OFF TANK Warrior Build Inquiry

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

Since most of the threads here are about builds and shiznits, I'll be inquiring about your opinion on what I am planning to build.
First off, let me clarify myself by saying that I am not aiming to be the Best Tank there is. I've been playing the melee warrior class in several games already including WoW and D3 and let's just say I got bored of luring and just standing there as the mob/boss/players stand there and beat me up while watching my team beat them up. I wanna get into the action. I wanna be one of those beating craps out of players/monsters as well. And most of the warriors here are already tanks so I think I don't need to be another addition to the pool.

Being an OFF-TANK warrior, however, allows me to have ample damage while still standing tough (well not as tough as main tanks but tougher than non-melee type characters and maybe tough enough to hold some weak bosses or until the tank that just died returns.) With regards to that, I am planning to respec to a build good enough to give me ample offensive might and decent toughness both for PvE and PVP. Again, I am not planning to TANK, taunt, or lure mobs or gangs but more on the offensive type of warrior.

As a background, here are my current unbuffed stats (w/ ribbit)



I do not own nor do I plan to buy excessively expensive mythic or arcane items. (drop or generosity are welcome though. lol)

As of the moment, Lvl Vap is 31 which means we are allowed to distribute 30 skill points.
My skill set is bad but here's what I am planning to do.

PLAN A
Passive:
Might 5/5
Damage 5/5
Durable 5/5

Active:
SS 5/5
VB 5/5
HoR 2/5 (duration only)
WM 3/5 (damage and duration)

Pros: Mana-saver Crit Smasher (SS Effortless exec + VB crit)
Cons: No ensnare from WM (Less crippling effect)


PLAN B
Passive:
Might 5/5
Damage 5/5
Durable 5/5

Active:
SS 5/5
VB 4/5 (No crit buff)
HoR 2/5 (duration only)
WM 4/5 (No taunt)

Pros: Smash-Crippler (SS Effortless + WM ensnare)
Cons: Non-critical skill (no VB crit buff)


PLAN C
Passive:
Might 5/5
Damage 5/5
Durable 5/5

Active:
SS 4/5 (No effortless exec)
VB 5/5
HoR 2/5 (duration only)
WM 4/5 (No taunt)

Pros: Critical Crippler (WM ensnare + VB Crit buff)
Con: Non-unli Smasher (No SS effortless)

Which do you think is better?
(Note: These are my only options Pls don't convince me to change to a tanking build. thanks!)

[bhutkeyur]

well u dont have taunt at all so u r not tank or off tank. Off tank job is to keep main tank alive. if u cant taunt boss when needed whats d point. i think u like dps warrior but this game doesn't have dps warrior.

for VB - if mobs is not hitting u....i dont think so u will generate mana without taunt
for HoR 2 sec shield > duration

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

well u dont have taunt at all so u r not tank or off tank. Off tank job is to keep main tank alive. if u cant taunt boss when needed whats d point. i think u like dps warrior but this game doesn't have dps warrior.

for VB - if mobs is not hitting u....i dont think so u will generate mana without taunt
for HoR 2 sec shield > duration

I'm not really fond of keeping others alive. Tank or not. Let's just say I got tired of being one of the supporting roles in the party. If he/boss attacks me then fine, I can stand up to him. If he/boss attacks others then I feel sorry for them but It ain't my fault anymore. And if there's no DPS warrior in the game right now (though I know there are already quite a few), might as well be the first one. hehe!

anyway for the benefit of discussion, which do you think is the better taunt skill based on the skills given above? the one from HoR or WM?
And what made you say that the 2 sec shield is better than duration? Any concrete example on this? Thanks for your inputs.

[Crowsfoot]

Since most of the threads here are about builds and shiznits, I'll be inquiring about your opinion on what I am planning to build.
First off, let me clarify myself by saying that I am not aiming to be the Best Tank there is. I've been playing the melee warrior class in several games already including WoW and D3 and let's just say I got bored of luring and just standing there as the mob/boss/players stand there and beat me up while watching my team beat them up. I wanna get into the action. I wanna be one of those beating craps out of players/monsters as well. And most of the warriors here are already tanks so I think I don't need to be another addition to the pool.

