Can we get the MOST BROKEN thing in pvp fixed ASAP?

[Mine AGK]

first stage is people complain about talon proc (some voices arent heard) and then they switch to talon dex. After they become dex mage/dex rhino, dex bird, they rarely complain. They adapt to the environment. Just like the image below. All dex players now.

Attachment 169609.

Lol remember point specifically out what they are. Talon/bow mages. Bow being broken on any class that uses it but with mages heals, its hard to keep them in the same spot to keep from kiting but good try.

[Jensmage]

Lol remember point specifically out what they are. Talon/bow mages. Bow being broken on any class that uses it but with mages heals, its hard to keep them in the same spot to keep from kiting but good try.

We know Bow and talon is broken. That is why there is a thread.

[Waug]

Depends on what procs you say dictate fights. As it stands, bow proc/dagger proc and even talon proc when played right can dictate fights. The mage proc and axe/sword procs dont dictate fights. Mage proc could possibly depending on how bad the other person is and if they are playing another set of gear (I.E. dex or str)

You can post ss all you want. Although you have very few compared to any guilds that have faced you. (I.E. your kdr on bird being negative what? 70k?)

SS, you agreed nice, Yes LeL fact, I've very few ss fighting a whole guild alone, that makes sense to me.

As it's all repetitive now, I'll summarize your perspective and wont be back to answer REPETITIVE replies (bring something new & nutral rather than biased) -

- You've denied PL's basics, described all of PL's old cap pvp till L100 PvP as "lucky crit/dodge" based pvp rather than skill based including arena of honor and when I told that L100 pvp everyone had 100+ crit, means all crit, your excuse for that something different. How that sounds? a perfect example is here - https://www.spacetimestudios.com/sho...I%92ll-explain when someone starts to enjoy pvp for gun and then when everyone start to use that, it wasn't a good experience for him.

Contradiction : Pl's pvp till 100 cap was luck based for you But highly effective procs ain't luck based even though they are random and luck based and fight result determining highly on the other hand Pl's old caps were the golden ages of Pl pvp, not gonna make few pages explaining that, every old pvp-ers somewhat understand that.

- Anything that you can't kill, requires no skill even bow birds becasue according to u, bow is one of the highly broken thing in pvp.
Contradiction : Neither you nor ANYONE ur team mate ever used bow. You say it highly op even though you fail with bow bird rarely you tried it even though you've played bird in past. Fact is - it's highly squishy with low skill damage but like other procs, it's proc is high as well, requires skill to use it, while staying safe even as bow mage. ALL you want to see is a talon bird in 1-1, who can tank for sure while proc is on but not enough damage whearas keeping him freez with 2 ice skills and kitting with mages superb heal along with wand proc to make you zero to full, wait for proc to be gone and then ez kill.

As the enormous time I witnessed you to complain over bow BIRDS and run to tree complain and leave, I bet you to use bow with any of ur class / bird / team and win some decent fight/ffa YOU CAN'T u can only complain rather than taking time to thinking the possible ways to counter it's squishy-ness. Bird's chance to kill an int mage is with bow, as explained, ALL YOU WANT is to be an unkillable class in pvp.

- Talon is not broken for you.
Contradiction : You kick rhinoes with talon/dagger/bow or with anything, you stated here talon mages is broken, I already explain NO INT MAGE find it hard to kill talon bird. What remain? fox rare, bear rare (so rare that hardly can be seen) rhino rare too but u kick it on see.

[Mine AGK]

SS, you agreed nice, Yes LeL fact, I've very few ss fighting a whole guild alone, that makes sense to me.

As it's all repetitive now, I'll summarize your perspective and wont be back to answer REPETITIVE replies (bring something new & nutral rather than biased) -

- You've denied PL's basics, described all of PL's old cap pvp till L100 PvP as "lucky crit/dodge" based pvp rather than skill based including arena of honor and when I told that L100 pvp everyone had 100+ crit, means all crit, your excuse for that something different. How that sounds? a perfect example is here - https://www.spacetimestudios.com/sho...I%92ll-explain when someone starts to enjoy pvp for gun and then when everyone start to use that, it wasn't a good experience for him.

Contradiction : Pl's pvp till 100 cap was luck based for you But highly effective procs ain't luck based even though they are random and luck based and fight result determining highly on the other hand Pl's old caps were the golden ages of Pl pvp, not gonna make few pages explaining that, every old pvp-ers somewhat understand that.

- Anything that you can't kill, requires no skill even bow birds becasue according to u, bow is one of the highly broken thing in pvp.
Contradiction : Neither you nor ANYONE ur team mate ever used bow. You say it highly op even though you fail with bow bird rarely you tried it even though you've played bird in past. Fact is - it's highly squishy with low skill damage but like other procs, it's proc is high as well, requires skill to use it, while staying safe even as bow mage. ALL you want to see is a talon bird in 1-1, who can tank for sure while proc is on but not enough damage whearas keeping him freez with 2 ice skills and kitting with mages superb heal along with wand proc to make you zero to full, wait for proc to be gone and then ez kill.

