PvP

[Aftermath]

Right now, this is the element of the game I dislike right now. I'll probably get flamed for this, judging from previous game forums. Bear with me. No pun.

What I think is the problem:
Purely not fair. PvP favours the people with much better equipment and is in my opinion not based on skill (although skill is still needed to be good at pvp). Its rather whether you are a paying player, or an experienced player's dupe with loads of equipment bought from the high level account. This makes the majority of us (experience fitting for level and not paying) almost impossible to compete. I've seen people of the same level three-four hit others of the same level, like myself. Not very fun at all.

My solution
Make pvp with even-ground rules. What I mean is this: instead of having an instant drop, each player gets a choice before entering a game of a pool of weapons, rings, helmets etc, as well as an amount of skill points to spend. The pool would be the same for all players in the specific battle, and include equal amounts of equipment for each class. The items and amount of skill points could be either randomized or decided by host, or fixed for a specific level area. All the equipment would not be permanent, and everything can go back as before once the player leaves the arena.

Why I think its a good idea
It makes pvp completely skill based, assuming individual classes are not overpowered/underopwered. This is not only the skills of actually fighting people, but also of creating effective builds for your character and assigning effective skill points.

It also allows high level players to play with lower levels, since higher levels would not have the advantages of better armor/would/stats anymore. This creates a feasible challenge for lower levels, and also allow them to collect advice from higher levels.

It would put more variety in the game. If you ever wondered what it would be like to play a different version of your character (int bird, str mage etc), you can do so.

It will also allow nonpaying players to get a taste of using paid items like rings, and persuade then to actually spend money to play all the other aspects of the game. This is good for devs, obv. Much like the excellent idea of the devs about the free elixer.

Okay, so thats it. Hit me with all your "newf*g" 's, "you noob" 's and "tl;Dr" 's. On the other hand, actually provide some feedback. I.e. Tell me if there are some gaping holes in the rules.

[Register]

PvP does take skill. Not as much at lower levels especially when most people have the same build. And certain classes are def. over/under powered. Have you seen a level 12 warbird with 2k+ kills? How 'bout a dex bear? Prob yes to the dex bear. I usaually pretty decent gold bought gear that can beat others but I have had people with WORSE GEAR THAN ME own me completely. Rings dont make the entire fight ya know! Its only a few extra points in armor/crit/hit/damage...

Unrelated, I like how you put it into sections! Makes it easier to read!

[cuard]

I do not agree.... no this is a bad idea

[WhoIsThis]

Strongly disagree on this one.

Equipment does not make as big a difference as it seems. Take for example Bagmans and Raid Roach. True, Raid Roach is superior, but not by much. Pinks are a lot of money for marginally better performance. It's mainly the placebo effect that makes the big difference. There are also cheap equipment that is in some ways superior, such as Drainers, which offers superior survivability, at the expense of damage output.

It is however a problem when beginners join in - they won't do well at first. Most will quit, and many will hide their PvP stats. Then again, becoming a competent PvP player requires persistence. If you're not willing to spend the time to farm for top end pink-equipment, well frankly, you deserve to be at a disadvantage (although as I said, it's marginal - pinks aren't that much better). Similarly, if you're not willing to spend hundreds of hours perfecting your PvP skills, well, you're not going to be an experienced PvP player.

I don't get what you're saying about "high" level and "low" level. You aren't going to have fights where a level 20 is up against a level 56. Games are restricted by category - level cap, which anybody 48+ can join (although I recommend at least being 51 plus before joining) and the various twink levels.

There is plenty of skill needing. Kiting, knowing which combos to use, when to engage, what to do in specific situations - I'd say there's much more skill involved than in PvE. It's because your opponent is another human - intelligent and with a character that rivals yours in overall capability.

[noobmigo]

Sorry, horrid.
It would crush economy.
It would be STUPID. Why should you have same items without earning them?
PvP is the main generator of plat. Probably. Who knows how much time people spend respeccing, or buying plat, and earning gold JUST to get the good equipment.
I'd say no.

