Is it by Design? Why is the Attack Range of Bulwark Ridiculously Short?

If something finally comes into your reach when you are equipped with Bulwark, you can probably hit it by your fist too.

Glaive has the longest reach among all available warrior weapons at the moment.

Conquerer's wall (legendary shield) has medium attack range, which is twice of what Bulwark has.

They say Bulwark can hit 3 targets at a time, but with this kind of attack range, its merit sounds more like a joke.

Attachment 96814

A complete miss. Try to replicate the result with any other weapon in AL :)


Bulwark's hit range is so short that I once got kited by a gunman (yes! the mob!) in Kraken... True story...


I have tried so many times in PVP, while I could hit an opponent who is standing still roughly 2m away from me with a Conquerer's Wall, an attack initiated by a Bulwark would totally miss the target in the same range. BTW, I tried both with a charged normal attack.

In a different scenario I tried to hit a rogue on the other side in some casual encounters, but like 85% (charged & normal) of my attempt ended up failing. This kind of thing never happened before no matter which kind of weapon I used.

Also, I noticed that with any other weapon equipped, if your attack is slightly off your target, it will be directed to a land a successful hit by taking your character half a step closer to your target. This is done automatically in both PVP and PVE.

However, with Bulwark equipped, my character seems to lose this kind of auto adjustment.

So I guess Dev can try to repeat my little experiment to see what actually went wrong with Bulwark.

omg. I was saving gold for it . better is tht old conqueror wall. it also proc stuns alot at Helena and ursoth and also gives armour proc. which is good at boss fight.

I am so sick of that I have to charge the normal attack for like two second only to find out that my attack completely misses my target in PVE.

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Originally Posted by utpal

omg. I was saving gold for it . better is tht old conqueror wall. it also proc stuns alot at Helena and ursoth and also gives armour proc. which is good at boss fight.

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Conqueror wall doesnt stuns. It procs an armour coat for 5 secs. That stun , probably is because of your skyward smash.

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@ish bhai
I dnt use hammer neither axe. and I use ribbit.
I was doing solo with my low lvl alt, Helena and Ursoth was getting stunned even tho I haven't used charged normal attack. I just spam normal attack since shield has high dps. i use windmill only whn too mch vines come.

when it procs, I see some gaseous substance in their (bosses) head and get stunned and sometime I get armour.

u can try too. just spam normal attack and u will stun rendtail too.

They obviously need to fix the Bulwark. Just a look at the price tells all.

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Originally Posted by utpal

@ish bhai
I dnt use hammer neither axe. and I use ribbit.
I was doing solo with my low lvl alt, Helena and Ursoth was getting stunned even tho I haven't used charged normal attack. I just spam normal attack since shield has high dps. i use windmill only whn too mch vines come.

when it procs, I see some gaseous substance in their (bosses) head and get stunned and sometime I get armour.

u can try too. just spam normal attack and u will stun rendtail too.

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Ohh does that really happen? I tanked every elite tindrin with conqueror stuff and many times i saw alagran and abomination troll stunned. I used to think its because of my skyward smash. Well, thanks for telling bhai. Ill look into this :) i wish it is true.
Btw tumhara ign kya hai? Mujhe add karna, ign mere signature mai hai. :)

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ye !need mobs very close then u can attack 3 target. ....

Tip : Throw your Bulwark out of the window .
It seriously needs a nerf.

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Originally Posted by Jxmaa

Tip : Throw your Bulwark out of the window .
It seriously needs a nerf.

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Buff*

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Originally Posted by Jxmaa

Tip : Throw your Bulwark out of the window .
It seriously needs a nerf.

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That would give it more range! Works the same for my golf clubs!

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Originally Posted by Ishtmeet

Conqueror wall doesnt stuns. It procs an armour coat for 5 secs. That stun , probably is because of your skyward smash.

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Come on man, it says right there that it does stun and it stunned for me many times on uncharged attack.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/07/11/enuny9yq.jpg

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Originally Posted by Uicheusa

If something finally comes into your reach when you are equipped with Bulwark, you can probably hit it by your fist too.

