Rogue Fighting Style

[Serancha]

The heal on pierce has saved my life more times than I can count. It is worth a point on elite.

[Viziam]

Really good info for new rogues. Thanks guys.

I've been charging aimed shot and nox because I seem to be getting bigger damage crits, but it seems like you guys don't do that.

For pierce Ive been charging that as well.. And I took the 3 added targets upgrade.. No good?

[Kingofninjas]

Fast auto attacks (i.e., tap, tap, tap) inflict damage faster than charged auto attacks. This is the DPS part.

Bows inflict more DMG per attack, which is why most rogues prefer them.

Or, you can do what I do, use a bow, fight in melee range with an aimed, nox, pierce combo, followed by tap, tap on auto, then repeat. It's not for the faint of heart though....

Thats what I do too. I also use razor and run right into middle of mobs and damage them with me razor.

[Zestee]

I'm going to need to read all this a few times I think, thank you! A bit reluctant to ask this due to being sniggered at, but what do you mean by auto attack? Is there a setting I don't know about where I can sit back and have a cup of tea while the battle goes on without my input? :-P

[Newcomx]

I'm going to need to read all this a few times I think, thank you! A bit reluctant to ask this due to being sniggered at, but what do you mean by auto attack? Is there a setting I don't know about where I can sit back and have a cup of tea while the battle goes on without my input? :-P

Auto attack is normal attack, no specific setting

[GoodSyntax]

Really good info for new rogues. Thanks guys.

I've been charging aimed shot and nox because I seem to be getting bigger damage crits, but it seems like you guys don't do that.

For pierce Ive been charging that as well.. And I took the 3 added targets upgrade.. No good?

I only charge skills while I'm moving between mob pulls and when I am preparing to launch Ribbit or Gyrm's AA. Other than that, the only time I find it appropriate to charge Aimed Shot is in the arena, under the Proximity Curse.

Charged Shadow pierce is good for two things, evading boss red zones and piercing through single mobs to the other side so you can run through a map faster. Other than that, I don't think I ever charge pierce.

The reason for rarely charging is because in the 1.5-2 seconds it takes to charge a skill, you could launch a full Aimed, Nox, Pierce combo. Not only does the combo do more damage than a single charged Aimed Shot, but it also keeps your crit stack at its peak, which (with the right pets) means almost everything will be critting.

[Qamr]

my build is almost the same as what you post kal.
just i preferred to have 5 skills 4 passives.

Shadow Pierce 2/5 (heal upgrade only 2nd)
Noxious Bolt 4/5 (just removed the 4th upgrade)
Aimed Shot 5/5 (All upgrades)
Entangling Trap 3/5 (except decay and bleeding)
Shadow Veil 4/5 (except decay)

changing between SP and veil depending on the map power if i can't get closer to mops i do activate veil if i can i activate SP

Passives str,Int,dex,crt 5/5 armor 2/5

[kinzmet]

Thank you for posting that kinzmet, very helpful, I just re-spec'd to try it. Firstly, I really do like having more than one arrow. A question about it though. Let's say I am fighting boss, I have aimed shot and nox, plus tappity tap on the main one. But I've forgotten to change my weapon to the bow and am still holding daggers. Will that impact me greatly? Will I do much more damage if I had remembered to switch to the bow?

One more question for you, I don't understand your choices for the passive skills. Someone told me rogue is kill or be killed, that there is no need to invest in things like strength or knowledge, because those are for warriors or mages. So why use them?

Thank you!

Hi Zestee! Sorry for replying so late, I was out on mountains for vacation. Anyway, looks like Goodsyntax/Kalizzaa has summed everything up. Listen to him, his one of my mentors on being a rougue from his elite farming guides.

But to answer your questions,
-Yes, damage wise holding dagger or bow will affect your boss game greatly. An example is the Elite boss Alargan, I really don't like to face him using daggers. Don't get me wrong, skilled people will still kill him without dying using daggers only. But, its just easier for me to kill him using bow. Again its personal preference, some people will take advantage on dagger's vast DPS better than bow's massive damage.

-That someone who told you about rogue's kill-or-be-killed is half right. All pro rouges go for pure dexterity build on stat distribution, but invest on gears, pets, grand gems and elixirs for health, mana and survival. Examples are mythic/arcane gears and pets, also grand gems like Tarlok wind gems. These gives the rogues completed stats to survive while still dealing massive damage.

