If Freeze is allowed in pvp now..Give Sorcerers their Freeze skill back in PVP

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nevercan

Mages faster, if mage no heal and get an crit of 3-4k without shield mages wil be dead, mage dies fast in pvp then rouges do...

---

I still think Freeze with immunity including stun should do well... Rogues should be able to escape freeze using Razor shield and Warriors using Juggernaut . ..

+1

sent from crusty crab using a payphone

Just sad this wasnt addressed at the beginning. BEFORE any CTF event or any further into this 'awesome' Winter Event. rolls eyes

I can see breeze becoming the next scorch. Then again there will be threads of #bufffreeze. STS should really stick to a no change policy once released. Before release show sample videos of how pet/item/weapon works in pvp and pve and its stats. Communities state in their views and once released no matter what arcane number of threads are here you stick to the original released plan. The people will then "find" a way out of it.

PPl is just too sad see a legendary pet got a good AA , they r sad they pay 20M+ for a pet arcane op , n a legendary with bad stats n only a gud AA is 3M around.. all i see that.. all ppl talk about breeze ruined pvp but paragem alrdy have ruined pvp.. only the rich cry for thi pet..
H.F!!!

How about you just remove breeze ability to 1/2 second in PVP or completely nullify it in PVP but increase PVE status. Also reduce para gems to half the damage it would normally give when in PVP, therefore everyones happy.

This is the OP bulwark all over again, people should seriously stop trying to buy things that are too OP to rule in PvP even when they know its probably going to get nerfed. Follow this golden rule and you'll be just fine:

If it seems too good to be true, it probably is.

Obviously this pet needs to be nerfed, there is literally no way one can win against a Breeze without using cheap tactics, such as using another player as a target dummy so Breeze freezes them, leaving you free to attack. I'm just hoping this doesn't go down the path of the Bulwark, with STS leaving it unnerfed for a MONTH, then drastically nerfing it.

The following changes could make breeze a good pet worth buying:

1. Its freeze is removed from PvP. The AA instead becomes an 80% slow for the whole duration.
2. The pet's ranged attack is removed, replaced with a melee attack. This increases the effectiveness in PvE.

OR:

1. Its auto target is removed. When the AA is pressed, it drops a freeze pool where it is standing.

Thoughts?

Poll closes tomorrow guys ..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Axesam

You r not alone :) All complainer dont have breeze so they dont know how stupid breeze is, how slowly breeze is, how blind breeze is, etc. If they have breeze, maybe they'll ask sts to fix breeze stupidly.

---

You right this pet is stupid! I dont think breeze owners realise how op this pet really is.
try facing a team who stack breeze in pvp. Try being vulnerable for 7-15 secs standing there while you take all the hits. We all know 5 tanks is ridiculous strategy in pvp try facing a team with breeze or yet a team who stack breeze! Then tell me your opinion again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hail

So when/"if" this pet becomes useless, what is the point of farming it? Surely the price will drop so drastically the pet will be useless to farm and useless to use. If people are complaining too much about it why not just follow the expressions "If you cannot beat them. Join them" and get this little blue lizard for yourself. People who may not own this pet are the ones complaining that its too op. If it gets a nerf what about the people that spent 2 to +3m to use this pet effectively. I have bought one and I know I wont be a happy camper :) Just remember every decision made will make someone upset. I think it would be wise to keep Breeze as it is to.. 1) Keep the price up so endgamers have something worthy to make money off. 2)People who have already bought and opened this pet will get what they deserve - a good pet. 3)Give anyone else who has not bought it the chance to see from our perspective on the pet. :)
Oh and... Bring back mages ability to freeze :)

---

Wouldnt mind spending 2-3m for this pet how ever am not spending on something that have a possibilty of being nerf again. Look at singe he boosted party stat by 50-80% before (cant remember) now only 8%

Mages with freeze is going to be OP I reckon, see the rage breeze has causes us lol if mage will get their freeze back because of this poll then make it a micro-stun 0.5 - 1 sec.

