Rogues.

They may be slightly overpowered, but isnt that their speciality? Theyre supposed to be BEASTS when fighting 1v1 so I dont see what the complaining is about.

Rogues = single target annihilation
Mages = Debuffs and aoe
Warrior = high hp, armor but low dps

If you think rogues require no skill to play with then youre wrong, they have to time their skills perfectly to kill people BEFORE running out of mana.

Rogues arent a complete package because 1 thing they lack is mana, when they are shooting off skills - midway theyll run out and spam normals. When they DO run outta mana, theyll be dead within seconds... Whats so OP about that? They cant hit 5 skills without running out -_-

Theres an update coming but rogues arent born pros, we have to learn. I dont agree with scripting but thats a whole new topic.

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Originally Posted by TheMiraclebird

They may be slightly overpowered, but isnt that their speciality? Theyre supposed to be BEASTS when fighting 1v1 so I dont see what the complaining is about.

Rogues = single target annihilation
Mages = Debuffs and aoe
Warrior = high hp, armor but low dps

If you think rogues require no skill to play with then youre wrong, they have to time their skills perfectly to kill people BEFORE running out of mana.

Rogues arent a complete package because 1 thing they lack is mana, when they are shooting off skills - midway theyll run out and spam normals. When they DO run outta mana, theyll be dead within seconds... Whats so OP about that? They cant hit 5 skills without running out -_-

Theres an update coming but rogues arent born pros, we have to learn. I dont agree with scripting but thats a whole new topic.

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Fully agreed. And to add some personal opinion, there are PvE builds and PvP builds. People using PvE builds on PvP will most likely tend to feel other classes are OP.

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Originally Posted by TheMiraclebird

They may be slightly overpowered, but isnt that their speciality? Theyre supposed to be BEASTS when fighting 1v1 so I dont see what the complaining is about.

Rogues = single target annihilation
Mages = Debuffs and aoe
Warrior = high hp, armor but low dps

If you think rogues require no skill to play with then youre wrong, they have to time their skills perfectly to kill people BEFORE running out of mana.

Rogues arent a complete package because 1 thing they lack is mana, when they are shooting off skills - midway theyll run out and spam normals. When they DO run outta mana, theyll be dead within seconds... Whats so OP about that? They cant hit 5 skills without running out -_-

Theres an update coming but rogues arent born pros, we have to learn. I dont agree with scripting but thats a whole new topic.

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I gotta disagree with that. First, you can't say ''Rogues are supposed'' because they already are. Then, no Rogues are not supposed to be beasts. They are supposed to hit with a good critical/damage, and dodge nicely. In PvP at the moment, they just kill you too fast. Then, warriors, yes, they are supposed to have good HP/Armor, to survive. Again, that's not happening in PvP. We get killed by 1 or 2 shots from Rogues. Yes, I agree that Rogues are played with skills, and if you have these skills, Mana won't be a problem for you. I played many rounds with Rogues (the ones on Leader Boards), we did tests, and that's what we concluded. :)

I disagree warriors who have poor gear or skills might be dying but theres alot out there that are not. Also, soon as two warriors work together. .forget about it.

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Originally Posted by reneedrey

I disagree warriors who have poor gear or skills might be dying but theres alot out there that are not. Also, soon as two warriors work together. .forget about it.

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This is so true

Well, rogues need the crit and dmg, although sometimes it might.. seem a bit overpowered. However, IMO, it is quite nesscary for rogues to kill fast because they specialize in 1 on 1 combat. Rogues aren't very good team players, they can't disable the entire enemy team, they can't tank for their teammates either, and most of their attacks are single target skills. If a rogue lost their ability to go 1 on 1 with other classes, they would most probably stick with their team and in my experience rogues just die very quickly in team fights unless managed very very carefully. So i think rogues aren't really that OP, actually. It's just what they're made for.

1. Aimed shot is OP (one-hit kill is not cool, or Rogue should be 1000hp 300armor class, then yeah, 1hit is a necessity).
2. Shield is OP. (dmg+dodge+debuff, 8sec of this pure happiness)
3. LB should be separate for each class, no common LB for ctf kills/flags, since rogues will anyway dominate kill-statistics in team games.