[Viziam]

I only charge skills while I'm moving between mob pulls and when I am preparing to launch Ribbit or Gyrm's AA. Other than that, the only time I find it appropriate to charge Aimed Shot is in the arena, under the Proximity Curse.

Charged Shadow pierce is good for two things, evading boss red zones and piercing through single mobs to the other side so you can run through a map faster. Other than that, I don't think I ever charge pierce.

The reason for rarely charging is because in the 1.5-2 seconds it takes to charge a skill, you could launch a full Aimed, Nox, Pierce combo. Not only does the combo do more damage than a single charged Aimed Shot, but it also keeps your crit stack at its peak, which (with the right pets) means almost everything will be critting.

Wow Kali.. Thanks for explaining that. It's really improved my game! I'm now critting on almost all of that combo, until I run out of mana.. It's freakin awesome! Thanks man! I love the rogue community here..

[Taaraveo]

Thanks kalizza and serancha and also zestee for the topic. I learn more will reading this thrend. Also, I thought kali is a girl..

[NotYoCookiez]

this has helped me beyond words. Honestly appreciate that you guys explain all this. I love you guys and i hopefully i will become a great rogue and share my wisdom!

[Reightz]

Hey all.
Seen u talking about Shadow Pierce
"use it to avoid the red areas"
"Use it to go through mobs"

How do u control it?
Everytime i tap SP it goes straight into the crowd then i take a lot dmg from enemies =/
Of course when using in a empty area i can control it and dash in any direction i want, but how to do that when the mobs are just there?
(Seems like SP has a auto aim, wich sux imo)

[GoodSyntax]

Pierce for evasion is only effective against bosses or any time there is only one enemy on screen.

Basically, the moment a boss starts his windup (red zone) charge pierce and the instant it is fully charged, let go. This will cause your rogue to pierce into the boss and try to seek a second target (which there won't be) and ends up going through the boss and outside of the attack area.

This is a super useful strategy and has saved my life countless times!

[Madnex]

Charging pierce reduces the damage per target so it's generally unadvised to do so - unless you're trying to avoid a red zone. Stay away from rising death upgrade as well, it also reduces the impact damage without making up for it by the 5-6 hits that follow.

[Reightz]

Got it! Ty for being quick on answering.

Two more questions -- about traps

1. Ppl says the bleed upgrade will attract aggro but having a short range wont it attract aggro anyway since u gotta get close to launch the trap?

2. What would be the utility of trap skill when used without bleed? Snare and pull effects for CC only? (Seems not that useful)

[NotYoCookiez]

Got it! Ty for being quick on answering.

Two more questions -- about traps

1. Ppl says the bleed upgrade will attract aggro but having a short range wont it attract aggro anyway since u gotta get close to launch the trap?

2. What would be the utility of trap skill when used without bleed? Snare and pull effects for CC only? (Seems not that useful)

i have the exact same question

[GoodSyntax]

Traps is most useful for crowd control. Aside from the most useful aspect (the pull) traps set up a barrier that most mobs won't go through. So, you can use this to play a cat and mouse game and effectively kite at close range.

Also, traps can be used to inflict small damage. This is helpful when used in a combination with Clock and Nox. If the traps pull, and a sorc drops a Clock, you can use a charged Nox and create 3 separate DoT attacks. It's not a lot of damage, but every bit helps, especially when you spread the damage over a large cluster of mobs.


But, basically, traps are all about the crowd control...

[kinzmet]

1. The bleeds on traps do make mobs aggro on you, now your question is --> when you set up the trap doesn't you already aggro the mobs already by going close to them? So why remove bleed effect?

Thats how I understood it, If that was your question then heres the answer:
-When you are with party on a warrior (pve build), surely the HoR and other warrior skills have "Taunt" which pulls the aggro on them. Now if you put bleed on your trap you will make the mob target you instead of the warrior when the taunt's effect wear off.
-You don't really want to put the trap first, If you do the mobs will definately have an all out aggro on you because you came close to them. What you wanted is for your tank to aggro them and then you can place the traps strategically and safely.

2. Traps without the bleed is for CC only?
-It seems like it but no. What you really want to set-up is you Noxious Bolt, since Shadow Storm Shot is poor choice of AoE skill (AoE is very limited to rogue). You wanted the mobs to cluster in group so that the poison splash of Noxious Bolt will be maximized. Bleed effect from the Razor wire upgrade of Entangling trap is really a good addition for DoT but what you really wanted is DoT without having the mobs aggro on you, and the bleed effect makes the aggro kills you.
-In the end, no bleed traps will provide you good CC without the risk of mobs swarming on you.