Change is a must, sts bring new gear and pet to make this game still fun. The point is we can buy that pet or farm tombs to get one, so if hard to fight team with 3-4 breeze u should find team like that too, all ppl can get that pet. Its not like sns with his op pool and not all ppl can have that pet. I just dont understand with ppl who always cry in pvp, if they bring arcane pet so we bring arcane too, if they have breeze we should have breeze too. So simple.

so the ppl wasted their 20m on arcane pets like sam only to be replaced by a 2m breeze huh@axesam?

Ok lets be honest, 90 percent of the people who voted yes are probably mages with a biased opinion. There is a reason mages freeze was removed from pvp before and that reason still holds true. Because it was op

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

Ok lets be honest, 90 percent of the people who voted yes are probably mages with a biased opinion. There is a reason mages freeze was removed from pvp before and that reason still holds true. Because it was op

---

Yeah.. this imbalance was created at game start...

See here whats happening at end game now :

Warriors: No skills Blocked

Rogues : No Skills Blocked ( 10% Damage Debuff in pvp) (correct me here) .. Have Normal criticals beyond 40% now ..which compensates for 10% debuffs..
Average rogues also have damages greater than or equal to mages... unstoppable . ..

Sorcerer: Root blocked, Freeze blocked,
Average Mages have low critical percentages (less than 20 or 25%)..so lightning isn't lucky everytime.
(That 10% Shield Buff made a damage absorb Increase to approx. 200 to 250 HP and Shield cooldown by 2 secs made slight difference ... try compare it to 4000 to 6000 Aimed shot in endgame lol)
Mage HP at end game doesn't cross 3200 or 3500 pts at lvl 41... unless u use kershal or Arcane Pet or Malison...

Lets look at results over 2 years of Time since the game started:

Rogues are leaders in:
Time runs
Leaders in Number of pvp kills.. Mages are not even close to Rank 25 Pvp leaderboard rogues . ..
Fastest Killers... no doubt since cooldowns of Skills are either 2 secs or 3 secs ...

Rogues can also pop 6 Packs with 2 absorbs(3 before and 3 after) each buffing 1000 hP in single pack.. Plus good Heal over times.....

Warriors : Are Scarier in endgame with high damages comparable to Mages now... making em harder and harder to kill over time ....

A lot more experience can be added here by players who have stayed in game for more than 2 years...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

Ok lets be honest, 90 percent of the people who voted yes are probably mages with a biased opinion. There is a reason mages freeze was removed from pvp before and that reason still holds true. Because it was op

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

Ok lets be honest, 90 percent of the people who voted yes are probably mages with a biased opinion. There is a reason mages freeze was removed from pvp before and that reason still holds true. Because it was op

---

Agreed mages were op many many seasons ago, 90% of mages now are nothing more than food due to tanks and rogues with unbelievable armor and damage. Sure some mages are gonna be biased but the same can be said for rogues and tanks who want to continue to be the dominant classes right?

With freeze having a high chance to break free every .5 seconds and also its own stun immunity timer there is no way mages will be considered op, it will only restore some balance to the weakest class.

Sure there will be fully geared mages who you wont be able to kill which is how it should be with class equality and only equipment and skill to factor in. On the other hand .5 seconds freeze will in no way stop a rogue from one hitting a mage as soon as shield drops, and a common practice for a skilled rogue is to wait until shield drops before opening fire anyway! So warrior's will become food to mages? No, because against a half decent tank stun 2 seconds panic 2.5-3 seconds freeze .5-2.5 seconds is the tank dead? No because he is a tank and most mages simply cannot deal the dps to down a decent geared warrior. Factor in razor shield and juggernaut stun immunity and theres nothing really to worry about for tanks or rogues, the only difference will be the stun class will have one stun that works.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Idly

Agreed mages were op many many seasons ago, 90% of mages now are nothing more than food due to tanks and rogues with unbelievable armor and damage. Sure some mages are gonna be biased but the same can be said for rogues and tanks who want to continue to be the dominant classes right?

