Page 1 of 12 12311 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 223

  Click here to go to the first Dev post in this thread.   Thread: With regards to the rogue armor nerf

  1. #1
    Senior Member Lawpvp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    1,282
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    39
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    188
    Thanked in
    93 Posts

    Default With regards to the rogue armor nerf

    The point of this thread is not to complain, not to start a flame war, but to address the clear deficiencies sts has with regards to balance between the 3 classes. Im 17 and could do a better job designing balance changes than anything they have put in place and im sure a significant portion of the arlor community could do the same. Yes i know many threads have been made regarding this issue but ive ranted to in game friends enough about it that I figured i would put my 2 cents in.(sorry in advance for the great length and saying tanks instead of warriors over and over)

    Ive been playing at lvl 17 pvp for over 2 years, primarily rogue but ive played the other 2 classes aswell. In addition i did some 46 pvp with a tank but ill be addressing that later. Since i started playing as a twink warriors were by and far the strongest class in twink pvp and that remains true today. What truly brought rogues and mages more in line with warriors was the buff to nekro. For the past few months before the rogue armor nerf lvl 17 had never been more balanced. All classes could beat all classes in vs, atleast 1 mage and rogue were always wanted for a clash, and all classes had the potential to be significant in all aspects of pvp, atleast for my lvl.

    Before I state where I believe sts has made their mistakes i'd like to establish some criteria for what could be considered "balance" in pvp. From a clash perspective, I believe that all classes should be desireable without 2 classes overshadowing the third. That being said, i do recognize that tanks will always be more desireable with atleast 2-3 tanks being preferable only 1-2 of each of the other classes may be needed. From a vs perspective, I believe that all classes should be competitive with each other, while one class may have a slight advantage over another, they should be at a slight disadvantage to the third.

    While the armor nerf in addition to other changes have devastated rogues across all lvls, twink pvp has been hurt even more so due to the blanket changes that sts applies to all levels when they only need to be applied to a select few. For example, the first change that irritated me was when juggernaut was buffed to grant 65% dmg reduction. While i will admit this change was definitely needed for endgame as tanks were dying too often through jugg, there was 0 reason to have this change apply to low lvls. In the time i played a lvl 18 tank, i used juggernaut for a shortwhile and i could survive 1v5 for 10 seconds without juggernaut breaking while the rest of my team regrouped. For a long time twinks were even considered noobs for using juggernaut because it took 0 skill in proper tanking to simply become invincible for the duration. Before the juggernaut buffs my guild and I were able to farm 5 tanks if we had the proper line up, nowadays, forget about it. 4/5 tanks are running around with juggernaut because it absurdly overpowered at twink lvls. Sometimes we cant even kill 2-3 tanks before the rest of their team rejoins because juggernaut reduces my 1k crits to a meager 400 or lower.

    After some time however ive been able to get over that, as boring as it can make clashes sometimes when people just stack tanks. What threw me over the edge, and many other rogues players was the blanket nerf to rogues armor. What frustrates me most about this change is the pitiful reasoning sts has used to justify it. Bear with me as i tear it apart piece by piece.

    Quote Originally Posted by Remiem View Post
    Class Balance

    + Rogue Armor Reduced: Over time, rogues have become much tankier than originally intended. In this update, Rogue armor attributes have been reduced across the board to bring them in line with the class balance design in-game. Rogues will no longer be tankier than Warriors, but will still have more armor that Sorcerers. For Rogue players who value those armor attributes, you'll want to consider putting your Skill Mastery points into Razor Shield which will give you up to 10% damage reduction.
    Over time signifies that rogues didnt used to be tankier than intended. In other words, at previous caps and lower lvls rogues tankyness was fine yet sts chooses to nerf rogues across all levels anyways. And here is the real kicker "rogues will no longer be tankier than warriors" WHAT??? ARE U CRAZY??? Sts please show me a lvl 46 rogue(the cap at the time of the change) with 3000 armor, or 9000 health, or 65% dmg reduction from a single skill. This shows a clear lack of knowledge regarding the state of the game. Then the suggestiont they come up with as compensation is to put 10 points into razor shield mastery for 10% dmg reduction. Minimum of 11 points for 10% dmg reduction compared to 2 points for 65% dmg reduction, this is what u call balance sts? And whats ur proposition for twinks? Nothing because you people didnt think this through at all.

    Whether this nerf was intended to bring about balance from a pvp or pve perspective, either way it was unintelligent, irrational, and unjustified. If this was from a pve perspective because rogues were the most favored class and tanks the least favored, nerfing rogues was not the fix because it still leaves tanks in just as bad a state as they were before. In fact, tanks were even speeding up elite runs and making it onto the lb for timed runs in the days preceding the rogue armor nerf. The real solution was not to nerf other classes in an attempt to force people to play tanks, but to buff tanks such that they were once again desireable. And how could that be achieved? Hmm idk, maybe fixing the taunt system that has been atrocious for years or developing maps with mobs that actually require a tank to be able to complete it. In the time i spent playing pocket legends before the days of arlor i spent a fair amount of time farming the hardest bosses at lvl 66. I can safely say that a full bird(the dex class) lineup was simply unfathomable, the thought would never have even crossed my mind. As the dex class, I almost never ran a map without atleast 1 enchantress(int) and a bear(str) along with me because a full dex lineup would have been demolished by the bosses, if not the mobs themselves.

    If this nerf was from a pvp perspective, tanks were already the overpowered class in pvp at endgame and at twinks. More than 1 rogue was almost never preferred over a mage or an additional tank. 1v1 tank vs rogue could go either way at twinks and at endgame. While i cant attest to the status of mage in 1v1 at endgame, as for lvl 17, mages could beat both tanks(yes, tanks)and rogues in 1v1. After the nerf, i havent played much endgame since but from my twinking experience and what i have gathered from thoughts by endgame rogues, rogues are now by and far the weakest pvp class in the game.

    The result of the nerf: despite being the single target dmg class, i can no longer beat equally geared/skilled mages/tanks in 1v1(yah i still beat well geared tanks who r clueless but that is because they miss 3/4 hits and cant heal properly). I havent even 1v1ed a well geared mage since the nerf because i know ill be obliterated. I have seen more 4-5 tank lineups with maybe 1 mage, and sometimes 3 warrior 2 mages, but rarely do i see rogues in 5v5s anymore. Countless twink rogues have quit rogue and switched classes quit the game alltogether, just check the auction house and u will see tons of para rogue items. Check the traders market, for every thread someone is buying rogue gear there are 6 threads to sell rogue gear. There is literally 0 reason to play rogue at twinks over the other 2 classes.

    THE SHEER FACT THAT SO MANY PEOPLE ARE QUITTING ROGUE SHOULD SERVE AS FLASHING RED LIGHTS THAT U MESSED SOMETHING UP. STS OPEN YOUR EYES.

