Price Manipulation in AL is not a real thing, we the people set the item prices, not STS. To say we should get banned for selling an item at the price we want is to say beggars should get banned for begging. I bet you’re the type of person believe that 500bil inflation is fake and the moon is made out of cheese.Originally Posted by kanogom
What moon is not made of cheese o.o.. Hahaha you talking like you 5 years old realy.. Who brake the rules shud get ban.. Finish story..
Yea and this all happen from inflation of gold in the game..nothing wrong here.. Okie
This is what happens when a scammer gets exposed. They cry, blaming others and and trying hard to make a wrong into a right.
Clearly violated TOS and betrayed everyone with your 'community posts'. Sad you waste so much time on a story only you get,
instead of being a man and appologise to the community.
It not part of the rules... so you end up banning someone’s who not brake rules...
Ah wait I make mistake, what encry did, did break rules. Price manipulation is when you tell other people to sell an item for higher price to try to rise price of the item.
Last edited by Giant bench; 08-04-2020 at 09:31 AM.
Yea I give him ban o.o..how is that? I, don't care who get ban if he braking the rules here.. Rules shud be same for everyone here.. Don't matter how much they buy platinum or idk what..
Uhmmm i thought were driving all I kept reading is "braking" xD just a pun
Hahahahahahaha
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I see this a bit different. Lets say I have the last set of some old lb vanity. I say I sell it for 3b fix no less even tho the highest offer is 1b. Am I considered a manipulator? Its clear I try to "manipulate" the price by not selling any cheaper? Does it matter if I tell everybody its worth 3b bc the only one selling overall?
Encryptions pmed like 10 people... out of 150 loons? So am I allowed to sell balloons now or not? I mean I didnt receive a msg but still own one. And even if I did. I dont care if a person wants me to keep it, I sell whenever I want for whatever price. I think you guys need to chill, encryptions is right: the house mail of him did not change anything for the reasons he mentioned.
There are people makroing their way in event lbs and most aps lbs to the top with several chars or stand in houses with 20 chars afk collecting gold and you want to ban this guy.
Okie.is not up to me who get ban or not.. I replay on this and say if he brake rules he shud get ban like all who brake it.. Thats it.
So you tell me I want to ban this guy.. Comon man.. Idk who is that guy and I don't care realy but if he do somthing wrong that's not of my problem.
In my opinion he did nothing wrong. The mail he wrote had no affect on the price of loons and the result is he didnt manipulate anything. I would not ban somebody for the attempt alone. Same as I would not ban a new player who writes "selling ign" and doesnt know its banable aslong as he didnt actually do it. Thats my point of few, if u think he should get banned for this thats up to you.
Hi Qua, no need to defend your friend. Feel free to see it different, but your example doesnt match this situation really.
Encryptions wanted to manupilate the prices, and therefor he needed others. The attempt itself is rlly poor and shows his real face. Tricking people for his own benefit. The fact he asked other to join his scam, shows how dedicated he is. Devs stated earlier that this is against the TOS, same goes for the makro users u mentioned above. Both should be removed from game. And this housemail is the one everyone can see, but who knows how many of this messaged we 'missed'.
Past is past no one should care about these old things but haters bro
U r one of the best players in this game and and role model for many many players in AL including me
Keep it up all hate u get means u r on the right way of successful
(( Newdose ))
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I don’t think he should get banned.
1.) This happened around 2 years ago.
2.) He didn’t actually got through with it.
3.) It didn’t even work.
I know, I know, “but the attempt to do it”. That’s fine and all, but I still don’t think he should get banned for it.
I mean it all looks bad on his end because,
-he was buying red balloon banners a few days before inflation hit,
-then he was selling them after inflation hit making it look like he manipulated the price when in reality he didn’t.
-And a screen shot of him “manipulating” those same balloons just so happened to be timed perfectly. To make him look bad.
I don’t buy it, I’m just calling it that most of you just envy him and everything just happened to line up perfectly to make him look bad.
