Will not be hosting a christmas tournament

[XghostzX]

Many people have been asking me if I was planning on hosting another tournament for the holidays. I was originally planning on it, yes.

I've decided that I will not be hosting any further tournaments until there are some sensible updates/changes to PL. Logging in to PvP isn't fun with immature children running around with 2h weapons, completely poisoning the only part of the game that's fun for me. Rather than implement some practical things that the community has been long asking for -- farmable, recolored vanities (holos, dragon, starries) to revitalize the economy -- we instead have these ridiculous guns consuming the spirit that PL is.

Forgive me for being frustrated. All I have ever done was support this game and advocated for what's really needed to keep the game alive and thriving, and only because I will always care about the community -- maybe I'm naive. But right now that's just not really possible given the circumstances.

[Dolloway]

Agreed. It seems to me that childish behavior becomes heightened when there are obvious balance issues within the gameplay/mechanics/stats and individuals look to use this imbalance to their advantage when these individuals would otherwise not be tolerated in the game or be unable to compete due to their lack of PvP skill bleeding through.

With the overpowered guns in PvP, if you have a finger and can tap auto, you can do well in pvp regardless of your skill level. That's how low the bar is set to do well in PvP nowadays. And to further this, Cinco has adopted the view that since Rhinos were underpowered at previous caps (under 85), he will not be changing the stats of any guns. Rather than argue for a position that believes in trying to balance all classes, he argues for the nonsensical view that because Rhinos were underpowered previously, they should be overpowered now and have their day in the spotlight.

This isn't only a PvP issue either. There have been countless PvE and holiday event decisions that haven't helped the game in anyway whatsoever. No attempt has been made to help the PL economy out by either lowering the drop rate on certain items (i.e. starries) or adding new items into loot tables at lower drop rates. Everything that can be looted in this game is easily obtainable and nothing is worth farming anymore. The only reason to play PvE is to cap nowadays.

The decision to implement the new Winter content in such a way that allows players to spend 25 platinum on a chance to loot something worthwhile and only drop 3k gold Crowns of Frost has also angered many players. This is essentially gambling 25 platinum for a chance to loot something new like a Redstar vanity but receiving something from last year's event that was farmed so much (Crowns of Frost) that it's essentially worthless. In my opinion, there were many other great ways to implement the new holiday content without angering players by doing things like this. When there is a unanimous negative opinion about the way the Winter content was implemented from players who normally can't agree on anything, you know that the update was bad.

Until there are more sensible updates, I too will not be hosting a tournament or even playing the game beyond dropping in once in a while to say hello to friends.

[Cinco]

I think there has been some GREAT feedback (all negative) about the Winter Event. I'm very grateful for it :-)

I'm taking it all into consideration and will have a much more universally acceptable battery of content for next year.

[Arvoh]

With the overpowered guns in PvP, if you have a finger and can tap auto, you can do well in pvp regardless of your skill level. That's how low the bar is set to do well in PvP nowadays. And to further this, Cinco has adopted the view that since Rhinos were underpowered at previous caps (under 85), he will not be changing the stats of any guns. Rather than argue for a position that believes in trying to balance all classes, he argues for the nonsensical view that because Rhinos were underpowered previously, they should be overpowered now and have their day in the spotlight.

This^^^^^^^

[Kurvy]

Im done trying on forums, our opinions must be jokes to you.. its hard not to be rude right now. You have seen good feedback from us (the actual players) and what we want and even how willing we are to pay for it... but sts you just keep ignoring EVERYTHING we have to say and then wonder why you get negative feedback.

I apologize for all the hate... just kind of upset lately

[Justg]

Im done trying on forums, our opinions must be jokes to you.. its hard not to be rude right now. You have seen good feedback from us (the actual players) and what we want and even how willing we are to pay for it... but sts you just keep ignoring EVERYTHING we have to say and then wonder why you get negative feedback.

I apologize for all the hate... just kind of upset lately

It's not a matter of ignoring EVERYTHING, it is a matter of a small shop (20 of us) supporting several live games. We only have so much bandwidth, and everyone thinks THEIR game is the most important and needs to be updated NOW. Take a look at the chat box. We've updated PL, DL, and SL, with an update for PLA on the way, but everyone from AL is a bit miffed they did not get their update today.