    As for endgame, while i havent had much experience as a rogue, ive had a discussion with zeus(who needless to say is no slouch of a rogue and undoubtfully is knowledgable about the game) regarding this issue and he has expressed that he has to be afraid of tanks with arc sword and little else in the way of gear because all a tank has to do to be successful is mindlessly spam autos to get a proc, use jugg to be invincible, and pull someone into the procs for an ez kill against rogues with far superior and more valuable gear. Many other rogues have expressed similar opinions, hence the vast number of threads regarding the armor nerf.

    And if sts was going to nerf rogues, WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD U NERF THEIR ARMOR??? Nerf what is overpowered about the class not what is average. And what is overpowered about rogues? AIMED SHOT, the most overpowered skill in the game, still a moot point given the current state rogues. But nerfing aimed shot would atleast have been justified and not ruined rogues status in pve. Mobas like Leage of Legends, Dota 2, Smite, all have dozens of characters that have to balance and when certain characters become overpowered, they surely dont go about bringing balance by nerfing the worst skills of those characters, they directly nerf what is overpowered about those characters. Spacetime studios, u have 3 characters to choose from, and u still have worse balance than mobas with 75+.

    While my issues with the armor nerf are primarily from a pvp perspective, even if the armor nerf was good for the balance of pve(which ive already said it wasnt the right way to go about it but i cant say if it has helped balance or not) it is not justified to sacrifice the balance of pvp for the sake of pve. This game would have died long ago had it not been for the pvp aspect.

    Now ill address some of the responses ive seen on other threads regarding the rogue armor nerf:

    For those who would say rogue had their time to be overpowered, now its time for tanks. This is ignorant and pays no attention to the balance of the game. And twink rogues have never been overpowered, tanks have always been overpowered. So how is it justified to tilt that balance even more so in favor of tanks. For those who would say this game wasnt meant to have twinks, twinks were even a part of pocket legends. Sts would not have added an option to disable if everyone was supposed to lvl to the cap. And the point of this game is entertainment, if people find more joy in pvp at lower lvls than endgame, they are entitled to pursue those opportunities. For those who would say rogues can now feel whats its like for mages, just...no. Ofc a mage is good as dead without a shield, but so is rogue, even before the armor nerf i could 2 combo any lvl 17 rogue, i even 1 comboed a rogue with 2000 health before the nerf. Not to mention that mages have 2 shields and can bye nye unstunnable when cycled well(i realize shields dont last as long at endgame but mages still have 2 while having similar armor to rogues). For those who would say im just complaining because my maxed out rogue isnt incredibly strong at twinks anymore, i am upset about it but that doesnt change that rogues are still the weakest class. I spent tons of time and gold to obtain a 3 para 7 eye 1 fort nature set which i am very proud of, my stats were perfect before the nerf. Now my rogue is worthless compared to mages or tanks despite the effort and money i have put into it. And maxed out mages and tanks could be just as dominate in twinks.

    For those who say that rogues arent meant to be a little bit tanky, they are meant to do dmg like a glass cannon, then why is sts nerfing our dmg. If u truly think this is how rogues should be, then lets remove the dmg debuff and see if anyone enjoys pvp then, ill gladly 2 combo tanks with 3500 health and 900 armor at lvl 17. And if rogues arent meant to be a little but tanky while doing dmg, why do tanks have invulnerability on top of the absurd dmg they are able to do with the arcane sword(yes i know its bugged but b4 the bug and once the bug is fixed it will still do absurd dmg). Id be glad to have aimed shot scaling reduced so that rogues could have some of their tankiness given back to them

    Seeing as how ive shown this change had nothing to do with balance, my theory and a theory i know others share is that this nerf was for the sake of $$$$. Dont u find it rather convenient that just as rogue armor gets nerfed, a new pet that only drops in locks which are opened with plat, bought with $$$$, is released with more armor than any other pet, 228. Isnt it interesting that sts then announces a new mythic weapon with a proc that gives 75% dmg reduction(but then makes u completely useless since u cant use any skills, cant even heal myself and the point of a rogue is to do dmg with skills like wtf). Seems like they are unjustly nerfing rogues and providing 1 subpar alternative that rogues have to pay for with $$$$ or someone else spends the money and rogues spend the gold to still end up weaker than before and have to give up the 40% dmg reduction of nekro.

    And on top of rogues being trashed, having dmg reduced in pvp by over 20%, armor reduced by over 16%, sts then buffs mages guns to do absurd dmg on crits through autos as zeus has expressed on another thread and given twink mages overpowered guns from crates(did rogues even get a crate weapon? I havent seen anything) sealed rogues fate as being useless in twink pvp, mages have more survivability, curse, team heals, restore mana, can still crit hard on lightning, do tons of dmg on autos, while rogues are simply food waiting to be eaten. Not to mention that mages are now able to get a mythic ring with dmg, putting them even further ahead of rogues, PLUS GALEN MAUL, THE MOST OVERPOWERED WEAPON IN THE HISTORY OF TWINKS HAS BEEN BUGGED SINCE ITS RELEASE and procs multiple times at once and has hidden armor reduction on it. My friend 1 comboed a rogue(a real twink not a random noob) AT LEVEL 13 AS A TANK AND HE DIDNT EVEN PROC. <<<this alone shows that rogues are far too squishy now. I could even be 2 comboed by tanks before the armor nerf from 1 stun and proc from galen maul, but u wont see any twink rogues 2 combo a tank.

    The last thing that really ticks me off about this is the blatant disregard and lack of response from sts despite the countless threads and comments that this needs to be looked at. If u think that being silent and allowing time to let this sink in with players, u are dead wrong. I will not be silent about this until i have an answer. Either let us know that this is being looked at and possible changes may be made, or this definitively not be looked at whatsoever so i, like many others, can give up hope in sts and quit playing rogue, if not the game alltogether.

    For those who made it through this essay i appreciate your time. For those who still think im wrong, pls share what u think and if its valid i may concede that, but the more likely case is ill have to point out why your wrong. To those who agree with me, show your support and lets save rogues before all rogues have dissappeared.

    And lastly to sts, give us anything u have to say regarding this issue or u will lose yet another paying customer, as u have lost many already and will lose many more down the road.

  2. The Following 26 Users Say Thank You to Lawpvp For This Useful Post:


  3. #2
    Guardian of Alterra Zeus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    San Diego, California
    Posts
    25,207
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    2,632
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    5,855
    Thanked in
    2,938 Posts

    Default

    Amen.


    I am considering retiring my rogue because it is no longer playable.
    Click My Signature to Check Out My YouTube Channel.
    Warning: Any Beggars Will Be Put On Ignore List

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to Zeus For This Useful Post:


  5. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    148
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    52
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    35
    Thanked in
    15 Posts

    Default

    I feel u bro.. totally agree with this.

