[Feedback] Rogue Armor

[Eagle Eye229]

Honestly guys,this game is not pvp fueled.This game cannot stop because you dominated pvp pve as a rogue.it has to move on.All I hear is rogue complaining about how they are not #1 for pvp AND pve.You guys should be the the easiest to kill(you also kill the fastest.Fair trade).There is no such thing as a "Tank rogue",I mean that sounds ridiculous at best.Think about the game.its a ROLE PLAYING GAME.WHATS THE USE IF ONE CLASS OWNS EVERY ASPECT OF THE GAME!YOUR OP HIERARCHY HAS COME TO AN END.Im sure it sucks for you rogues that spent millions on gear ect but you knew this expansion would one day come.you knew your playstyle and equip would one day come to an end.time have changed.Maybe wait till we see the new content before we lose our marbles.equip value lose is your fault.please tell me otherwise and I can explain.

Rogues don't need to have everything,so selfish.

Go warriors! No king would be alive without trusted warriors.

[soon]

We really appreciate the valuable feedback, you guys. Thank you. We realize that this update makes a major difference in how rogues are played and, as we do with all major updates, will continue to take your feedback, suggestions and ideas into consideration going forward. Definitely keep it coming.

If the intention is to make rogues use a shield skill, healing and two attack skill you should have inserter 10% damage reduction by default the ability. Rogues below lv 20 can not use it, but they were also nerf. In mastery could increase an additional 5% damage reduction, for players who are in the end game..

By the way, spend 10 skill points makes you miss on your skill you use. We need mana and health as well, it already spends 10 points in passive. The other two classes have 40/65% reduction shield, no need to spend on masterie.


you did not answer what everyone asked, 10% are stacked with the shield of nekro? If not, what has been done is that rogues are fragile and other classes kill she very easily.

[Zeus]

Amount of gold spent is not a valid argument unless if you have a formula that also calculate amount of each char and amount of each item/whatnot is available in game. Supple vs demand. Gear prices vary. That is also why Finesse costs more than other jewels.

The gold relates to the gear, so a similar geared player should be competitive with a person of also similar gear and not expect to be competitive with a player that's maxed.

[Khalleesie]

When classes are balanced, we are all united. When classes are unbalanced, we are all divided. As you can see many players are livid... This causes resentment toward other classes. STS, with respect, there has to be another way.

[Avaree]

When did you stop remembering this is a game? "If we all win it" we have nothing left to gain. I am completely satisfied with the changes. If sts reverts game back to what it was, the game will be over in a matter of months.

Adjust to the changes of armor by adding jewels that buff your nerf.

Use Orc shaman effigies... Completely free to craft and make...
They grant 5% crit and 15% armor for 15 minutes. Again completely free!! Not only do they grant this, they also give your friends ingredients and you a chance for a orc tag, or small chance of legionnaire's insignia or a ren'gol ancestral rune.

See link below
Higher armor not better


More valuable information below!

 

Armor	Damage Taken
0	938
400	848
585	807
600	804
850	748
935	729
1000	714
1075	698
1200	670
1275	653
1310	645
1425	619
1500	602
1555	590
1600	581
1612	578
1700	558
1745	548
1800	536
1860	522
1990	493
2137	460
2155	457
2200	447
2380	406
2520	375
2717	331

(Based on the static damage received from a certain boss in Shuyal, scaled to L41).

As part of supplementary tests, I would also like to confirm that neither the enemy's HP/armor nor its damage are scaling higher depending on if there is a warrior in party or not. With everyone in party at the same level, the mobs' difficulty only depends on the number of players in the instance, not the classes. You're welcome, warriors!

There might be another topic coming containing the exact percentages of how mob's damage, armor and HP are scaling as more players join the party. For now, as a general guideline, mobs and bosses seem to scale smoother for three players comparing to four, purely from a statistical point of view.

