Mythical Bow need a DMG nerf & Rhino need tweak!

[MageFFA]

Mages needs a buff at endgame or Mytic sets needs it on mages specially INT

Yes endgame int set does need a buff, or better yet just fix dex sets to see if said PvP would be more balanced. You have a bow thats 13 meters, 14 meter kite range. Not only is it a bow so its going to do far too much damage, it's impossible to kite or run from it. Terrible idea from the devs.

[Waug]

If rhinos are to be nerfed then a mage nerf should follow right after if not before. Mages posses the highest skill damage in the game. The acher skill 'Blash Shot' has a base damage of 164 at maximum when it's L.6. Mages drain has 254, Light has 220, Frost at 6 is 120 which is more than 6 Stomp, and fire is 230. Ontop of a overpowered arsenal dedicated to skill damage they also have the highest critical rating in game, only 1 off of the games MAIN Crit class. Even with both of those points mages also have the ability to be guaranteed 100% of the time that drain life will provide health back, a function that was nerfed on rhinos in 2013 just for the same exact reason.

Mages need to be nerfed, foxes need to be nerfed, Bears dodge needs to be brought back and IB needs to be nerfed. Let's make this happen since we want to completely annihilate classes. I've already started a thread on mages going into detail on why they are op anyways. The class is skilless. It crits for x5 mkre dmg than any other class and ontop of that they crit more likely than even archers, their drain is broken and guarantees full hp back.

Did you not read the very first sentence he wrote? A nerf on rhino effects the class globably as all class nerfs does. If he was making a thread he would of made his points directly based on gear alone but he didn't. Even then mages are broken in endgame already. Players try to justify it by saying how easily birds beat mages but ignores the reality of debuffs. If blind misses or is dodged a mage will win 70% of the time against birds and bears can't even beat mages anymore.

Dude You need to chill and read my post carefully before keep stating something irrelevant and misinterpret. Yes lol, it's mostly irrelevant and you misinterpret about rhino "nerf" which I didn't even talked about (please read carefully)-

1- About mages, you're bringing twinking issues here which is ABSOLUTELY IRRELEVANT here, No mage class buff or nerf has been suggested here other than 2k mana pool adding to gear even which wouldn't effect the class.

2- I didn't ask to Nerf rhino, rather I asked tweak that to prevent it's two hit kills and what you missed is that, I preferred adding extra damage on other skills of rhino even if totally we are adding more damage than reduction from one single skill. You talked alot about rhino but denied one particular issue about endgame, never commented on that, should it be able to two hit kill opponents? You never addressed the issue. As far twinking with rhino I kept the issue in my mind and asked adding more damage on other skills but reduction on one hit all damage type of thing .

Also for your information, I never asked for mage buff in the past rather nerf since L77 cap, so if mages are op at winking doesn't relate to me any way. You just need to chill lol
Also let me tell you one thing, if you read rhino skills properly you would see the class is meant to be tanking and support in teamplay not to go and nuke everyone lol take classes the way it meant to be. Rhino has very high potential as tank and team support aka high team buff and heal.

Specially the new classes never been taken that way, each and everyone who tried, took those classes as exploitation, well you wan me to be aggressive i can be, it's just the beginning.

I think mythic endgame is fine i kill everyone, they kill me, you just got to know what you're doing. Mage is by far the weakest class this cap but its always going to be that way every cap cant expect a "perfect balance".

Nope it's not about Perfect balance, 100% players are birds. Just 2 mages that play one just focus on easy kills and only teamplay thats what they do.

I think Rhino needs to be tweaked as well. If we remove them from the game, they will surely be balanced.

I really liked the way ppl comment something but in reality they hardly even played last 2-3 caps, that shows love towards PL, keep it up.

[MageFFA]

Dude You need to chill and read my post carefully before keep stating something irrelevant and misinterpret. Yes lol, it's mostly irrelevant and you misinterpret about rhino "nerf" which I didn't even talked about (please read carefully)-

1- About mages, you're bringing twinking issues here which is ABSOLUTELY IRRELEVANT here, No mage class buff or nerf has been suggested here other than 2k mana pool adding to gear even which wouldn't effect the class.

2- I didn't ask to Nerf rhino, rather I asked tweak that to prevent it's two hit kills and what you missed is that, I preferred adding extra damage on other skills of rhino even if totally we are adding more damage than reduction from one single skill. You talked alot about rhino but denied one particular issue about endgame, never commented on that, should it be able to two hit kill opponents? You never addressed the issue. As far twinking with rhino I kept the issue in my mind and asked adding more damage on other skills but reduction on one hit all damage type of thing .