Glaive has the longest reach among all available warrior weapons at the moment.

Conquerer's wall (legendary shield) has medium attack range, which is twice of what Bulwark has.

They say Bulwark can hit 3 targets at a time, but with this kind of attack range, its merit sounds more like a joke.

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Mersinmehmet

Conquer does stun and proc armor. Some would say that's enough for elites. I agree to buffing it, but a buff in the direction of tanking. More hp and armor, don't give it more damage. It's not meant for that and shouldn't be. Everyone should stop playing pvp and give elites some love.

The basic attack is worthless in many ways. However, it is an area based attack with a medium radius when charged.

The secret proc is triggered 100% of the time when charged anyways.

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Originally Posted by Kakashis

Conquer does stun and proc armor. Some would say that's enough for elites. I agree to buffing it, but a buff in the direction of tanking. More hp and armor, don't give it more damage. It's not meant for that and shouldn't be. Everyone should stop playing pvp and give elites some love.

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Damage and DPS help hold aggro. Here are a few percents relating to the bulwark to consider

A lvl 41 Conqueror's Wall has 32.5_% more armor than a lvl 36 Northern Tower.

A lvl41 Bulwark has 23_% more armor than a lvl 31 Pavise

A lvl 31 Pavise has 101_% more armor than a lvl 31 Northern Tower

A lvl 41 Bulwark has 86.5_% more armor than a lvl 41 Conqueror's Wall

Additionally, the Pavise had both higher DPS and Damage than the Northern tower by a hefty amount. By contrast, the Bulwark has similar damage but less DPS than its legendary counterpart.

Hey guys,

I've taken a look at the data for the Bulwark, and wanted to share my results!

From what I see, the range of the Bulwark is identical to that of any Sword & Board in the game currently. This includes the Pavise, Conquistador, Fire, Nordr, etc items of the same category. The 3 enemy cleave is also intact, and they all share the same 180 degree hit cone in front of the tank.

Where the design may be misunderstood however, is in the charged attack. The charged attack on the Bulwark will 100% of the time apply an Elondrian Curse to the affected enemies, which acts similar to the Sorcerer Curse. It reduces enemy armor, hit chance (not in pvp), and reflects damage dealt by the afflicted enemy/player. This is the true offensive ability of the Bulwark and why the charged attack takes longer to charge (1.5 Seconds).

The Bulwark overall is designed as a tanking weapon, and not an offensive weapon. The Curse is useful in crowds mainly, and can be very effective against bosses when keeping up the curse (denoted by the bubbly green effect). This is of cours eon top of the passive proc that summons the Elondrian Spirit when taking damage.

Sorry if some of this information was not conveyed in an articulate enough way, but I promise if you play with the bulwark a bit you'll find it quite useful. :)

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Originally Posted by Carapace

Hey guys,

I've taken a look at the data for the Bulwark, and wanted to share my results!

From what I see, the range of the Bulwark is identical to that of any Sword & Board in the game currently. This includes the Pavise, Conquistador, Fire, Nordr, etc items of the same category. The 3 enemy cleave is also intact, and they all share the same 180 degree hit cone in front of the tank.

Where the design may be misunderstood however, is in the charged attack. The charged attack on the Bulwark will 100% of the time apply an Elondrian Curse to the affected enemies, which acts similar to the Sorcerer Curse. It reduces enemy armor, hit chance (not in pvp), and reflects damage dealt by the afflicted enemy/player. This is the true offensive ability of the Bulwark and why the charged attack takes longer to charge (1.5 Seconds).

The Bulwark overall is designed as a tanking weapon, and not an offensive weapon. The Curse is useful in crowds mainly, and can be very effective against bosses when keeping up the curse (denoted by the bubbly green effect). This is of cours eon top of the passive proc that summons the Elondrian Spirit when taking damage.

