Aggro on Rogues Solution

[NiN]

We need a skill to escape from warriors that dont know how to tank.
Like vanish or something.
This is me q_q because 80 out of my 106 deaths are caused by them.

[Astrocat]

We need a skill to escape from warriors that dont know how to tank.
Like vanish or something.
This is me q_q because 80 out of my 106 deaths are caused by them.

Your deaths cannot be caused because of someone else. You must know what you do, and must learn how to use a rogue. Just saying. But anyways, I understand you.

[sirtibby]

Just stop attacking until warrior regains aggro... That's what I do. Not much else we can do at this time.

[Asahetek]

It doesn't nesscarily mean its the warriors fault because sometimes your rogue does to much damage to a boss they cannot regain its agri no matter what, even if you stop attacking and running. Its happened to me a few times ag ainst the jarl

[lonakana]

You rogues are aggro thieves. Hard to keep aggro with a 199.3 damage rogue.

[nenjih]

Question: if you get aggro as a rogue should you run around in circles or just stand still?

Running around makes the (assume melee) boss chase you and you get hit less, even better if you're running to collect health packs. On the other hand it makes the warrior (who for some reason isn't using their taunt-type skills) chase the boss and miss a few hits himself, thereby slowing the aggro regain

[Wretch]

Wasn't going to post on this thread as I haven't made a rogue yet..... But thank you for the way you think!

[primaeva]

If you're pugging just swap out to a Lvl15 21Str weapon instead of your usual [16]21Dex. The drop in DPS will close the gap between the tank and you. There really is no other way to quickly influence warriors to master their craft.

The best solution you can have is to find your own warrior friends when you want to run elites. I'm pretty sure a lot of warriors with full Jugg + Vorpal hate running with slow DPS as well.

[Muhmota]

If we had some kind of aggro meter it would help alot. Such as the bosses name plate glows orange when we hit 90%. So we can slow our dps.

[Fyrce]

I usually run around the warrior. Assuming your warrior didn't run away...

[Psyche]

If by setting one's heart right every morning and evening, one is able to live as though his body were already dead, he gains freedom in the Way. His whole life will be without blame, and he will succeed in his calling.

[mafiainc42]

We need a skill to escape from warriors that dont know how to tank.
Like vanish or something.
This is me q_q because 80 out of my 106 deaths are caused by them.

maybe u just need to learn your class and skills a lil bit bttr quit blaming crap on the warriors

[*Zero*]

I have seen alot of bad warriors since IOS released. That could be one problem second is you have to let the warrior get aggro in before you go all aimed shot spamming. I myself can tank any boss without mage or rogue grabbing aggro. If another warrior is in the group he may grab attention because of are taunts in skills.
So maybe it was a bad warrior maybe a bad rogue, either way solution is easily solved don't play with pugs.

[carni91]

Malison arcane ability + razor shield with 20% dodge perk + high dex = 40-60% dodge then add a run like hell and your good! ( I feel your pain, this is what I do)

[primaeva]

maybe u just need to learn your class and skills a lil bit bttr quit blaming crap on the warriors

^Um. Learning your role as a rogue = maxing DPS and keeping debuffs up. If the boss is turning to the rogue, it's the warrior that needs to brush up on his skills.

Oh the irony.

[Einzo]

Hmm.. even after letting the warriors hit first for a few seconds before I start attacking.. after 2-3 hits from my rogue.. the boss/ mobs turned to me... Probably they can increase the taunt's aggro percentage for the warriors?

[Astrocat]

Hmm.. even after letting the warriors hit first for a few seconds before I start attacking.. after 2-3 hits from my rogue.. the boss/ mobs turned to me... Probably they can increase the taunt's aggro percentage for the warriors?

Rogues have a LOT damage, so i'm sure rogues are the ones hurting the boss much more, so they aggro.

[Lexlyde]

True its pretty boring. Everyone use warrior because it looks easy to use but tanking isnt that much easy and most parts of warrior dont know how to they run on the pack and with his low damages skills he loose aggro and rogue or mage takes all damages ._.