Being an OFF-TANK warrior, however, allows me to have ample damage while still standing tough (well not as tough as main tanks but tougher than non-melee type characters and maybe tough enough to hold some weak bosses or until the tank that just died returns.) With regards to that, I am planning to respec to a build good enough to give me ample offensive might and decent toughness both for PvE and PVP. Again, I am not planning to TANK, taunt, or lure mobs or gangs but more on the offensive type of warrior.

As a background, here are my current unbuffed stats (w/ ribbit)



I do not own nor do I plan to buy excessively expensive mythic or arcane items. (drop or generosity are welcome though. lol)

As of the moment, Lvl Vap is 31 which means we are allowed to distribute 30 skill points.
My skill set is bad but here's what I am planning to do.

PLAN A
Passive:
Might 5/5
Damage 5/5
Durable 5/5

Active:
SS 5/5
VB 5/5
HoR 2/5 (duration only)
WM 3/5 (damage and duration)

Pros: Mana-saver Crit Smasher (SS Effortless exec + VB crit)
Cons: No ensnare from WM (Less crippling effect)


PLAN B
Passive:
Might 5/5
Damage 5/5
Durable 5/5

Active:
SS 5/5
VB 4/5 (No crit buff)
HoR 2/5 (duration only)
WM 4/5 (No taunt)

Pros: Smash-Crippler (SS Effortless + WM ensnare)
Cons: Non-critical skill (no VB crit buff)


PLAN C
Passive:
Might 5/5
Damage 5/5
Durable 5/5

Active:
SS 4/5 (No effortless exec)
VB 5/5
HoR 2/5 (duration only)
WM 4/5 (No taunt)

Pros: Critical Crippler (WM ensnare + VB Crit buff)
Con: Non-unli Smasher (No SS effortless)

Which do you think is better?
(Note: These are my only options Pls don't convince me to change to a tanking build. thanks!)

Uhm, if u wanted to deal beat the crap out of people be a rouge.... AL isn't designed for any class to play any role.

Warrior: tank
Rouge: damage/DPs
Mage: mob control via stun

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

Uhm, if u wanted to deal beat the crap out of people be a rouge.... AL isn't designed for any class to play any role.

Warrior: tank
Rouge: damage/DPs
Mage: mob control via stun

This is a MMORPG. Massive Multi-media Online ROLE PLAYING Game.
If I want to play the role of a Pure INT Warrior and kill you with unlimited Axe Throw, I will.
You certainly did not understand where I am coming from nor my qualm of being a tank.
Anyway, I respect your opinion so go now and have yourself beaten eternally.

(I dunno if you get my humor... Peace! )

[bhutkeyur]

well improved HoR (increse radious + shield) is better than wm. if u taunt and cant survive...it doesnt make sence...i dont like suicidal taunt. with HoR u can survive but with wm u need backup healing or potions.

take any example of elite norder boss...during boss ultimate two sec shield save people below 35% health. many times boss hitting harder than total health gain from HoR.

if u like dps warrior...give it a shot. get all dps skill n dps gear without taunt.

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

well improved HoR (increse radious + shield) is better than wm. if u taunt and cant survive...it doesnt make sence...i dont like suicidal taunt. with HoR u can survive but with wm u need backup healing or potions.

take any example of elite norder boss...during boss ultimate two sec shield save people below 35% health. many times boss hitting harder than total health gain from HoR.

if u like dps warrior...give it a shot. get all dps skill n dps gear without taunt.

That made me think twice about the build i'm planning to do (Thank God, the expansion would increase the cap to 36 meaning we'll have 5 additional skill points to be distributed. yay!) But your suggestion (considering that I will transfer 1 skill pt from HoR duration to HoR shiled), would still require me one more additional skill point. Which I do now know where to get. As of the moment, I can only think of two skill which I could sacrifice at the moment and get at later parts of the game (once expansion and 36 cap is implemented)

Which do you think is more beneficial? Effortless from SS or Crit from VB? The less worthy one would be sacrificed and its skill point would be transferred to HoR.


