Bandit Boy Stronghold

[davidis57]

What is the fixation with groups wanting to pull mobs on this map? It doesn't save deaths or stop you from dying by fire traps. When you have lag there is many deaths. I died six times on one run. With that many deaths and trash drop from the queen it makes the small XP I got not worth it. I am pretty laid back and don't really gripe about stuff but your not in a race. Clearing the map the way it was meant to be cleared you have lot less deaths and more XP. When you die you get less XP if you were not aware of that. I don't care about dieing I have almost 1500 deaths. However deaths that could be avoided upsets me some. I just don't like the pulling mobs in this game too much save the pulling for WOW or L2.

Timbabird lvl 55

[karmakali]

Adrenaline rush

[icantgetkills]

i round up mobs we clear it very fast i have never had a wipe out on that map you should get a better team to be honest

[Necrobane]

It's not just the tank that benefits from these pulls, mages and archers love being able to combo large groups as it is satisfying. Don't like it? Request for the group to avoid pulling large mobs, if their remotely civilised then it's problem solved.

[davidis57]

Its pulling during laggy server that really don't care for. We just had a 4 person wipe because of it. I agree I like the damage but most of the time too much lag with too many mobs at just the wrong time. Pings been high for a week.

[noneo]

Its pulling during laggy server that really don't care for. We just had a 4 person wipe because of it. I agree I like the damage but most of the time too much lag with too many mobs at just the wrong time. Pings been high for a week.

I agree.

Depending on how your team is set up, no matter how well the tank pulls the mobs, everyone/most everyone will get wiped. It doesn't really go any faster (the amount faster is negligible), and it lag-kills me nearly everytime. Try being an INT mage and surviving though that. The second you cast a debuff, your done. I prefer just good old fashioned running and killing.

[Subterraneous]

Hmm then don't get in my groups...

[karmakali]

Ultimately it comes down to a matter of preference. I have leveled out and to farm BB Hideout gets boring and repetitious. Avoiding a highly possible team wipeout becomes part of the challenge. There are teams out there to suit all types of players. Find one that works in harmony with your play style and have fun!

[Ellyidol]

It's definitely fun to do once in awhile, but basing from practicality, it's just not worth it.

The idea that it's "faster" just comes from the fact that you actually spam less and spend more time waiting than actually killing. The only bit that actually speeds up the run is when you split into two groups from the main huge room to those two corridors and you meet in the middle. After that, it should just be free-for-all killing in that mazed spiral.

Unless of course you've got a tank that just speed pots up and actually makes those huge mobs ready every time

[Kalielle]

I prefer rondups when I play on my mage, because with a good group I'm actually less likely to die from firetraps. I hate seeing mobs scatter all over the place over the firetraps and you have the choice to leave them or die chasing them.

I very rarely see wipes in our groups; there are occasional deaths but not more so than I've seen in groups fighting the regular way. If anything people seem to die more from the firetrap passage where they're all in a row, than from fighting after pulls. If your group is wiping all the time or people are dying 6 times, something's not right. Maybe your tank is not taunting enough or not pulling at the right place. It also helps to have at least 2 mages in the group, since the occasional mage death will inevitably happen.

[Ayrilana]

I don't things many PUGS can pull it off. I've only been in a couple groups that managed to do this and we cleared stronghold in less than 4 min every time. Actually, I think it was with the same people both days. The puller was using a speed pot. I wish I could remember their name and get them to post how they did it. All I remember is that they were Korean and had a habit of "hiding" in the barrel at the beginning of the map while we all got ready.

[WhoIsThis]

I don't things many PUGS can pull it off. I've only been in a couple groups that managed to do this and we cleared stronghold in less than 4 min every time. Actually, I think it was with the same people both days. The puller was using a speed pot. I wish I could remember their name and get them to post how they did it. All I remember is that they were Korean and had a habit of "hiding" in the barrel at the beginning of the map while we all got ready.

It depends on the skill of the puller and the team. With a good team, I find that it can save time, although not as much as the more ardent advocates claim. If there was a dodge pot, well, it would make it easy. Speed pot + dodge pot - lol. Speed pot is much more useful than tank pot for roundup.

Deaths seem to happen when all of the mob concentrates on one player - often an int mage after they've nuked. I'm still debating between staff or wand/bracer for this - staff for raw firepower, but wand because you are likely to live.

I'm guessing that the tank may have been Knightnoi.

[Moogerfooger]

I agree.

Depending on how your team is set up, no matter how well the tank pulls the mobs, everyone/most everyone will get wiped. It doesn't really go any faster (the amount faster is negligible), and it lag-kills me nearly everytime. Try being an INT mage and surviving though that. The second you cast a debuff, your done. I prefer just good old fashioned running and killing.

Deaths seem to happen when all of the mob concentrates on one player - often an int mage after they've nuked. I'm still debating between staff or wand/bracer for this - staff for raw firepower, but wand because you are likely to live.