Bonus info: The damage reduction from both Nekro's & Scorch's shield is 40%. The difference is that Nekro's absorbs much more HP before it breaks.

 

Special thanks to Blipz, Ardbeg, Raregem, Shinytoy & the Pheonix guild for assisting with the tests and Kalizzaa for making an awesome chart out of the gathered data!

Hope this helps.

[Gerran]

Hey stop complaining rogues are still good. Remember back at the release of the new arcane weps? Warriors got awesome proc. Rogues got dagger buff. Now what do we mages get? We get a funny looking flashy proc that uses mana. Is that fair?

Excuse me!Are you okay? I can complain if I want, Each of us has the right to complain, we invested time efforts, and money here, so shut up!
If you have concerns in your class go make thread, don't come here saying non sense.

[tomsawer]

Bottom line..and to be fair to all classes ( I play all of em) each class has its perks and downfalls. I don't have to explain because we know what they are.
I see some changes being made to rogues but, I beleive IF we wait until full expansion comes out and run the new maps, we can then make suggestions for rogues ect. If needed. I say rogues because every thread addressing this issue is rogue players,so imo until expansion let's relax have fun and play!

[csyui]

Don't worry, when rogue hit Lv56, she will have op crit rate and dmg.

[Earlingstad]

Don't worry, when rogue hit Lv56, she will have op crit rate and dmg.

Can anybody disagree that besides Lv 56, AL has players who have characters actively playing at many level brackets? And PVE issues should not be mixed up with PVP. For instance, Banish was made to work only in PVE and not PVP because whichever STS dev made that decision was insightful enough to realise that what works for PVE might be horrible for the user experience in PVP.

We have active endgame characters for PVE/PVP and we also have twinks for PVP. This armor nerf on rogues might have been implemented with a positive intention - but let us not forget that it is in no way fair to make balance at low levels go awry for the sake of only endgame PVE.

To sum it up, the lovely solutions for the rogue armor nerf in this feedback thread are - 1.) Use Effigy 2.) Use Jewels to Buff the Nerf 3.) Use Skill Mastery. 4.) Go level up.

Here is why these solutions will not work.

1. No cannot use Effigy in PVP.

2. Cannot use Jewels to compensate for the nerf because the Armor Nerf is heavy and using that many armor jewels just means a Nerf to other stats - it is weakening rogue stats - after allowing us to spend our funds on acquiring them.

3.) Skill Mastery Cannot be used under Lv 20. Lets not even go there.

4.) Already have endgame characters. Besides if twinking is neglected and discouraged with this armor nerf to rogues, are devs implying that we should only spend and play on 1 character at 1 level rather than playing at several levels and investing on gearing up several characters? How is this move even profitable for a business somebody please enlighten us.


As PVE is the main concern of players agreeing with the armor nerf here (The Itemization thread by Remiem has some pretty good feedback too) maybe sts could keep the rogue ARMOR NERF to PVE maps only?

[acewasabi]

i may be wrong, but it seems the armor nerf is coming from a pvp perspective. i don't pvp, i am purely pve - and i think i speak for many, many rogues with no interest in pvp. this armor nerf SUCKS. i'm tired of pvp issues affecting my pve gameplay (pet nerfs/buffs in particular). there are plenty of examples of things that only apply to pvp, like rogue dmg nerf, so if armor MUST be nerfed, for heavens sake at least buff it somewhat for pve.

not saying that the struggle ain't real for my pvp rogue sisters, just that i represent a particular pve-only demographic, and can't speak to pvp.

[ilhanna]

I think more than the actual nerf itself, I am dismayed by the counterresponses to rogue's complaints to it. These threads have been divisive and unconstructive at the very least, even hostile in places. It doesn't help at all to be told to shut up, to be told we lack skills and network, to be instructed by non-rogues how to deal with the nerf, to receive insinuations that we are ignorant of the grand scheme and future of the game. There is very little support and constructive discussions on how to, to quote Carapace, play with the tools available. Instead there is an impression of gleeful vindictiveness on the part of the other two classes, and while I know those who post these comments do not in any way represent their classes, their statements go a long way to make a visit to the forums that much more unpleasant. Really made me miss the days when going to the forums means getting new ideas and strategies to try in game, getting more enlightened about the mechanics of the game that help make things easier and more fun.