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Yes the attempt is poor. I am not sure if he knew that its banable bc it happened long ago. I believe he sent the mail to all the people mentioned, not more, not less. He would have put them into the list otherwise. In this particular case I would not ban anybody for it. I agree that no good reputation goes within this message and so does he know. I just feel like people are a bit overreacting because this attempt didnt change anything and it looks very weak, just as some new player trying to buy an ign. I believe devs should look into each case and decide if its worth a lifetime ban, a temporary ban or a warning. Just as they do with makro users since theres no protection in form of an "automatic security". If you believe this attempt deserves a ban I can understand why and I'm ok with that choice. But I personally dont think it deserves one no matter if he is a friend or not.
Past is past and nobody should care about old things?
As far as i know, if u ever break the law and get caught few years later.. U will face consequences whatsoever.
Not saying that he should get banned or not but the 2 years ago excuse isn't a good one
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Here you go:
https://www.spacetimestudios.com/sho...t=trend+market
A quick research into past similar forum threads would have answered your ignorance on this topic, perhaps reading more before commenting purely based on your invalidated opinion helps you sound a tiny bit more matured.
[Disclaimer: Before you read any further, my Intention is to hopefully clear up some if not all doubts on the topic of price manipulation, I'm not interested in defending anyone stance nor do I have the time to engage in a meaningless drama]
"Price manipulation is not real in AL"
It seems to me there's clearly a lack of understanding between merching(short term/long term) and manipulation as well as how the price of an item is determined.
"We as the people set the price not STS"
I believe you meant each of us get to decide what price we are eventually gonna sell our items, correct me if I misunderstood you. While that's partially true, think about selling an item say deary egg for 100m, would anyone in their right mind buy? AN INDIVIDUAL DO NOT SET THE PRICE for an item. One person who decides to sell at a particular price contributes to the overall market demand and market supply which ultimately sets the price for that item.
"To say we should get banned for selling an item at the price we want is to say beggars should get banned for begging."
I don't see how is this a relevant analogy, but nice attempt anyway (:
"I bet you’re the type of person believe that 500bil inflation is fake and the moon is made out of cheese"
I appreciate your sense of humor but it seems a completely redundant remark.
Now, Let's get into some real talk.
First, prices of an item goes up and down because of the constantly changing market supply and market demand. For any item, there's a ceiling price(max price) and floor price(min price) people are willing to pay for. Depending on supply of that item, the floor price may be pressured to go lower if supply is abundant, similarly, if demand for that item is high enough while the supply is limited, the ceiling price will be forced to break to a new height. Now, when you decide to sell an item at a price that's within the CURRENT min and max price range(not a day/week/months/years ago), you are selling the item at the current market price.
Merching happens when you buy an item that's below the maximum market price (ceiling price) and sell it at an appropriate time at the ceiling price or higher than the amount of you bought for. Here, your merching profit depends on the gap between the price you bought and the the ceiling price at the time you intend to sell as the market price range changes over time. The Larger the gap, the more profit you get. As a side differentiation from merching, lowballing is when you offer to buy something outside of the min and max bracket people are currently paying for. Of course, there are people willing to sell way below the current market price range when they are in a rush, you did not lowball an offer but rather received a lowball selling price.
As an example:
Let's say mishi egg's current price range is this: 2m = floor price, and 3m = ceiling price. Selling at anywhere within 2m-3m, you are selling at the current market price. Merching means for e.g. you are buying at say 2m and selling at 2.5m.
Manipulation is when you are selling an item that is set by you or a small group of people solely instead of by the overall people in the market. In other words, manipulation involves one or a few individuals attempting to control the entire market supply and demand to create a false and new accepted market price range. In a free market where the demand & supply for an item is not being artificially created, it is not possible to sell at any price you want because market price is determined by actual market demand and market supply a.k.a the average of the sum of all legitimate, interested buyers & willing sellers and not by a single individiual. You might ask: what if I have no intention to manipulate the price I'm just hoarding some of them so that i can sell later when price goes up? Well, this is a very tricky question. (I will attempt to the best of my ability to distinguish the difference between the two) Hoarding can be understood as a form of long term merch, however depending on what you are doing with the items you hoard, you may either be merching or doing something that's against the TOS i.e. actively manipulating the market supply and demand.