Also for your information, I never asked for mage buff in the past rather nerf since L77 cap, so if mages are op at winking doesn't relate to me any way. You just need to chill lol
Also let me tell you one thing, if you read rhino skills properly you would see the class is meant to be tanking and support in teamplay not to go and nuke everyone lol take classes the way it meant to be. Rhino has very high potential as tank and team support aka high team buff and heal.

Specially the new classes never been taken that way, each and everyone who tried, took those classes as exploitation, well you wan me to be aggressive i can be, it's just the beginning.



Nope it's not about Perfect balance, 100% players are birds. Just 2 mages that play one just focus on easy kills and only teamplay thats what they do.


I really liked the way ppl comment something but in reality they hardly even played last 2-3 caps, that shows love towards PL, keep it up.

You're legitimately taking rhino as a class that should only be used in support with no chances of gaining kills. For starters rhinos aren't even good at supporting teams in endgame. What is a measly 30 damage and 5 armor going to do to 14k damage and 3k armor? Riddle me that. The last time rhinos were a good supporting class was in 40 where the stats actually meant something.

1* Again. You wrote this post yet you still can't come to grasp that touching redemption is still Nerfing the class? Have i not said there has already been 3 previous nerfs towards redemption? How hard is it to understand that without sets that can be easily exploited rhinos are considerably garbage? Honor proves it and the past does also. I did rhino from L.5-71 during 76 and 77 cap. 71 was damn near endgame as it is. They couldn't tank, they couldn't offer good team support, amd better yet they were just as easy to kill as aiming for a sharp mage. I did 56 Glyphic strongman rhino, and that couldn't kill anything 56 related but birds. 61 demonic mace rhinos lost to 56s. 66 rhinos couldn't kill 61s. 85 rhino was the worst of the the classes yet i seen nobody complaining about it then.

2* What damage tweaks could you do? That x2 damage multiplier that you and gotenks keeps talking about is nothing more than combo damage. It's no different than beck stomp or shatter blast. Just because a class is labeled as tank or support doesn't mean it shouldn't have the ability to gain kills. The entire game revolves around using the best gear available for your class so why do you continue to blame this on rhinos? From my time doing rhino back then, mind you rhinos have never been buffed but has been nerfed 3 times, i racked up a neg KDR from 61-71 then 85-105. Rhinos didn't become a viable class until Cinco had given them a boost towards their set in 100 cap.

3* What exactly can you do that would help rhino? Like make them useful in honor PvP. They have the lowest HP on the game. Their tanking ability is sub par when next to bears. Their heal cooldown is 2 seconds too long, they only have 3 attack skills, 4 if you include rhino might that does no damage, 2 once you take into consideration that redemption became a useless skill after the 3rd nerf, 1 when you consider that charge could only correlate with redemption for combo damage. That leaves you with Holy Tempest. So please tell me how you of all people are supposed to fix a class that I've played since it's launch. The minute thr armor value on mythic sets is increased to match damage step for step is the day rhinos cease to be useful in endgame.

4* Play honor against a rhino in both 100 and elite set then respond back to this post.

[Waug]

You're legitimately taking rhino as a class that should only be used in support with no chances of gaining kills. For starters rhinos aren't even good at supporting teams in endgame. What is a measly 30 damage and 5 armor going to do to 14k damage and 3k armor? Riddle me that. The last time rhinos were a good supporting class was in 40 where the stats actually meant something.

1* Again. You wrote this post yet you still can't come to grasp that touching redemption is still Nerfing the class? Have i not said there has already been 3 previous nerfs towards redemption? How hard is it to understand that without sets that can be easily exploited rhinos are considerably garbage? Honor proves it and the past does also. I did rhino from L.5-71 during 76 and 77 cap. 71 was damn near endgame as it is. They couldn't tank, they couldn't offer good team support, amd better yet they were just as easy to kill as aiming for a sharp mage. I did 56 Glyphic strongman rhino, and that couldn't kill anything 56 related but birds. 61 demonic mace rhinos lost to 56s. 66 rhinos couldn't kill 61s. 85 rhino was the worst of the the classes yet i seen nobody complaining about it then.

2* What damage tweaks could you do? That x2 damage multiplier that you and gotenks keeps talking about is nothing more than combo damage. It's no different than beck stomp or shatter blast. Just because a class is labeled as tank or support doesn't mean it shouldn't have the ability to gain kills. The entire game revolves around using the best gear available for your class so why do you continue to blame this on rhinos? From my time doing rhino back then, mind you rhinos have never been buffed but has been nerfed 3 times, i racked up a neg KDR from 61-71 then 85-105. Rhinos didn't become a viable class until Cinco had given them a boost towards their set in 100 cap.