Being rude serves no purpose on the forums. We're here because we care. We moderate the forums because this is our workplace, and salt or insults do not help. Check out more poisonous forums, the devs are no where to be found.

So even if it is frustrating that folks have brilliant ideas that we refuse to listen to, please understand that we are here, listening, and often times the things asked for do get implemented. It is always an issue of prioritization, and we do our best.

[Kurvy]

It's not a matter of ignoring EVERYTHING, it is a matter of a small shop (20 of us) supporting several live games. We only have so much bandwidth, and everyone thinks THEIR game is the most important and needs to be updated NOW. Take a look at the chat box. We've updated PL, DL, and SL, with an update for PLA on the way, but everyone from AL is a bit miffed they did not get their update today.

Being rude serves no purpose on the forums. We're here because we care. We moderate the forums because this is our workplace, and salt or insults do not help. Check out more poisonous forums, the devs are no where to be found.

So even if it is frustrating that folks have brilliant ideas that we refuse to listen to, please understand that we are here, listening, and often times the things asked for do get implemented. It is always an issue of prioritization, and we do our best.

Thats all i needed to know. Thanks g.

[Congeniality]

It's not a matter of ignoring EVERYTHING, it is a matter of a small shop (20 of us) supporting several live games. We only have so much bandwidth, and everyone thinks THEIR game is the most important and needs to be updated NOW. Take a look at the chat box. We've updated PL, DL, and SL, with an update for PLA on the way, but everyone from AL is a bit miffed they did not get their update today.

Being rude serves no purpose on the forums. We're here because we care. We moderate the forums because this is our workplace, and salt or insults do not help. Check out more poisonous forums, the devs are no where to be found.

So even if it is frustrating that folks have brilliant ideas that we refuse to listen to, please understand that we are here, listening, and often times the things asked for do get implemented. It is always an issue of prioritization, and we do our best.

Firstly, thank you for responding so promptly to the forums. I mean that genuinely, just clarifying in case it came across as sarcastic, because I didn't mean it to be. I understand that 20 people can't hand-hold 9 games simultaneously, and given what you mentioned about AL being upset, I appreciate that you made time to come respond to the unrest on the PL forums.

I would also like to preface this by saying that I do not believe you are ignoring us, I do not think that you are doing a bad job as developers, I do not want to cause strife, I just think that having one person voice what they have seen on the forums in one post may help communicate the discontent.

I believe that at the heart of the frustration from the community is that the things that have been implemented aren't what the players have been asking for quite some time. The players have wanted options for those looking to spend plat, but have the prioritization be on free-low cost to participate maps (this is in reference to this Holiday event). Also, in the case of PvP, options for those looking to spend plat has been given, which from what I have seen, people are fine with. However that option is so much more powerful than the ceiling of what people can achieve without plat, that it becomes frustrating for people who either don't want to or can't spend 100+ dollars on a game. In many ways, I believe people feel as though the game is unplayable.

As a side note, I believe this platinum option would be more viable if the player base was larger, but because there aren't a large quantity, few buy the guns and thus there aren't enough for people to buy with gold in the market. Thus, we get the people with guns who can spend plat having an unfair (yes, I believe it is downright unfair) advantage over those without it. In essence, the idea wasn't flawed, I just don't believe it works for PL anymore.

On a final note, I don't want this to come across as salt, I don't want this to come across as insult. I understand everything you stated, and don't disagree in the slightest. I also am not posting this in hopes that changes will come to PL, I understand that 20 people can't cover 9 games constantly. Instead, I just wanted to better articulate what the community has been trying to communicate so that it doesn't come across the wrong way. If this did come across as salt / insult, I suppose that's on me, so my bad. In the end, I love the game and I'll continue to play it for the people I can connect with and the nostalgia of remembering the people I met who no longer play.

I hope this doesn't come across the wrong way,
Walie

[Azerothraven]

It's not a matter of ignoring EVERYTHING, it is a matter of a small shop (20 of us) supporting several live games. We only have so much bandwidth, and everyone thinks THEIR game is the most important and needs to be updated NOW.