Sorry if some of this information was not conveyed in an articulate enough way, but I promise if you play with the bulwark a bit you'll find it quite useful. :)

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Isn't damage reflected from curse proportional to damage intake? The Bulwark's reflect is not.

I tested the reflect on an elite Breckenridge goblin and an elite Tindirin Shaman. Both mobs, although dealing widely differing damage to me, were receiving an average of 120 damage per hit of the reflect. I had no buffs active and no pet equipped. I have no idea if DoT attacks trigger the reflect, I plan to do more testing once mine is done gemming.

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Originally Posted by Crowsfoot

Isn't damage reflected from curse proportional to damage intake? The Bulwark's reflect is not.

I tested the reflect on an elite Breckenridge goblin and an elite Tindirin Shaman. Both mobs, although dealing widely differing damage to me, were receiving an average of 120 damage per hit of the reflect. I had no buffs active and no pet equipped. I have no idea if DoT attacks trigger the reflect, I plan to do more testing once mine is done gemming.

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The reflection damage is based on the raw Damage value of the attacker, and does not include modifiers for things like level difference, scaled bonus damage and the like which is why you're seeing such things I imagine

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Originally Posted by Ishtmeet

Ohh does that really happen?

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obviously bhai.
see this

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Originally Posted by gumball3000

Come on ishmeet, it says right there that it does stun and it stunned for me many times on uncharged attack.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/07/11/enuny9yq.jpg

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bhai, check every weapon description before buying or using XD.

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Originally Posted by Carapace

It's based on the raw Damage value of the attacker, and does not include modifiers for things like level difference, scaled bonus damage and the like which is why you're seeing such things I imagine

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So the bulwark, an extremely low damage weapon, deals approximately half the user's damage stat as reflect damage? Mildly dispointing. I understand making it proportional to damage intake encourages low armor tanks to use it in PvP and may become OP. However, the gear now encourages high damage and thus lower survivability. Wouldn't basing the reflect on armor be a good compromise? That would mainly help the PvE aspect since no tank will do PvP with under 400 DPS.

One thing I did notice, is the reflect damage was causing mobs be less likely to attack another target. Is this because the hits are considered to be dealt by the user, unlike a DoT, or is there a taunt aspect to the proc?

@the conqueror's wall, many mobs are immune to the stun. I've only seen it work on spear users and archers.

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Originally Posted by Crowsfoot

@the conqueror's wall, many mobs are immune to the stun. I've only seen it work on spear users and archers.

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who care mobs when it can stun all bosses (yes including OP bosses Helena, ursoth, rendtail, inan and alargan)
it also stun those green serpent dragons in rockhorn summit map.
dnt know about armaldo dragons.

So to the point. Is there any buff planned on this weapon at all? It's worth less than 1/4 of the other mythics, which is all the proof we need that it is a highly undesirable weapon in its current form.

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Originally Posted by Serancha

So to the point. Is there any buff planned on this weapon at all? It's worth less than 1/4 of the other mythics, which is all the proof we need that it is a highly undesirable weapon in its current form.

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I dnt see a hint of buffing it on dev's reply.

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Originally Posted by Serancha

So to the point. Is there any buff planned on this weapon at all? It's worth less than 1/4 of the other mythics, which is all the proof we need that it is a highly undesirable weapon in its current form.

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That's what it sounds like. Not going to stop me from typing up a thread on possible changes after I can test more (1 day and 16 hours left on my last gem).

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Originally Posted by Crowsfoot

So the bulwark, an extremely low damage weapon, deals approximately half the user's damage stat as reflect damage? Mildly dispointing. I understand making it proportional to damage intake encourages low armor tanks to use it in PvP and may become OP. However, the gear now encourages high damage and thus lower survivability. Wouldn't basing the reflect on armor be a good compromise? That would mainly help the PvE aspect since no tank will do PvP with under 400 DPS.

One thing I did notice, is the reflect damage was causing mobs be less likely to attack another target. Is this because the hits are considered to be dealt by the user, unlike a DoT, or is there a taunt aspect to the proc?