As the enormous time I witnessed you to complain over bow BIRDS and run to tree complain and leave, I bet you to use bow with any of ur class / bird / team and win some decent fight/ffa YOU CAN'T u can only complain rather than taking time to thinking the possible ways to counter it's squishy-ness. Bird's chance to kill an int mage is with bow, as explained, ALL YOU WANT is to be an unkillable class in pvp.

- Talon is not broken for you.
Contradiction : You kick rhinoes with talon/dagger/bow or with anything, you stated here talon mages is broken, I already explain NO INT MAGE find it hard to kill talon bird. What remain? fox rare, bear rare (so rare that hardly can be seen) rhino rare too but u kick it on see.

I never said all levels. I specifically said 100 cap before pure stats and new armors were added. It was crit based and also whoever spammed skills first (I.E. drain/light/fire) for mage fights. Birds 3 shot mages and bears 4 shot mages.

Problem with you saying that procs determine fights compared to crit/hit dertmining fights. You can play around procs and get aggressive or conservative when you need to. There isnt "sometimes" crit or hit, its always there.

As far as bow is concerned, ive stated that bow is OP across the board, not just with 1 specific class.(though some classes can be more op with specific gear as we see with a dagger/bow rhino and bow mages) It has 13 range, proc debuffs hp/mana/hit/crit and even destroys any chance of kiting or even healing to avoid getting nuked because of no mana regen.

As far as kicking rhinos with talon? I havent kicked a single rhino that plays talon. I specifically kick nubs who play a class that is crazy broken with a dagger/bow. Dagger being no skill and bow being barely any skill but kiting until its proc activates. Talon rhinos require skill, talon bears require skill, talon birds require skill, talon foxes require skill. Talon mages dont require skill as their nuking capabilities have been improved due to not having to compensate heal or damage output from skills while using dex.

At the end of the day, this thread was to get the talon proc nerfed. Which the proc itself isnt OP. Several people have attested to that and still say it. You and several others play talon mage and still have struggles in teams and even in solos? Bow being amazingly broken in a 1v1 and talon giving tanking abilities with its nuking capabilities without having to compensate for healing abilities.

[Congeniality]

As a small side note, I would say that bow is perceived as overpowered due to the relative weakness of Tyben Strength Set. If Tyben were better equipped to help a tank survive, I think the bow would feel much less overpowered.

[Bats]

Mine AGK, what class do you use and why do you consider the bow to be broken? It seems from your perspective that you are a bird. Your frustration seems also to be orientated versing a dexterity-attributed enchantress.

By experience...

Birds with a bow can simply use the 'root' spell to counter kite and eventually use their skills to quickly damage an enchantress with the same weapon where they would eventually win. I think the same would go for talon: bird uses a talon & mage can use a talon. It all ends up being based on both of their strategies. If a mage can kite and a bird is unskilled or cannot properly use the 'root' spell, then there is nothing broken.

It is not like a mage has more damaging skills or more dodge than a bird that would cause a mage to tank & win against a bird (only way it would be considered to be broken). Birds have buffs that gives then more dodge & damage (resulted by bird's large amount of skill points dedicated entirely to damaging another player) that would enable a bird to easily kill a mage (that would use kite in order to counter bird damage & dodge). Dex mages have less armor and are considerably vulnerable to other classes that use a bow. If root doesn't even work, you can rely also on the bow's proc in order to prevent kiting from an enchantress.

Mage heal is capped at 295 health points with cool down. Birds can heal a similar amount of up to 200 health points. All classes auto-heal 1,500 and rely on that. I don't think healing a plus of +95 health points can make a difference when bow autos 1,000 and inflicts damage pools.

This is not level 75 or 100 where mages are supposedly 3 or 4 shotted. If you would like PVP to be so easy for birds, then endgame is not the place where 105 has enchantments and more advanced variables that you should consider; you need to try to use strategies like all other birds that can easily win against a dexterity-attributed enchantress - such as I've described above.

In my view, there is nothing broken.

[Jensmage]

Mine AGK, what class do you use and why do you consider the bow to be broken? It seems from your perspective that you are a bird. Your frustration seems also to be orientated versing a dexterity-attributed enchantress.

By experience...

Birds with a bow can simply use the 'root' spell to counter kite and eventually use their skills to quickly damage an enchantress with the same weapon where they would eventually win. I think the same would go for talon: bird uses a talon & mage can use a talon. It all ends up being based on both of their strategies. If a mage can kite and a bird is unskilled or cannot properly use the 'root' spell, then there is nothing broken.

It is not like a mage has more damaging skills or more dodge than a bird that would cause a mage to tank & win against a bird (only way it would be considered to be broken). Birds have buffs that gives then more dodge & damage (resulted by bird's large amount of skill points dedicated entirely to damaging another player) that would enable a bird to easily kill a mage (that would use kite in order to counter bird damage & dodge). Dex mages have less armor and are considerably vulnerable to other classes that use a bow. If root doesn't even work, you can rely also on the bow's proc in order to prevent kiting from an enchantress.