    Sent from my SM-G530H using Tapatalk

  6. #4
    Banned Binlaggin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    145
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    54
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    31
    Thanked in
    22 Posts

    Default

    Cliff notes please. Not being smart--and I'm interested in your thoughts--just too lazy to read

  7. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    188
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    74
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    17
    Thanked in
    12 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lawpvp View Post
    The point of this thread is not to complain, not to start a flame war, but to address the clear deficiencies sts has with regards to balance between the 3 classes. Im 17 and could do a better job designing balance changes than anything they have put in place and im sure a significant portion of the arlor community could do the same. Yes i know many threads have been made regarding this issue but ive ranted to in game friends enough about it that I figured i would put my 2 cents in.(sorry in advance for the great length and saying tanks instead of warriors over and over)

    Ive been playing at lvl 17 pvp for over 2 years, primarily rogue but ive played the other 2 classes aswell. In addition i did some 46 pvp with a tank but ill be addressing that later. Since i started playing as a twink warriors were by and far the strongest class in twink pvp and that remains true today. What truly brought rogues and mages more in line with warriors was the buff to nekro. For the past few months before the rogue armor nerf lvl 17 had never been more balanced. All classes could beat all classes in vs, atleast 1 mage and rogue were always wanted for a clash, and all classes had the potential to be significant in all aspects of pvp, atleast for my lvl.

    Before I state where I believe sts has made their mistakes i'd like to establish some criteria for what could be considered "balance" in pvp. From a clash perspective, I believe that all classes should be desireable without 2 classes overshadowing the third. That being said, i do recognize that tanks will always be more desireable with atleast 2-3 tanks being preferable only 1-2 of each of the other classes may be needed. From a vs perspective, I believe that all classes should be competitive with each other, while one class may have a slight advantage over another, they should be at a slight disadvantage to the third.

    While the armor nerf in addition to other changes have devastated rogues across all lvls, twink pvp has been hurt even more so due to the blanket changes that sts applies to all levels when they only need to be applied to a select few. For example, the first change that irritated me was when juggernaut was buffed to grant 65% dmg reduction. While i will admit this change was definitely needed for endgame as tanks were dying too often through jugg, there was 0 reason to have this change apply to low lvls. In the time i played a lvl 18 tank, i used juggernaut for a shortwhile and i could survive 1v5 for 10 seconds without juggernaut breaking while the rest of my team regrouped. For a long time twinks were even considered noobs for using juggernaut because it took 0 skill in proper tanking to simply become invincible for the duration. Before the juggernaut buffs my guild and I were able to farm 5 tanks if we had the proper line up, nowadays, forget about it. 4/5 tanks are running around with juggernaut because it absurdly overpowered at twink lvls. Sometimes we cant even kill 2-3 tanks before the rest of their team rejoins because juggernaut reduces my 1k crits to a meager 400 or lower.

    After some time however ive been able to get over that, as boring as it can make clashes sometimes when people just stack tanks. What threw me over the edge, and many other rogues players was the blanket nerf to rogues armor. What frustrates me most about this change is the pitiful reasoning sts has used to justify it. Bear with me as i tear it apart piece by piece.



    Over time signifies that rogues didnt used to be tankier than intended. In other words, at previous caps and lower lvls rogues tankyness was fine yet sts chooses to nerf rogues across all levels anyways. And here is the real kicker "rogues will no longer be tankier than warriors" WHAT??? ARE U CRAZY??? Sts please show me a lvl 46 rogue(the cap at the time of the change) with 3000 armor, or 9000 health, or 65% dmg reduction from a single skill. This shows a clear lack of knowledge regarding the state of the game. Then the suggestiont they come up with as compensation is to put 10 points into razor shield mastery for 10% dmg reduction. Minimum of 11 points for 10% dmg reduction compared to 2 points for 65% dmg reduction, this is what u call balance sts? And whats ur proposition for twinks? Nothing because you people didnt think this through at all.

    Whether this nerf was intended to bring about balance from a pvp or pve perspective, either way it was unintelligent, irrational, and unjustified. If this was from a pve perspective because rogues were the most favored class and tanks the least favored, nerfing rogues was not the fix because it still leaves tanks in just as bad a state as they were before. In fact, tanks were even speeding up elite runs and making it onto the lb for timed runs in the days preceding the rogue armor nerf. The real solution was not to nerf other classes in an attempt to force people to play tanks, but to buff tanks such that they were once again desireable. And how could that be achieved? Hmm idk, maybe fixing the taunt system that has been atrocious for years or developing maps with mobs that actually require a tank to be able to complete it. In the time i spent playing pocket legends before the days of arlor i spent a fair amount of time farming the hardest bosses at lvl 66. I can safely say that a full bird(the dex class) lineup was simply unfathomable, the thought would never have even crossed my mind. As the dex class, I almost never ran a map without atleast 1 enchantress(int) and a bear(str) along with me because a full dex lineup would have been demolished by the bosses, if not the mobs themselves.

    If this nerf was from a pvp perspective, tanks were already the overpowered class in pvp at endgame and at twinks. More than 1 rogue was almost never preferred over a mage or an additional tank. 1v1 tank vs rogue could go either way at twinks and at endgame. While i cant attest to the status of mage in 1v1 at endgame, as for lvl 17, mages could beat both tanks(yes, tanks)and rogues in 1v1. After the nerf, i havent played much endgame since but from my twinking experience and what i have gathered from thoughts by endgame rogues, rogues are now by and far the weakest pvp class in the game.

    The result of the nerf: despite being the single target dmg class, i can no longer beat equally geared/skilled mages/tanks in 1v1(yah i still beat well geared tanks who r clueless but that is because they miss 3/4 hits and cant heal properly). I havent even 1v1ed a well geared mage since the nerf because i know ill be obliterated. I have seen more 4-5 tank lineups with maybe 1 mage, and sometimes 3 warrior 2 mages, but rarely do i see rogues in 5v5s anymore. Countless twink rogues have quit rogue and switched classes quit the game alltogether, just check the auction house and u will see tons of para rogue items. Check the traders market, for every thread someone is buying rogue gear there are 6 threads to sell rogue gear. There is literally 0 reason to play rogue at twinks over the other 2 classes.

    THE SHEER FACT THAT SO MANY PEOPLE ARE QUITTING ROGUE SHOULD SERVE AS FLASHING RED LIGHTS THAT U MESSED SOMETHING UP. STS OPEN YOUR EYES.

    As for endgame, while i havent had much experience as a rogue, ive had a discussion with zeus(who needless to say is no slouch of a rogue and undoubtfully is knowledgable about the game) regarding this issue and he has expressed that he has to be afraid of tanks with arc sword and little else in the way of gear because all a tank has to do to be successful is mindlessly spam autos to get a proc, use jugg to be invincible, and pull someone into the procs for an ez kill against rogues with far superior and more valuable gear. Many other rogues have expressed similar opinions, hence the vast number of threads regarding the armor nerf.

