Kettle versus Slag stat comparison

[wvhills]

Kettle gives 15 dex, 15 int, 15 str and 10 damage. So the difference in kettle and the new mythic pet is 2 more damage, 10 movement speed and 5 less str. Kettle's arcane ability adds 12 movement speed. So the only difference is slag's arcane damage and it has 5 less str.

[Jellowpy]

This ^^

First set of stats was awesome and was ready to buy 2 $89.99 for my 2 account to get one each and have extra plat for new expansion but the new changes i also changed my mind lol StS saved me some money bec of their decision =)

[JaytB]

I ran out of thanks... again.

I agree 100% with the fact that the planned stats for this new 'Mythic' pet are currently average at best. I posted my thoughts about it in the announcement thread.

Maybe it's a good idea to copy your post into the announcement thread too. It can possibly help STS understand why people are so underwhelmed with the currently announced stats.

I basically suggested 20str/dex/int instead of the current 10/15/15.

[Samhayne]

Slag the Fire Elemental's Arcane Ability also has a chance to panic enemies and is pretty solid aoe damage. Just throwing that out there as well. The design team is trying to keep things interesting without throwing out balance with the kitchen sink. We'll see how interested people are with Slag when he goes on sale.

[earhole]

Don't forget that ripmaw is pretty much just flapjack as well :)

[Darko]

And we love us some rip...im curious about the aoe damage....is it better than wyatts aoe?

[Dervy]

So this was taken here!! :)
Kettle is good!! Smurfinas main pet before was ketts!! ;)

[Rare]

Speaking of panic. What does that actually do? Maybe up until now I've just missed it. This is the first time I've heard it mentioned.

[CrimsonTider]

Speaking of panic. What does that actually do? Maybe up until now I've just missed it. This is the first time I've heard it mentioned.

You aren' t the only one.

[Natrich]

Speaking of panic. What does that actually do? Maybe up until now I've just missed it. This is the first time I've heard it mentioned.

It's basically what Clyde does. Plus a fire nuke apparently. It's passive attack is pretty nice too...although its still kind of a kettle clone

[JaytB]

Slag the Fire Elemental's Arcane Ability also has a chance to panic enemies and is pretty solid aoe damage. Just throwing that out there as well. The design team is trying to keep things interesting without throwing out balance with the kitchen sink. We'll see how interested people are with Slag when he goes on sale.

Would it hurt to make its str/dex/int stats 20/20/20? At least it would be better without having to count on its arcane ability with its fairly long cooldown. It's a new pet after all and it's mythic, wouldn't it be fair to have just slightly buffed stats as compared to already existing ones? Kettle is already very similar in stats and malison gives 20/20/20 + 5crit. So, arcane abilities aside, 20/20/20 stats on the new pet doesn't sound unreasonable does it?

20/20/20 also has the advantage of it becoming truly useful for every class equally, and wouldn't mean a 'completely OP' difference in stats compared to existing pets.

Furthermore, there's this new cap coming where int/dex/str points will mean less because of our naturally/gear added stats. If this pet is supposed to be a preview of some sorts for the next cap, wouldn't it make sense it had buffed stats, even if it was only very minimal?

All the reasons above make me firmly believe that 20/20/20 str/dex/int would make the pet be more useful for any class, without making it OP, only driving sales of it up.

Doesn't that sound like a win-win?

Of course, this is all my opinion about it. I would like to hear what other people think about this too :)

[sonvolt]

I would love to see the 10% damage increase changed to a 15% damage increase so it would be on par with flap jack and just leave the stats as they are. I think the extra 5% damage would go a long way in making it a elite pet without it being over powered.

[Zuzeq]

Would it hurt to make its str/dex/int stats 20/20/20? At least it would be better without having to count on its arcane ability with its fairly long cooldown. It's a new pet after all and it's mythic, wouldn't it be fair to have just slightly buffed stats as compared to already existing ones? Kettle is already very similar in stats and malison gives 20/20/20 + 5crit. So, arcane abilities aside, 20/20/20 stats on the new pet doesn't sound unreasonable does it?

