing and subsequent purchase.

I even implemented a high/low/average, but we scrapped it based on feedback (link (https://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?648000-Feedback-Auction-Statistics&highlight=Auction+history)).

You will just need to remain vigilant.

-ALS

[Zfan]

To be honest, I simply just ignore players who set ridiculous prices on items/gears. If I see blatant price manipulation happening, I report it to support.

[Savitar]

Imagine how ridiculous it is to pay 15b in mage ghost hahahahaha these types of players have **** in their heads

[Encryptions]

Kraken vests for rog were amusing, before the catacombs they were 130m ea, then people wanted to rise their price up to 230m and now those same people are trying to sell their vests for 100m or so.

[Oawaoebi]

There’s is something players neither want devs to know about these pricings. It is used to hide in real life gold trading. When someone sells his ghost set for 20b everyone who has the gold knows it’s not worth it. So either someone is desperated or stupid enough.

But let’s look it from the more interesting part. There are a few players who use overpriced or underpriced trades to make irl transactions. For example give me 5b gold and 2k real life money I’ll give you Medusa set. Hiding an irl transaction behind an in game trade. This way players keep on buying and selling gold or items or whatever.

Now you gonna say why would someone make it this big to hide an irl transaction. Well let me explain. The more know about it the better. It makes a big tralala and everybody believes the trade is either been done legit and someone was stupid enough or believes it’s fake sale and later the item returns somewhere cheaper … .

A Goldsale is not bigly published because Theres many who would instantly trade it. But buying gold is kept big to make it look clean and that it gets the needed attention. These deals are made on main where you don’t trade suspicious level 5 characters in Garetta village. Making an obviously overepriced thread gets the attention of the people they want. They know they just can’t go with it on Facebook because of the risk of a snitch, undercover dev and whatever other possibility could happen. So when a random goldseller then sees the thread he knows he has to act. He knows who the person is and in which groups out of sts control they are active. There is Facebook telegram line and instagram. That’s these I have heard of. So the seller messages the item seller and they chat up and agree on price. Now comes the important safe part for them. If the goldseller wants to snitch on that person he can’t. Posting on forums with proof is against tos. Saying in thread will be called jealouse player who wants to harm someone and so on. This protects the item seller from being exposed and banned. Can’t be touched.


You now pretty sure wonder where I got these informations. I am going to tell you. I am absolutely clean in the game and always been can always check it.

A player who quitted about half year to year ago told me about this. He told me he was deeply involved into the black market and knew these tricks to keep gold buying and selling safe on main characters.


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[Oszn]

Noiicee , i need to comment so i unluck post lol

[KarTik1]

There have been many threads on item auction history (latest (https://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?709101-Transaction-History)), but even that can be manipulated with a quick listing and subsequent purchase.

I even implemented a high/low/average, but we scrapped it based on feedback (link (https://www.spacetimestudios.com/showthread.php?648000-Feedback-Auction-Statistics&highlight=Auction+history)).

You will just need to remain vigilant.

-ALS

I think it can be solved with a simple fix but this is kind of not possible too.
Assomers is it really ethical to sell an item over 1 b gold?
If a player limit is set by you he can not hold more then 1 b .
Make a simple fix like no one can add items if you are paying curtain amount of gold .
Like if i add over 500m in a single trade add item button will disappear.
It will temporarily block such acts but will hurt some players .
But in reality we all know that no item should worth more them current gold cap .


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[KarTik1]

If something is digital it should not be super rare that it is breaking the game laws.


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[QuaseT]

I think it can be solved with a simple fix but this is kind of not possible too.
Assomers is it really ethical to sell an item over 1 b gold?
If a player limit is set by you he can not hold more then 1 b .
Make a simple fix like no one can add items if you are paying curtain amount of gold .
Like if i add over 500m in a single trade add item button will disappear.
It will temporarily block such acts but will hurt some players .
But in reality we all know that no item should worth more them current gold cap .


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkPeople will just get scammed then by trying to find ways around that via mid-man trading or irl transactions.

[Hiabacihan]

+1 for the auction feature

[dangibg]

Can any admin move this topic to the “AL General Discussion” channel? It seems like i have missclicked and made it in an inappropriate place, just noticed, thanks in advance!


Ign ~ Danrog

[Itzmemohsin]

Can any admin move this topic to the “AL General Discussion” channel? It seems like i have missclicked and made it in an inappropriate place, just noticed, thanks in advance!


Ign ~ DanrogBro you had put it in general discussion, some dev transferred it here , I know for a fact coz i was the first one to comment [emoji28]

[dangibg]

Bro you had put it in general discussion, some dev transferred it here , I know for a fact coz i was the first one to comment [emoji28]

I hope they put it back there, this is not a suggestion nor a feedback. This is an open for discussion topic affecting general part of AL (trading) and is also for informational purposes.


Ign ~ Danrog

[Roguemaybe]

I mean, at least they are paying attention to this issue, and hopefully after the big expansion, this would be addressed.




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[Immortal_Blood]

i made a video on how to do this, sorry :D

more so to give some people awareness than to use it but i guess it is a double edged sword

lol

[ItsTheCat]

Funny how you over price things all the time and want to talk about price manipulation.

It’s true some people do create fake offers, fake posts when they don’t own the item. However, that’s all clutter. I’ve been in this market since 2013. Things are changing exponentially. What it comes down to is

Owner of item = chooses price to sell.
It’s really that simple

There is no longer a “market price” for items that are LB, and limited in game.

Here’s the facts anyone concerned with “market price” or “what a rare item is worth” and claiming manipulation. Please find another seller quit wasting your energy. If you cannot find another seller for the item you want either buy it or quit trying to lower the TRUE sellers price by claiming manipulation and getting a bunch of people to gang up and state it’s worth less.

[ItsTheCat]

I do agree some items have jumped in huge ways but we cannot control what people want to price things at if it’s their items. Me on the other hand I’m known to price things a year in advance. Lmao has to be worth my while to sell.
I over price things too, and I also OVERPAY when I want something because I CAN. I don’t complain or claim manipulation. I JUST DONT BUY when it looks overwhelming in price. I also UNDERSELL when I want to sell something fast.

Just go with the flow y’all.

And for those who do truly make fake accounts and offers and claim to have items; not cool.

[Tekila]

I do agree some items have jumped in huge ways but we cannot control what people want to price things at if it’s their items. Me on the other hand I’m known to price things a year in advance. Lmao has to be worth my while to sell.
I over price things too, and I also OVERPAY when I want something because I CAN. I don’t complain or claim manipulation. I JUST DONT BUY when it looks overwhelming in price. I also UNDERSELL when I want to sell something fast.

Just go with the flow y’all.

And for those who do truly make fake accounts and offers and claim to have items; not cool.

That’s the game.
But I can assure you that there are lot of people who use multiple ingame and forum account and that lie to make fake current offer on their rare items that aren’t supplied enough to make it’s price rise.
And to make it amazing they buy almost all of the items available with their friends so they create the need.
It’s used in almost all games but on AL it creates a complete mess when no event is running because of the supply in gear method that is heavily monetised and lacking.
But anyway what you say is half true. Except that there is the « psychological price » at wich people buy an item. And those people who use unethical methods are easy to identify because their items are almost never sold and never sold.
Sometime they just continue again and again and change items and do it again with the same item few days later just blocking the items people need. The best way to acquire some items now because of the supplying system and this unethical method is just to buy plats and gamble on loot boxes leading to a real « pay to win » or « pay to not be blocked by some scammers in your game »


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[Blessful]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20231002/f2ce6e459f554021256849ec13ff9e88.jpg

Thought this was funny


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