Mage heal is capped at 295 health points with cool down. Birds can heal a similar amount of up to 200 health points. All classes auto-heal 1,500 and rely on that. I don't think healing a plus of +95 health points can make a difference when bow autos 1,000 and inflicts damage pools.

This is not level 75 or 100 where mages are supposedly 3 or 4 shotted. If you would like PVP to be so easy for birds, then endgame is not the place where 105 has enchantments and more advanced variables that you should consider; you need to try to use strategies like all other birds that can easily win against a dexterity-attributed enchantress - such as I've described above.

In my view, there is nothing broken.

The fire pit contributes to the dmg and slows the mage. Have you ever been in a quicksand? Its like you are in a quicksand and the sand burns/dmg. lol

[Bats]

The fire pit contributes to the dmg and slows the mage. Have you ever been in a quicksand? Its like you are in a quicksand and the sand burns/dmg. lol

I think you are talking about dexterity enchantresses vs. intelligence enchantresses. The proc is meant to be there on purpose for balance purposes.

Consider this: Both mages are wearing sets. One is wearing a one-handed weapon (bow) only with enchanted damage that must in some way counter the balanced armor & damage capabilities of a intelligence enchantress. The only way is to kite and wait to use proc. No proc = no kite = intelligence enchantress has an 90% chance of winning compared to the stats of a dexterity enchantress.

One other thing: Dexterity enchantresses cannot use magic shield while intelligence enchantresses can whenever they have mana pool spawned and use it as leverage whenever they have low HP.

[Jensmage]

I think you are talking about dexterity enchantresses vs. intelligence enchantresses. The proc is meant to be there on purpose for balance purposes.

Consider this: Both mages are wearing sets. One is wearing a one-handed weapon (bow) only with enchanted damage that must in some way counter the balanced armor & damage capabilities of a intelligence enchantress. The only way is to kite and wait to use proc. No proc = no kite = intelligence enchantress has an 90% chance of winning compared to the stats of a dexterity enchantress.

One other thing: Dexterity enchantresses cannot use magic shield while intelligence enchantresses can whenever they have mana pool spawned and use it as leverage whenever they have low HP.

I was referring to your statement below. Bird bow will not survive vs a mage without that fire pit. Mage tank and dmg too much. That is why the fire proc is there.



'"Birds with a bow can simply use the 'root' spell to counter kite and eventually use their skills to quickly damage an enchantress with the same weapon where they would eventually win. I think the same would go for talon: bird uses a talon & mage can use a talon. It all ends up being based on both of their strategies. If a mage can kite and a bird is unskilled or cannot properly use the 'root' spell, then there is nothing broken.""

[og_zylum]

Instead of talking about different balance issues, time to talk about the MOST BROKEN thing to fix, it's such game breaking mostly in team play ffa/ctf I'm sure even current tourney members (oldschool fair players) wont disagree to get it fix as if the current tourney is a concern.

Yest 1k armor and 10k talon proc with ANY CLASS is the worst thing, pls change it to something like 200dmg and 200 armor, talon set need a dmg boost anyway and 200 armor is fine.

If we going further abit right now, then nerfing dagger proc would be second next best thing.

Yea they seriously need to nerf dex sets and buff str sets.

[Jensmage]

I don’t think they need to modify anything with pvp except maxing enchant on my sets. Anyways, both won’t happen so don’t hold your breath.

[3pc]

According to u everything you can't beat requires no skill, if same class same setup no proc beats you then it's lucky crit even if everyone has 100+ crit -

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(3rd ss, here? :O strange)

You do pvp in a pretty narrow way, only reason u do some 5-5ctf nexus to do practice tourney, other than that you do all kick unfavour things or leave, the fact is you have no problem killing a talon bird in a 1-1 situation bcz as a whole it's underpowered and a mage can easily kite and stay full with superb heal and proc and kill easily a talon bird when proc is gone, it's easiest thing to do. U kick rhinoes on see, how would you even know that rhino with talon is even harder to kill. Same goes to a 2/3 vs 2/3 where talon proc is more unfriendly, you ddon't even do that, you would realise the consequences.

After getting killed by bow mage you tried bow mage and quickly back to int then you realized, bow mage is weak in general and tweaked your tactics as int vs bow mage, fact.

I'm not the only one, many did complained about talon proc. I won't oppose item being class bound but then it is ALSO NECESSAY to balance other classes, u can take away talon dagger bow etc from other classes but then you'll have to strengthen em to be viable with their own class specific gear and for the person who complains about lucky crit in 100+ all crit era, how can he/she justify the SUPERB luck factor of procs? answer this my frnd.

Nope i like having the most OP proc also helpful in PVE also i 10-6 you yesterday soo