As an example:
For anyone who has over 50m, you can very significantly if not entirely control the whole market supply and demand of say magma eggs. Let's assume for simplicity sake the market currently has 1000 magma eggs, i.e. 1000 willing sellers waiting for buyers. Say, initially other than these 1000 legitimate sellers, there are also a 1000 legitimate buyers of magma eggs. Being one of the 1000 legitimate buyers, and the richest among all of them, you bought all the 1000 magma eggs from the 1000 sellers. No one in the market except you has magma eggs. Now, the remaining 999 people who was looking to buy magma egg at the market price now is forced to buy at the price you are willing to sell because only you has magma eggs and nobody else has it. Now this, is market or price manipulation.
How about hoarding? If I hoard all magma eggs and not sell them until after some time would i be considered as manipulating the market? The answer is no. Why? Because the new supply of magma eggs (from new sellers other than the 1000 sellers earlier) will slowly match the demand of 999 people (or possibly more people) in the market to determine a new market price. Yes indeed, the new market price would have raised to a new higher bar from say 10k to now 50k because you hoarded them but you did not manipulate the market in a way that doesn't allow the market to have its free flow of supply and demand, manipulating would mean you actively play a role to control the market at all times (i.e. whenever a new seller of magma eggs appear you buy it, making you the only seller of magma eggs at all time for now and forever or as long as you play AL)
The above are my attempts to provide some over-simplistic examples on how merching/hoarding and price manipulations works. Hopefully it clears some doubts, if anyone has better input, feel free to add (:
Yes I mistake, and I edited my recent post. You didn’t need to write a book about it...Here you go:
https://www.spacetimestudios.com/sho...t=trend+market
A quick research into past similar forum threads would have answered your ignorance on this topic, perhaps reading more before commenting purely based on your invalidated opinion helps you sound a tiny bit more matured.
[Disclaimer: Before you read any further, my Intention is to hopefully clear up some if not all doubts on the topic of price manipulation, I'm not interested in defending anyone stance nor do I have the time to engage in a meaningless drama]
"Price manipulation is not real in AL"
It seems to me there's clearly a lack of understanding between merching(short term/long term) and manipulation as well as how the price of an item is determined.
"We as the people set the price not STS"
I believe you meant each of us get to decide what price we are eventually gonna sell our items, correct me if I misunderstood you. While that's partially true, think about selling an item say deary egg for 100m, would anyone in their right mind buy? AN INDIVIDUAL DO NOT SET THE PRICE for an item. One person who decides to sell at a particular price contributes to the overall market demand and market supply which ultimately sets the price for that item.
"To say we should get banned for selling an item at the price we want is to say beggars should get banned for begging."
I don't see how is this a relevant analogy, but nice attempt anyway (:
"I bet you’re the type of person believe that 500bil inflation is fake and the moon is made out of cheese"
I appreciate your sense of humor but it seems a completely redundant remark.
Now, Let's get into some real talk.
First, prices of an item goes up and down because of the constantly changing market supply and market demand. For any item, there's a ceiling price(max price) and floor price(min price) people are willing to pay for. Depending on supply of that item, the floor price may be pressured to go lower if supply is abundant, similarly, if demand for that item is high enough while the supply is limited, the ceiling price will be forced to break to a new height. Now, when you decide to sell an item at a price that's within the CURRENT min and max price range(not a day/week/months/years ago), you are selling the item at the current market price.
Merching happens when you buy an item that's below the maximum market price (ceiling price) and sell it at an appropriate time at the ceiling price or higher than the amount of you bought for. Here, your merching profit depends on the gap between the price you bought and the the ceiling price at the time you intend to sell as the market price range changes over time. The Larger the gap, the more profit you get. As a side differentiation from merching, lowballing is when you offer to buy something outside of the min and max bracket people are currently paying for. Of course, there are people willing to sell way below the current market price range when they are in a rush, you did not lowball an offer but rather received a lowball selling price.
As an example:
Let's say mishi egg's current price range is this: 2m = floor price, and 3m = ceiling price. Selling at anywhere within 2m-3m, you are selling at the current market price. Merching means for e.g. you are buying at say 2m and selling at 2.5m.
