Spec Advice

[Crowsfoot]

2) as a tank, I know I prefer mages to freeze archers and move on. Additionally, several players commented in my hypothetical build in game. Of them, none suggested I use ice patch so I will wait to try it during free respec.

3) darn, I already have lightning unlocked. I will do some tests and drop it if I find clocks working well enough in boss fights.

Yes, I will probably use shield for this reason. Assuming I don't let my mage die out, I may become skilled enough to play without shield. However, since I have a nagging tendency to forget that I'm not on my tank I think shield is safest for everyone.

---

Shame there is no good mage build threads with math dissecting the passives.

However, I went ahead and did some for the heck of it.

Assuming each class is at an average stat range we can apply values of a whole of how potent that class' damage output on mobs is. I started with warriors as the base value of 1 since they are, by far, the lowest damage output. Rogues are above warriors but don't have many area based attacks so I only gave them the value of 3 (ie 3 warriors = 1 rogue). Mages were tricky, they have much less damage than rogues but many area based attacks. I gave them a value of 4 (ie 4 warriors = 1 mage).
*Note: all values are of accordance to mob slaying, the boss fight has been excluded from this part.

Assuming a case scenario for mage damage importance, a party would consist of 1 warrior, 2 rogues, and 1 mage. By deciding the the mage value of 4 by the sum of all factors (1+2(3)+4=11) we get the value 0._36 which is, under SigFigs, 40%.

Next we find the time of an average elite run (mobs portion only, I am not accounting for the boss). I focused only on Tindirin and found average run times of the mobs being between 9 and 15 min. The average of these is 12min (720 seconds).

40% of all damage was from the mage, thus the time impact of the mage was 288 seconds (720 x 0.4). Assuming perfect numbers, each point in passive damage will reduce the value of 288 by an equivalent amount of time. That time is roughly 3 seconds (288 x 0.01 = 2.88 ~ 3). This, 5/5 damage should result in a 15 second faster run in this party. The time of the run is reduced further by the party having more warriors and lessened by the party having more mages.

When error is accounted for the impact of passive damage is negligible. However, the 75 HP from 5/5 Dex is just as unattractive to me. Of course, the better geared a mage is the greater his impact will be. Especially if he/she is better geared than the other party members.

*Note: figures assume perfect numbers, were rounded generously, and a working (stackable) passive damage is assumed.

Good work. The one point I disagree with is the average run time. IMO, it's closer to 15 minutes. For an average party with maybe one arcane item in team and no elixirs, the times are:

• Wilds ~14 minutes
• Jagged ~ 13 minutes
• Magma ~ 14 minutes
• Caves ~ 13 minutes
• Rockhorn ~ 20 minutes

Another thing, pairings and class combinations can't exactly be calculated this way; the damage output of two mages working together is improved beyond double by alternating time shift for example. Generally replacing any class with a mage speeds up the run (at least for the mobs part). What I'm trying to say is that the effect of any rogue's/mage's damage and essentially any damage boosts like passive damage are directly connected with the number of mages in the run.

Two mages, one rogue and a warrior is the most efficient scheme for most of the elites. The warrior can be replaced in an experienced group with another mage or rogue for extra speed. Good mages are hard to find nowadays though. :/

No one reads the whole post whenever its long :/

[Madnex]

Fixed.

[Crowsfoot]

2) as a tank, I know I prefer mages to freeze archers and move on. Additionally, several players commented in my hypothetical build in game. Of them, none suggested I use ice patch so I will wait to try it during free respec.

3) darn, I already have lightning unlocked. I will do some tests and drop it if I find clocks working well enough in boss fights.

Yes, I will probably use shield for this reason. Assuming I don't let my mage die out, I may become skilled enough to play without shield. However, since I have a nagging tendency to forget that I'm not on my tank I think shield is safest for everyone.

---

Shame there is no good mage build threads with math dissecting the passives.

However, I went ahead and did some for the heck of it.

Assuming each class is at an average stat range we can apply values of a whole of how potent that class' damage output on mobs is. I started with warriors as the base value of 1 since they are, by far, the lowest damage output. Rogues are above warriors but don't have many area based attacks so I only gave them the value of 3 (ie 3 warriors = 1 rogue). Mages were tricky, they have much less damage than rogues but many area based attacks. I gave them a value of 4 (ie 4 warriors = 1 mage).
*Note: all values are of accordance to mob slaying, the boss fight has been excluded from this part.

Assuming a case scenario for mage damage importance, a party would consist of 1 warrior, 2 rogues, and 1 mage. By deciding the the mage value of 4 by the sum of all factors (1+2(3)+4=11) we get the value 0._36 which is, under SigFigs, 40%.

Next we find the time of an average elite run (mobs portion only, I am not accounting for the boss). I focused only on Tindirin and found average run times of the mobs being between 9 and 15 min. The average of these is 12min (720 seconds).