3* What exactly can you do that would help rhino? Like make them useful in honor PvP. They have the lowest HP on the game. Their tanking ability is sub par when next to bears. Their heal cooldown is 2 seconds too long, they only have 3 attack skills, 4 if you include rhino might that does no damage, 2 once you take into consideration that redemption became a useless skill after the 3rd nerf, 1 when you consider that charge could only correlate with redemption for combo damage. That leaves you with Holy Tempest. So please tell me how you of all people are supposed to fix a class that I've played since it's launch. The minute thr armor value on mythic sets is increased to match damage step for step is the day rhinos cease to be useful in endgame.

4* Play honor against a rhino in both 100 and elite set then respond back to this post.

I didn't say rhino should not be able to kill, I said "nuke", A tanking class shouldn't be able to nuke, get your thing straight first.
Now you still didn't answer my question. I WANT THE ANSWER FIRST right now, no need your long posts, just answer my question that you denied ever since.

Whatever your logic is but that doesn't mean Rhino should be doing what it does in the MOST POPULAR & DEDICATED, hardcore and ever changing pvp level that is ENDGAME about that two hit kills that I mentioned many times.

I'm just literally confused about what pvp level you do with rhino, if I know then I can come up with something that can balance things, if that is your purpose.
WHAT IS YOUR RHINO PVP LEVEL THAT YOU PLAY? make it clear first.

[MageFFA]

I didn't say rhino should not be able to kill, I said "nuke", A tanking class shouldn't be able to nuke, get your thing straight first.
Now you still didn't answer my question. I WANT THE ANSWER FIRST right now, no need your long posts, just answer my question that you denied ever since.

Whatever your logic is but that doesn't mean Rhino should be doing what it does in the MOST POPULAR & DEDICATED, hardcore and ever changing pvp level that is ENDGAME about that two hit kills that I mentioned many times.

I'm just literally confused about what pvp level you do with rhino, if I know then I can come up with something that can balance things, if that is your purpose.
WHAT IS YOUR RHINO PVP LEVEL THAT YOU PLAY? make it clear first.

To asnwer your question that i already have done over a billion times, nuking isn't exclusive to just rhinos. You're acting as if beck stomp doesn't deal the same damage. Should tanks be able to two-shot players? Of +#@#ing course they should if your stats are low enough to allow it. 100 honor pre nerf all we saw was beck stomp bears. Even in the first stages of mythic PvP, which i played mind you, we saw beck stomp bears killing things with str. Again i don't know how many times i have to say this but the original concept of this game was using whats best with your class to your advantage. Maybe if the sets was balanced correctly with better input from the community here at endgame just maybe MAYBE would things be better.

I have layed out the issue with rhinos on a nice cosy blanket. I have said what causes them to act the way they do now. I've had to deal with 2 unjustifiable nerfs from 100 cap to 105 yet here you are trying to tell me about a class you don't even play let alone possibly never even played in the first place. 105 and 110 cap is almost a complete replica of each other with the same functions outside of procs. Did it not occur to you that set heal is actually a terrible idea? Did it not occur to you that base damage should not be over 10k more than armor? Why does HP completely dwarfs over armor value when HP doesn't acts as a counter to damage such as how more armor nullifies damage? Never took the time to ask these questions?

110 can be basically summed up as a cap that revolves around more damage than armor giving the ability of birds and rhinos to take advantage of other classes by out damaging and completely overpowering other classes. Yet i say this I'm sure you'll just ignore. So I'll just simplify everything again.

1* Set heal benefits rhinos the most because their own heal "Restore", gives a base heal and H/s already. Effectively giving rhinos the ability to heal for 4 times. Heal, Set Heal, H/s, and a Life steal. If set heal was removed I'm sure bears and mages would go back to eating rhinos like the 76, 77, 80, 85.

2* Armor Value is too low and 4pc sets can't tank nor deal considerable damage. The proof can easily be looked at by looking at past caps. Bears are at such a disadvantage because they cannot go toe to toe against a class that can simply keep themselves full. Knowing you, you'd prolly just ask Cinco to nerf rhinos heal instead.

3* Why would we even have 9k Health in the first place? Topping this off with the set heal exploit then you really wonder why rhinos don't seem to die much.

4* Where is the debuffs? Why is dodge so high? Why is the Hit value so high on str and int? Maybe if Str and Int set had 120-140 hit% instead of damm near 200 maybe we wouldn't need to complain as is. Why is bow 13 meters? Why does bow have just as much damage as a longsword?

So many questions and so little answers.