    And if sts was going to nerf rogues, WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD U NERF THEIR ARMOR??? Nerf what is overpowered about the class not what is average. And what is overpowered about rogues? AIMED SHOT, the most overpowered skill in the game, still a moot point given the current state rogues. But nerfing aimed shot would atleast have been justified and not ruined rogues status in pve. Mobas like Leage of Legends, Dota 2, Smite, all have dozens of characters that have to balance and when certain characters become overpowered, they surely dont go about bringing balance by nerfing the worst skills of those characters, they directly nerf what is overpowered about those characters. Spacetime studios, u have 3 characters to choose from, and u still have worse balance than mobas with 75+.

    While my issues with the armor nerf are primarily from a pvp perspective, even if the armor nerf was good for the balance of pve(which ive already said it wasnt the right way to go about it but i cant say if it has helped balance or not) it is not justified to sacrifice the balance of pvp for the sake of pve. This game would have died long ago had it not been for the pvp aspect.

    Now ill address some of the responses ive seen on other threads regarding the rogue armor nerf:

    For those who would say rogue had their time to be overpowered, now its time for tanks. This is ignorant and pays no attention to the balance of the game. And twink rogues have never been overpowered, tanks have always been overpowered. So how is it justified to tilt that balance even more so in favor of tanks. For those who would say this game wasnt meant to have twinks, twinks were even a part of pocket legends. Sts would not have added an option to disable if everyone was supposed to lvl to the cap. And the point of this game is entertainment, if people find more joy in pvp at lower lvls than endgame, they are entitled to pursue those opportunities. For those who would say rogues can now feel whats its like for mages, just...no. Ofc a mage is good as dead without a shield, but so is rogue, even before the armor nerf i could 2 combo any lvl 17 rogue, i even 1 comboed a rogue with 2000 health before the nerf. Not to mention that mages have 2 shields and can bye nye unstunnable when cycled well(i realize shields dont last as long at endgame but mages still have 2 while having similar armor to rogues). For those who would say im just complaining because my maxed out rogue isnt incredibly strong at twinks anymore, i am upset about it but that doesnt change that rogues are still the weakest class. I spent tons of time and gold to obtain a 3 para 7 eye 1 fort nature set which i am very proud of, my stats were perfect before the nerf. Now my rogue is worthless compared to mages or tanks despite the effort and money i have put into it. And maxed out mages and tanks could be just as dominate in twinks.

    For those who say that rogues arent meant to be a little bit tanky, they are meant to do dmg like a glass cannon, then why is sts nerfing our dmg. If u truly think this is how rogues should be, then lets remove the dmg debuff and see if anyone enjoys pvp then, ill gladly 2 combo tanks with 3500 health and 900 armor at lvl 17. And if rogues arent meant to be a little but tanky while doing dmg, why do tanks have invulnerability on top of the absurd dmg they are able to do with the arcane sword(yes i know its bugged but b4 the bug and once the bug is fixed it will still do absurd dmg). Id be glad to have aimed shot scaling reduced so that rogues could have some of their tankiness given back to them

    Seeing as how ive shown this change had nothing to do with balance, my theory and a theory i know others share is that this nerf was for the sake of $$$$. Dont u find it rather convenient that just as rogue armor gets nerfed, a new pet that only drops in locks which are opened with plat, bought with $$$$, is released with more armor than any other pet, 228. Isnt it interesting that sts then announces a new mythic weapon with a proc that gives 75% dmg reduction(but then makes u completely useless since u cant use any skills, cant even heal myself and the point of a rogue is to do dmg with skills like wtf). Seems like they are unjustly nerfing rogues and providing 1 subpar alternative that rogues have to pay for with $$$$ or someone else spends the money and rogues spend the gold to still end up weaker than before and have to give up the 40% dmg reduction of nekro.

    And on top of rogues being trashed, having dmg reduced in pvp by over 20%, armor reduced by over 16%, sts then buffs mages guns to do absurd dmg on crits through autos as zeus has expressed on another thread and given twink mages overpowered guns from crates(did rogues even get a crate weapon? I havent seen anything) sealed rogues fate as being useless in twink pvp, mages have more survivability, curse, team heals, restore mana, can still crit hard on lightning, do tons of dmg on autos, while rogues are simply food waiting to be eaten. Not to mention that mages are now able to get a mythic ring with dmg, putting them even further ahead of rogues, PLUS GALEN MAUL, THE MOST OVERPOWERED WEAPON IN THE HISTORY OF TWINKS HAS BEEN BUGGED SINCE ITS RELEASE and procs multiple times at once and has hidden armor reduction on it. My friend 1 comboed a rogue(a real twink not a random noob) AT LEVEL 13 AS A TANK AND HE DIDNT EVEN PROC. <<<this alone shows that rogues are far too squishy now. I could even be 2 comboed by tanks before the armor nerf from 1 stun and proc from galen maul, but u wont see any twink rogues 2 combo a tank.

    The last thing that really ticks me off about this is the blatant disregard and lack of response from sts despite the countless threads and comments that this needs to be looked at. If u think that being silent and allowing time to let this sink in with players, u are dead wrong. I will not be silent about this until i have an answer. Either let us know that this is being looked at and possible changes may be made, or this definitively not be looked at whatsoever so i, like many others, can give up hope in sts and quit playing rogue, if not the game alltogether.

    For those who made it through this essay i appreciate your time. For those who still think im wrong, pls share what u think and if its valid i may concede that, but the more likely case is ill have to point out why your wrong. To those who agree with me, show your support and lets save rogues before all rogues have dissappeared.

    And lastly to sts, give us anything u have to say regarding this issue or u will lose yet another paying customer, as u have lost many already and will lose many more down the road.
    I agree 100% they should give rogue their armor back unlike other classes we rogue need a pet to live. Due to armor lost Nekro not much of help now. STS return our armor ^

  8. #6
    Banned Binlaggin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    145
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    54
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    31
    Thanked in
    22 Posts

    Default

    Ok never mind about the cliff notes. This is a very well thought out post. I agree with every point made in this thread and I hope they listen to your suggestions. This is coming from a tank. 5 tanks > than balanced team. That's not balance. Perhape the armor nerf can only be applied in pve maps, which is where the problem existed.


    20% is drastic. Why not do 5% and see where that sits
    Last edited by Binlaggin; 04-15-2016 at 10:57 PM.

  9. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    1,328
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    87
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    91
    Thanked in
    58 Posts

    Default

    Damn son, you weren't kidding about this being an essay. You have made cohesive points. Let's hope something can be done to salvage rogues from this treacherous fate.