My two cents.

BTW, tl;dr.

[Aftermath]

I dunno how to quote in the phone app, so here it goes:
@register: I have no idea what a warbird is, is it a regular bird? Devs bears are almost always people's second accounts, especially low level devs bears. These people mostly load gear into these bears from higher accounts, which results in the 2k kills. As for gear, could you please tell me what gear that person had that beat you? Also cud you tell me what 'gold bought gear' you mention that is pretty good. Thanks.

@cuard: that was exactly the sort of response I was expecting. Luckily, some people like Register can formulate proper reasoning.

[noobmigo]

I dunno how to quote in the phone app, so here it goes:
@register: I have no idea what a warbird is, is it a regular bird? Devs bears are almost always people's second accounts, especially low level devs bears. These people mostly load gear into these bears from higher accounts, which results in the 2k kills. As for gear, could you please tell me what gear that person had that beat you? Also cud you tell me what 'gold bought gear' you mention that is pretty good. Thanks.

@cuard: that was exactly the sort of response I was expecting. Luckily, some people like Register can formulate proper reasoning.

ONE:@register: I have no idea what a warbird is, is it a regular bird? Devs bears are almost always people's second accounts, especially low level devs bears. These people mostly load gear into these bears from higher accounts, which results in the 2k kills. As for gear, could you please tell me what gear that person had that beat you? Also cud you tell me what 'gold bought gear' you mention that is pretty good. Thanks.
OK, I agree, D-Bears are OP. But WTF! Why would you buy ANYTHING for twinking when you could just go to a PvP match and choose an Artisan's and also have the other person have an Artisan's? It makes NO SENSE. A compromise of your idea would be to be able to LOAN items for a certain amount of gold per day.

[cuard]

after math i dont have time to type sentaces since u make up stupid ideas and ask how to play the game in threads
the question was stupid so it got a stupid answer im done with ur noobish ways. and dont make more pittiful threads like this. im done.

[noobmigo]

after math i dont have time to type sentaces since u make up stupid ideas and ask how to play the game in threads
the question was stupid so it got a stupid answer im done with ur noobish ways. and dont make more pittiful threads like this. im done.

The question was not stupid, it was CORRECT, Aftermath nailed it.. PvP is unbalanced, whether you like it or not.

The IDEA was kind of stupid, but you can grow off of it.

[Aftermath]

@whoisthis: I don't mean anything about high level vs low level. Please quote were you think I meant that.
I am by no means a high level player. Im not close to the lvl 50s, and I dont think many people only up to AO1 would count grinding as a priority. If at that level I should be grinding for gear, then I wont touch pvp until another 14 levels.
I still dont understand why you sisters with my idea. Skill is still very much in pvp (i never said there was NO skill in pvp), my idea just makes it a level playing ground for all. If items matter as little as you say, surely taking away that advantage wont hurt?

[Aftermath]

Cuard: oh, so this forum is not newb friendly? I like your warmth towards less experienced players. Thanks for admitting your answer is stupid. You have yet to tell me why my suggestion (i repeat, suggestion) is stupid.

[noobmigo]

Cuard: oh, so this forum is not newb friendly? I like your warmth towards less experienced players. Thanks for admitting your answer is stupid. You have yet to tell me why my suggestion (i repeat, suggestion) is stupid.

Hello? Hello?

Please reply to my post, plawx? I've got to see your logic in this, so we can see eye-to-eye.

[WhoIsThis]

@whoisthis: I don't mean anything about high level vs low level. Please quote were you think I meant that.
I am by no means a high level player. Im not close to the lvl 50s, and I dont think many people only up to AO1 would count grinding as a priority. If at that level I should be grinding for gear, then I wont touch pvp until another 14 levels.
I still dont understand why you sisters with my idea. Skill is still very much in pvp (i never said there was NO skill in pvp), my idea just makes it a level playing ground for all. If items matter as little as you say, surely taking away that advantage wont hurt?