20/20/20 also has the advantage of it becoming truly useful for every class equally, and wouldn't mean a 'completely OP' difference in stats compared to existing pets.

Furthermore, there's this new cap coming where int/dex/str points will mean less because of our naturally/gear added stats. If this pet is supposed to be a preview of some sorts for the next cap, wouldn't it make sense it had buffed stats, even if it was only very minimal?

All the reasons above make me firmly believe that 20/20/20 str/dex/int would make the pet be more useful for any class, without making it OP, only driving sales of it up.

Doesn't that sound like a win-win?

Of course, this is all my opinion about it. I would like to hear what other people think about this too :)



Agreed. I'll always be safe piggy backing you (went over board in my last post on this topic).

[Carapace]

I would love to see the 10% damage increase changed to a 15% damage increase so it would be on par with flap jack and just leave the stats as they are. I think the extra 5% damage would go a long way in making it a elite pet without it being over powered.

Flap Jack does not provide additional stats on top of the damage benefit. Keep in mind that with the changes to Dex and Int etc for other characters the stat points also account for additional damage that's missing as an explicit bonus. In addition the crit and bonus damage modifiers associated with these stats.

[Rare]

It's basically what Clyde does. Plus a fire nuke apparently. It's passive attack is pretty nice too...although its still kind of a kettle clone

Didnt buy clyde, so I'm not sure what he does either.

[Natrich]

Didnt buy clyde, so I'm not sure what he does either.

Surely you've seen someone use it before? Well its sort of an equivalent to stunning.

[Carapace]

Surely you've seen someone use it before? Well its sort of an equivalent to stunning.

That works on a boss in a lot of cases

[sonvolt]

Thanks Carapace for the response, I understand that slag right now will be better than flap-jack. I was just saying that the extra 5% damage would change it from being just a little bit better than some existing pets, to being a good bit better and being worth the plat without being over powered. Just my thoughts, I dont know the game mechanics the way the devs do so I will trust that they will make the right moves in regards to the stats on slag.

[JaytB]

Flap Jack does not provide additional stats on top of the damage benefit. Keep in mind that with the changes to Dex and Int etc for other characters the stat points also account for additional damage that's missing as an explicit bonus. In addition the crit and bonus damage modifiers associated with these stats.

And how about my suggestion with the 20/20/20 stats? Wouldn't that be a fair and balanced compromise?

[sonvolt]

Clyde is awesome his stun does, as Carapace said, works on bosses, and at a surprisingly high rate I might add.

[Akaee]

Still the added stats should be at least equal (20) to mallison at this prize.

[Natrich]

Still the added stats should be at least equal (20) to mallison at this prize.

But then Malison would be abandoned lol.

[JaytB]

But then Malison would be abandoned lol.

It still would be a very worthy alternative that can be farmed for free, without having to spend a dime.

[earhole]

And how about my suggestion with the 20/20/20 stats? Wouldn't that be a fair and balanced compromise?

Well, if Slag gets boosted there, I demand that Ripmaw be boosted with similar stats as well since they are both mythic and it's expensive to have both mythic pets on a toon.

[Rare]

But then Malison would be abandoned lol.

No it wouldn't. I use several pets. Malison would still be one of my tops. Do you only use one pet? I prefer not to drain my gold into feeding them in the field. I will feed them if the situation calls for it. Otherwise I send them back to their stable to eat there.


Surely you've seen someone use it before? Well its sort of an equivalent to stunning.

I may have seen it and never noticed it. Who knows?

[Rare]

Well, if Slag gets boosted there, I demand that Ripmaw be boosted with similar stats as well since they are both mythic and it's expensive to have both mythic pets on a toon.

Technically it would be an "un-nerf"" even though the thing hasn't come out yet.