Being rude serves no purpose on the forums. We're here because we care. We moderate the forums because this is our workplace, and salt or insults do not help.

I could not agree with this anymore. I see some people commenting horrible things when it is not really needed regarding X or Y game etc. I believe if u dont have something nice to say then dont post and if you care enough to make it better then write things can be achievable or constructive. Devs dont need to hear X or Y game will be a failure after working hard for months on it..

Why does STS not consider expansion the number of people working? I am sure some of the forum players would be happy to help any way we can. I for one, would be happy to help.

[Justg]

Firstly, thank you for responding so promptly to the forums. I mean that genuinely, just clarifying in case it came across as sarcastic, because I didn't mean it to be. I understand that 20 people can't hand-hold 9 games simultaneously, and given what you mentioned about AL being upset, I appreciate that you made time to come respond to the unrest on the PL forums.

I would also like to preface this by saying that I do not believe you are ignoring us, I do not think that you are doing a bad job as developers, I do not want to cause strife, I just think that having one person voice what they have seen on the forums in one post may help communicate the discontent.

I believe that at the heart of the frustration from the community is that the things that have been implemented aren't what the players have been asking for quite some time. The players have wanted options for those looking to spend plat, but have the prioritization be on free-low cost to participate maps (this is in reference to this Holiday event). Also, in the case of PvP, options for those looking to spend plat has been given, which from what I have seen, people are fine with. However that option is so much more powerful than the ceiling of what people can achieve without plat, that it becomes frustrating for people who either don't want to or can't spend 100+ dollars on a game. In many ways, I believe people feel as though the game is unplayable.

As a side note, I believe this platinum option would be more viable if the player base was larger, but because there aren't a large quantity, few buy the guns and thus there aren't enough for people to buy with gold in the market. Thus, we get the people with guns who can spend plat having an unfair (yes, I believe it is downright unfair) advantage over those without it. In essence, the idea wasn't flawed, I just don't believe it works for PL anymore.

On a final note, I don't want this to come across as salt, I don't want this to come across as insult. I understand everything you stated, and don't disagree in the slightest. I also am not posting this in hopes that changes will come to PL, I understand that 20 people can't cover 9 games constantly. Instead, I just wanted to better articulate what the community has been trying to communicate so that it doesn't come across the wrong way. If this did come across as salt / insult, I suppose that's on me, so my bad. In the end, I love the game and I'll continue to play it for the people I can connect with and the nostalgia of remembering the people I met who no longer play.

I hope this doesn't come across the wrong way,
Walie

No salt at all, a great example of how to communicate a different point of view in a professional way. Much appreciated.

[Mothwing]

We understand the difficulty of balancing so many games at once.

However, to be blunt, you guys kind of put yourselves in this position. PL will always be the best game you ever designed (in my opinion), and when you guys decided to branch out and make more and more games it really hurt the community as a whole. All of the different types of games fractured the loyal PL community which only amplified the damage done to an already declining PL. Instead of bearing down and fixing very blatant issues with PL gameplay, the decision to make more games was made which only watered down the brand as a whole and didn’t offer any help to the community already established. This is why I am and always will be frustrated with this game and reluctant to participate in any more updates. Yes, it’s great that we still get updates for a 7 year old game, but when they are just ways to keep making money off of us without actually addressing the issues we have identified we lose the respect we once had for STS.

Dolloway made a genius post on why the stat balance in PL in its current state is bad for PVP. A few devs even responded to it, yet no action was ever taken to attempt to fix the issues addressed. Is stat balancing really that intensive from a developing standpoint? It’s not like new content is being introduced. All we want is balanced PVP to enjoy with friends, but we can’t have that until the ridiculous holiday “fun” is abandoned and the core issues of stat balancing are finally addressed. If the devs are willing to listen and even implement reasonable stat changes, then I can guarantee that me and other players would put in the work to help make that possible. But right now it just feels like a one sided conversation where all of our suggestions go in one ear and out the other which is extremely frustrating.