[Kingofdevilz]

I play warrior in twink pvp. Even I feel that after the armour nerf rogues have become really weak and its not fun anymore as it is too easy for us as tanks.

[Darkquantum]

I think more than the actual nerf itself, I am dismayed by the counterresponses to rogue's complaints to it. These threads have been divisive and unconstructive at the very least, even hostile in places. It doesn't help at all to be told to shut up, to be told we lack skills and network, to be instructed by non-rogues how to deal with the nerf, to receive insinuations that we are ignorant of the grand scheme and future of the game. There is very little support and constructive discussions on how to, to quote Carapace, play with the tools available. Instead there is an impression of gleeful vindictiveness on the part of the other two classes, and while I know those who post these comments do not in any way represent their classes, their statements go a long way to make a visit to the forums that much more unpleasant. Really made me miss the days when going to the forums means getting new ideas and strategies to try in game, getting more enlightened about the mechanics of the game that help make things easier and more fun.

Im no doubt at least one of the people you speak of. The reason i spoke up is because i like the changes.... I play too!

Id hate to see everything that was just fixed broken and changed back due to only rouges and people that pretend to love all classes complaining. I feel the need to put in my 2 cents as well. For if sts see only people say "we want it changed back!".... it will probably happen!

Id hate that. so i speak up. Game has not been so fair in ages.
( in my opinion )

[uehi]

we need nerf mage with crit pasiv and warior with armor pasiv like rog with damage and i think balance will be back xd

[uehi]

To be honest yes. I really do like the tanks having all the power now. You guys did have it before would you disagree? I plan on staying mage either way. I hate tanks always getting no kills in pvp. Means they dont play. SO MANY TANKS IN PVP NOW its great! Sorry mate i really do love it. I feel your pain tho i to over the years have spent well more than 400m. And an embarrassing amount of platinum. My pain has come and gone. And yes i do think its fair. I wish all parra gems and eyes never existed. I wish nekro was never made. For thats when the game broke. In my opinion. I like were the game is at now and werw its heading. I know what that dose to you and the money you spent but. Yes i do like it sorry.


Im actually telling my friends now "you know that crazy game i play? its fair now you should play it" because if they tryed starting any time before last few months id have disagreed. The prices the pvp i love it all again

you like when tank have all power and you play mage try rogue and back here you see many tank because oponent for warior is only warior.

[Vixenne]

Honestly guys,this game is not pvp fueled.This game cannot stop because you dominated pvp pve as a rogue.it has to move on.All I hear is rogue complaining about how they are not #1 for pvp AND pve.You guys should be the the easiest to kill(you also kill the fastest.Fair trade).There is no such thing as a "Tank rogue",I mean that sounds ridiculous at best.Think about the game.its a ROLE PLAYING GAME.WHATS THE USE IF ONE CLASS OWNS EVERY ASPECT OF THE GAME!YOUR OP HIERARCHY HAS COME TO AN END.Im sure it sucks for you rogues that spent millions on gear ect but you knew this expansion would one day come.you knew your playstyle and equip would one day come to an end.time have changed.Maybe wait till we see the new content before we lose our marbles.equip value lose is your fault.please tell me otherwise and I can explain.

Rogues don't need to have everything,so selfish.

Go warriors! No king would be alive without trusted warriors.

I'm a Rogue and I pity those selfish other rogues who take this so seriously Let them cry. Coz they think they own everything. I'm thankful and happier to have more teamwork with all the classes now than before.

