A "Tank's" Pot Use

On Elite Seas, I use at least 70 health pots when I tank. I'm lvl 26 and I have over 1,100 armor and about 3800 health. Dodge is about 5%. Using Malison and spamming his arcane +15% dodge. Skills I'm using are HoR, Jugg, VB, CS (so basically a survivalist/taunting build --no real damage, just massive taunts and HP buffs). I don't think its important to list damage and dps, but mine is 164 damage and 185 dps, so its average or slightly above average, i guess).

The result while tanking on Elite Seas with two rogues and a sorc? I'm spamming health pots, dying here and there, and so is my team.

Is this normal? I can't imagine someone with 900 armor and 3200 health, as well as someone with 1400 armor and 4000+ health doing SIGNIFICANTLY worse or better (caps added for emphasis).

If its NOT normal, I'm hoping someone can enlighten me as to what I need to change.

If it IS normal (again, caps added for emphasis), then I am seriously underwhelmed by the mechanics of this game. Seriously, your greatest gear you can acquire are health pots (I mean you can't survive without them)? No wonder they are colored purple when you buy them 100 at a time, STS must consider them to be a legendary item!

So in the end, when we finally "win" Elite Seas, and I've spammed most of my 100 health pots that can cost me up to 1,500g --per run, I don't really feel accomplished that we did some amazing tactic or did some amazing teamwork. No, strikingly, I feel that health pot spamming won it for us...

I guess my assumption is that warriors are supposed to be tanks, absorb all the damage by taunting mobs for the team. STS seems to hint so, by making taunt skills more effective with this last major patch. But our survivability certainly does not warrant the title "tank." Because if the "average" geared warrior can't do it effectively, how can the title "tank" define our class?

If youre the only one taunting, you've got to be REALLY fast with your pot spamming. Good luck.

Just bring a second warrior if all else fails

You gotta have really high SPPS (spam pots per second ) LOL
i dont die elite seas unless i log.. or get crits ot 3k+ by the boss.. which i think is ridiculous
but ya.. expec to use a lot of pots.. by the end of farming after farming ud realize.. ud have no money
of how much pots ur using LOL.. and the drops are so bad.

Thanks for the replies. If the drops aren't that worth it, maybe the map ain't either.

lvl up ur toons upto lvl26 and then quit AL.
when new maps come again play nd lvl up ur toons and so on.......
elite r jst a time waste nd cubersome unless ur a rich guy (having better gears) u can hav fun.

I usually don't even bother potting at elite seas. You die, spawn with full health and man right next to where you die anyways.

When it was lv21, even if I have all 3 taunt, it wasn't this bad.
Like I always say everywhere, warrior class need better armor.

I waste like 200 pots and My stats are below perfect

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Originally Posted by Teoijio

Is this normal? I can't imagine someone with 900 armor and 3200 health, as well as someone with 1400 armor and 4000+ health doing SIGNIFICANTLY worse or better (caps added for emphasis).

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i disagree. a difference of 500 armor + 800 health is significant.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Teoijio

If its NOT normal, I'm hoping someone can enlighten me as to what I need to change.

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i never really measured my pot usage earlier .. but i used 29 pots on one elite ss run just now (i mistimed skills quite a few times). my team was 2 warriors 1 rogue 1 sorcerer. i have none of the best items .. unbuffed stats are - 3768 health 986 armor. with u having 3800 health 1100 armor, i dont think better gear is the answer u r looking for.

just speculating .. maybe the rogues/sorcerers in ur team need to do damage faster? team takes more time to do damage ==> u have to stay up and tank for long ==> more pots.

another pot-friendly option is to have 2 warriors - ofc it will be slower.

also, with the 45 sec cd among other factors, im not a big fan of jugg.

note - if u r buying 1k hpots @ 13.5k, just one elite silver pirate brings u to the breakeven point, and the rest is profit. good luck farming :)

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Originally Posted by Teoijio

So in the end, when we finally "win" Elite Seas, and I've spammed most of my 100 health pots that can cost me up to 1,500g --per run, I don't really feel accomplished that we did some amazing tactic or did some amazing teamwork. No, strikingly, I feel that health pot spamming won it for us...

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That's my issue with the current mechanics. "Elite should be just that, elite." That's good! But shouldn't elite be defined more by skill and effort put into the game, than by how quickly one can guzzle down health potions?

Sometimes a good offense is the best defense. I use Skyward Smash with Quaking Earth often to help stun Mobs so that my team can get some hammering in while I HoR (I have the Protective Shield upgrade). I find this healing allows me to pot somewhat less, unless I'm the only warrior. I must admit though my build is more a secondary tank (That I can shift to primary depending on the weapon set I wield). This has been a somewhat hampered tactic as of late though because they removed the Mana boost from Vengeful Blood (something that still sucks even with the latest change to the Mana recovery with Skyward Smash, Effortless Execution has a 25% chance to regain it's full mana). Just food for thought and something you can try.

On a side note, any developer that reads this post, It might be nice to increase the Skyward Smash Effortless Execution to 50%. hint.. hint.. :)

I have a 4 buff build, using a level 21 shadow realm and using either esteban, koko or ripmaw for the runs. I get laughed at for having noob damage :)

Before the patch that weakens enemies health, I used 200pots per run. I used around 50pots these days. With a 3-4 warrior team I use close to none. Since everyone is spamming HoR.