I like going DPS on a warrior because, by nature, they are tougher than mages or rouges. I am also not a fan of run-and-shoot or Glass cannon build.
Again, thanks for your inputs.

[Wowsome]

something new! since you have already made up your mind, i will just vote - C.

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

received my plats earlier. Currently "Test Driving" Plan C with HoR Shield instead of Duration. Doing fine on PvE so far...

[Taejo]

I am interested to see how you progress with this experiment. I, too, am rather tired of being a pure tank in this game because of the way PvP is set up (killing blow system vs. an honor points system). I really want to get the 10k PvP kills achievement, so I might be changing the way I play in season 5.

One thing I can comment on about your build is the 5/5 durability. As I've posted in other threads, I am not entirely convinced this passive skill is worth anything. I have a strong suspicion that this game has a soft cap value for armor - I just haven't found it yet. But in places such as the Shuyal Arena, I don't notice much of difference between having 1714 armor (with Koko) or 1564 armor (I do have 5/5 durability at the moment). It's very difficult to test out different values of mitigation based on different values of armor, simply because all damage on my screen is red and I can't always decipher who's damage it is (not to mention no combat log). I am thinking Dex may be better than durability, or Int, for your builds posted above.

I will be following your thread and I will chime in my thoughts/opinions as I experiment more. It's true, to a certain extent that AL does not offer warriors a very powerful damage build. As far I know, the only way to see numbers in damage remotely close to sorcs and rogues is by using a Maul. Even then, we're not on equal grounds with their damage output.

[Alrisaia]

Let's just say I got tired of being one of the supporting roles in the party.

I thought I might chime in here mate from the perspective of a rogue and this is one of the points I think that's really striking me as odd...

So - basically what you're saying is you want to be the primary role in a party from what I gather here? supporting role lends me to believe you feel as though your job is a secondary job compared to what everyone else is doing... correct me if I'm wrong... and by everyone else I mean rogues and mages.

So here goes:
To help you out here... you're not a supporting role. You're a primary role. If anyone is support, it's rogues and mages...

Think of it this way:
Can a nonmythic non-pro group run Skull cove without a Tank? No
Can a nonmythic non-pro group run Skull Cove without a Rogue? Yes (just bring a tank and three mages)
Can a nonmythic non-pro group run Skull Cove without a Mage? Yes (just bring three rogues)
Can a nonmythic non-pro group run Skull Cove with only Tanks? Yes Albeit i'm sure it would be slow - it would be possible

Second point:
I used to play a tank well as DPS in a number of different games... Don't be offended, I'm saying this with the utmost love and respect for my fellows who tank by my side and take the hits so I can dish them out... ahem Kill and Crow And King when you're not in your dress

Tanks DPS is just never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever going to reach anywhere near what a rogue and mage can output. You can be a high damage output tank - but realistically Dots and AOEs included - rogues and mages dish out somewhere in the realm of 10k per second with large crowds even small crowds are getting like 3k per second, heck maybe more - since there's no log as Taejo pointed out - it's hard to tell.


So... I dunno - hope I added some value - I love seeing people running with theoretical specs and trying to determine the best ways to run. So... option - C - from me

[Azepeiete]

Make a rogue or sorc and give up on your dreams of a high damage warrior.

[Excuses]

Can a nonmythic non-pro group run Skull Cove with only Tanks? Yes Albeit i'm sure it would be slow - it would be possible

I do agree with you about tank, that's why I play warrior.

But I tried skull cove with 3 warriors + 1 rogue(no mythics for anyone), but we couldn't finish it.
Every time rogue got killed(she didn't have plats to revive), boss recover its hp back. We spent 2 hours and gave up when the boss reached full hp for 3rd time. Warrior dmg is just too bad. -_-
Sorry for random post. Just sharing my experience.

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

First of all guys, thanks for all your creative input. I really appreciate it very much. Now going back to each of you...