[JaytB]

Well, if Slag gets boosted there, I demand that Ripmaw be boosted with similar stats as well since they are both mythic and it's expensive to have both mythic pets on a toon.

Demands won't get you anywhere, suggestions might. The way I see it, Ripmaw is a pet of the past. I'm sure there will be future mythic pets that blow every current pet out of the water, including this new pet. You enjoyed the, for that time and that lvl cap, strong buff, so why wouldn't a new mythic pet be similarly better for this cap?

Your 'demand' would mean that there's only 1 mythic pet you'd buy for the rest of your game life, because they would get a buff each time a new mythic pet comes around.

What was strongest in previous caps can't be expected to be stronger in all future caps.

At least that's my opinion about it :)

[jtst]

And how about my suggestion with the 20/20/20 stats? Wouldn't that be a fair and balanced compromise?

it wouldn't
it would make this pet BEST FOR ALL TIMES. You basically would buy other pets only for achievements,
also it would result in demand of buffing other mythic/arcane pets

[earhole]

Demands won't get you anywhere, suggestions might. The way I see it, Ripmaw is a pet of the past. I'm sure there will be future mythic pets that blow every current pet out of the water, including this new pet. You enjoyed the, for that time and that lvl cap, strong buff, so why wouldn't a new mythic pet be similarly better for this cap?

Your 'demand' would mean that there's only 1 mythic pet you'd buy for the rest of your game life, because they would get a buff each time a new mythic pet comes around.

What was strongest in previous caps can't be expected to be stronger in all future caps.

At least that's my opinion about it :)

Doesn't matter if it's out. It's still current since it's not removed til tomorrow. As of now, ripmaw is just a ripoff of flapjack. Boosting the stats to the 20/20/20 would make it way overpowered compared to ripmaw.

[JaytB]

Doesn't matter if it's out. It's still current since it's not removed til tomorrow. As of now, ripmaw is just a ripoff of flapjack. Boosting the stats to the 20/20/20 would make it way overpowered compared to ripmaw.

As said in my post, ripmaw is a pet of the past and I don't see how 20/20/20 is overpowered as there are many pets that add more stats, that are better suited in different situations.

[Rare]

it wouldn't
it would make this pet BEST FOR ALL TIMES. You basically would buy other pets only for achievements,
also it would result in demand of buffing other mythic/arcane pets

How so? I mean honestly, the buffs these pets give are going to become obsolete soon. So there can't be a best pet for all time. Unless they change to percentages.

[Fyu]

Kettle gives 15 dex, 15 int, 15 str and 10 damage. So the difference in kettle and the new mythic pet is 2 more damage, 10 movement speed and 5 less str. Kettle's arcane ability adds 12 movement speed. So the only difference is slag's arcane damage and it has 5 less str.





Thanks Wvhills for spotting this i never woulda thought :) Unless sts change stats dramatically im not going to spend 250 Plat on a pet.



On the other hand RED LOOKS EPIC

[earhole]

As said in my post, ripmaw is a pet of the past and I don't see how 20/20/20 is overpowered as there are many pets that add more stats, that are better suited in different situations.

It's way over powered compared to the other mythic pet ripmaw. 20/20/20 is overpowered when you combine the 12% damage and speed to it.

[wvhills]

I see kettle and slag as being basically the same. Yes, slag has the arcane going for it but is it worth it considering the long cooldown time? For me it comes down to whether you would rather 1) spend the time farming a kettle or spend the 200k to buy one from auction or 2) just spend 250 plat to buy one straight out.

I already have a kettle so I doubt I go for a slag. When it was 30 dex I would def go for it but not now (the one monkey pet gives 30 int so why can't a pet give 30 dex?). Even with it's current stats I'd probably buy a slag to use in my pet rotation in pvp if it cost less than 250 plat. Malison gives 20/20/20 with 5 crit and 15 dodge arcane buff (which to me is a lot better than slag's stats) and he costs 90 plat. For me to spend 250 plat the pet would have to be even better than malison (and by a lot).