1.)
HoR, Jugg, VB, CS

Nah...
Replace:
cs -> ss : cs is worst warrior skill actually
Jugg -> rally cry or windmill :
jugg is actually more for tanking in pvp
Rally: 5% dmg reduction, 25 miss, nice cool time
Windmill: u make dmg, and still taunt mobs after last patches

Max ups your skills, rest 5 points in passiv str.

2.)
Try partys:
2 warriors 2 rogues, or
2 warriors 1 rogue 1 wizard

3.)
Fight in down right corner, there:
Attachment 26759

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Originally Posted by ishyrionek

cs -> ss : cs is worst warrior skill actually

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no no no! :)

Big no no chest spilter is awesome, especially on elite ss

I really appreciate all the replies. Elite Seas really is a difficult map, especially if you are used to other MMOs that treat health potions as a luxury and not as a necessity.

Try a pet like koko over malison maybe...the 80 armor helps more than the occasional 15 dodge. Lose jug and get maxed windmill. Use windmill or horn then VB you get the mana back from all the taunted debuffed enemies. I prefer skyward smash over chest splitter for the stunning, but cs might be okay, I used to use it. But right now I'm using axe throw for taunting at the boss.

I have never encountered this problem. And for the most part I have been using the Lvl 26. Deep Sea set on my Warrior (now I have Sealord of Will). This can be the reasons 1) Your skill set up and/or skill cycle execution is not good 2) You don't pot spam quick enough. (I rarely die unless I get the one hit KO critical from Bloodhammer). Or lastly your party is very weak (this can range from poor skill setups, to gear, just overall skill in PvE, etc).

My pot use is strictly medicinal ;-)

If they would add a targeting system, your pot use could drop SIGNIFICANTLY on this map. Tell em here:

http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...rgeting-System

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Originally Posted by Raxin

My pot use is strictly medicinal ;-)

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LOL...best comment on this thread. Devs can lock it now; we don't need to hear anything else.

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Originally Posted by Teoijio

On Elite Seas, I use at least 70 health pots when I tank.

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That's alot of pots. If you are burning through that many, the rest of your team aren't doing their jobs or you need another tank with you.

when i tank i really use some potions, of course that ins't like 70 because i'm just lvl 20 but, i use some of them just to keep in good health state hahah, i'm proud to be always the tank, the base of the team.. so keep calm and always be THE tank :)

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Originally Posted by Eggcelent

That's alot of pots. If you are burning through that many, the rest of your team aren't doing their jobs or you need another tank with you.

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Agreed, look for the guy that died in the corner and doesn't bother re-spawning til the boss is dead or almost dead.

I've done elite seas numerous times, and tactics do make a difference!

What I've noticed is that the fastest, easiest runs with the fewest pots used were when the group just waited for most of the mob to spawn. We waited in the right most edge of the ship (in the little cutout area). As long as no one attacked, never got aggro and mobs kept spawning. Once a large group has spawned, a Warrior taunted and the entire mob came into the corner with us. Then it was a bunch of HoR, Windmills and VB from the Warriors, Fireball, Lightning, Heals and Clocks from the Sorcs and Rogues going bananas spamming skills. Using this tactic, my Rogue can ratchet her Crit% (via Aimed Shot upgrade) to over 60% (with Ribbit, I get to almost 100%). You just keep dealing with the mobs in the corner until Bloodhammer arrives. Bloodhammer is actually really easy. Getting through the mobs is the most difficult part of all elite maps.

The worst runs I've had is when everyone scatters trying to attack individual mobs. This leads to incredible pot usage, because you are not using team mates effectively. I've been in runs where the ship was overrun with mobs, all at 50% health because no one actually finished off any single mob.

Tactics do make a huge difference in success in the elite maps. It's like Elite Rooks nest and just waiting at the entrance of the boss room. Bael eventually comes over to you by himself, but the impatient can always go in and deal with the mobs and ninjas that spawn, and burn through tons of pots.

As a tank, and I guess a good tank with about 4k health and 1100 armor (average I see running around), agroing a shipdeck full of mobs sounds... painful to survive without massive pot spamming initially.

I guess if you survive their first volley of attacks, your teammates can take over. But without using crowd control (rogues trap / sorcs timeshift), I see the warrior in 100% need of health pots to survive the first couple seconds, at the very least (althouh I think a tank in its pure form should survive for quite a while on its own --that ability defines the class, don't you think).

If the other classes dont know their jobs (use tactics), they'll still pass the map, at the expense of the warrior's heavy health pot use. I guess that's what everyone is saying. But I think what im getting at is that the warrior's ability to taunt without the ability to back it up with endurance is really cruel mechanic of the game for warriors to endure.

I carry at least 100 health pots going into Elite Seas. If I only needed a couple dozen, that's all I'd bring. For those who use less than 70 pots a run, how much you bring would be telling on how reliant you think warriors are on health pots on this map in the best and worst case scenarios.

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Originally Posted by Shaukei

That's my issue with the current mechanics. "Elite should be just that, elite." That's good! But shouldn't elite be defined more by skill and effort put into the game, than by how quickly one can guzzle down health potions?

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This.