Judging by your post, you're in twink warfare.

You do realize that most of the top end twinkers do not have just one character. What they do have are many alts, usually at least one high level that makes money. There's a reason why the level 30 Vyxnaar helm and similar top end items command such a premium, despite offering often only a marginal advantage. People are willing to pay, to farm, and to grind for them. They go for every advantage.

I get the overwhelming impression, and I don't mean to offend you, that you want something for nothing. People who twink have often spent hundreds of plat in respecs, hundreds of thousands in equipment, and have thousands of kills. If you want to beat them, you're going to have to put similar effort in. What you're calling for is a system where they are getting nothing for their efforts under the guise that it is "level". (In practice, it already is relatively level; skill, not equipment or builds will be the decisive factor in most cases). What incentives then would their be to twink for thousands of kills if your system was implemented?

[Aftermath]

Noobigo: not definitely the same gear as a the enemy, but you choose from the same pool of items. Aside from that, how does fighting with the same items make 'no sense'? Wouldnt taking out the factor of equipment make it skill alone? (remember that I am not proposing taking out items, there would be a POOL of them to choose from.)

[noobmigo]

Judging by your post, you're in twink warfare.

You do realize that most of the top end twinkers do not have just one character. What they do have are many alts, usually at least one high level that makes money. There's a reason why the level 30 Vyxnaar helm and similar top end items command such a premium, despite offering often only a marginal advantage. People are willing to pay, to farm, and to grind for them. They go for every advantage.

I get the overwhelming impression, and I don't mean to offend you, that you want something for nothing. People who twink have often spent hundreds of plat in respecs, hundreds of thousands in equipment, and have thousands of kills. If you want to beat them, you're going to have to put similar effort in. What you're calling for is a system where they are getting nothing for their efforts under the guise that it is "level". (In practice, it already is relatively level; skill, not equipment or builds will be the decisive factor in most cases). What incentives then would their be to twink?

My thoughts exactly, thanks for wording it well, because I didn't.

[WhoIsThis]

It also allows high level players to play with lower levels, since higher levels would not have the advantages of better armor/would/stats anymore. This creates a feasible challenge for lower levels, and also allow them to collect advice from higher levels.

It would put more variety in the game. If you ever wondered what it would be like to play a different version of your character (int bird, str mage etc), you can do so.

The first line is the "high level", "low level" that you asked me to quote.

Reading this again, I find this post heavily contradictory. How does this increase variety? You are calling for restrictions on builds and equipment. This will decrease variety.

[Aftermath]

Whoisthis: I see your point. If thats the way the devs designed the game, fine. I'm no longer country touch pvp, just like the majority of people in the game. This twinking was actually exactly what I wanted to stop, so that pvp would be fair. If its part of the game, I accept that.
Noobmigo: I answered posts based on this priority chart:

Good comments ---> attempt to shut down the troll/idiot ----> other

[Aftermath]

Whoisthis: by that I meant that high level players could play with low levels, since they cant right now.

Also, Im not calling for restrictions outright, im calling for restrictions per game. Each game could hav different equipment. The other reason for increased variation I mentioned in your quote.

[noobmigo]

Whoisthis: I see your point. If thats the way the devs designed the game, fine. I'm no longer country touch pvp, just like the majority of people in the game. This twinking was actually exactly what I wanted to stop, so that pvp would be fair. If its part of the game, I accept that.
Noobmigo: I answered posts based on this priority chart:

Good comments ---> attempt to shut down the troll/idiot ----> other

Twinking is what you wanted to stop? Huh...actually, twinking is more "level" than high level PvP, if that's what you're suggesting.

[noobmigo]

Whoisthis: by that I meant that high level players could play with low levels, since they cant right now.

Also, Im not calling for restrictions outright, im calling for restrictions per game. Each game could hav different equipment. The other reason for increased variation I mentioned in your quote.

There is no variation in this.

Everyone would be using the same thing, the same items.
At least in twinking we have a choice of whether to go Expert or Artisan. Lol.