[Energizeric]

Don't forget that ripmaw is pretty much just flapjack as well :)

I can't think of 2 pets that are most opposite. Ripmaw gives STR (health) and damage reduction, while Flapjack is purely offensive (15% damage boost). One is a defensive pet while the other is offensive.

[JaytB]

I can't think of 2 pets that are most opposite. Ripmaw gives STR (health) and damage reduction, while Flapjack is purely offensive (15% damage boost). One is a defensive pet while the other is offensive.

They both have 8 h/s and 8 m/s? :p

Just joking, your post made me LOL. Definitely said what I was thinking :)

[earhole]

I can't think of 2 pets that are most opposite. Ripmaw gives STR (health) and damage reduction, while Flapjack is purely offensive (15% damage boost). One is a defensive pet while the other is offensive.

3%dr is miniscule and prob won't make any difference. 15% damage vs 15str. Rest of stats and abilities is a carbon copy.

[earhole]

20/20/20 might make this the best pet ever.....glacian included.

[JaytB]

20/20/20 might make this the best pet ever.....glacian included.

I read that the first time when you claimed it. I still disagree for reasons I won't repeat :)

[Energizeric]

3%dr is miniscule and prob won't make any difference. 15% damage vs 15str. Rest of stats and abilities is a carbon copy.

If you are a warrior with 3800 health, then 3% is equivalient to 114 health, or the same that 11 STR gives you. If you are a sorcerer with 2500 health, then 3% is 75 health which is the same as 7+ STR points. It does make a difference. You don't know how many times in PvP I've been down to 2% health after a rogue aimed shot, but then managed to stun them, heal myself a little, and then chop them down before they recovered from the stun.

[Khylan]

If you are a warrior with 3800 health, then 3% is equivalient to 114 health, or the same that 11 STR gives you. If you are a sorcerer with 2500 health, then 3% is 75 health which is the same as 7+ STR points. It does make a difference. You don't know how many times in PvP I've been down to 2% health after a rogue aimed shot, but then managed to stun them, heal myself a little, and then chop them down before they recovered from the stun.


The damage reduction values are worthless for PvE. If you are in a pack of mobs and taking say, 500 dps, the 3% will reduce it to a whopping 485 dps. Boss fight, you are taking 1000 hp hits all things being equal you would take 970 hp damage. Yeah, it's a difference, and that would probably mean something if potions had a 20 second cool down or whatever, but since they don't and can be spammed NPC dps is so high that a warrior with 4k hp and 1100 armor can go splat faster than he can spam potions---please, someone show me how 3% makes any practical difference outside of number on a calculator.

The value Shiloh had of 12% was fine..STS argument that it would be unbalancing was utterly ridiculous because the same argument could be made for flat damage % increase pets..15% more damage at 31 is going to be substantially more than at level 16. Additionally, if higher DR values were so unbalancing why can the elixirs still be purchased?

[Energizeric]

The damage reduction values are worthless for PvE. If you are in a pack of mobs and taking say, 500 dps, the 3% will reduce it to a whopping 485 dps. Boss fight, you are taking 1000 hp hits all things being equal you would take 970 hp damage. Yeah, it's a difference, and that would probably mean something if potions had a 20 second cool down or whatever, but since they don't and can be spammed NPC dps is so high that a warrior with 4k hp and 1100 armor can go splat faster than he can spam potions---please, someone show me how 3% makes any practical difference outside of number on a calculator.

Unless you have zero deaths in PvE, then I have to assume you have died. If you are like me (and most players) then you have died hundreds (maybe thousands?) of times. And I'm sure that some of those times that you died, had you had a 3% damage reduction you would not have died. It may only be a small percentage of those deaths, but I'm sure it is true for some of them. Sometimes you get hit and have only 2% of your health left and you are able to spam a couple of pots and heal yourself, where as if you had 3% less health you would have died.