[Astrocat]

True its pretty boring. Everyone use warrior because it looks easy to use but tanking isnt that much easy and most parts of warrior dont know how to they run on the pack and with his low damages skills he loose aggro and rogue or mage takes all damages ._.

That's why Warriors shouldn't get nerf

[Ambient]

I wish you luck in obtaining something significant to care about, OP.

Pocket game death counts aren't it.

[primaeva]

That's why Warriors shouldn't get nerf

Hmm, that IS true-- if there was no taunt/aggro mechanic in the system and damage is the only way to generate aggro.

It isn't, however. In most other games the tanks get something that doesn't increase their damage, but rather, each point of damage generates more aggro than a DPS class to help them hold threat. This way they aren't given as much damage as a DPS is supposed to have, but can play their role of unkillable reliable tank.

Right now because of the system, the only way for warrs to hold threat is stacking Vorpal / Juggernaut / Ribbit and spamming CS-- which is highly random actually. The system needs to address this issue-- I'll be the first to agree that it's easier for a rogue/sorc to pile on the damage than a warrior holding aggro (and I don't even play warrior, I have a sorc/rogue).

[NiN]

My only option is running around and avoiding the bog attack from jarl but even after 10 secs of running around i still have aggro so i just give up at that time and manage to kite him but it gets annoying kitting on my ipad, i at least die 2-3 times every 10 runs.
I feel bad for whoever dies because of me running around but this really needs to be fixed IMO

[BodMaster]

Many Warriors are to worried about dealing damage to have a true tank build. Full buff build works wonders on keeping aggro no matter the situation.

[Jeff Williams]

Sure blame the warrior cause you cant play your toon and running around like a dumbass and possible resetting the boss isnt good either..best thing freaken take the death and come back let warrior regain aggro ...never run away with boss..

[primaeva]

Sure blame the warrior cause you cant play your toon and running around like a dumbass and possible resetting the boss isnt good either..best thing freaken take the death and come back let warrior regain aggro ...never run away with boss..

Hmm? Don't get it. Can't play toon would mean never getting aggro cos damage is low. If boss goes to him, isn't it something to do with the warrior? [Does not apply to second and third runs with warrior where you know his aggro stinks and thus should hold back on DPS.]

[Vystirch]

Um I play warrior and rouge Nd must say on behalf of the rouge that I want to kill bosses as quick as possible so I can kill them again :) even when I play warrior I want a rouge to help kill the boss fast. So I really want tanks that can hold agro! So my solution to the problem would be to through defense into the aggro equation. So the amount to dps times the amount of defense will equal the aggro number. Just my idea....

[Bless]

Its not a problem, therefore it doesn't need a solution.

[StompArtist]

Its not a problem, therefore it doesn't need a solution.

Never stopped anyone before!

[Raxin]

Good rogues pull aggro
Good warriors regain hate fast
Lets focus on the real problem why do people constantly link adds in elite then run into a corner say sorry and leave game at least clean up your damn mess

[Astrocat]

Never stopped anyone before!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1m3dZZA7ws

[primaeva]

Its not a problem, therefore it doesn't need a solution.

Actually after messing around with a rogue and pulling aggro off warriors with rather less effort than on my sorc, I decided to run some tests. In about 50 Jarl runs (pug and running with a warrior who held most of my sorc aggro-- we did 1m05s Jarls before), I did not once fail to grab aggro from the warrior simply by spamming NB + AS + melee (no blades used even-- and no damage boosting pet.)

I dropped my rogues DPS to ~90 (from 150), boosted his HP to 1450, brought his armor to 440, and dropped points from Noxious Bolt to chuck into Smoke Bomb armor buff and dodge from the blades.

I ran about 30 Jarls and ended tanking about 28 of them after pulling off the aggro off the warrior and keeping my simple DPS rotation up (Noxious -> Aimed -> Melee Melee --> Noxiious --> Aimed). I kept aggro in all of these situations, and more than a few members of those groups were rather astounded that a rogue could hold aggro and survive the entire fight. Granted these were pugs, but I was running with pug-like DPS.