With freeze having a high chance to break free every .5 seconds and also its own stun immunity timer there is no way mages will be considered op, it will only restore some balance to the weakest class.

Sure there will be fully geared mages who you wont be able to kill which is how it should be with class equality and only equipment and skill to factor in. On the other hand .5 seconds freeze will in no way stop a rogue from one hitting a mage as soon as shield drops, and a common practice for a skilled rogue is to wait until shield drops before opening fire anyway! So warrior's will become food to mages? No, because against a half decent tank stun 2 seconds panic 2.5-3 seconds freeze .5-2.5 seconds is the tank dead? No because he is a tank and most mages simply cannot deal the dps to down a decent geared warrior. Factor in razor shield and juggernaut stun immunity and theres nothing really to worry about for tanks or rogues, the only difference will be the stun class will have one stun that works.

---

Just because i said that mages shouldnt be given freeze back doesnt mean that mages shouldnt be buffed. Ive said it in many different posts that mages shield and lifegiver should be buffed to provide more survivability but i wont say the specifics right now. The reason mages shouldnt be given freeze back is because they would have 3 ways to prevent their enemy from moving or using any skills while rogues and warriors would have 2. This is the flaw in allowing freeze. Mages could stun with fireball, then use their freeze, then use a panic pet like samael. And by the time all thst is done the stun immunity timer will be just about up and mages can stun AGAIN. They wouldnt even need lifegiver because their enemies wouldnt be able to do anything before they died. And also you guys only think about endgame. Rogues dont have 40% crit at endgame, without a crit pet at lvl 17 we have 9-10. A good mage can already kill rogues 1v1 at my lvl. And what ticks me off the most about the surge of people wanting mage freeze to come back is that hardly anyone was asking for mage freeze back in pvp before breeze was introduced. This means most of you mages are trying to use a broken pet ability that has broken pvp as justification to break pvp even more

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by siddhant

so the ppl wasted their 20m on arcane pets like sam only to be replaced by a 2m breeze huh@axesam?

---

i have samael too :) but when another pet better i'll use that pet. Ppl complaining all the time that AL dominate by rich ppl who can get arcane item and arcane pet, and now sts give u cheap pet (compare to samael) and ppl still complaining *sigh*

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bunkz

Correct. It's already been stated. Breeze was not meant to be more useful than arcane pets. It was a mistake. This is why we aren't playing legendary legends. Excited for devs to make him how he was meant to function. :)

---

I DIED @This is why we aren't playing legendary legends.... LMAO almost fell outta my chair when I read this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

Just because i said that mages shouldnt be given freeze back doesnt mean that mages shouldnt be buffed. Ive said it in many different posts that mages shield and lifegiver should be buffed to provide more survivability but i wont say the specifics right now. The reason mages shouldnt be given freeze back is because they would have 3 ways to prevent their enemy from moving or using any skills while rogues and warriors would have 2. This is the flaw in allowing freeze. Mages could stun with fireball, then use their freeze, then use a panic pet like samael. And by the time all thst is done the stun immunity timer will be just about up and mages can stun AGAIN. They wouldnt even need lifegiver because their enemies wouldnt be able to do anything before they died. And also you guys only think about endgame. Rogues dont have 40% crit at endgame, without a crit pet at lvl 17 we have 9-10. A good mage can already kill rogues 1v1 at my lvl. And what ticks me off the most about the surge of people wanting mage freeze to come back is that hardly anyone was asking for mage freeze back in pvp before breeze was introduced. This means most of you mages are trying to use a broken pet ability that has broken pvp as justification to break pvp even more

---

BreezeFreeze is the underlying issue here ofcourse, would you be ok if the next legendary pet had an aimed shot?
It seems STS are unwilling to remove BreezeFreeze from pvp because some people spent 3m on it!? (Lol @Bulweak, Singe, STS nerf history) therefore if a pet can have a mage skill why cant a mage?