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Originally Posted by Yoho

1. Aimed shot is OP (one-hit kill is not cool, or Rogue should be 1000hp 300armor class, then yeah, 1hit is a necessity).
2. Shield is OP. (dmg+dodge+debuff, 8sec of this pure happiness)
3. LB should be separate for each class, no common LB for ctf kills/flags, since rogues will anyway dominate kill-statistics in team games.

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:D Yoho, a rogue, saying the truth. <3

If a warrior gets dies in one hit, then (and Ill put this in the best way possible) they are weak.

My warrior once got into a battle with 2 Sorcs and a Rogue, I was alone.
Entered with 75% hp, killed all three and came out with 4% hp. ( Yeah I did use Vengeful Blood )
Ftw

kill fast is reasonable but a pvp is not design to 1 hit KO its opponent, i think rogue is capable of doing it to mage?

As long as Mage shield is up they won't be one hit KO

lol i'm saying is capable of , if there is a possibility means something must be wrong somewhere.

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Originally Posted by TheMiraclebird

If a warrior gets dies in one hit, then (and Ill put this in the best way possible) they are weak.

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I'll put it another way- if a warrior dies in one hit then he sucks. haha.
Mages did seem weak but theres a new build going around that makes them dangerous also. Ur right on with ur assessment of the classes, imo. I feel like most sorcerers in AL were mages in PL and they want sorcerers to be the OP end game class like they are in PL where they have armor like tanks and do more damage than birds/rogues.

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Originally Posted by rAyZ1234

lol i'm saying is capable of , if there is a possibility means something must be wrong somewhere.

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agree, some combo aimed shot(crit) + piercer + hit n slash is ok, but just one-hit someone with top gear?
For now I see no difference between pvp/pve modes - farm kills, get flags. Ofc it will be changed in guild vs guild battles, though balance adjusting would be highly appreciated.

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Originally Posted by reneedrey

I disagree warriors who have poor gear or skills might be dying but theres alot out there that are not. Also, soon as two warriors work together. .forget about it.

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Yep. I came across two who always roamed together, buffing eachother to attain invincibility for entire fights. Doesn't matter how OP many claim Rogues to be, we can't go against invincible teams.

People seem to forget that this is not a 1v1 matchup - it's cooperative team play. In a well organized group, Warriors lead the pack, buffing and casting invincibility when necessary, and absorb the brunt of the initial damage by making themselves the auto-target. Rogues follow and dispense as much damage as possible and Sorcerers support by stunning (with Fireball) and replenishing HP and Mana. A good group is nearly indestructible.

Without the good group tactics, Rogues run out of mana and die, Sorcerers are easily picked off and Warriors get teamed because they don't do enough damage to take down opponents fast enough.

The worst possible tactic is for the entire group to splinter off.

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Originally Posted by Ruejade

Well, rogues need the crit and dmg, although sometimes it might.. seem a bit overpowered. However, IMO, it is quite nesscary for rogues to kill fast because they specialize in 1 on 1 combat. Rogues aren't very good team players, they can't disable the entire enemy team, they can't tank for their teammates either, and most of their attacks are single target skills. If a rogue lost their ability to go 1 on 1 with other classes, they would most probably stick with their team and in my experience rogues just die very quickly in team fights unless managed very very carefully. So i think rogues aren't really that OP, actually. It's just what they're made for.

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Ty, rue.

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Originally Posted by Rot

My warrior once got into a battle with 2 Sorcs and a Rogue, I was alone.
Entered with 75% hp, killed all three and came out with 4% hp. ( Yeah I did use Vengeful Blood )
Ftw

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Originally Posted by GoodSyntax

Yep. I came across two who always roamed together, buffing eachother to attain invincibility for entire fights. Doesn't matter how OP many claim Rogues to be, we can't go against invincible teams.

People seem to forget that this is not a 1v1 matchup - it's cooperative team play. In a well organized group, Warriors lead the pack, buffing and casting invincibility when necessary, and absorb the brunt of the initial damage by making themselves the auto-target. Rogues follow and dispense as much damage as possible and Sorcerers support by stunning (with Fireball) and replenishing HP and Mana. A good group is nearly indestructible.