[GoodSyntax]

1. The bleeds on traps do make mobs aggro on you, now your question is --> when you set up the trap doesn't you already aggro the mobs already by going close to them? So why remove bleed effect?

Thats how I understood it, If that was your question then heres the answer:
-When you are with party on a warrior (pve build), surely the HoR and other warrior skills have "Taunt" which pulls the aggro on them. Now if you put bleed on your trap you will make the mob target you instead of the warrior when the taunt's effect wear off.
-You don't really want to put the trap first, If you do the mobs will definately have an all out aggro on you because you came close to them. What you wanted is for your tank to aggro them and then you can place the traps strategically and safely.

2. Traps without the bleed is for CC only?
-It seems like it but no. What you really want to set-up is you Noxious Bolt, since Shadow Storm Shot is poor choice of AoE skill (AoE is very limited to rogue). You wanted the mobs to cluster in group so that the poison splash of Noxious Bolt will be maximized. Bleed effect from the Razor wire upgrade of Entangling trap is really a good addition for DoT but what you really wanted is DoT without having the mobs aggro on you, and the bleed effect makes the aggro kills you.
-In the end, no bleed traps will provide you good CC without the risk of mobs swarming on you.

Perfect explanation!

Also, remember that traps need a few seconds after being dropped before they are sprung. So, what I do is place a trap where I want and expect mobs to follow (i.e., choke points and corners) then aggro one or two mobs and "lead" them where I want a pull to get set up.

From there it is a matter of dropping traps as soon as they cool down and keep hoping for a pull to keep the mobs exactly where you want them. This way the sorcs can maximize their AoE/DoT. With a tank in party, you really don't generate too much aggro with traps if you do not have the bleed upgrade.

Rogues, being a single target class, really only generate aggro on one or two mobs at a time, so long as you maintain attacks on a single enemy. Spray attacks all over the place, and you make everyone's job harder.

Remember, this is a cooperative game, and the better the teamwork and the better your group is able to compliment each other, the more successful your team will be.

[Soundlesskill]

I often wonder how other rogues fight. For example, when I get to the boss, I like to get up close, and hold down then release. Rather than tap tap tap tap I mean. It's easier on the fingers/wrists! But on the times I change to tap tap tap, I feel like he dies faster. Am I imagining this?

Also, lots of rogues use their bow on the boss, but it's sooooooo slow!! I bought the best legendary bow available to me, and it still doesn't kill as fast as my daggers. But I seem to be the only rogue who feels this way. Maybe the day I bought my bow there wasn't much good stuff available?

My main weapon: 193.5dps, 45dex
My bow: 121dps, 31dex, 2.15 crit

I know the bow numbers are significantly smaller, but I'm told that's pretty normal, that they still do more damage....???? Confused....

I suggest not to use daggers at all, because you want to get out as much single target damage as possible, the mages handle the AoE. Don't use daggers unless you got the mythic ones. For boss, rouges use bow because it has higher single target damage, that's why your Damage increases when you equip it. Whereas the daggers increases your DPS (Damage Per Second) and has a little AoE attack. I suggest you run with bow all the time and focus down the hardsst mobs, such as the mages in the new tombs, the witches, lizards, weird-green-guys in Tindrin. It may be slow when attack, but it has more damage output if it's used right.
The bow should be used with Aimed Shot, Noxious Bolt, Piercer and a skill of own choice: Veil, Trap, Razor, whatever you prefer. Eg. Heres my PvE specs:
5/5 Aimed Shot
5/5 Passive Dexterity
5/5 Passive Strength
5/5 Passive Intillegence
3/5 Noxious Bolt (I get the first (or secod, if I rememer correctly lol) and the last.
4/5 Veil, no explosion
4/5 Trap, no explosion
1/5 Piercer, or 2/5 with heal upgrade. I like the heals .
Rest in passive crit or damage.

I recommend not charging your attacks, it's more DPS with single target damage. I usually face tank everything and spam pots, but running around works just as well. Combo is: Non-charged Aimed -> Nox -> Auto -> Nox -> Piercer. Repeat, drop Veils and Traps when possible. For mobs, I would target the biggest problem (Witch, Lizard, Big green mob). Just spam the combo and pots!

Regards
Noisy