40% of all damage was from the mage, thus the time impact of the mage was 288 seconds (720 x 0.4). Assuming perfect numbers, each point in passive damage will reduce the value of 288 by an equivalent amount of time. That time is roughly 3 seconds (288 x 0.01 = 2.88 ~ 3). This, 5/5 damage should result in a 15 second faster run in this party. The time of the run is reduced further by the party having more warriors and lessened by the party having more mages.

When error is accounted for the impact of passive damage is negligible. However, the 75 HP from 5/5 Dex is just as unattractive to me. Of course, the better geared a mage is the greater his impact will be. Especially if he/she is better geared than the other party members.

*Note:figures assume perfect numbers, were rounded generously, and a working (stackable) passive damage is assumed.

Good work.

Just a bit something, pairings and class combinations can't exactly be calculated this way; the damage output of two mages working together is improved beyond double by alternating time shift for example. Generally replacing any class with a mage speeds up the run (at least for the mobs part). What I'm trying to say is that the effect of any rogue's/mage's damage and essentially any damage boosts like passive damage are directly connected with the number of mages in the run.

Two mages, one rogue and a warrior is the most efficient scheme for most of the elites. The warrior can be replaced in an experienced group with another mage or rogue for extra speed. Good mages are hard to find nowadays though. :/

No one ever reads the whole post whenever it's long :/

PS: o really thought you would have read the whole post after the first mistake. XD

[Madnex]

Yeah I read that part but my point up there is focusing on the number of factors that need to be considered not the numbers as figures themselves. >.>

[Crowsfoot]

Yeah I read that part but my point up there is focusing on the number of factors that need to be considered not the numbers as figures themselves. >.>

Perfect numbers focus on a single variable and are usually inaccurate (I can't think of a better adjective. They are not the most accurate, it they are accurate enough. (I hate to say this, but) You know what I mean?). The origin of the term is the same as "Perfect State Laws" (most notably "Perfect Gas Laws"). In essence, perfect numbers are "perfect" to work with but not very accurate. They are, however, good at getting quick results which can be used to derive true figures given the time is invested to solve for those.

AL is a game with many figures. I usually use perfect numbers and rounding to SigFigs of ^-2 <absolute> for quick math. Any significant changes can be found this way. Pets throw in enough "chance" to make precise figures impossible (not impossible, but impractical and inconsistent in practice). Not to mention the fact that 4 humans, usually different each run, have to be factored in, and we all know of the inaccuracies associated with human error.

[faefaefae]

1) its 75 HP
2) passive damage will be stackable
3) km3 is half of what my mage will do, I'm fairly adamant on keeping those 2 points in life giver to save potions. I don't see a drastic chance in performance from 2 passive points. 4+ makes a difference from what I noticed during free respec testing.

If KM3 is half of what your mage does, try Gale. It is extremely useful in tombs. You won't regret it.

[falmear]

When error is accounted for the impact of passive damage is negligible. However, the 75 HP from 5/5 Dex is just as unattractive to me. Of course, the better geared a mage is the greater his impact will be. Especially if he/she is better geared than the other party members.

I wasn't going to bother to correct you on this but since you stated it twice, 5/5 DEX gives you 125 health. You get 5 health from 1 Dex. Use a pet that boosts your DEX and you can see the math for yourself. This is for others who read this not to be misinformed. As for the other stuff there is enough points to put everything on 5/5 int,dex,str,dmg,crit assuming you are using the right build.

No pet:



Pet which gives +25 DEX:

[Crowsfoot]

I wasn't going to bother to correct you on this but since you stated it twice, 5/5 DEX gives you 125 health. You get 5 health from 1 Dex. Use a pet that boosts your DEX and you can see the math for yourself. This is for others who read this not to be misinformed. As for the other stuff there is enough points to put everything on 5/5 int,dex,str,dmg,crit assuming you are using the right build.

No pet:



Pet which gives +25 DEX:

Ok







4164 - 4089 = 75

[falmear]

Right.... that's because mage and warrior are the same. Haha.

[Wutzgood]

Yeah for mages its 125 health for 25 dex. Warriors get less health per point of dex. I use the dex passive for health, damage, dodge and crit boost.

[Crowsfoot]

I don't have any dex pets on my mage but I'll take your word on it. Considering all but damage, and now HP from secondary stats, is the same for all classes you can understand my jumping to conclusion. I will consider Dex as a viable passive.

[Veluthe]

My mage has exact same build just not scorch on fire. Have never used so i dunno if good. I like heal cus it does save on potions a good bit for whole team. I also like shield for suvivial when tanks lose aggro or cant move from a redzone. Mostly i run with fire ice time heal for mobs and normal stuff. Use shield instead heal with less experienced teams or hard elites. And i always swap out time for lightning at boss. Dropping time on bosses will generally get u killed by redzones.

I may do away with heal and or shield again though soon and try those points elsewhere. Afterall i die often anyways. Mage isnt my expertise class but its fun nonetheless.