Without the good group tactics, Rogues run out of mana and die, Sorcerers are easily picked off and Warriors get teamed because they don't do enough damage to take down opponents fast enough.

The worst possible tactic is for the entire group to splinter off.

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Yah I do believe warriors are the op class. If a warrior can't kill me then he just doesn't that've the right build. And yes Mages are starting to become op also.

-Vys

P.S. as many of you have noticed I have said the classes are balanced and there only needs to be tweaks for a long time. I'm glad people are starting to come around.

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Originally Posted by Yoho

1. Aimed shot is OP (one-hit kill is not cool, or Rogue should be 1000hp 300armor class, then yeah, 1hit is a necessity).
2. Shield is OP. (dmg+dodge+debuff, 8sec of this pure happiness)
3. LB should be separate for each class, no common LB for ctf kills/flags, since rogues will anyway dominate kill-statistics in team games.

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Boo you outed the Shield! Now everybody knows! Haha.

1. AS is a delicate skill to mess with. Nerf the crit damage and maybe pvp becomes a little more competitive. On the pve side though, rogues will take a huge hit if AS is nerfed. So I'm on the fence TBH.
2. Booooo! Great skill though. Never leave home without it. I was pleasantly surprised to see how effective it was in pvp, after people scoffed at me for having it in pve.
3. Completely agreed. Separate the LBs.

So, what y'all are saying is to take away (meaning completely nerf) two of the rogues only skills that helps it survive: Aimed shot and Razer shield.

What if sts took away:

Warriors vengeful blood and windmill?
Mages arcane shield and lightning/Another heavy attack.

Sure Rogues are so OP -.-

Without a pet they are close to useless without a Tank to hide behind.

Mana issues isn't even funny.

Mage Stuns/Warriors stuns and Axe = Out of Mana, then they use shield to heal and pretty much kill you off.

whats this new pro sorceror build i keep hearing about? plz tell me the build xD.

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Originally Posted by TheMiraclebird

They may be slightly overpowered, but isnt that their speciality? Theyre supposed to be BEASTS when fighting 1v1 so I dont see what the complaining is about.

Rogues = single target annihilation
Mages = Debuffs and aoe
Warrior = high hp, armor but low dps

If you think rogues require no skill to play with then youre wrong, they have to time their skills perfectly to kill people BEFORE running out of mana.

Rogues arent a complete package because 1 thing they lack is mana, when they are shooting off skills - midway theyll run out and spam normals. When they DO run outta mana, theyll be dead within seconds... Whats so OP about that? They cant hit 5 skills without running out -_-

Theres an update coming but rogues arent born pros, we have to learn. I dont agree with scripting but thats a whole new topic.

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Lilbless, you know rogues are a no skill class thats a given fact. That's why I don't play them. Every class should be good in 1v1, it shouldn't work like one class will always be superior than another otherwise who of the PvP players would play that class? You're right in saying every class has their own specialty, but the way you describe it even shows that rogue is the superior PvP class. Lets be honest now, who among the most of us want good Kill death ratio's rather than a flag capture ratio. It's just stupid to play a class you know you won't win vs a particular class. Now you mentioned rogue's being a skill-based class....tell me, conserving mana is not something hard to do, a monkey can do it lol, that's the only skillful part you pointed out on playing a rogue. You know when we do 1v1, how fast is the 1v1? like 2 secs? Clearly show's how op the class is. Rogue Dmg Needs to be nerf'd, and you of all people should know that mage's should be buffed.... I tried 1 v 1 'ing Noobs yesterday, ask him yourself, I gave it everything I could in every 1 v 1, I was even given the advantage of casting shield early....the max hp I could reduce was about 60%... and im fully twinked. Mage's armor is just too low to face the rogue's crits and its because of that, why rogue should be balanced to adjust with other classes's armor and HP.

STS have adjusted warriors perfectly, no work needs to be done there.... It's just rogue's and mage's that need altering.

