Stacking items on star beast

[Voorge]

Can stacked primary stats be removed anytime when we put star beast set on. With current system it doesn’t make any difference since you still can stack it up with kraken set + 71 item on and when you’re done just carry on with a star beast.
I don’t see it being much of a problem to change current system since 71 items are way outdated anyway.

[|Ares|]

In general just remove the thing with endless stacking stats using the items for like 5 years ago because they've already served their purpose gameplay wise. Scores on various leaderboards have always been affected by that.

[AgentStonoga]

Today I've realized that we're not able to stack with 71lvl arcanes when we have starbeast set bonus on. It's probably due to rogue and warrior discrimination with full set, cause mage would be able to stack with full starbeast set (cause there's no starbeast amulet). Wouldn't it be better to let us stack in a 3/6 set and not allow it in a 6/6 set? Otherwise we would have to use zaarus set to stack stats which is discriminating rogues, cause belt is a part of set. 71lvl arcanes were useful (which was good because we didn't have to always rely on the newest gear) in some cases, now their fate is unknown. Now some maps would require even less strategy, making game even simpler.
@Cinco @asommers

[Voorge]

-1 for the idea,

Zaarus isn’t mandatory as for a dmg set, kraken dmg sets exist, so it’s not really an argument.

Rather remove outdated item from capped gameplay since it’s been like what, 3 expansions ago?

There is no skill whatsoever in using different belt, amu or ring until certain wave to stack some primary stats.

[asommers]

What problem does this solve?

-ALS

[Voorge]

What problem does this solve?

-ALS

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20231219/6a04105f3f8f9740cb02b070c4c39e46.jpg

Cinco did mention what’s up on the screen shot.
In simple words 71 gears still stack, but not on star beast set. Yet you can stack the stats with a similar set stat wise (which would be kraken) and once you’re done swap to star. What’s the point honestly.

Problem: the thing you implement has flaws and isn’t really making any difference for a person with various gears.

Solution: just drop the 71 items out of the rotation because they are not necessary.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

it doesn't solve any problem. They're dirt cheap gears anyone can use to incorporate into their gameplay, popularly used ever since on every wave map - which utilizes the gears feature of stacking infinitely.

[Voorge]

it doesn't solve any problem. They're dirt cheap gears anyone can use to incorporate into their gameplay, popularly used ever since on every wave map - which utilizes the gears feature of stacking infinitely.

Then let’s just run wave maps on 81 gears and not use the star beast at all, because what for?
If you can use kraken and 71 stuff together.

I don’t get how new ‘better’ stuff isn’t even useful anymore

[Ilove_Poopoo]

Then let’s just run wave maps on 81 gears and not use the star beast at all, because what for?
If you can use kraken and 71 stuff together.

I don’t get how new ‘better’ stuff isn’t even useful anymoreOr you can use 2/3 star beast incorporated with stacking. Stat wise these are still stronger than 81 stuff and the fact that we could slot stronger jewels. Its really all about strategy and how clever you are in incorporating all the gears available to us. Removing this would give us less options.

[Voorge]

Mind showing me how 2/3 star beast set is stronger than kraken/zaarus dmg sets?
Not that I’m trying to prove you wrong, I’m genuinely curious what are we comparing rn

[Legolasn]

Mind showing me how 2/3 star beast set is stronger than kraken/zaarus dmg sets?
Not that I’m trying to prove you wrong, I’m genuinely curious what are we comparing rn

Bud you got the option to use it or not. Its just choices noone forcing you to do anything. Instead of trying to nerf anything you dont like just remember it's same for everyone.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

Mind showing me how 2/3 star beast set is stronger than kraken/zaarus dmg sets?
Not that I’m trying to prove you wrong, I’m genuinely curious what are we comparing rnu cant stack the 71 belt while using a zaarus set. But u can with a 2/3 sb. You can't slot corrupted jewels on kraken armor/helmet. Also, who would use the kraken armor as their main set, so it could proc at anytime randomly?

Again, its really about how clever you are strategizing all the gears available to us. Limiting the options would just make it boring.

[Voorge]

Bud you got the option to use it or not. Its just choices noone forcing you to do anything. Instead of trying to nerf anything you dont like just remember it's same for everyone.

Please read the section we’re in. I gave a suggestion. Don’t see much of a feedback from your side. Same as u say I’m trying to nerf everything I’ll respond saying you don’t need to comment on every thread involving ‘temple’ word.

[Voorge]

u cant stack the 71 belt while using a zaarus set. But u can with a 2/3 sb. You can't slot corrupted jewels on kraken armor/helmet. Also, who would use the kraken armor as their main set, so it could proc at anytime randomly?