As stated previously by a mod freeze will be placed into its own stun immunity category so that permastuns won't happen. Your point about warrior and rogue having 2 stuns and mages having 3... well we're the stun class right? And what about skill swap which we cant do anymore? Try being a mage in pvp without both shield and lifegiver. So with fb and ice mages lose their only real damage source (lightning) therefore maybe you will be stunned a couple seconds longer but chances are you will take less damage anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Axesam

Change is a must, sts bring new gear and pet to make this game still fun. The point is we can buy that pet or farm tombs to get one, so if hard to fight team with 3-4 breeze u should find team like that too, all ppl can get that pet. Its not like sns with his op pool and not all ppl can have that pet. I just dont understand with ppl who always cry in pvp, if they bring arcane pet so we bring arcane too, if they have breeze we should have breeze too. So simple.

---

THIS is not the point being made. BREEZE pet has made pvp ridiculous.

Example: Clashes/GW's usually last 20secs-60secs for complete defeat depending on team setup. Now enter players with 2 Breeze pets on one team. (Breeze's passive can Freeze for say 4-6secs -ok not so bad- but right after you unfreeze, the player with breeze use's its AA freeze ability which is another 6secs, NOW HERE'S the kicker, the 2nd Breeze users pet is still attacking and then its passive freeze lands. 4-6secs running total of possible time stunned/frozen 12secs-18secs... and now the 2nd Breeze user fires off his pets AA. Possible time a team can be frozen unable to Attk/Heal/Shield can range from min. 22secs - rough max 24secs (maybe not exact times but very close). <---Even though no 1 is usually alive after around the 20sec or so mark.

In a clash that (i was being gracious with 20secs) can last as little as 20 secs being completely frozen for that entire time is RIDICULOUS. Even if an arcane pet had this type of ability it would still be a bit much. Fought in a 2v2 yesterday with 2breeze users, was Frozen a total of 10secs watching my toon get beat on. (prolly would of lasted longer if i hadn't of been dropped while 2warriors used skills on me)

PvP for those that take it serious, compete in tournaments, Guild wars with rival guilds, USED to be about --PvP Tactics and above all PvP Skill of the player/guild-- Example, Karma in this past tournament showed the best tactics/skill. NOT they used 3 breezes and froze everyone each match, for what is really an Unrecoverable amount of time for many pvp teams/players to defend against. IMO Breeze takes VERY LITTLE skill/pvp talent to use (just tapping you pet AA button can equal a 90% win chance) & gives the user a Huge one sided advantage.

The new thing in guild wars, 1v1, Tdm, Ctf is: How many breeze pets do We/They have?

Thats what makes the pets abilities Ridiculous. Going breeze vs breeze doesn't help really, because -----PVP SKILL----- will be eliminated and it will boil down to how many freeze's a players team has. We can literally go in with blue/green armors and freeze you to victory.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HotttSauce

THIS is not the point being made. BREEZE pet has made pvp ridiculous.

Example: Clashes/GW's usually last 20secs-60secs for complete defeat depending on team setup. Now enter players with 2 Breeze pets on one team. (Breeze's passive can Freeze for say 4-6secs -ok not so bad- but right after you unfreeze, the player with breeze use's its AA freeze ability which is another 6secs, NOW HERE'S the kicker, the 2nd Breeze users pet is still attacking and then its passive freeze lands. 4-6secs running total of possible time stunned/frozen 12secs-18secs... and now the 2nd Breeze user fires off his pets AA. Possible time a team can be frozen unable to Attk/Heal/Shield can range from min. 22secs - rough max 24secs (maybe not exact times but very close). <---Even though no 1 is usually alive after around the 20sec or so mark.

In a clash that (i was being gracious with 20secs) can last as little as 20 secs being completely frozen for that entire time is RIDICULOUS. Even if an arcane pet had this type of ability it would still be a bit much. Fought in a 2v2 yesterday with 2breeze users, was Frozen a total of 10secs watching my toon get beat on. (prolly would of lasted longer if i hadn't of been dropped while 2warriors used skills on me)

PvP for those that take it serious, compete in tournaments, Guild wars with rival guilds, USED to be about --PvP Tactics and above all PvP Skill of the player/guild-- Example, Karma in this past tournament showed the best tactics/skill. NOT they used 3 breezes and froze everyone each match, for what is really an Unrecoverable amount of time for many pvp teams/players to defend against. IMO Breeze takes VERY LITTLE skill/pvp talent to use (just tapping you pet AA button can equal a 90% win chance) & gives the user a Huge one sided advantage.