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Originally Posted by Infrico

Lilbless, you know rogues are a no skill class thats a given fact. That's why I don't play them. Every class should be good in 1v1, it shouldn't work like one class will always be superior than another otherwise who of the PvP players would play that class? You're right in saying every class has their own specialty, but the way you describe it even shows that rogue is the superior PvP class. Lets be honest now, who among the most of us want good Kill death ratio's rather than a flag capture ratio. It's just stupid to play a class you know you won't win vs a particular class. Now you mentioned rogue's being a skill-based class....tell me, conserving mana is not something hard to do, a monkey can do it lol, that's the only skillful part you pointed out on playing a rogue. You know when we do 1v1, how fast is the 1v1? like 2 secs? Clearly show's how op the class is. Rogue Dmg Needs to be nerf'd, and you of all people should know that mage's should be buffed.... I tried 1 v 1 'ing Noobs yesterday, ask him yourself, I gave it everything I could in every 1 v 1, I was even given the advantage of casting shield early....the max hp I could reduce was about 60%... and im fully twinked. Mage's armor is just too low to face the rogue's crits and its because of that, why rogue should be balanced to adjust with other classes's armor and HP.

STS have adjusted warriors perfectly, no work needs to be done there.... It's just rogue's and mage's that need altering.

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Well, IMO, rogues do need that damage. I've explained it in another post before that rogues Are made to 1 v 1. And if every class is to be evenly good in 1 in 1, then make rogues and sorcs as tanky as warriors, and warrs and rogues have as much disables as sorcs. Rogues heavily rely on their ability to 1v1 to kill. A rogue that can't 1v1 will basicly run around and die in a team fight, because they can't tank heavy aoe from sorcs, nor they can kill tanky warriors. When 1v1 matches are introduced to AL, this will be a completely different story. However, CTF is a team game, and each class have their roles to play in the team. Rogues roles are to chase down a anihiliate enemies quickly before they carry out their strategy, and for this, they need to kill fast. If you removed a rogue's damage, they're just temporary meat shields.

And Lilbless did not say that rogues are more superior than other classes, he just stated the strength of each class. Each class has their own strength and weaknesses.

And about rogues requiring no skill to play, I have to disagree with that. Although rogues require less skill to play than sorcs generally, there's still a great deal of technique needed to manage a rogue well. Mana management is not as easy as it seems. Since you said that you don't play rogues, you can't say that mana management is an easy thing to do. A rogues mana usually last for about a maximum of 3 kills. After that, we either find mana packs or rely on our normal attacks only. A rogue without mana is basically a rogue without the ability to kill fast. When mana is depleted, rogues are most vulnerable. And for this reason too, a rogue usually cant last an entire teamfight full of warrs and sorcs unless they stay out and in strategically, which is hard since they'll be focused down first due to their squishiness. And carrying on the topic of rogues requiring no skill to play, besides mana management, good rogue play also requires careful powerup management, a high degree of map awareness and also careful planning of kills. It's true a less skilled rogue can still kill pretty well, but they die pretty fast too.

Rogues can't run around fearlessly like warrs, nor they can rush into teamfights and disable everyone like sorcs, they are built like assasins, they need their burst damage output to serve their purpose. And as for sorcs dying too easily, sorcs are not suppose to go face on with a rogue 1on1 with hopes that the rogues can be killed easily. Sorcs just isnt built like that. It is true a sorc dies faster than rogues in 1v1, however they usually survive longer than rogues in teamfights with the correct skill set. And being a rogue, I've seen some sorcs own me in a 1v1 with correct skill timing and toon management.

And about the warriors, they still need to be balanced a bit, just a little bit IMO. The small problem is that when 3 or more warriors team up and start buffing each other, they basically just survive longer than the other classes. I would not be a problem if each team have the same number of characters of each class. However in a match between 5 warriors and 5 rogues/mage, the warriors will usually triumph due to their buffs and average damage output.