Don’t see it being more beneficial than using it with full kraken set

literally, what for.

[|Ares|]

Bud you got the option to use it or not. Its just choices noone forcing you to do anything. Instead of trying to nerf anything you dont like just remember it's same for everyone.

You gotta read what the this thread is actually about. Drop the 71 stuff when 86 is out and adjust the gameplay. Its repetitive and boring otherwise.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

Don’t see it being more beneficial than using it with full kraken set

literally, what for.

for options? You go ahead play with full kraken set and stack, while people could also stack using different gear pieces as they prefer. The reason Cinco exclusively limits its stacking feature with 6/6 sb, in any case people would use this, is cuz a mage could still stack their 71 amulet but rog/tanks could not.

But the problem is they made it also unstackable with the 3/6 sb, which nullifies the point of this new set to fulfil its purpose of actually being a set.

So instead of removing the purpose of 71 stacking gears from the game, would it not be better to let it stack w 3/6 sb instead?

[AgentStonoga]

Kraken dmg set exists - well, in some cases you can't use whole krak set to stack stats, also it's another expensive gear to buy which can be solved with letting us use 3/6 star set.
Amulet isn't (or wasn't till now) outdated, cause it had usage. If item has any usage then it's not useless.
It's not complicated strategy, but there are still plenty of people who don't know about this strategy and removing this will make gap between weak/average and good players even smaller.

[Kystone]

Wah wah wah who stacks anyways

[Voorge]

for options? You go ahead play with full kraken set and stack, while people could also stack using different gear pieces as they prefer. The reason Cinco exclusively limits its stacking feature with 6/6 sb, in any case people would use this, is cuz a mage could still stack their 71 amulet but rog/tanks could not.

But the problem is they made it also unstackable with the 3/6 sb, which nullifies the point of this new set to fulfil its purpose of actually being a set.

So instead of removing the purpose of 71 stacking gears from the game, would it not be better to let it stack w 3/6 sb instead?

Honestly, no. People make t10 without stacking too, so it’s doable and not necessary by any means.
I’ll also repeat what I said earlier somewhere, running with 71 ring, amu until certain wave doesn’t make your gameplay any more skilful.
So saying that we get less ‘options’ by removing those don’t really make me change my opinion about it.
You guys also mentioned something about the gap between good and bad players.
The only ‘gap’ that I see is division between geared players and overgeared players (you’re the one benefiting more from it still).


btw after all wave lbs come down to the aspect of luck.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

Honestly, no. People make t10 without stacking too, so it’s doable and not necessary by any means.
I’ll also repeat what I said earlier somewhere, running with 71 ring, amu until certain wave doesn’t make your gameplay any more skilful.
So saying that we get less ‘options’ by removing those don’t really make me change my opinion about it.
You guys also mentioned something about the gap between good and bad players.
The only ‘gap’ that I see is division between geared players and overgeared players (you’re the one benefiting more from it still).


btw after all wave lbs come down to the aspect of luck.So... you want it removed because of what exactly? All those aforementioned reasons are subjective, there isn't anything concrete or objective enough of a reason to completely remove gear purpose to the game.

Stacking gears increases the variation. You're able to adapt to the next wave since the stats you stack is on par with the stat increase of the enemies. Its all about your endurance, how long you last, that's the essence of these temple events, its the reason the map goes on to infinity.

Removing means to shorten runs is counterintuitive to the objective of the event. This isn't a siege 2.0. Think of it as running a 5k vs a full 42km marathon.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

Think of gear stacking as a ticket to the next wave, increase in stat increments makes you eligible for the next, then the next, then the next.

The fact that we could do this makes it more challenging because we are gradually facing more waves, more chances to mess up for every wave. And as previously stated, its what makes temple the way it is. An infinite dungeon to test your endurance.

I hope this does not get removed as it would shorten runs = easier to mimic previous attempts @cinco @asommers

[Voorge]

So... you want it removed because of what exactly? All those aforementioned reasons are subjective, there isn't anything concrete or objective enough of a reason to completely remove gear purpose to the game.

Stacking gears increases the variation. You're able to adapt to the next wave since the stats you stack is on par with the stat increase of the enemies. Its all about your endurance, how long you last, that's the essence of these temple events, its the reason the map goes on to infinity.

Removing means to shorten runs is counterintuitive to the objective of the event. This isn't a siege 2.0. Think of it as running a 5k vs a full 42km marathon.