There IS a feeling that the top-tier warriors won't be able to keep pace with a top-tier rogue on aggro. The damage output on a single target is simply ridiculous and there aren't enough taunt cooldowns for warrs. Something needs to be done for their aggro gen. In the meantime, I'm wondering why I started with a sorcerer in the first place. It's far more fun to see a screenful of crits and three-digit figures pop up constantly on the screen. :(

[lonakana]

I've tried as a warrior and failed and succeded keeping aggro against jarl.
When I can keep aggro I have finished jarl in 55 seconds. I have the 3 taunt skills and somehow still fail...

Solution: obviously don't nerf any class, elite is tough enough. Give warrior op taunt abilities. That's what tanks r for.

When mobs or bosses can one hit kill rogues when they can steal aggro, makes it difficult for tanks preventing deaths.

Edit: my rogue has 199.3 dmg btw

[NiN]

Yeah no nerf needed but warrior need better taunt skills or rogues need a vanish skill.
If a warrior is not able to regain aggro after 5 secs all i do is kite jarl and it works but when my finger slips.
GAME OVER NiNNY!

[primaeva]

Idea: Horn of Renew (or any other secondary) effect takes all aggro generated by each party member and redirects that amount to the warrior instead, for a duration similar to the heal over time.

This way it scales with the party and should leapfrog things quite far enough.

[ZeroBlu]

I do agree with yall but i just gotta say most warriors dont keep aggro (being one myself) because i think most ppl built their skill set for more damage...

[Montanabro]

Actually after messing around with a rogue and pulling aggro off warriors with rather less effort than on my sorc, I decided to run some tests. In about 50 Jarl runs (pug and running with a warrior who held most of my sorc aggro-- we did 1m05s Jarls before), I did not once fail to grab aggro from the warrior simply by spamming NB + AS + melee (no blades used even-- and no damage boosting pet.)

I dropped my rogues DPS to ~90 (from 150), boosted his HP to 1450, brought his armor to 440, and dropped points from Noxious Bolt to chuck into Smoke Bomb armor buff and dodge from the blades.

I ran about 30 Jarls and ended tanking about 28 of them after pulling off the aggro off the warrior and keeping my simple DPS rotation up (Noxious -> Aimed -> Melee Melee --> Noxiious --> Aimed). I kept aggro in all of these situations, and more than a few members of those groups were rather astounded that a rogue could hold aggro and survive the entire fight. Granted these were pugs, but I was running with pug-like DPS.

There IS a feeling that the top-tier warriors won't be able to keep pace with a top-tier rogue on aggro. The damage output on a single target is simply ridiculous and there aren't enough taunt cooldowns for warrs. Something needs to be done for their aggro gen. In the meantime, I'm wondering why I started with a sorcerer in the first place. It's far more fun to see a screenful of crits and three-digit figures pop up constantly on the screen. :(

Thank you for sharing. Do you know his build?

[Phoenician1]

Maybe I'm just not understanding the different philosophies being discussed here, but is it possible that what makes a good solo build warrior also makes him a less-useful damage sink in groups? For example, Taunt may be (and probably is) useful in a group-oriented warrior build, but for a warrior designed for soloing, it's pretty useless, isn't it? So a solo-build warrior wouldn't necessarily be useless, just less useful to your rogue than you would prefer.

[Montanabro]

Maybe I'm just not understanding the different philosophies being discussed here, but is it possible that what makes a good solo build warrior also makes him a less-useful damage sink in groups? For example, Taunt may be (and probably is) useful in a group-oriented warrior build, but for a warrior designed for soloing, it's pretty useless, isn't it? So a solo-build warrior wouldn't necessarily be useless, just less useful to your rogue than you would prefer.

Yes. In my experience there usually about 2 skills that change between a tank and DPSer. For example, if I'm soloing or level grinding in Kraag 3 I wouldn't have Horn of Renew.

[primaeva]

Thank you for sharing. Do you know his build?

Chest Splitter constantly off CD (not for disorient as he needs all the damage he can get to keep pace. He said he disorients for normal groups to reduce inc damage.)
Juggernaut up during initial seconds of the fight for maximum +str bonus.
He definitely has horn of renew as well.
And he works in smash into the rotation.