Would that make a huge difference in the life of your character? Maybe, and maybe not. There is no way to know. Maybe the time you died right before your party beat the boss, you would have dropped that gold chest that had the arcane hooks in them. Maybe not. No way to know.

[gundamsone]

Unless you have zero deaths in PvE, then I have to assume you have died. If you are like me (and most players) then you have died hundreds (maybe thousands?) of times. And I'm sure that some of those times that you died, had you had a 3% damage reduction you would not have died. It may only be a small percentage of those deaths, but I'm sure it is true for some of them. Sometimes you get hit and have only 2% of your health left and you are able to spam a couple of pots and heal yourself, where as if you had 3% less health you would have died.

Would that make a huge difference in the life of your character? Maybe, and maybe not. There is no way to know. Maybe the time you died right before your party beat the boss, you would have dropped that gold chest that had the arcane hooks in them. Maybe not. No way to know.
That's one way to think of it but people have a choice to use other pets. A 10% dodge pet with other bonuses (such as esteban) might save you from more deaths than the Ripmaw.
One can say "what if I dodged that attack" but ofc with dodge its like crit, a random variable that you can't fully rely on. Dmg reduction would be comparable to damage % boost.
I think what people are saying is the 250 plat pets arn't so great. They're just a tad better and in the case of ripmaw there's many cheaper alternatives.

[Darko]

That's one way to think of it but people have a choice to use other pets. A 10% dodge pet with other bonuses (such as esteban) might save you from more deaths than the Ripmaw.
One can say "what if I dodged that attack" but ofc with dodge its like crit, a random variable that you can't fully rely on. Dmg reduction would be comparable to damage % boost.
I think what people are saying is the 250 plat pets arn't so great. They're just a tad better and in the case of ripmaw there's many cheaper alternatives.

I guess if you don't think they are great don't use em...I personally loved ripmaw, wish it had more str, but the mana regean helped me to put more passive in other areas because int....also energen I would venture to say this is true in pvp too, u know how many times im at 1-2% of life and have time to use horn and recover.... I might have been dead lol....I still would like to see a str, dam, armor, health pet, warriors drean...ans to be fair rouge xould have dex crit dodge int..also mentioned esteban I wish just have pasives change as they level pw ts get new arcane at level 30, might change some of these worthless pets like snoball......that was a pretty penny yet is worthless, and well I dress like Santa I want my snoball lol

[X29798]

The damage reduction values are worthless for PvE. If you are in a pack of mobs and taking say, 500 dps, the 3% will reduce it to a whopping 485 dps. Boss fight, you are taking 1000 hp hits all things being equal you would take 970 hp damage. Yeah, it's a difference, and that would probably mean something if potions had a 20 second cool down or whatever, but since they don't and can be spammed NPC dps is so high that a warrior with 4k hp and 1100 armor can go splat faster than he can spam potions---please, someone show me how 3% makes any practical difference outside of number on a calculator.

The value Shiloh had of 12% was fine..STS argument that it would be unbalancing was utterly ridiculous because the same argument could be made for flat damage % increase pets..15% more damage at 31 is going to be substantially more than at level 16. Additionally, if higher DR values were so unbalancing why can the elixirs still be purchased?

Reduce damage is armor, therefore you add 3% to armor percentage.

3%+armor percentage= overall damage blocked.

E.g, 3%+15%=18% blocked

Slag is made for boosting and dealing damage. It has better passiveS and aoe damage/stun arcane resulting in faster runs.

[Valsacar]

His arcane ability isn't all that great IMO. I've been testing it (he's lvl 20 now), the AoE damage appears to be the same as a normal attack. It's nice that it's AoE but an extra 50-100 damage isn't that substantial. The panic (stun) thing... I'm not sure I've ever see it go off (and I've done dailys using just slag and his arcane). I think it might have gone off once, but that could have been lag. Clyde I have, and I've seen his go off (about 20% chance), but slag I'm not seeing it.