[Waug]

To asnwer your question that i already have done over a billion times, nuking isn't exclusive to just rhinos. You're acting as if beck stomp doesn't deal the same damage. Should tanks be able to two-shot players? Of +#@#ing course they should if your stats are low enough to allow it. 100 honor pre nerf all we saw was beck stomp bears. Even in the first stages of mythic PvP, which i played mind you, we saw beck stomp bears killing things with str. Again i don't know how many times i have to say this but the original concept of this game was using whats best with your class to your advantage. Maybe if the sets was balanced correctly with better input from the community here at endgame just maybe MAYBE would things be better.

I have layed out the issue with rhinos on a nice cosy blanket. I have said what causes them to act the way they do now. I've had to deal with 2 unjustifiable nerfs from 100 cap to 105 yet here you are trying to tell me about a class you don't even play let alone possibly never even played in the first place. 105 and 110 cap is almost a complete replica of each other with the same functions outside of procs. Did it not occur to you that set heal is actually a terrible idea? Did it not occur to you that base damage should not be over 10k more than armor? Why does HP completely dwarfs over armor value when HP doesn't acts as a counter to damage such as how more armor nullifies damage? Never took the time to ask these questions?

110 can be basically summed up as a cap that revolves around more damage than armor giving the ability of birds and rhinos to take advantage of other classes by out damaging and completely overpowering other classes. Yet i say this I'm sure you'll just ignore. So I'll just simplify everything again.

1* Set heal benefits rhinos the most because their own heal "Restore", gives a base heal and H/s already. Effectively giving rhinos the ability to heal for 4 times. Heal, Set Heal, H/s, and a Life steal. If set heal was removed I'm sure bears and mages would go back to eating rhinos like the 76, 77, 80, 85.

2* Armor Value is too low and 4pc sets can't tank nor deal considerable damage. The proof can easily be looked at by looking at past caps. Bears are at such a disadvantage because they cannot go toe to toe against a class that can simply keep themselves full. Knowing you, you'd prolly just ask Cinco to nerf rhinos heal instead.

3* Why would we even have 9k Health in the first place? Topping this off with the set heal exploit then you really wonder why rhinos don't seem to die much.

4* Where is the debuffs? Why is dodge so high? Why is the Hit value so high on str and int? Maybe if Str and Int set had 120-140 hit% instead of damm near 200 maybe we wouldn't need to complain as is. Why is bow 13 meters? Why does bow have just as much damage as a longsword?

So many questions and so little answers.

Yet there's no answer which level you play with rhino, seriously? Answer it, otherwise it seems like your trying to protect endgame rhino with the excuse of twinking.

NO rhino should not 2hit kill and I'm glad that you agreed upon that it can do that which is quite helpful for outsiders who don't do ground level pvp. Basing off Bear situation doesn't make it valid because bears don't do it instantaneously what rhinoes does. It takes time to pull and then stomp leaving the scope for enemy to use some skills also it's possible to kite, rhinoes leave hardly any scope.

I think case is closed, just when you agreed rhinoes does two hit kill and it's instantaneous leaving hardly any scope to escape, what else you need to ask for a nerf, even though I preferred tweak way better than that. Thanks. Just a reminder, asking the tweak if bow get nerf otherwise thank you no need bow nerf.

[MageFFA]

Yet there's no answer which level you play with rhino, seriously? Answer it, otherwise it seems like your trying to protect endgame rhino with the excuse of twinking.

NO rhino should not 2hit kill and I'm glad that you agreed upon that it can do that which is quite helpful for outsiders who don't do ground level pvp. Basing off Bear situation doesn't make it valid because bears don't do it instantaneously what rhinoes does. It takes time to pull and then stomp leaving the scope for enemy to use some skills also it's possible to kite, rhinoes leave hardly any scope.

I think case is closed, just when you agreed rhinoes does two hit kill and it's instantaneous leaving hardly any scope to escape, what else you need to ask for a nerf, even though I preferred tweak way better than that. Thanks. Just a reminder, asking the tweak if bow get nerf otherwise thank you no need bow nerf.

You're legitimately acting as if you can't repulse mid charge like you csn when mid beck. Now you're just making excuses for having a slow reaction time. With elite sets you could easily just avian repulse the rhino away and heal to full. Really? So in this same post you agreed that bears can kill on a 2 skill combo yet you're rant against rhinos for being too fast for you to react. You gonna complain about int bird next?

Also i haven't touched my rhino since you and jen killed the class in 105 if that says something. The minute StS fixes endgames set problem there won't be a need for me to use it. It doesn't work in honor either so it's just taking up character space. I made a 40 and a 25 rhino and both i deleted since the class is completely useless.