Chill twink, theyre gonna get nerfed anyways

rogues arent super easy to play, especially when are only defensive skill is razor sheild that adds a 20% dodge buff that barely has an affect and shadow veil which no one is dumb enough to walk into lol and only affects a small area unless its charged mages and warriors run around fearlessly with there shields. and all you mages out there dont say you dont, because nearly every mage i encounter already has a shield up or has it charged. it reduces that 1 hit ko shot to about 130 to 200 dmg and lasts 8 seconds -_-. while rogues have to hide behind walls(which doesnt work on mages since the aoe on the fireball has an affect through walls) and in blind spots to survive.another thing about aimed shot out of all my 1.4k kills only 2 of them were a one shot kill and only 1 of those 2 i can confirm was a true 1 hit ko because i spawn killed him. if a rogue runs out of mana which it will happen. most likely shes dead. stuned rogue=dead rogue. even if a rogue wakes up from the stun without dying, the enemy has already healed him/herself. and given the fact that they have the worst heal skill possible makes them even more vunerable. rogues spawn health packs that heal 40% health each or 35% something like that and then they have to go pick them up. most of the time they dont spawn where they are wanted. the packs despawn if the not picked up too. mages and warriors have instaheal. that lightning attack tht mages have also has a 250% bonus damage on critical too, thats the same as aimed shot. the only real hope i have of surviving is to stun the target. ultimate mage combo: fireball, shield, lightning and main if needed. and the freeze skill for mages does work!!!! i was in the middle of a fight and a mage was running away from the battle and i tried to chase him down but i realised my toon wasnt moving and when i looked at her she was frozen!! although this has only happend 2 times. the slow affect of frost bolt also works. warriors have ridiculous range. warriors running around swinging there swords from bow(not bow range but more range than it really should have, about mage staff range) range and doing damage. windmill also has a large AOE aswell as skyward smash. rogues overpowered? i dont belive that

yea yea yea...warriors supposedly have high armor and hp.."high" is slightly higher than a rogue..and i don't see that "high armor and hp" making a big difference at pvp

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Originally Posted by Rasittt

yea yea yea...warriors supposedly have high armor and hp.."high" is slightly higher than a rogue..and i don't see that "high armor and hp" making a big difference at pvp

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Agree 200%.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD

A razor shield + heal combo on a rogue (when used well) can beat mages however long their shield is.

And while yes, rogues should do high dmg 1 hit ko defeats the purpose of pvp any way i look at it....

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Originally Posted by Ruejade

Well, IMO, rogues do need that damage. I've explained it in another post before that rogues Are made to 1 v 1. And if every class is to be evenly good in 1 in 1, then make rogues and sorcs as tanky as warriors, and warrs and rogues have as much disables as sorcs. Rogues heavily rely on their ability to 1v1 to kill. A rogue that can't 1v1 will basicly run around and die in a team fight, because they can't tank heavy aoe from sorcs, nor they can kill tanky warriors. When 1v1 matches are introduced to AL, this will be a completely different story. However, CTF is a team game, and each class have their roles to play in the team. Rogues roles are to chase down a anihiliate enemies quickly before they carry out their strategy, and for this, they need to kill fast. If you removed a rogue's damage, they're just temporary meat shields.

And Lilbless did not say that rogues are more superior than other classes, he just stated the strength of each class. Each class has their own strength and weaknesses.

And about rogues requiring no skill to play, I have to disagree with that. Although rogues require less skill to play than sorcs generally, there's still a great deal of technique needed to manage a rogue well. Mana management is not as easy as it seems. Since you said that you don't play rogues, you can't say that mana management is an easy thing to do. A rogues mana usually last for about a maximum of 3 kills. After that, we either find mana packs or rely on our normal attacks only. A rogue without mana is basically a rogue without the ability to kill fast. When mana is depleted, rogues are most vulnerable. And for this reason too, a rogue usually cant last an entire teamfight full of warrs and sorcs unless they stay out and in strategically, which is hard since they'll be focused down first due to their squishiness. And carrying on the topic of rogues requiring no skill to play, besides mana management, good rogue play also requires careful powerup management, a high degree of map awareness and also careful planning of kills. It's true a less skilled rogue can still kill pretty well, but they die pretty fast too.

Rogues can't run around fearlessly like warrs, nor they can rush into teamfights and disable everyone like sorcs, they are built like assasins, they need their burst damage output to serve their purpose. And as for sorcs dying too easily, sorcs are not suppose to go face on with a rogue 1on1 with hopes that the rogues can be killed easily. Sorcs just isnt built like that. It is true a sorc dies faster than rogues in 1v1, however they usually survive longer than rogues in teamfights with the correct skill set. And being a rogue, I've seen some sorcs own me in a 1v1 with correct skill timing and toon management.

