sic3. Games should NEVER start until each time has 5 players on each side.
Hmm, guess some ppl have to get the games rolling so others can pitch in, so maybe being flexible does have it's merits also?
Thread: PvP Ideas
sic3. Games should NEVER start until each time has 5 players on each side.
Hmm, guess some ppl have to get the games rolling so others can pitch in, so maybe being flexible does have it's merits also?
Just to kinda legitimise my ramblings a bit, I am (i guess) a veteran of WoW Arena PvP, having played at 2000ish rating. Currently playing an enchanter who you repeatedly fail to accept my friend requests Xanthia
This is a good idea, but there would have to be some kind of time limit on the amount of time being spent inside it, otherwise the enemy team could simply camp inside. Spawn killing is to a degree something thats part of PvP, and there's a degree of skill in controlling the battle in order to gain control over the enemy team (WoW has it with graveyards in Warsong Gulch etc. and MW/MW2 has it through objective control). I do agree though that spawn killing as it is atm is down to a bad spawn system and not players skill.Originally Posted by Xanthia
I find that the openness of classes, allowing bowchantresses etc, is one of the hallmarks of this game, and really allows for creativity when playing. Cutting off choices and just leaving the cookie-cutter classes would mean that very often one would just be playing with the same tactics over and over. I think that if the lag is dealt with, the options for team tactics and group setups would be really interesting, maybe creating a very defensive setup which relies on draining an enemy teams attacks (for 3v3: Bowbear, Tankbear for stuns, enchantress as an example) or something very offensive (caster, bowchantress, archer) but squishier.
The rest of your ideas make a lot of sense though. I'd personally like to see damage reduced even further still, although this is probably controversial. People are still dying in bursts that are way too high, things need to be smoother and slower. I'd suggest that HP should really scale upwards via your level (if only in PvP), as well as simply being influenced by strength.
I also think MP should be increased, especially for casters; putting a mana shield on should not drain almost all my mana just from one burst. Again this could be just for PvP.
This is very obviously ripped from WoW, but i think diminishing returns on stuns/freezes could also be important if damage was reduced further. As an enchantress i can completely take a Bear/Archer out of the game just by chain freezing them.
Just some ideas to throw about and be widely discredited
Edit: to sum up really; the ridiculous killtime as it stands at the minute needs to be fixed, and then i think smaller tweaks to particular subclasses could be made.
Last edited by lazuli; 05-29-2010 at 12:48 PM.
Well the biggest and most important idea on that list is that players should be confined to just class specific weapons and armor. I understand that no other players see my view on that, but it will be IMPOSSIBLE to make pvp equal and fair if players can do what ever they want. There will always be a class of the week, depending on what class or skill the devs want to buff or give the nurf bat too. However, it is really funny to see the different players disagree with me, especially considering they are only saying this when their class is on top, and after that changes I don't hear from them again. Honestly, I would be saying this even if Healing Enchantress were the top of the list, which never happens, but something to hope for
Anyway, I hope that you all are looking at PvP in a team aspect, not in who gets the most kills, because honestly, I do not care who gets the most kills, I get kinda mad when people brag about how many kills they received because if it was not for your team there is no way you could have achieved that. If you really care about PvP in the future and not just now, you would agree that PvP needs to be balanced and the best and only way to do it is to restrict class specific items and gear. There are still MANY ways to design your character, considering some weapons do certain proc's that allow many combos, this would enable you to use those points you spent in that debuff somewhere else. You all need to stop expecting complete random madness, it honestly makes this game look really crude in my opinion. Don't get me wrong I love this game and I think the DEV's are doing an excellent job. I just would like to see this game grow, and I don't see that happening all that much when battles last 3 seconds and everyone dies no matter what skill you use.
As I have been saying, Venom is making an extremely long post and will be posted in 2 days
Sorry Lazuli, I don't accept anyones friend request unless I know them, so send me a tell when your about to do it.
Last edited by Xanthia; 05-29-2010 at 02:13 PM.
By default, class-based PvP isn't fair and equal.
It's rock/paper/scissors, which is, however, more fair than an open-ended skill building MMO... or I should say, R/P/S is more fair with regards to player skill than an open-ended skill building MMO.
Personally I don't think PvP can ever be truly balanced in a class-based MMO, regardless of whether gear restrictions are in or not.
As it stands there are three different roles - I think the real issue you're having is whether or not they are clearly defined as originally intended. Well, the devs have stated that their original intent is not to have enchantresses only wearing cloth subsets and using wands/staves with mostly INT - they've stated that it is as open-ended as a class-based MMO can be. You can put YOUR points where YOU want, period. You can EQUIP any gear YOU want, period.
Now, if they changed it, I wouldn't really be upset. Again, it's just about giving the player a little bit of customization beyond the three classes.