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Seems I was misunderstood, that is how the Curse damage the attacker takes reflected back on them is calculated. Using the attackers raw damage value. The players stats are irrelevant in the reflection damage related to the curse.

It does in fact generate a bit more hate, because that extra damage being dealt from the reflection is still coming off of you.

ok im confused ... is bulwark better than glaive ?

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Originally Posted by mahony

ok im confused ... is bulwark better than glaive ?

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They are different. The Glaive is an offensive weapon, while the Bulwark is primarily a defensive weapon. It is apples to oranges based on how you play your warrior in my opinion.

so bulwark isn't good its a defensive weapon ? lol im disapointed

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Originally Posted by Carapace

Seems I was misunderstood, that is how the Curse damage the attacker takes reflected back on them is calculated. Using the attackers raw damage value.

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Good to know, disproves a lot of things I've been told by players in game (I admit that I have never tested curse myself first hand).

However, mages are typically high damage players where warriors are extremely low. Not to mention that charging the bulwark is inhibited by potion spamming and a long charge time. In the two runs I tested it in, I was only able to charge the bulwark when around half the pull was dead at which point I would (the following is an assumotion, i ahve yet to test (I have a method in mind)) have netted higher damage output using a conqueror's wall. The reflect is also less appealing in a boss fight than a magmatic claymore.

I support a buff of some sort for the Bulwark. What it should be I don't know exactly but plan to narrow my opinion in a few days.

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Originally Posted by Carapace

They are different. The Glaive is an offensive weapon, while the Bulwark is primarily a defensive weapon. It is apples to oranges based on how you play your warrior in my opinion.

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Except that the glaive's proc makes it both offensive and defensive.

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Originally Posted by Zeus

Except that the glaive's proc makes it both offensive and defensive.

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It also has two procs that are extremely powerful (the armor/Str buff and the pierce effect). One is offensive/defensive and one is pure offense.

The Bulwark has two weaker procs one defensive (+10% armor which is weekend by my passive 5% armor and a low heal) and offensive/defensive (reflect which is low damage output).

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Originally Posted by Crowsfoot

It also has two procs that are extremely powerful (the armor/Str buff and the pierce effect). One is offensive/defensive and one is pure offense.

The Bulwark has two weaker procs one defensive (+10% armor which is weekend by my passive 5% armor and a low heal) and offensive/defensive (reflect which is low damage output).

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So overall, it's not a weapon to use. I have not noticed a warrior become any more durable by utilizing this weapon.

We are certainly interested in any ideas related to potentially bumping this item, and something may happen in the future. I'm interested in the idea of WHAT the community would like to see buffed, whether a damage buff would feel appropriate or some deeper defensive stats to really solidify its tankability.

Thanks guys!

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Originally Posted by Carapace

We are certainly interested in any ideas related to potentially bumping this item, and something may happen in the future. I'm interested in the idea of WHAT the community would like to see buffed, whether a damage buff would feel appropriate or some deeper defensive stats to really solidify its tankability.

Thanks guys!

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I plan to post a purely PvE analysis in a few days (3-5? Depends on real life).

Glad to see that the bulwark is open to possible changes.

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Thank you for the clarifications and confirmations provided.

so will the bulwark be buffed or changed yes or no cuz i want to know !

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Originally Posted by mahony

so will the bulwark be buffed or changed yes or no cuz i want to know !

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Maybe....maybe not....




Maybe?

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Originally Posted by Crowsfoot

Maybe....maybe not....




Maybe?

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crowsfoot what is your opinion buy pavise or buy bulwark ? (and how much to pay for pavise +15 ?)

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Originally Posted by mahony

crowsfoot what is your opinion buy pavise or buy bulwark ? (and how much to pay for pavise +15 ?)

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Pavise can't hold aggro well. I tested one and had to switch to a conqueror's wall by the third pull. The slow basic attack speed and extremely low damage makes it out dated. I bought a bulwark.