And about the warriors, they still need to be balanced a bit, just a little bit IMO. The small problem is that when 3 or more warriors team up and start buffing each other, they basically just survive longer than the other classes. I would not be a problem if each team have the same number of characters of each class. However in a match between 5 warriors and 5 rogues/mage, the warriors will usually triumph due to their buffs and average damage output.

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What was that ... i dont play rogues? Lmao, my twink rogue has 1.5k hp and 300 deaths.... Conserving mana is not hard, ive done it, far more than u, and even if mana runs out, auto attack kills rogue with full hp and mana, you need to have a strong rogue to understand what I talk about, im not talking about the minor cheap pink rogues... i mean rogues like me, lilbles, noobs, qlu.... the twinked onnes, they all know how its like, we did the craziest stuff as rogues but at some point its just like ... wtf do i think im good by pressing one button, some aimed shots, some shadow piercers... lol its too easy, twink your rogue and you will understand.

:love_heart: rue :)

Rogues are really too owerpowered. I got lvl 17 warrior full str and best armors. I am able to kill rogue in 1v1 by stunning and spinning. 2 good rogues kills me in under second. Its just not fair for warriors. 2 Rogues does 1100, 1100 cit damages and one charged normal and im dead. 5 lvl 17 sorcs are easy kill for me. Just run in middle of them and spin. They do poor damage and i got so much hp. More crit for mages and reduce armor from rogues

Don't Nerf rogues.

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Originally Posted by Infrico

What was that ... i dont play rogues? Lmao, my twink rogue has 1.5k hp and 300 deaths.... Conserving mana is not hard, ive done it, far more than u, and even if mana runs out, auto attack kills rogue with full hp and mana, you need to have a strong rogue to understand what I talk about, im not talking about the minor cheap pink rogues... i mean rogues like me, lilbles, noobs, qlu.... the twinked onnes, they all know how its like, we did the craziest stuff as rogues but at some point its just like ... wtf do i think im good by pressing one button, some aimed shots, some shadow piercers... lol its too easy, twink your rogue and you will understand.

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Ah.. Twinks... I see..
I have a lv 21 rogue and I play endgame matches. And twinks, how can there be balance when you play with a twinked rogue lol. Some of your opponents might not have equipment or experience as good as you, of course your rogue might seem overpowered. I don't know about twink matches, but when I play against other lv 21s, 1 shot kills are really rare nowadays unless a sorc got careless at the corner or is backstabbed.

Regarding your "a rogue without mana can kill another rogue with full mana" statement, it is true, I agree. But to be able to do that
High skill play is needed to prevent the rogue without mana from dying first. Its not like a rogue without mana can just rush headon with others with full hp full mana and kill them, maybe it's possible when playing a twinked one, but in my experience, rogues usually die unless you get a lucky crit or the enemy is careless.

Well maybe my rogue is not as strong as you think it is, so...yeah... I'm just stating my opinion.

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Originally Posted by finnman

Rogues are really too owerpowered. I got lvl 17 warrior full str and best armors. I am able to kill rogue in 1v1 by stunning and spinning. 2 good rogues kills me in under second. Its just not fair for warriors. 2 Rogues does 1100, 1100 cit damages and one charged normal and im dead. 5 lvl 17 sorcs are easy kill for me. Just run in middle of them and spin. They do poor damage and i got so much hp. More crit for mages and reduce armor from rogues

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If you're able to kill them 1v1, doesn't that mean they're quite balanced already? You can't say rogues are OP just because you died in a 1v2 lol. Any normal toon should die in a 1v2 situation, unless theres a huge skill difference between players. 2 good warrs can kill any good rogue, 2 good rogue can kill any good warr. And about you killing 5 sorcs, I guess they forgot to stunlock you and stay out of range then...

i think warrior op now tho... their armor and hp actually works... and their windmill... INSANE DMG THAT CAN OWN ROGUES

"shoot at the right time to save mana...run out of mana" bla bla bla
1. Yes, shoot at the right time to be a beast at ks
2. Yes, because shooting at a different time will somehow save mana.

Save mana exactly for ? They always kill me (1500 hp ) with one shot, don't need any other mana