Manipulation is when you are selling an item that is set by you or a small group of people solely instead of by the overall people in the market. In other words, manipulation involves one or a few individuals attempting to control the entire market supply and demand to create a false and new accepted market price range. In a free market where the demand & supply for an item is not being artificially created, it is not possible to sell at any price you want because market price is determined by actual market demand and market supply a.k.a the average of the sum of all legitimate, interested buyers & willing sellers and not by a single individiual. You might ask: what if I have no intention to manipulate the price I'm just hoarding some of them so that i can sell later when price goes up? Well, this is a very tricky question. (I will attempt to the best of my ability to distinguish the difference between the two) Hoarding can be understood as a form of long term merch, however depending on what you are doing with the items you hoard, you may either be merching or doing something that's against the TOS i.e. actively manipulating the market supply and demand.
As an example:
For anyone who has over 50m, you can very significantly if not entirely control the whole market supply and demand of say magma eggs. Let's assume for simplicity sake the market currently has 1000 magma eggs, i.e. 1000 willing sellers waiting for buyers. Say, initially other than these 1000 legitimate sellers, there are also a 1000 legitimate buyers of magma eggs. Being one of the 1000 legitimate buyers, and the richest among all of them, you bought all the 1000 magma eggs from the 1000 sellers. No one in the market except you has magma eggs. Now, the remaining 999 people who was looking to buy magma egg at the market price now is forced to buy at the price you are willing to sell because only you has magma eggs and nobody else has it. Now this, is market or price manipulation.
How about hoarding? If I hoard all magma eggs and not sell them until after some time would i be considered as manipulating the market? The answer is no. Why? Because the new supply of magma eggs (from new sellers other than the 1000 sellers earlier) will slowly match the demand of 999 people (or possibly more people) in the market to determine a new market price. Yes indeed, the new market price would have raised to a new higher bar from say 10k to now 50k because you hoarded them but you did not manipulate the market in a way that doesn't allow the market to have its free flow of supply and demand, manipulating would mean you actively play a role to control the market at all times (i.e. whenever a new seller of magma eggs appear you buy it, making you the only seller of magma eggs at all time for now and forever or as long as you play AL)
The above are my attempts to provide some over-simplistic examples on how merching/hoarding and price manipulations works. Hopefully it clears some doubts, if anyone has better input, feel free to add (:
This sounds really biased and defensive relative to your previous constructive comments on inflation.
To clarify, while some may indeed be jealous of his wealth, others who are just as wealthy may not be. Also, that's besides the discussion of whether a falied attempt to commit a crime is a crime.
My question for all the 3 points you gave :
1. That was 2 years ago, what about now? How do we know he's not doing it again or nobody else is doing this? And why does the discussion on price manipulators only limited to him, is it really more important to know who did it in the past or is it more important to know what's actually happening in the now ?
2 & 3. If one failed to kill a person with a knife does that mean that he's free from any punishment when someone reported his behaviour? What would you do assumming you are an objective and unbiased authority?
Murder and stealing candy are two completely different things... both have different consequences. But I understand your analogy.
People price manipulate all the time.. with either “Fake C/O” or saying an item is “X price” when in reality it’s “Y price”. It’s nothing new.
You’re right we don’t know if he’s going to do it again. What he did happened at a very bad time.
He bought balloons a few days before inflation hit, then when inflation did hit, he decided to resell them. Then out of no where a screen shot of him trying to manipulate the price of balloons just so happen to be “exposed” at the right time. To make him look bad. Since he bought 3 balloons for 60m and resold them for 100m, it looked like he was price manipulating. When it was just inflation.
Did he make the mistake a few years ago of trying to manipulate the price? Yes
Did he learn from it? I would think so.
Will he do it again? Probably not.
Just like in the real world there are consequences but there are second chances as-well. correct?
It’s up to Devs to decide. Not the communities choice.
Everything just lined up at a bad time, and the people who envy him just so happened to have their pitch forks sharpened and torches lit.
But if you’re asking if he should be banned. My answer is: No, people learn from their mistakes. Just my own opinion, I don’t care if you agree or disagree with me.
In the end it’s the devs decision, not mine.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
"The mail he wrote had no effect on the price of loons"
- what a huge claim on top of another claim that "he did nothing wrong". Mind to elaborate further how it had ABSOLUTELY no effect?
Let's insist that "he did nothing wrong", are you at the same time implying that we are allowed to do the same(sending as many mails to as many people we can) as well so long as all the recipients don't follow what we suggest them to do?
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