Vorpal Sword for the crit, I suppose.
Flap-Jack.

Close to 100 damage and 600+ armor, and about 2500 HP IIRC.

By the way-- I only ran with him when I was at 150~ DPS, but grabbing aggro wasn't hard at all. I only went to the 90+DPS build after he logged off, to test whether rogues could tank and hold aggro-- they most certainly can, and considering rotating between smoke bomb and blade dodge, they're quite efficient at it.

@Phoenician: There really isn't much point being a solo build once you hit cap and run elites to farm. With the possible exception of running Hauntlet for coins to get awesome pets, I can't figure out why an endgame warrior would be messing around in Kraag.

[Catwomann]

Ohk, first I am not quote versed with forums terminology so forgive me about that.

About agro( or is it aggro?), I am a rogue and I noticed that I quickly gain grab agro from a mediocre warrior, to prevent from from doing that I made another char and did some tests.

I firstly noticed that AIMED SHOT grabs agro more than NOXIOUS BOLT. Also u should keep ur dodge high as a rogue so even if u grab agro u can survive easily. At level I personally think u should have 1000-1500 health , 500-800 Intelligence. Ur dex should be very high so that ur dodge and damage is high. Also if u r so worried about deaths them always be with a warrior who has good gear and chest splitter cause that attack I think grabs agro better than any other skill in the whole game.

If u sometime accidentally grab agro, then stop attacking and try moving near ur warrior cause that is the fastest way the warrior will be able to grab agro again.

Not an expert but a pretty good player of this game.

Original acc - Catwoman - 14k+ kills, 600+ deaths.
New account - Cattwoman - 2k+ kills, 1 death.

[Reggin]

Threre is an old saying in MMOs. If the tank dies, it's the healers fault. If healer dies, it's the tanks fault. If the DPS dies, it's their own damn fault.

And tanking, especially elites requires a skilled tank with an understanding of skills and taunts.

I personally never lose aggro to anything other than other tanks. Build is CS with interrupt, vengeance with all except duration, renew with all except range, and juggernaut with all except movement freedom.

Chest Splitter is amazing. It interrupts wind up (red cone) attacks, even on bosses. It also is a TAUNT. Notice the ! over the enemy's head when used. Does wonders when trying to get hate back.

Vengeance acts like a heal when you charge it, and makes you never use mana pots. It also helps you generate threat with short term damage boosts.

Renew is critical to use intelligently. If a boss turns around to face anyone in the party, release a charged one and for 2 seconds your party is immune to damage. Get in the habit of skill canceling as a tank, remember it isn't your job to do damage. This means when not doing anything else, keep it charged and ready to go. If you need to do something else, slide finger off the skill without taking it off the screen. Follow it up with a chest splitter and your rogue won't even notice he pulled aggro.

I use Juggernaut in two situations. If I STILL don't have aggro, I let off a charged one and another CS. The other situation is as an emergency button (such as a dodged CS on elite bael during a wind up) or when pulling half of watchers 3 in one pull. I try not to need the taunt, since the panic button is so useful.

Hope this helps some solo warriors learn to be good team players!

[primaeva]

@Reggin: Hey, what's your IGN? I'm running some tests and need a warrior like you :D

EDIT: Dude, are you positive CS is a TAUNT?? I highly doubt it. It has a 3s cooldown-- what excuse would a warrior have for ever losing aggro then, if it was?

[DontNerfMeBro]

I don't know if this is actually a problem but the solution most certainly shouldn't be for a rogue to underperform.

[DontNerfMeBro]

Chest Splitter is amazing. It interrupts wind up (red cone) attacks, even on bosses. It also is a TAUNT. Notice the ! over the enemy's head when used. Does wonders when trying to get hate back!

So much truth. great matter-o-fact by itself

[Reggin]

Ugg for my warrior. I only have mediocre level 15 pink set and don't lose aggro to 190+ damage rogues in my guild. Honestly, for elite bosses I rarely even need to auto attack, as it's all about skill management as a tank. Make a low level warrior and test CS. It taunts. It's why I don't lose aggro with weak damage and only a single offensive skill in my elite tank build. I always handle the pulls and educate PUG players how to play with a real tank, since tanks that know what they are doing are so rare.