@Taejo, I'm glad you support my "Advocacy (?)". In games like these where hybrids are not really that much appreciated, It's really heartwarming to know that I am being supported by one of the most seasoned warriors of the game. (Well that's based on your Joined date which dates back Jan 2013. I started playing this just this June of 2013.)
I do agree that experimenting on builds in these game (specially on determining the specific effect of point per stat) is quite hard due to lack of battle log and same color of damage. But this awesome game is free so I guess its one of the things we have to live with and figure out. I am also quite surprised about the effect of armor on damages. On other games, damage reduction based on amount of armor is very effective. Thanks for pointing that out. Too bad I never had the luxury of shuffling armor enhancing pets. I will be looking forward to your inputs.

@Alrisaia Thanks for giving us a rogue's point of view. Regarding your post on being the "supporting role", Yes I know that the TANK is indeed one of the main, if not the main, character that makes a team. even in World of Warcraft, you can't go on any raid without having a tank. What I am trying to say is that I am tired of playing that role that supports the whole party in the sense that I need to stay alive to keep them alive. I want to be part of those DPSr that can attack and die anytime without worrying about the party or the raid group. I am also not trying to compete with the amount of damage that a rogue or mage makes the same way that they cannot compete with our amount of armor and HP. Even the best dressed rouge would still be softer as compared to a scantily clad warrior. But still I am glad to find out that other classes are also somewhat curious on what I am trying to do. Cheers my friend.

As of the moment, tried several ulfangs and ubermanns. I know they're pretty easy to do but I find it a lot easier this time. I never ran out of mana and my damage by skills are quite impressive in my own standards. I haven't tried it that much on PVP though for it mostly depends on your team. Though now (at Plan C) I find myself standing longer in the middle of a gang up as compared to my former self. I also get to kill one or two toons once in a while with my SS and WM combo (primarily due to the stun-cripple effect)

There's still room for improvement esp since the expansion is coming and that it would mean 5 additional skill point due to the lvl cap increase. Once I have mastered which build to do, I will start experimenting on diff ways to kill opposing classes or bosses.

hoping to hear more from you guys. Thanks!

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

(Note: These are my only options Pls don't convince me to change to a tanking build. thanks!)

Make a rogue or sorc and give up on your dreams of a high damage warrior.

Which part of these did you not understand? KThanxBye lol

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

I do agree with you about tank, that's why I play warrior.

But I tried skull cove with 3 warriors + 1 rogue(no mythics for anyone), but we couldn't finish it.
Every time rogue got killed(she didn't have plats to revive), boss recover its hp back. We spent 2 hours and gave up when the boss reached full hp for 3rd time. Warrior dmg is just too bad. -_-
Sorry for random post. Just sharing my experience.

I dunno if there's a time limit in killing bosses but based on my own experience, you can take hours in killing them just don't take them too far from their respawn point or else there will come a time that they will run back to where they originally appeared back with full health. Regardless if your damage is good or not.

[Crowsfoot]

Second point:
I used to play a tank well as DPS in a number of different games... Don't be offended, I'm saying this with the utmost love and respect for my fellows who tank by my side and take the hits so I can dish them out... ahem Kill and Crow And King when you're not in your dress

Tanks DPS is just never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever going to reach anywhere near what a rogue and mage can output. You can be a high damage output tank - but realistically Dots and AOEs included - rogues and mages dish out somewhere in the realm of 10k per second with large crowds even small crowds are getting like 3k per second, heck maybe more - since there's no log as Taejo pointed out - it's hard to tell.


So... I dunno - hope I added some value - I love seeing people running with theoretical specs and trying to determine the best ways to run. So... option - C - from me

We all have a role, pick one. To often I see people pick a class that looks cool and then complaining its not what they wanted. Alr like dealing damage, he's a rouge. I like never dieing while alr kills the people stabbing me, I'm a warrior. My friends the cheeses like stunning and eliminating mobs quickly, they are mages.
You don't see me asking why my mage (my original main was a mage) can't tank, I simply deleted him and started over as a class I like better. If you want to deal damage be a rouge. Don't try to make a massive damage warrior build, because the game doesn't work that way

[Trahern]