The new thing in guild wars, 1v1, Tdm, Ctf is: How many breeze pets do We/They have?

Thats what makes the pets abilities Ridiculous. Going breeze vs breeze doesn't help really, because -----PVP SKILL----- will be eliminated and it will boil down to how many freeze's a players team has. We can literally go in with blue/green armors and freeze you to victory.

---

Not to forget that half of the heal skills fail because the passive freezes way to often.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pyrogenie

I couldn't agree more ^. people that mix up the mage freeze with breeze freeze there's a reason sts made breeze's freeze allowed in PvP while at the same time knowing mages freeze doesn't. They didn't forget, they know exactly what they did and its because mages freeze is class specific which creates an unbalance and jealousy where breeze is not. Anyone and everyone can get a breeze and have freeze. That was there idea in the first place. Now agreed its was way too op with that 15 sec stuff. Indeed It needed to be cut down but if it weren't completely removed I wouldn't mind. And yes I am a mage.

---

I see. So on this logic we should be soon expecting a pet with aimed shot :D

Breeze passive freeze doesnt work on twink under 10 lvl

For me, the point is there will be a time that all arcane pet is outdated even samael or singe. There will be a time that we should change our playstyle and adapt with the new era. There will be a time that we must throw away our expensive gear/pet to trash bag and change with the new one. If u defeated in clash with team full of breeze, why not try to slap their face with breeze too? Make a tank as a target for enemy breeze, and rogue still can give their god critical from outside the pool, its strategy. Clash is about teamwork since ctf made for 5v5 and tdm made for 4v4. Dont be angry and push sts to nerf this nerf that.

Ah and one more thing, i think controlling pet is a skill, when the perfect time to use AA, wheres best pet position, when to resummon your pet, what pet used on any different situation. Thats all need skill, not only press AA as soon as posible after count down end without looking the situation and pets position.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Linkincena

Rogues have access to Samael too and Many other Stun pets...
Correct ? .. along with breeze

---

3>2 this is my point. If you cant understand this then idk what to say

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

3>2 this is my point. If you cant understand this then idk what to say

---

So ur conclusion is to remove freeze completely from pvp?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Linkincena

So ur conclusion is to remove freeze completely from pvp?

---

YYEESSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!! And buff breeze in pve. It was originally MADE TO BE A PVE PET. I forgot who said it but some mod or dev said breeze was meant to help out with difficult pve maps by freezing enemies. This pet wasnt supposed to be a pvp god so just remove it from pvp. And if people complain because they already opened then add 1.5m gold to their stash. We need more gold in the economy anyways

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

YYEESSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!! And buff breeze in pve. It was originally MADE TO BE A PVE PET. I forgot who said it but some mod or dev said breeze was meant to help out with difficult pve maps by freezing enemies. This pet wasnt supposed to be a pvp god so just remove it from pvp. And if people complain because they already opened then add 1.5m gold to their stash. We need more gold in the economy anyways

---

Agree...

don't know what action devs would be planning ...

Many people may Rage... they should plan something for it..

I dont understand why the disscusion, if mages have back their skill no happend nothing, is more will be more mages in AL .

Look at the polls people.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by obee

Look at the polls people.

---

Look at my earlier post about the polls

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

Look at my earlier post about the polls

---

Yup like all mages voted lols..

Jk xD

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Linkincena

Yup like all mages voted lols..