[NiN]

Aggro, hate or threat, a mechanism used in video game AI to determine the target prioritization of computer-controlled characters.


Ohk, first I am not quote versed with forums terminology so forgive me about that.

About agro( or is it aggro?), I am a rogue and I noticed that I quickly gain grab agro from a mediocre warrior, to prevent from from doing that I made another char and did some tests.

I firstly noticed that AIMED SHOT grabs agro more than NOXIOUS BOLT. Also u should keep ur dodge high as a rogue so even if u grab agro u can survive easily. At level I personally think u should have 1000-1500 health , 500-800 Intelligence. Ur dex should be very high so that ur dodge and damage is high. Also if u r so worried about deaths them always be with a warrior who has good gear and chest splitter cause that attack I think grabs agro better than any other skill in the whole game.

If u sometime accidentally grab agro, then stop attacking and try moving near ur warrior cause that is the fastest way the warrior will be able to grab agro again.

Not an expert but a pretty good player of this game.

Original acc - Catwoman - 14k+ kills, 600+ deaths.
New account - Cattwoman - 2k+ kills, 1 death.

[Asahetek]

Its sometimes easy for to take agro from warrior if you have skills th at cause bleed damage and stack crit like aimed shot have, i have 100+ damage and 800 health,400 armour im stil tweaking some things. Need to manage your crit rate, as for what hapens when you take agro either tank or run.

41,000+ kills

[ShadowGunX]

i constantly use CS coz its a 100% taunt low CD skill. nd i also hav HOR having taunt. bt smetimes HOR doesnt wrk nd d party neither get heal or a shield or i get taunt. makes me mad. anyway CS is a bst nd every warrior should hav det skill coz it has 100% taunt. bt smetime boss dodge it lol.

[ShadowGunX]

@Reggin: Hey, what's your IGN? I'm running some tests and need a warrior like you :D

EDIT: Dude, are you positive CS is a TAUNT?? I highly doubt it. It has a 3s cooldown-- what excuse would a warrior have for ever losing aggro then, if it was?

yup CS is main taunting skill for warrior. 100% taunt. i always use CS followed by HoR nd venge blood in elite bosses. bt smetimes bosses dodge it so HoR is always there to taunt :-D

[Silverpegasus]

See. Some complain when Warriors are too strong in PVP then they complain when Warriors can't outaggro them in PVE. Quit blaming and hating the tanker. If Warriors can't do much damage, there is less incentive playing this class, and I tell you its no fun being the meathead getting no kills and all deaths. With other classes at least you get kills along with your deaths.
Maybe you should nerf the other classes so they wont out aggro the tank lol.

[Deadbite]

If you're pugging just swap out to a Lvl15 21Str weapon instead of your usual [16]21Dex. The drop in DPS will close the gap between the tank and you. There really is no other way to quickly influence warriors to master their craft.

The best solution you can have is to find your own warrior friends when you want to run elites. I'm pretty sure a lot of warriors with full Jugg + Vorpal hate running with slow DPS as well.

I use full mighty gear and I still take Agro from warriors so no your idea wouldent work for a damage build.... And I sure as heck am not gonna respec so I do less damage where's the logic in that... Play plat to do less damage... Nope not happening..

[von92]

Most mmorpg ive played the rogue has a skill they can use to get out of tight spots like playing dead or invisibility, now for example jarl in elite who has givin me most of deaths can kill a rogue or sorc with a charged atk. A solution to.that is attacking from behind, but what about the warriors who cant sit still, I have died so many times because of warriors moving around while they have aggro the rogue is small and when up close to jarl and other warriors your toon isnt even visible. If your a warrior try not to move if.you have aggro, if you move you put classes that cant survive a charged skill from elite boss to die when i see that red light turns my way idont even have time to get out of way. Now about rogues getting aggro, by running and using regular atks around bosses like jarl you have a less chance to.die from charged atk, you will get hit by reg strike but you wont die