[Justg]

However, to be blunt, you guys kind of put yourselves in this position. PL will always be the best game you ever designed (in my opinion), and when you guys decided to branch out and make more and more games it really hurt the community as a whole. All of the different types of games fractured the loyal PL community which only amplified the damage done to an already declining PL. Instead of bearing down and fixing very blatant issues with PL gameplay, the decision to make more games was made which only watered down the brand as a whole and didn’t offer any help to the community already established.

I wish it was as easy as saying we should never have made more games, however companies have to continually innovate to survive, especially in such a competitive market as mobile gaming. Pocket Legends was our first (and some say best game) but it would never have carried us through seven years, no matter what you may think.

As a business we need to continue to make new things, and try to expand our audiences. You may not agree with it, but it is a reality. That being said, we are happy to try and continue to entertain, even with our seven year old games.

[Tippertwo]

I wish it was as easy as saying we should never have made more games, however companies have to continually innovate to survive, especially in such a competitive market as mobile gaming. Pocket Legends was our first (and some say best game) but it would never have carried us through seven years, no matter what you may think.

As a business we need to continue to make new things, and try to expand our audiences. You may not agree with it, but it is a reality. That being said, we are happy to try and continue to entertain, even with our seven year old games.

Yeah, I would've never been able to survive without AL

[3pc]

I wish it was as easy as saying we should never have made more games, however companies have to continually innovate to survive, especially in such a competitive market as mobile gaming. Pocket Legends was our first (and some say best game) but it would never have carried us through seven years, no matter what you may think.

As a business we need to continue to make new things, and try to expand our audiences. You may not agree with it, but it is a reality. That being said, we are happy to try and continue to entertain, even with our seven year old games.

Very true Justg but im pretty sure PL is your highest income revenue out of all your games so it should be focused on a tad more.

[Justg]

Very true Justg but im pretty sure PL is your highest income revenue out of all your games so it should be focused on a tad more.

Pretty sure we have a better lens into this

[Mothwing]

I wish it was as easy as saying we should never have made more games, however companies have to continually innovate to survive, especially in such a competitive market as mobile gaming. Pocket Legends was our first (and some say best game) but it would never have carried us through seven years, no matter what you may think.

As a business we need to continue to make new things, and try to expand our audiences. You may not agree with it, but it is a reality. That being said, we are happy to try and continue to entertain, even with our seven year old games.

I definitely agree, but I find it hard to believe that PL was at the point of being “obsolete.” Why couldn’t the innovations you wanted to implement simply be added to PL instead of creating a whole new game and segregating your community?

There is no other game like PL on the App Store that plays as smoothly as it does. It’s just sad for me to see it die like this.

[Congeniality]

We understand the difficulty of balancing so many games at once.

However, to be blunt, you guys kind of put yourselves in this position. PL will always be the best game you ever designed (in my opinion), and when you guys decided to branch out and make more and more games it really hurt the community as a whole. All of the different types of games fractured the loyal PL community which only amplified the damage done to an already declining PL. Instead of bearing down and fixing very blatant issues with PL gameplay, the decision to make more games was made which only watered down the brand as a whole and didn’t offer any help to the community already established. This is why I am and always will be frustrated with this game and reluctant to participate in any more updates. Yes, it’s great that we still get updates for a 7 year old game, but when they are just ways to keep making money off of us without actually addressing the issues we have identified we lose the respect we once had for STS.

Dolloway made a genius post on why the stat balance in PL in its current state is bad for PVP. A few devs even responded to it, yet no action was ever taken to attempt to fix the issues addressed. Is stat balancing really that intensive from a developing standpoint? It’s not like new content is being introduced. All we want is balanced PVP to enjoy with friends, but we can’t have that until the ridiculous holiday “fun” is abandoned and the core issues of stat balancing are finally addressed. If the devs are willing to listen and even implement reasonable stat changes, then I can guarantee that me and other players would put in the work to help make that possible. But right now it just feels like a one sided conversation where all of our suggestions go in one ear and out the other which is extremely frustrating.

I wish it was as easy as saying we should never have made more games, however companies have to continually innovate to survive, especially in such a competitive market as mobile gaming. Pocket Legends was our first (and some say best game) but it would never have carried us through seven years, no matter what you may think.