[JaytB]

His arcane ability isn't all that great IMO. I've been testing it (he's lvl 20 now), the AoE damage appears to be the same as a normal attack. It's nice that it's AoE but an extra 50-100 damage isn't that substantial. The panic (stun) thing... I'm not sure I've ever see it go off (and I've done dailys using just slag and his arcane). I think it might have gone off once, but that could have been lag. Clyde I have, and I've seen his go off (about 20% chance), but slag I'm not seeing it.

Actually, I liked the AOE dmg. It's damage over time and can apparently hit any number of enemies in its large range. As compared to other pets I'd say it's pretty decent, especially for a large group of mobs.

I do agree with the stun part though. Clyde seems to stun far more often as compared to Slag.

The big let down is the annoyingly long cooldown time though.

[Valsacar]

That's the problem, the damage it does compared to it's cool down makes it just... eh. As it is, it's something I hit if I remember, not something I feel the need to use (compared to say, Colton or Clyde where I need to pay attention because it's really useful).

Either drop the cool down to 15 sec, or make the damage double (as I said, right now it appears to be his normal attack damage, so double normal attack).

[digitalbot]

take your slags out to palm or harbor, reef.. any of those maps.. kills bosses windups
seriously great pet when you got a team with them doing those tough maps

[Valsacar]

I have noticed that, but is it every time or just when it panics? I generally solo palm, so normally a bit too busy to pay attention.

[digitalbot]

suppose its the panic arcane, its chance i'd say is 50/50
works on bosses too!
great pet currently at 24.. in tombs now (:

[Chaim Nail]

The design team is trying to keep things interesting without throwing out balance with the kitchen sink.

I'm still waiting for the Kitchen Sink (http://www.haku.co.uk/pics/ArcaneLegendsKitchenSink.jpg)... :D

[Sproodle]

I think shortening the arcane cooldown might help a bit

[Aplyed]

I used him when i got him today Slag and did his arcane and burn damage was a ton of zeros . I'm not liking sloth one bit. Please power him up and give him shorter cool down and 5 more str.

[Cuteandsmexy]

Am I the only one that notice that slag has better stats than hammerjaw as in str/dex/int and damage?

[jtst]

Am I the only one that notice that slag has better stats than hammerjaw as in str/dex/int and damage?

hammerjaw indeed needs a buff

[Excuses]

Don't know about all math thingy...
But it does looks like upgraded red Kettle.

And I agree it's stun works good everywhere.. (I was in pvp as warrior. Three slag vs 4 warriors. They stun like crazy...)

So sadly I am considering purchasing slag for my mage. (Or warrior. Maybe both. Sigh.)

[Slashiroth]

Slag the Fire Elemental's Arcane Ability also has a chance to panic enemies and is pretty solid aoe damage. Just throwing that out there as well. The design team is trying to keep things interesting without throwing out balance with the kitchen sink. We'll see how interested people are with Slag when he goes on sale.

Solid aoe damage? Are you joking lol and what's the deal with him not learning any new passive/arcane abilities as he levels up and the panic lasts a whole 2 seconds yeah awesome pet. Your talking about balance? Warriors have 1 30+str pet mages have 2 30+ int yeah don't throw the kitchen sink.

[digitalbot]

a buff for his arcane dmg slightly would make him nice..
though his panic is still great on bosses, evn if it is two seconds

-just a bit mire dmg arcane buff considering the cool down and all would be wonderful

[earhole]

Solid aoe damage? Are you joking lol and what's the deal with him not learning any new passive/arcane abilities as he levels up and the panic lasts a whole 2 seconds yeah awesome pet. Your talking about balance? Warriors have 1 30+str pet mages have 2 30+ int yeah don't throw the kitchen sink.

Stop whining. Warriors only benefit from strength while every class benefits from strength. Secondary stats like dex is pretty much useless for a warrior. We get no damage and a full dex build (150 dex) gives a whopping 9% dodge....whooppeeee....