Jk xD

---

I'm rogue and voted for yes :s

Really sorcerers? U have Fireball, Curse, Lightning, u also usually have stun pets...and u want more? I remembered when u cried because of Bulwark because u think only u can kill on pvp. I remember how many votes where opposite giving back Bulwark Stats. They was sorcerers' votes. Didn't u think that Breeze is for aligning chances between all the classes? There are some voices to deactivate Breeze's skill. But u also didn't think some people spent a lot of money, waisted a lot of time, gained a lot of deads, spent a lot of Ankhs, bought a lot of potions and much, much more to get the pet. U don't think about such things. U only think about yourself!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Azageeber

Really sorcerers? U have Fireball, Curse, Lightning, u also usually have stun pets...and u want more? I remembered when u cried because of Bulwark because u think only u can kill on pvp. I remember how many votes where opposite giving back Bulwark Stats. They was sorcerers' votes. Didn't u think that Breeze is for aligning chances between all the classes? There are some voices to deactivate Breeze's skill. But u also didn't think some people spent a lot of money, waisted a lot of time, gained a lot of deads, spent a lot of Ankhs, bought a lot of potions and much, much more to get the pet. U don't think about such things. U only think about yourself!

---

Bro.. There are no mages or rogues or warrs discussing here . ..
There are real world players...

So the Phrase " You mages" doesn't work here . .
I play as a mage, warrior and rogue...

As far as wanting or not wanting . ..
We are discussing on a balance of a serious skill here...

And what? U'll ruin Breeze's stats just like Bulwark's ones?? It's unfair! People spents lots of money, real and game one to get this pet!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

You clearly either ignored or misread my entire post. I addressed the issue of having 3 ways to stop ur enemy from moving or using skills before even if freeze had a new stun immunity so i suggest you read it again. Mages wouldnt even need lifegiver for a 1v1 cuz they could shield, fireball stun, ice freeze, samael panic, and by the the stun immunity timer would almost be up and they could fireball again. This plus using lightning whenever its off cooldown. Rip other classes. Now Let me use your example of a pet with aimed shot to show you what mages are currently trying to do. If a pet with aimed shot was released people would be complaining that its op. Since aimed shot is a rogues skill, they should give rogues a new op skill with 100% crit chance that does 500%bonus dmg. Does this seem balanced? NO!! So why are people trying to use the fact that breeze is overpowered as justification to give mages an op skill. And ill say it AGAIN. probably the 10th post ive said this in now. Hardly anybody was saying mage freeze should be brought back into pvp before breeze was introduced so why are u using something that killed pvp as justification to kill pvp even more? Im yet to see any good response from anybody to that question

---

I actually did read, understand and answer your response with various relevant points.

Im all for removing freeze from pvp, however if STS are unwilling to completely remove the freeze ability from breeze in pvp then mages deserve it as part of their skill set.

I'm unsure how a rogue being given a 100% crit 500% damage skill even remotely ties in to the same issue we're talking about here as I understand it IF freeze were given to mages the skill would remain the same, only with the possibility to freeze for .5-2.5 seconds, and I also play endgame rogue and warrior so my point of view is not at all biased.

As I already mentioned I'd prefer a different buff for mages that would make them a lot less reliant on stuns and more in line with other classes in terms of damage and health/armor however as stated by a dev earlier in this thread freeze is being considered as a permenant addition due to people spending (only) 3m on an overlooked AA that was never intended to be used in PvP.

Either way whatever buff mages get (and they will get a buff as it's not even close to balanced right now) class specific players will inevitably complain because of the simple fact there will be a lot less food around and you'll have to work for kills instead of ...

'Enters pvp, aimed shots 2-3 mages, runs as soon as they come across a tank or rogue'

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Linkincena

Yup like all mages voted lols..

Jk xD

---

I cant tell if u were being serious here or not but to clarify what i said earlier, there is a good chance that most of the people who voted yes play as a mage and they have a biased opinion

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dalmony

I see. So on this logic we should be soon expecting a pet with aimed shot :D

---

lol *evil grin :banana:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrowz

I cant tell if u were being serious here or not but to clarify what i said earlier, there is a good chance that most of the people who voted yes play as a mage and they have a biased opinion

---

Can't comment on that bro...
Who knows who voted .. mage rogue or warr..
I play all three characters . ..