This is the key point. They are not necessarily faster, because time spent cleaning up stragglers is a factor, waiting time partially offsets the big kill factor, although these are also dependent on the skill of the team, like some have mentioned.

However....what bears (myself included, as I have rounded up on mine for a while) fail to realize is that as soon as a Int mage unleashes a debuff on that mob of 20 you just brought over, or a bird unleashes a heavy-hitting Cruel Blast, guess who now has mad mob aggro? That's right, it's not you the bear or pally (as your skill damage if throwing skills is lower on a pally). It's that Int mage or bird, and speaking from experience 20 mobs drilling a Int mage or a bird is not a good thing once they have inadvertently gotten large mob aggro. I have died more on my bird and mage doing roundups than I ever did NOT doing them, and I have never been accused of sucking.

That said, there are some areas where splitting up like on Stronghold when a tank/pally goes right and the rest go up and meet in the middle where it seems to work well. Or when the roundups are a little smaller, say 5-12ish mobs (just making a number up).

Yes it's fun (for the bear/pally rounding). Yes it's something different. Yes, it is showy. Yes, it also gets people killed due to lag induced by the huge combos going off. Yes it kills people due to playing on slow connections. Yes, it can also easily kill even skilled mages and archers due to massive mob aggro.

Just my opinion, not saying anyone here is "wrong". I just prefer to play as a "team"/group kite method where everyone has a better chance of complimenting each other's skills by being close, unlike Catacomb rushes where everyone can easily get strung out having to clean up stragglers, dodging traps, etc. Sometimes people are going for XP, so leaving them behind and missing out on that XP for the sake of saving 30 seconds is questionable.

[FluffNStuff]

I have found the key to being successful is to not pull too many mobs. If you have more mobs then will get caught in your archers roots, you are going to have a problem, since any that avoid the insta kill from nature strike + blast are gonna swarm your team.

[Blind]

I'm a pure intel mage, and today i was able to pull with mega set, (with the help of speed and tank pots )

[Riccits]

i think this will need some time compares to know what method is faster... but imo pulling is faster, bcz u can begin pull even not all mates joined party and u if u dont make crowds all players begin to single kill somewhere in the area wich is very slow and uncoordinated.. the "puller" just needs to run as much foreward as possible to dont let wait much the others..
and yes... some deaths arent avoidable with that system, but its not so tragic..

[davidis57]

Fighting in between fire grates you will find yourself being like a pinball game which will result in death. Its best to kite and keep moving as a group as you clear on your way to the queen.

[Doubletime]

I don't think one method is better than the other per se, but I do prefer the roundup when the party is setup correctly. In most PUGs, I avoid it unless the party is pally and archer heavy.

Last night I farmed Stronghold with Olliwalli, Echelong, Mitsuisun, and Anichelith (I believe he was the 5th). So we had 2 pallys, and pure mage and two dex birds. Olli would round and we could ususally one or two shot kill the mobs with combos as one or two of us was usually running a damage pot. It was very quick to clear and left little chance for a fire pit death. For me, this type of party is perfect for rounding. However, we even still have the occasional death, which none of us really care about.

So for me, the party makeup dictates tactics for stronghold. Roundup can work well, you just have to have the right people to pull it off. If it is a random PUG, the Death Train/Kite method works better it seems.

[Echelong]

I don't think one method is better than the other per se, but I do prefer the roundup when the party is setup correctly. In most PUGs, I avoid it unless the party is pally and archer heavy.

Last night I farmed Stronghold with Olliwalli, Echelong, Mitsuisun, and Anichelith (I believe he was the 5th). So we had 2 pallys, and pure mage and two dex birds. Olli would round and we could ususally one or two shot kill the mobs with combos as one or two of us was usually running a damage pot. It was very quick to clear and left little chance for a fire pit death. For me, this type of party is perfect for rounding. However, we even still have the occasional death, which none of us really care about.

So for me, the party makeup dictates tactics for stronghold. Roundup can work well, you just have to have the right people to pull it off. If it is a random PUG, the Death Train/Kite method works better it seems.

Yeah those where really good roundups, but the thing about that is that the player doing the roundup needs to know when enough enemies is enough. If they do to much of a big pull it could easily wipe the party, but last night we had two pro pallys rounding up and they where very clean runs. The good thing I like about rounding up was the area with the scatter fire traps in strong hold; because it is easier and less deadly as for the others its just about who and how big is the pull.

[MITSUISUN]

I liked the 1-2-3-K&Q stop that we did. Best of all I was nuking as a noob mage and not as noob bird. Played nonstop mage this past weekend and finally understand why people play mage. it's so fun. I might just delete my bird and be a mage rofl.

nah...

Kudos to all the rounders and mages out there that I have grouped. you guys are amazing.

Death Train ftw but once in a while when you just wanna be lazy / holding a drink and play at same time, a round up party would be nice