If there were say, FIVE or SIX [or MORE] classes??? I would probably agree with you. But for now, it almost feels necessary that they leave at least speccing open which opens the door for different gear options and thus slightly different playstyles.
I don't have a problem with it either way, but I don't think caring about PvP means you support gear/stat restrictions.
to be honest getting a balance in PVP is very hard, theres always going to be a class that has the upperhand over the other, many MMOS ive played were like this and there were those 'flavour of the months' where people would jump on the bandwagon to be the best until its nerfed. id say now its bowbear, and it will soon change.
i love the customizing aspect of this game, i think the big problem here is the damage, its way to much for our characters to take, the burst damage all classes have now is insane. this sort of burst damage should be lowered. more health, or more defense modifiers would definately solve the problem, because i assume people just hate dieing in 2 seconds (i know i do)
maybe if they had more classes this wouldnt be a problem, but i really like their system ATM, its very customizable and its unique imo
but everything else you said xanthia i agree with
Sayishere - Archer.
Never tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon.
I think I would ideally want the damage/health mechanic changed so that it needs 2 people to take down a player that is being efficiently healed, and then these worries about classroles being swapped around would probably become less important. When everyone is hitting super high and only one or two gear choices have the HP feedback to back that damage up then obviously people aren't going to like that. If damage is lowered or maybe it's made so that strength isn't pivotal in hp increase... I think it will make things better.
I personally believe that 3 classes might be too low to disallow to much dynamism with choice, but if class requirements were brought in, you could always make it so that the pink weapons/armour have class requirements, but anything lower doesn't. People could still experiment but the big guns are locked away for set classes.
Oh and il hit you up on that friend request Xanthia, Im just interested to find out what team setup you roll with and how you play PvP, particularly as a defensive healer.
On the contrary, I think at the moment, the classes with their default builds are kinda unbalanced in PVP and so with the FREEDOM to mix and match, one can hope to achieve a bit more balance between the classes. It is also creative and unique to have the FREEDOM to build whatever you please and take that into battle.Well the biggest and most important idea on that list is that players should be confined to just class specific weapons and armor. I understand that no other players see my view on that, but it will be IMPOSSIBLE to make pvp equal and fair if players can do what ever they want. There will always be a class of the week, depending on what class or skill the devs want to buff or give the nurf bat too. However, it is really funny to see the different players disagree with me, especially considering they are only saying this when their class is on top, and after that changes I don't hear from them again. Honestly, I would be saying this even if Healing Enchantress were the top of the list, which never happens, but something to hope for
Anyway, I hope that you all are looking at PvP in a team aspect, not in who gets the most kills, because honestly, I do not care who gets the most kills, I get kinda mad when people brag about how many kills they received because if it was not for your team there is no way you could have achieved that. If you really care about PvP in the future and not just now, you would agree that PvP needs to be balanced and the best and only way to do it is to restrict class specific items and gear. There are still MANY ways to design your character, considering some weapons do certain proc's that allow many combos, this would enable you to use those points you spent in that debuff somewhere else. You all need to stop expecting complete random madness, it honestly makes this game look really crude in my opinion. Don't get me wrong I love this game and I think the DEV's are doing an excellent job. I just would like to see this game grow, and I don't see that happening all that much when battles last 3 seconds and everyone dies no matter what skill you use.
As I have been saying, Venom is making an extremely long post and will be posted in 2 days
Sorry Lazuli, I don't accept anyones friend request unless I know them, so send me a tell when your about to do it.
Let's not be a NAZI and restrict players to default builds, like others have said - that would simply be boring. PVP is all about challenge, skill, and a bit of luck - lets keep it that way.
Last edited by v5point0; 06-03-2010 at 12:53 PM.
It is nearly impossible to fix any balance issues as long as there are no equipment restrictions on classes or skills. You defeat your own argument. Most suggestions have including these restrictions will be accompanied by improved stat and skill system to create more diversity within classes to offset the removal of hybrids.
What is it with people invoking the Nazi 3rd Reich to describe any concept they don't like? And what game have you been playing? PvP in PL is already boring, and it doesn't require skill... and isn't challenging.
Ogrim-lvl 50-Ursan Alta-lvl 45-Enchantress Broke-lvl 45-Avian
Venom Website: http://venom.forumn.net
get at least one health and manna potion after a kill so you stand a chance to next person that wants to fight you. because i always kill and have 15% health left and die to next person in a couple hits...
RuneDarkBlade level 40 Smart Bear Rastlen level 11 Paladin
Possibly because it is the most reviled period in human history??
Mysteriane [lvl 42 - I killed Seth so you might live]
In training - Mysterione [lvl 18 - Archer] In training - Mysteriune [lvl 13 - Warrior]
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