  10. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    718
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    122
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    83
    Thanked in
    47 Posts

    Default

    I am tank
    Rogues dodges 75% auto attacks of pets and 75% auto attacks of player. While other two classes dodges like 5% auto attacks of both pet and player. The juggernaut cool down is the longest in the game ( 45 sec ). It doesn't do any damage. its an complementary skill. Tanks can't rush kill like rogues do. They don't get kill steals. Rogues still do brutal damage and one combo tanks and mages like 6k crit dmg from an AS at lvl 48 (i'm at 48). and my hp is 7500 and armor is 2400 and i now use galen.
    I used Both arcane sword and Aegis. The arcane sword do lot of dmg if you get caught in lava. It can even take out another tank if he get caught in lava. That was when its bugged and when it gives 100% stun and ignored stun immunity rules. Now its fixed.

  11. The Following User Says Thank You to supersyan For This Useful Post:


  12. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    107
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    4
    Thanked in
    4 Posts

    Default

    yes yes only true.

  13. #10
    Junior Member Right's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    13
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    3
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Default

    Why not instead of demanding your "armor" back wich it was never meant in the first place why not use armor gems pet and use pots?
    rouges indeed were more tankier then warriors and remember when everyone was saying tanks suck dont party them their better off naked bla bla bla and now reality hits you and what you do come here and make a thread almost every day right? if they give your "armor" back there's gonna be consequences i wouldn't be making any more threads if i was you,and remember the cake exploiters that made over 100m gold of it someone was even making threads on how to do it can you get any more selfish then that?

  14. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Right For This Useful Post:


  15. #11
    Senior Member konafez's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    a bakery
    Posts
    1,284
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    825
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    820
    Thanked in
    370 Posts

    Default

    For the longest time I saw rogues be the greatest thing since sliced cake, then they got nerffed and I said "welcome to our world"

    But after running with my rogue friends and seeing them get flattened time after time by bosses I have to agree..give them some armor back

    The thin line between entertainment and war
    There'll be no shelter here

  16. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to konafez For This Useful Post:


  17. #12
    Forum Adept uecho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    254
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    9
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Default

    I Agree 100%

  18. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    718
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    122
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    83
    Thanked in
    47 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by konafez View Post
    For the longest time I saw rogues be the greatest thing since sliced cake, then they got nerffed and I said "welcome to our world"

    But after running with my rogue friends and seeing them get flattened time after time by bosses I have to agree..give them some armor back
    what maps were you running?

  19. #14
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    6 Feet Deep
    Posts
    242
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    12
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    116
    Thanked in
    45 Posts

    Default

    oh wow, very long post regarding your unhappiness.
    Just remember tanks went through it for over a year and a half.. Try being a tank in that moment, before sts took forever to fix 1 skill and getting 1/2 shotted through your jugg with rogues who almost had the same armor as some tanks, and 1million x the dmg/dps factor. i have no sympathy for rogues. You are clearly what you are meant to be now, which is paper. Not so funny when the shoe is on the other foot now is it? In any mmorpg i have played, Warrior is what it is meant to be, Taunt,soak up dmg, have rage/vengeful factor, crazy amounts of health and basically survive(almost never dying). Rogues in A.l are what they are meant to be, currently. Easy to kill, but if you dont watch out, they can kill just as easily. They're Fast. But otherwise meant to be easy to die.. In no rpg/mmorpg iv ever played, was there a rogue class which was equal to a warrior or better. So i dont see the arguments or complaints, now that the game is balanced. Perhaps alot of you who are crying are the ones who cant handle elite runs or keep dying in elite timed runs. Like somebody else mentioned.. Adjust your gear. Add health/diamond jewels. Oh ofcos, its not as great as your +8/+9 jewels? or eyes/paras on older gear. To bad, adjust to the new criteria. You shouldnt be dealing so much dmg anyway imo.. Sts should nerf that too.

  20. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to MasterP For This Useful Post:


  21. #15
    Senior Member Lethoiun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Playing AL since winter 2014
    Posts
    1,266
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    90
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    133
    Thanked in
    84 Posts

    Default

    All these tanks are now happy that they are invicible with op dmg at endgame will rogs cant survive 2 secs and telling us not to complain...

    Speechless
    76 Lethoiun 71 Hymns 58 Selfocracy
    "Even the smallest person can change the course of the future." J.R.R Tolkien

  22. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Lethoiun For This Useful Post:


  23. #16
    Forum Adept Att's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    407
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    223
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    80
    Thanked in
    52 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lawpvp View Post
    The point of this thread is not to complain, not to start a flame war, but to address the clear deficiencies sts has with regards to balance between the 3 classes. Im 17 and could do a better job designing balance changes than anything they have put in place and im sure a significant portion of the arlor community could do the same. Yes i know many threads have been made regarding this issue but ive ranted to in game friends enough about it that I figured i would put my 2 cents in.(sorry in advance for the great length and saying tanks instead of warriors over and over)

    Ive been playing at lvl 17 pvp for over 2 years, primarily rogue but ive played the other 2 classes aswell. In addition i did some 46 pvp with a tank but ill be addressing that later. Since i started playing as a twink warriors were by and far the strongest class in twink pvp and that remains true today. What truly brought rogues and mages more in line with warriors was the buff to nekro. For the past few months before the rogue armor nerf lvl 17 had never been more balanced. All classes could beat all classes in vs, atleast 1 mage and rogue were always wanted for a clash, and all classes had the potential to be significant in all aspects of pvp, atleast for my lvl.

    Before I state where I believe sts has made their mistakes i'd like to establish some criteria for what could be considered "balance" in pvp. From a clash perspective, I believe that all classes should be desireable without 2 classes overshadowing the third. That being said, i do recognize that tanks will always be more desireable with atleast 2-3 tanks being preferable only 1-2 of each of the other classes may be needed. From a vs perspective, I believe that all classes should be competitive with each other, while one class may have a slight advantage over another, they should be at a slight disadvantage to the third.

    While the armor nerf in addition to other changes have devastated rogues across all lvls, twink pvp has been hurt even more so due to the blanket changes that sts applies to all levels when they only need to be applied to a select few. For example, the first change that irritated me was when juggernaut was buffed to grant 65% dmg reduction. While i will admit this change was definitely needed for endgame as tanks were dying too often through jugg, there was 0 reason to have this change apply to low lvls. In the time i played a lvl 18 tank, i used juggernaut for a shortwhile and i could survive 1v5 for 10 seconds without juggernaut breaking while the rest of my team regrouped. For a long time twinks were even considered noobs for using juggernaut because it took 0 skill in proper tanking to simply become invincible for the duration. Before the juggernaut buffs my guild and I were able to farm 5 tanks if we had the proper line up, nowadays, forget about it. 4/5 tanks are running around with juggernaut because it absurdly overpowered at twink lvls. Sometimes we cant even kill 2-3 tanks before the rest of their team rejoins because juggernaut reduces my 1k crits to a meager 400 or lower.

    After some time however ive been able to get over that, as boring as it can make clashes sometimes when people just stack tanks. What threw me over the edge, and many other rogues players was the blanket nerf to rogues armor. What frustrates me most about this change is the pitiful reasoning sts has used to justify it. Bear with me as i tear it apart piece by piece.