[Darkquantum]

I'm a Rogue and I pity those selfish other rogues who take this so seriously Let them cry. Coz they think they own everything. I'm thankful and happier to have more teamwork with all the classes now than before.

Love your words

[Earlingstad]

I'm a Rogue and I pity those selfish other rogues who take this so seriously Let them cry. Coz they think they own everything.

The rogues who take this armor nerf seriously do so because they do love this game and this company and they do not wish to stop playing because of gameplay-affecting decisions influenced (even if 1%) by comments like these.

For instance, most of the rogues who are voicing out their opinions in this thread and in the Itemization thread by Remiem, are doing so with reason. They have put forward their opinion on how badly it is affecting their game-play and most of the opinions are substantiated with valid reasons. You are stating "Let them cry" - an attitude which can prove to be a hurdle to logical discussion.

Not to flame or to call you out but generally speaking, nobody is "crying" here, I do not see any whining or ranting or negative words from them. Most of their opinions are backed up by questions to the devs and reasons for how they feel and possible solutions for the issue. "Coz they think they own everything" - No we dont, why would you even generalize? If the attitude of the majority of rogues was this, then we would not have been supporting other class buffs in older threads.

I would like to ask what do you feel about some of the solutions and questions that have been brought up about this topic? Please try to elaborate why and how. Every rogue's feedback is helpful, even in disagreement, but please back it up.

[Vixenne]

The rogues who take this armor nerf seriously do so because they do love this game and this company and they do not wish to stop playing because of gameplay-affecting decisions based on comments like these.

For instance, most of the rogues who are voicing out their opinions in this thread and in the Itemization thread by Remiem, are doing so with reason. They have put forward their opinion on how badly it is affecting their game-play and most of the opinions are substantiated with valid reasons. You are stating "Let them cry" - an attitude which can prove to be a hurdle to logical discussion.

Not to flame or to call you out but generally speaking, nobody is "crying" here, I do not see any whining or ranting or negative words from them. Most of their opinions are backed up by questions to the devs and reasons for how they feel and possible solutions for the issue. "Coz they think they own everything" - No we dont, why would you even generalize? If the attitude of the majority of rogues was this, then we would not have been supporting other class buffs in older threads.

I have played this game far too long to see who knows how to reason and those who are, yes I will say it again: Crying. We have 3 classes, with each of their own purposes. Why do you think I said "They think they own everything"? Because they DO want to be everything. Never have other classes cried as this much in forums as Rogues do because they know their roles very well.

Let's just see what happens to our stats when we all cap at 56

Edit:

I'm not affected by the armor nerf because for one, I am not a tank. My only job is to kill. STS has their reasons and they're trying to balance this "Rogue Legends" into Arcane Legends again. I would like to see in our game that our classes will work again, together. That's all.

[ilhanna]

I'm a Rogue and I pity those selfish other rogues who take this so seriously Let them cry. Coz they think they own everything. I'm thankful and happier to have more teamwork with all the classes now than before.

You seem to imply there was no team work before the nerf and that it's an acceptable solution for this. Three-class teamwork in pve was vastly improved with the new weapons, especially aegis and the arcane sword. Warriors (note the plural) are making it to the timed run leaderboard. Farming went faster, smoother with good warriors in party than in full dps party. Then the nerf.

You also seem to imply that the nerf affects only rogues. Good warriors I know who pride themselves on not having dps die in their party were scrambling to figure out how to prevent rogues from getting one shot killed. Also, every second a rogue is down is prolonging a run, putting everyone, including warrior and mage at greater risk, and extra costs.

Personally, given what Remiem and Carapace had said in response to the outrage from the rogue community, I've resigned myself to the nerf. This by no means mean I accept it, and certainly for the low level rogues this isn't a problem easily remedied (I don't pvp, but I have low level event rogues). Only I think it's better to find ways to cope with the situation rather than point fingers, name call, make blanket generalization, or other pointless gesturing.