Variation wow, what does that stat actually do when you don’t proc on a high wave, as I said it’s luck. There’s no sequence that guarantees you proc.
Plus saying stacking should be kept because temple is supposed to be long run is a bit of a stretch when every time it’s about to come people push devs to shorten the run length for a simple reasons like the time it takes, repetition or internet issues people may have at any point. And guess what devs actually take on that topic and try to shorten it. So it means they are aware that it’s what should be done.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

Variation wow, what does that stat actually do when you don’t proc on a high wave, as I said it’s luck. There’s no sequence that guarantees you proc.
Plus saying stacking should be kept because temple is supposed to be long run is a bit of a stretch when every time it’s about to come people push devs to shorten the run length for a simple reasons like the time it takes, repetition or internet issues people may have at any point. And guess what devs actually take on that topic and try to shorten it. So it means they are aware that it’s what should be done.Theres a difference between removing stacking gears vs. making earlier waves harder

You are limiting the hard waves we can attempt by not stacking. In the long run actually makes it easier overall which is just backwards thinking.

[Voorge]

what I see is you solely trying to defend the stacking items (literally lvl 71 items) even though you have the set that will probably outplay other mages without it.
Stacking gives even bigger advantage between mid-good geared players on a better geared one favor. I can see where you’re coming from but I’m not sure if you do.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

Ok, lets merge the other thread to here. I'll take the previous twilight results for elaboration, the median score for top 25 is 8m points mage class. So, we could say that the top25 people started to choke at around wave 124-130 - is where we can set this as the start of difficult waves. Cuz we know waves 40 -110 are so easy, then suddenly mobs exponentially hit harder/have much more health by wave 120ish.

The reason we stack is so we can attempt more waves once the harder waves come in. If we look at the top10 scores its in between 12m - 18m. Meaning, mages begin to lose at waves 152 - 174

Note that stacking accounts for an extra 400-500 primary stats, and thousands of health, which is amplified through proc and damage multipliers. Therefore, that means the mages can endure 32 to 54 hard waves. Imagine if we didn't have stacking. The loss of of thousands of hp and base damage, we could've probably be stuck at waves 140 from 120.

Its similar with the other classes with smaller percentages. But overall, removing stacking makes the standard deviation smaller, which actually just makes the event easier.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

what I see is you solely trying to defend the stacking items (literally lvl 71 items) even though you have the set that will probably outplay other mages without it.
Stacking gives even bigger advantage between mid-good geared players on a better geared one favor. I can see where you’re coming from but I’m not sure if you do.

What I'm saying is, with lesser waves to attempt = there is less deviation, which just means its more likely players with the same gear would score similarly - you can twist this whatever you like, the end result is there's lesser variation - such that you can predict when you will exactly lose the lesser waves we overall can attain.

[Voorge]

I know the idea is to score the most and survive the longest, the question is why are we (or majority of us) bound to using 71 gear to achieve that?
What’s so wrong in scoring less under new ‘set of rules’ than we did on a previous temples?
I don’t get why point comparison matter to you.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

I know the idea is to score the most and survive the longest, the question is why are we (or majority of us) bound to using 71 gear to achieve that?
What’s so wrong in scoring less under new ‘set of rules’ than we did on a previous temples?
I don’t get why point comparison matter to you.Standard deviation is less.

Ok, since ya'll want runs to be shorter and shorter, I'll just bring up the siege event. Look at the standard deviation for all the classes:

447 - 457k rog
463 - 465k mage
418k - 430k tank

Runs were so predictable because we are limited to such a very low wave range to complete. It is so dumb that the reason some players scored 1k more than the other is cuz they killed a mob 0.5s faster.

So, the correlation is the lower the waves, the higher the likelihood these waves all mimic one another and result in a very similar attempt run such that another player would score better cuz he has 30 ping more in the entirety of the run.

"why are we bound to using 71 gear to achieve that"

Are you complaining about the level of the gear? or is it that you want shorter runs because you can't endure longer waves? what if they make a new 86 stackable gear, would it be good now cuz its max lvl?

[Voorge]

Bringing up siege isn’t relevant when devs stated runs won’t be as short
especially when you literally refer to 6 t10 runs that you did. Not the others bruh. It’s not the level of stackable gear that I don’t like it’s the gear itself, thought it would be easy to catch after so many comments, just referred to it as 71 gears so it’s simpler to recognise which one am I talking about.


That being said, I’ll just end the conversation. I stated why I don’t like the idea of stacking you did opposite, sure. Devs will do whatever they decide and I’ll live with it either way, so will you.

[Megatr0n]

what a headache of a read


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