    Over time signifies that rogues didnt used to be tankier than intended. In other words, at previous caps and lower lvls rogues tankyness was fine yet sts chooses to nerf rogues across all levels anyways. And here is the real kicker "rogues will no longer be tankier than warriors" WHAT??? ARE U CRAZY??? Sts please show me a lvl 46 rogue(the cap at the time of the change) with 3000 armor, or 9000 health, or 65% dmg reduction from a single skill. This shows a clear lack of knowledge regarding the state of the game. Then the suggestiont they come up with as compensation is to put 10 points into razor shield mastery for 10% dmg reduction. Minimum of 11 points for 10% dmg reduction compared to 2 points for 65% dmg reduction, this is what u call balance sts? And whats ur proposition for twinks? Nothing because you people didnt think this through at all.

    Whether this nerf was intended to bring about balance from a pvp or pve perspective, either way it was unintelligent, irrational, and unjustified. If this was from a pve perspective because rogues were the most favored class and tanks the least favored, nerfing rogues was not the fix because it still leaves tanks in just as bad a state as they were before. In fact, tanks were even speeding up elite runs and making it onto the lb for timed runs in the days preceding the rogue armor nerf. The real solution was not to nerf other classes in an attempt to force people to play tanks, but to buff tanks such that they were once again desireable. And how could that be achieved? Hmm idk, maybe fixing the taunt system that has been atrocious for years or developing maps with mobs that actually require a tank to be able to complete it. In the time i spent playing pocket legends before the days of arlor i spent a fair amount of time farming the hardest bosses at lvl 66. I can safely say that a full bird(the dex class) lineup was simply unfathomable, the thought would never have even crossed my mind. As the dex class, I almost never ran a map without atleast 1 enchantress(int) and a bear(str) along with me because a full dex lineup would have been demolished by the bosses, if not the mobs themselves.

    If this nerf was from a pvp perspective, tanks were already the overpowered class in pvp at endgame and at twinks. More than 1 rogue was almost never preferred over a mage or an additional tank. 1v1 tank vs rogue could go either way at twinks and at endgame. While i cant attest to the status of mage in 1v1 at endgame, as for lvl 17, mages could beat both tanks(yes, tanks)and rogues in 1v1. After the nerf, i havent played much endgame since but from my twinking experience and what i have gathered from thoughts by endgame rogues, rogues are now by and far the weakest pvp class in the game.

    The result of the nerf: despite being the single target dmg class, i can no longer beat equally geared/skilled mages/tanks in 1v1(yah i still beat well geared tanks who r clueless but that is because they miss 3/4 hits and cant heal properly). I havent even 1v1ed a well geared mage since the nerf because i know ill be obliterated. I have seen more 4-5 tank lineups with maybe 1 mage, and sometimes 3 warrior 2 mages, but rarely do i see rogues in 5v5s anymore. Countless twink rogues have quit rogue and switched classes quit the game alltogether, just check the auction house and u will see tons of para rogue items. Check the traders market, for every thread someone is buying rogue gear there are 6 threads to sell rogue gear. There is literally 0 reason to play rogue at twinks over the other 2 classes.

    THE SHEER FACT THAT SO MANY PEOPLE ARE QUITTING ROGUE SHOULD SERVE AS FLASHING RED LIGHTS THAT U MESSED SOMETHING UP. STS OPEN YOUR EYES.

    As for endgame, while i havent had much experience as a rogue, ive had a discussion with zeus(who needless to say is no slouch of a rogue and undoubtfully is knowledgable about the game) regarding this issue and he has expressed that he has to be afraid of tanks with arc sword and little else in the way of gear because all a tank has to do to be successful is mindlessly spam autos to get a proc, use jugg to be invincible, and pull someone into the procs for an ez kill against rogues with far superior and more valuable gear. Many other rogues have expressed similar opinions, hence the vast number of threads regarding the armor nerf.

    And if sts was going to nerf rogues, WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD U NERF THEIR ARMOR??? Nerf what is overpowered about the class not what is average. And what is overpowered about rogues? AIMED SHOT, the most overpowered skill in the game, still a moot point given the current state rogues. But nerfing aimed shot would atleast have been justified and not ruined rogues status in pve. Mobas like Leage of Legends, Dota 2, Smite, all have dozens of characters that have to balance and when certain characters become overpowered, they surely dont go about bringing balance by nerfing the worst skills of those characters, they directly nerf what is overpowered about those characters. Spacetime studios, u have 3 characters to choose from, and u still have worse balance than mobas with 75+.

    While my issues with the armor nerf are primarily from a pvp perspective, even if the armor nerf was good for the balance of pve(which ive already said it wasnt the right way to go about it but i cant say if it has helped balance or not) it is not justified to sacrifice the balance of pvp for the sake of pve. This game would have died long ago had it not been for the pvp aspect.

    Now ill address some of the responses ive seen on other threads regarding the rogue armor nerf:

    For those who would say rogue had their time to be overpowered, now its time for tanks. This is ignorant and pays no attention to the balance of the game. And twink rogues have never been overpowered, tanks have always been overpowered. So how is it justified to tilt that balance even more so in favor of tanks. For those who would say this game wasnt meant to have twinks, twinks were even a part of pocket legends. Sts would not have added an option to disable if everyone was supposed to lvl to the cap. And the point of this game is entertainment, if people find more joy in pvp at lower lvls than endgame, they are entitled to pursue those opportunities. For those who would say rogues can now feel whats its like for mages, just...no. Ofc a mage is good as dead without a shield, but so is rogue, even before the armor nerf i could 2 combo any lvl 17 rogue, i even 1 comboed a rogue with 2000 health before the nerf. Not to mention that mages have 2 shields and can bye nye unstunnable when cycled well(i realize shields dont last as long at endgame but mages still have 2 while having similar armor to rogues). For those who would say im just complaining because my maxed out rogue isnt incredibly strong at twinks anymore, i am upset about it but that doesnt change that rogues are still the weakest class. I spent tons of time and gold to obtain a 3 para 7 eye 1 fort nature set which i am very proud of, my stats were perfect before the nerf. Now my rogue is worthless compared to mages or tanks despite the effort and money i have put into it. And maxed out mages and tanks could be just as dominate in twinks.

    For those who say that rogues arent meant to be a little bit tanky, they are meant to do dmg like a glass cannon, then why is sts nerfing our dmg. If u truly think this is how rogues should be, then lets remove the dmg debuff and see if anyone enjoys pvp then, ill gladly 2 combo tanks with 3500 health and 900 armor at lvl 17. And if rogues arent meant to be a little but tanky while doing dmg, why do tanks have invulnerability on top of the absurd dmg they are able to do with the arcane sword(yes i know its bugged but b4 the bug and once the bug is fixed it will still do absurd dmg). Id be glad to have aimed shot scaling reduced so that rogues could have some of their tankiness given back to them

    Seeing as how ive shown this change had nothing to do with balance, my theory and a theory i know others share is that this nerf was for the sake of $$$$. Dont u find it rather convenient that just as rogue armor gets nerfed, a new pet that only drops in locks which are opened with plat, bought with $$$$, is released with more armor than any other pet, 228. Isnt it interesting that sts then announces a new mythic weapon with a proc that gives 75% dmg reduction(but then makes u completely useless since u cant use any skills, cant even heal myself and the point of a rogue is to do dmg with skills like wtf). Seems like they are unjustly nerfing rogues and providing 1 subpar alternative that rogues have to pay for with $$$$ or someone else spends the money and rogues spend the gold to still end up weaker than before and have to give up the 40% dmg reduction of nekro.