Hey mate, heres my suggestion.
Its prob what i would do in your situation and i fully get your ideals. As a pure tank in training @lv25 and after playing for a month randomly Ive noticed sometimes a string tuggin on my heart to be able to deal out the damage even a mage can dish. After sweeping an area solo in an agonising amount of time when not able or keen to look for a full party, a random rogue or mage can clean up in seconds right! But warriors role is pretty specific in a (free) game like this that isnt as vast/expansive as WoW or D2 with many classes and options to branch out into DPS or Tank.
Option i would look at after thinking about them from day one is how would you like to help the party or mainly the pure tank as an off-tank right?
You already know that as a DPS warrior you can solo mob sets and low class bosses through Elite (talking about PvE) maps but I think a combo which includes SS/CS/HOR/VB would benefit a party. HOR has the best taunt Ive seen and matched with full VB will def keep you/party alive long enough for Tank to return. Your base health is v high so equip to high DPS/dex wep for dodge/crit. So what is left? deal the damage you are looking for and dont waste the party's slot, alternate between CS/SS then hit pots and switch between your +mana pets, making sure you have HOR/VB in reserve for the next usage.
I guess WM is an option for your solo adventures to hit many mobs but damage so low in boss party and PvP its pretty useless for DPS, i mean the buffs from CS/SS to me outweigh multiple mob hits. Im thinking also to better utilise skill points to might/damage passives.
P.S. just reminiscing: I used to play text based MUD RPG and had a DPS knight class which was slightly more damage dealing and less tanking than Juggernaut class (pure tank) and could branch off into either DPS or tank. I went DPS and same deal, could not for the life of me hold higher boss class as opposed to people who chose tank branch and could not hit as hard but could outtank the life outta anything alive (or undead). So Im coming from the other end of the spectrum and the solo life lead not being able to use the prescribed tanking abilities. Putting everything into DPS just would not achieve the satisfaction that using your class to true potential holds. I recommend having something in reserve for those situations when you are called upon to relieve a lagging pure tank, since you already have the base pure stats (thinking you may be starting to put stats into dex now?) like adding Jugg to SS/CS/HOR/VB with rest into passives.
Like i said mate, this is just my 2 cents and thanks for listening to me voice opinion.
I really hope you find what you are looking for and please let us know how you are going.
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[ShadowGunX]

I do agree with you about tank, that's why I play warrior.

But I tried skull cove with 3 warriors + 1 rogue(no mythics for anyone), but we couldn't finish it.
Every time rogue got killed(she didn't have plats to revive), boss recover its hp back. We spent 2 hours and gave up when the boss reached full hp for 3rd time. Warrior dmg is just too bad. -_-
Sorry for random post. Just sharing my experience.

if u want to kill bloodhammer with a warrior class then warrior should hav AT skill.

also need a bow rogue with AS skill

and a mage with arcane shield.

i solo or in group kill blood hammer easily coz of AT feeble+armour debuff . and i use guapo as it has 5% speed+ it also debufff armour in both his arcane and passive ability making me or party do more dmg so as to make up his hp regen.

[Alfred Emmanuel Tanopo]

@crowsfoot
I'll say over and over again that I am not building an offensive warrior to match those of rogues or mages. No. I know that never will it happen.
I am also not complaining about my toon not being able to have their offensive prowess.
All I am trying to say is I WANT TO BUILD AN OFFENSE BASED WARRIOR so I won't have to be the tank of the party.
This is the path less traveled. This is the path I choose to take. I am not forcing you to do the same as mine. I don't see why you don't get my drift.

Re: Skull Cove
I am doing pretty fine on it even on my current offensive build. THAT's my point. Though with my current build (Plan C), I cannot (main tank) bosses and stronger elites, I can still TANK easier areas while contributing DPS. I guess these are the things a rouge or mage cannot do even if they go defensive.

Note: Again, this is what I choose to be. Inputs and ideas are welcome but do not convince me to do otherwise.


" I'm bad, and that's good. I will never be good, and that's not bad. There's no one I'd rather be than me. " - Wreck-It-Ralph