As a business we need to continue to make new things, and try to expand our audiences. You may not agree with it, but it is a reality. That being said, we are happy to try and continue to entertain, even with our seven year old games.

I would also argue that when someone dedicates their profession to game development, it would make sense for those that truly love it to "branch out" and make new games simply out of the passion to do so. Yes, milking out one game can be extremely profitable, but so can making many games and if it makes the job more enjoyable, why wouldn't it be done?

I find the belief that STS somehow left PL to be somewhat misguided. If anything, PL has been constantly watched by the developers and maintained. However, at the same time, I feel that the fact that the developers moved on to other games shows that they enjoy what they are doing, not simply looking to milk a cash cow as they could have with PL..... If anything, making endless updates for one game would kill what love anyone had for game development fairly quickly as there would be a hindrance on the creative aspects of it.

As a final point, I think us as players should lay off the STS bashing, if anything, a point has already been made and any further talking is a little excessive. Keep in mind that these are people who are making a living for making new games and maintaining PL. They aren't heartless robots out to make your game terrible. They wouldn't ever want their game to be "bad". There simply is no incentive for that. Understand devs work to make the game great and be mindful of that when you target posts their way.

Disclaimer: Not trying to create an argument, just trying to shed light as to the human side to the people behind the game.

Let's keep heads level and emotions on the down-low ,

Walie

[plpr]

Y'all trying to get some forum mods . ?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A5000 using Tapatalk

[XghostzX]

I would also argue that when someone dedicates their profession to game development, it would make sense for those that truly love it to "branch out" and make new games simply out of the passion to do so. Yes, milking out one game can be extremely profitable, but so can making many games and if it makes the job more enjoyable, why wouldn't it be done?

I find the belief that STS somehow left PL to be somewhat misguided. If anything, PL has been constantly watched by the developers and maintained. However, at the same time, I feel that the fact that the developers moved on to other games shows that they enjoy what they are doing, not simply looking to milk a cash cow as they could have with PL..... If anything, making endless updates for one game would kill what love anyone had for game development fairly quickly as there would be a hindrance on the creative aspects of it.

As a final point, I think us as players should lay off the STS bashing, if anything, a point has already been made and any further talking is a little excessive. Keep in mind that these are people who are making a living for making new games and maintaining PL. They aren't heartless robots out to make your game terrible. They wouldn't ever want their game to be "bad". There simply is no incentive for that. Understand devs work to make the game great and be mindful of that when you target posts their way.

Disclaimer: Not trying to create an argument, just trying to shed light as to the human side to the people behind the game.

Let's keep heads level and emotions on the down-low ,

Walie

Nicely put. I really do admire the entire STS staff. They put so much heart into what they do and have fostered a robust community, and that is a huge reason as to why I've stuck around for the last 7.5 years.

But that's exactly what their job demands: achieving a steady flow of income through paying customers. And that can't be achieved when community members feel abandoned. It's ultimately a 2-way street. Some may say "it's just a game," but PL has become a social extension of my life, and for many others. I've encountered individuals in the game who have told me that PL has prevented them from committing suicide. A gaming experience like that of PL is unique and should be cherished. And we can't sustain that if we don't point out the flaws in the game. PL has reached a stage where all of it's aspects have crumbled apart.

That said, we should most defintely express our opinions in mature, professional ways. And I do apologize if my first post came across too unconstructively. But at the heart of it all is genuine care for the collective community.

[3pc]

Nicely put. I really do admire the entire STS staff. They put so much heart into what they do and have fostered a robust community, and that is a huge reason as to why I've stuck around for the last 7.5 years.

But that's exactly what their job demands: achieving a steady flow of income through paying customers. And that can't be achieved when community members feel abandoned. It's ultimately a 2-way street. Some may say "it's just a game," but PL has become a social extension of my life, and for many others. I've encountered individuals in the game who have told me that PL has prevented them from suicide. A gaming experience like that of PL is unique and should be cherished. And we can't sustain that if we don't point out the flaws in the game. PL has reached a stage where all of it's aspects have crumbled apart.

That said, we should most defintely express our opinions in mature, professional ways. And I do apologize if my first post came across too unconstructively. But at the heart of it all is genuine care for the collective community.

Great use of words will 100% agree