    And on top of rogues being trashed, having dmg reduced in pvp by over 20%, armor reduced by over 16%, sts then buffs mages guns to do absurd dmg on crits through autos as zeus has expressed on another thread and given twink mages overpowered guns from crates(did rogues even get a crate weapon? I havent seen anything) sealed rogues fate as being useless in twink pvp, mages have more survivability, curse, team heals, restore mana, can still crit hard on lightning, do tons of dmg on autos, while rogues are simply food waiting to be eaten. Not to mention that mages are now able to get a mythic ring with dmg, putting them even further ahead of rogues, PLUS GALEN MAUL, THE MOST OVERPOWERED WEAPON IN THE HISTORY OF TWINKS HAS BEEN BUGGED SINCE ITS RELEASE and procs multiple times at once and has hidden armor reduction on it. My friend 1 comboed a rogue(a real twink not a random noob) AT LEVEL 13 AS A TANK AND HE DIDNT EVEN PROC. <<<this alone shows that rogues are far too squishy now. I could even be 2 comboed by tanks before the armor nerf from 1 stun and proc from galen maul, but u wont see any twink rogues 2 combo a tank.

    The last thing that really ticks me off about this is the blatant disregard and lack of response from sts despite the countless threads and comments that this needs to be looked at. If u think that being silent and allowing time to let this sink in with players, u are dead wrong. I will not be silent about this until i have an answer. Either let us know that this is being looked at and possible changes may be made, or this definitively not be looked at whatsoever so i, like many others, can give up hope in sts and quit playing rogue, if not the game alltogether.

    For those who made it through this essay i appreciate your time. For those who still think im wrong, pls share what u think and if its valid i may concede that, but the more likely case is ill have to point out why your wrong. To those who agree with me, show your support and lets save rogues before all rogues have dissappeared.

    And lastly to sts, give us anything u have to say regarding this issue or u will lose yet another paying customer, as u have lost many already and will lose many more down the road.
    Longest post on forum. Will reply next year when i finish read.

  24. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Att For This Useful Post:


  25. #17
    Senior Member Lawpvp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    1,282
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    39
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    188
    Thanked in
    93 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Binlaggin View Post
    Cliff notes please. Not being smart--and I'm interested in your thoughts--just too lazy to read
    If i have the time ill add a summative section at the bottom, thanks for the idea

    Quote Originally Posted by supersyan View Post
    I am tank
    Rogues dodges 75% auto attacks of pets and 75% auto attacks of player. While other two classes dodges like 5% auto attacks of both pet and player. The juggernaut cool down is the longest in the game ( 45 sec ). It doesn't do any damage. its an complementary skill. Tanks can't rush kill like rogues do. They don't get kill steals. Rogues still do brutal damage and one combo tanks and mages like 6k crit dmg from an AS at lvl 48 (i'm at 48). and my hp is 7500 and armor is 2400 and i now use galen.
    I used Both arcane sword and Aegis. The arcane sword do lot of dmg if you get caught in lava. It can even take out another tank if he get caught in lava. That was when its bugged and when it gives 100% stun and ignored stun immunity rules. Now its fixed.
    If u seriously think auto attacks do dmg even close to that of skills ur dead wrong. And i play at lvl 17. I have 20 dodge, not 75.

    Quote Originally Posted by Right View Post
    Why not instead of demanding your "armor" back wich it was never meant in the first place why not use armor gems pet and use pots?
    rouges indeed were more tankier then warriors
    PLEASE SHOW ME A LVL 46 ROGUE WITH EITHER: 9000 HEALTH, 3000 ARMOR, OR 65% DMG REDUCTION
    and remember when everyone was saying tanks suck dont party them their better off naked bla bla bla and now reality hits you and what you do come here and make a thread almost every day right?
    Ive already addressed this regarding pve, as u said "everyone was saying tanks suck dont party them" so pls tell me how nerfing rogues changes that at all? Ive clearly pointed out how sts could have alleviated this by revitalizing the taunt system and developing maps that actually require a tank
    if they give your "armor" back there's gonna be consequences i wouldn't be making any more threads if i was you im entitled to make a thread if i want to, just as much as any other person on these forums,and remember the cake exploiters that made over 100m gold of it someone was even making threads on how to do it can you get any more selfish then that?
    First off, i never demanded rogue armor back, i simply pointed out the nerf was unjustified and rogues need looked into because they are the worst class in the game atm, as shown by so many people quitting rogue for the other classes. And what does this have to do with the cake exploit? Absolutely nothing. Not to mention that warriors were actually making runs faster and joining the timed lb before the nerf so the argument tanks were useless is invalid

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterP View Post
    oh wow, very long post regarding your unhappiness.
    Just remember tanks went through it for over a year and a half..
    I PLAY AT LVL 17 and have been for over 2 years. 80% of that time warriors were the overpowered class, 20% of that time it was balanced between all 3 classes. Try being a tank in that moment, before sts took forever to fix 1 skill and getting 1/2 shotted through your jugg with rogues who almost had the same armor as some tanks, and 1million x the dmg/dps factor. i have no sympathy for rogues. You are clearly what you are meant to be now, which is paper. Not so funny when the shoe is on the other foot now is it? In any mmorpg i have played, Warrior is what it is meant to be, Taunt,soak up dmg, have rage/vengeful factor, crazy amounts of health and basically survive(almost never dying). Rogues in A.l are what they are meant to be, currently. Easy to kill, but if you dont watch out, they can kill just as easily. They're Fast. But otherwise meant to be easy to die.. In no rpg/mmorpg iv ever played, was there a rogue class which was equal to a warrior or better. So i dont see the arguments or complaints, now that the game is balanced. Perhaps alot of you who are crying are the ones who cant handle elite runs or keep dying in elite timed runs. Like somebody else mentioned.. Adjust your gear. Add health/diamond jewels. Oh ofcos, its not as great as your +8/+9 jewels? or eyes/paras on older gear. To bad, adjust to the new criteria. You shouldnt be dealing so much dmg anyway imo.. Sts should nerf that too.
    If i seriously think changing to health/diamond jewels is a viable option u clearly know nothing about the rogue class. Unlike tanks who can put everything into str and get dmg, health, rogues need points in str, dex, int. If i was to swap out my 7 eyes for 7 fort nature/diamond my build would be an absolute joke. U really think 24 extra health is better than the extra 20 mana, .5 crit and dmg from an eye? U really think 18 armor is better than 36 health, 20 mana, .5 crit and some dmg on an eye? Lmao this is like remiems suggestion of using razor for 10% dmg reduction.
    And as for rogues shouldnt be dealing as much dmg anyways, ive already stated that aimed shot is what should have been nerfed, not rogues armor. Id be perfectly fine with aimedshot scaling being reduced if rogues recieved some tankiness back.

    And ur saying rogues should be glass cannons, thats how they are meant to be. Fine, then warriors should be tanks. A LEVEL 13 WARRIOR SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO 1 COMBO A ROGUE. Lets cap all warriors dmg at 600 and give them an extra 1000 armor so they can be what they are meant to be, tanks and see if anybody enjoys this hmm. Its always incredible to me how people can make the argument that rogues are meant to do dmg not be tanky, whilst warriors are doing absurd amounts of dmg while being unkillable. The hypocracy is real

    Multiple of you who i just responded to clearly havent read my entire first post(yes ik its long) or u would have known i come from lvl 17 twink pvp, rogues are not, were not, ever op there and are no so far below the other 2 classes across all twink lvls. Tons of rogue twinks are quitting, tanks can 2 combo rogues(even before the nerf) and kill them by getting 1 stun and proc. It will take me atleast 3-4 combos, critting on aimed shot every time, to kill a tank. But i cant get 1 stun and proc and kill them before they can get to packs, they can just use horn and become invincible. Galen maul IS STILL BUGGED SINCE ELONDRIAN EVENT OF LAST YEAR, STS WTH FIX THIS. Rogues in twinks can no longer vs warriors or mages. Rogues are as squishy as a mage but with only 1 shield. 3-5 tanks with maybe 1-2 mages, 0 rogues is now the norm in twink 5v5s.

    THE ABOVE PARAGRAPH IS HOW TWINKS HAVE BEEN DESTROYED. it is completely unjustified to destroy twinks for the sake of incorrectly balancing endgame, there is no way around it, and that needs to be addressed
    Last edited by Lawpvp; 04-16-2016 at 07:35 AM. Reason: Typos

  26. #18
    Forum Adept
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Makati, Philippines
    Posts
    305
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    35
    Thanked in
    23 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterP View Post
    oh wow, very long post regarding your unhappiness.
    Just remember tanks went through it for over a year and a half.. Try being a tank in that moment, before sts took forever to fix 1 skill and getting 1/2 shotted through your jugg with rogues who almost had the same armor as some tanks, and 1million x the dmg/dps factor. i have no sympathy for rogues. You are clearly what you are meant to be now, which is paper. Not so funny when the shoe is on the other foot now is it? In any mmorpg i have played, Warrior is what it is meant to be, Taunt,soak up dmg, have rage/vengeful factor, crazy amounts of health and basically survive(almost never dying). Rogues in A.l are what they are meant to be, currently. Easy to kill, but if you dont watch out, they can kill just as easily. They're Fast. But otherwise meant to be easy to die.. In no rpg/mmorpg iv ever played, was there a rogue class which was equal to a warrior or better. So i dont see the arguments or complaints, now that the game is balanced. Perhaps alot of you who are crying are the ones who cant handle elite runs or keep dying in elite timed runs. Like somebody else mentioned.. Adjust your gear. Add health/diamond jewels. Oh ofcos, its not as great as your +8/+9 jewels? or eyes/paras on older gear. To bad, adjust to the new criteria. You shouldnt be dealing so much dmg anyway imo.. Sts should nerf that too.
    Yea tanks be tanks while rogues be rogues
    U call game balanced when tanks 1-2 combo/hit rogues?
    SINCE WHEN DID TANKS EVER DO THAT AND WHY DO THEY DO IT???
    Yea sure rogues are easy to kill but they shouldn't be that easy
    ROGUES SHOULDNT BE DOING THAT MUCH DAMAGE???
    WELL NOW I SUPPOSE ROGUES SHOULD DO WAY MORE DAMAGE TO TANKS BECAUSE THEY ARENT TANKS ANYMORE..... apparently they've been mutated to be part rogue part tank but not in a 50/50 way but its more of 100/100 since tanks hit so hard and take so less damage
    So I would prefer tanks doing moderate dmg but HP and armor increase about 2000(?) + Jugg 65%reduction
    But rogues hit weak with jugg on but when its gone then we do so much more dmg

  27. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Aerodude For This Useful Post:


  28. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    718
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    122
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    83
    Thanked in
    47 Posts

    Default

    From the tank perspective auto attacks do some amount of damage close to skill (considering the cool down of skills are long) And pet attacks do some damage and as well as. Because of the high dodge of rogues, both are missed (dodeged 75% time)we don't dealing the damage as we should do. The dot from pets as well the chance of getting any debuff are also missed. I understand u come from lvl 17. but you said you spoke to an end game player and he's feeling the same.
    And as for the weapon bugs it should be fixed.

  29. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    718
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    122
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    83
    Thanked in
    47 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aerodude View Post
    Yea tanks be tanks while rogues be rogues
    U call game balanced when tanks 1-2 combo/hit rogues?
    SINCE WHEN DID TANKS EVER DO THAT AND WHY DO THEY DO IT???
    Yea sure rogues are easy to kill but they shouldn't be that easy
    ROGUES SHOULDNT BE DOING THAT MUCH DAMAGE???
    WELL NOW I SUPPOSE ROGUES SHOULD DO WAY MORE DAMAGE TO TANKS BECAUSE THEY ARENT TANKS ANYMORE..... apparently they've been mutated to be part rogue part tank but not in a 50/50 way but its more of 100/100 since tanks hit so hard and take so less damage
    So I would prefer tanks doing moderate dmg but HP and armor increase about 2000(?) + Jugg 65%reduction
    But rogues hit weak with jugg on but when its gone then we do so much more dmg
    Cd of jugg is long. its 45 sec. May be the tanks at twinks level hit hard but not the tanks at the end game

Page 1 of 12 12311 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. about rogue dmg nerf in pvp
    By Aerodude in forum AL General Discussion
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 04-09-2016, 06:25 AM
  2. Bulwark's feedback - nerf nerf nerf more
    By Swardix in forum AL Player vs. Player
    Replies: 166
    Last Post: 11-22-2014, 02:32 PM
  3. Dmg nerf for rogue in ctf [ under lvl 10 ]
    By DeCruxify in forum AL Player vs. Player
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 07-29-2014, 10:19 AM
  4. Rogue nerf
    By iamstoned562 in forum AL General Discussion
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 09-02-2013, 08:03 AM
  5. Armor Nerf in today's update
    By krazii in forum PL General Discussion
    Replies: 81
    Last Post: 11-30-2010, 06:14 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •