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Thread: Anybody feeling OP? Bears are!

  1. #21
    Senior Member Whirlzap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otukura View Post
    What if the armor doubled and there was no dodge?
    Agh, triple post, but w/e.

    Just to add on.

    Armor means nothing to a nuke mage.

    During sewers, bears had lower dodge, and they had really high armor as well.
    Nuke mages like me didn't even have to heal much. As an Enchanted Staff Mage, a simple full-nuke combo as a bear would Beckon and drag me would end up taking most, if not all his HP.

    Think of it this way.
    Armor= a percentage of damage reduction, at around 50-60% for bears.
    Dodge= 100% damage reduction.

    At a lower extreme scale, armor works better than dodge.
    At a higher extreme scale, dodge works exponentially better than armor.

  2. #22
    Forum Legend Zeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whirlzap View Post
    Agh, triple post, but w/e.

    Just to add on.

    Armor means nothing to a nuke mage.

    During sewers, bears had lower dodge, and they had really high armor as well.
    Nuke mages like me didn't even have to heal much. As an Enchanted Staff Mage, a simple full-nuke combo as a bear would Beckon and drag me would end up taking most, if not all his HP.

    Think of it this way.
    Armor= a percentage of damage reduction, at around 50-60% for bears.
    Dodge= 100% damage reduction.

    At a lower extreme scale, armor works better than dodge.
    At a higher extreme scale, dodge works exponentially better than armor.
    You're not taking into consideration of regeneration and debuffs.

    If you double armor now, bears will have over 500 armor. Weapon damage doesn't even reach to that yet, so how do you expect to "nuke" them?
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    Senior Member Whirlzap's Avatar
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    Red damage orbs in Alien Underground, duh.

    Sewer Age massive FFAs :P

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    Senior Member Ixillicus's Avatar
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    What if they are re-scaling the points so what you have for 6 points now, will take 7 after the update. So you can still achieve the same levels with your skills but... you can't have all of them maxed anymore.

    If that were the case, it would mess with peoples twinks, but not really affect end-game PVP.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ixillicus View Post
    What if they are re-scaling the points so what you have for 6 points now, will take 7 after the update. So you can still achieve the same levels with your skills but... you can't have all of them maxed anymore.

    If that were the case, it would mess with peoples twinks, but not really affect end-game PVP.
    I wouldnt like that, that just results in mages using "drain frost fire" and dead fried bird on the ground..... *AGAIN*
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    Forum Legend Zeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ixillicus View Post
    What if they are re-scaling the points so what you have for 6 points now, will take 7 after the update. So you can still achieve the same levels with your skills but... you can't have all of them maxed anymore.

    If that were the case, it would mess with peoples twinks, but not really affect end-game PVP.
    That would definitely be an easy solution, but I don't think people would like the idea of going one step backwards, lol.
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    Member Justinjspark's Avatar
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    @apollo hey u gonna do thrasher runs tomorrow? If yes may I please join?
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    Guardian of Alterra Physiologic's Avatar
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    At some point, whether it be Humania's release or another campaign release, skills will have to be completely revamped, especially for PvP since a linear increase in skills would really make PvP unfair(er). It would not make sense in PvP to have some classes be able to completely dodge attacks. I'd imagine they would do some inverse exponential increase to skills instead, having higher level skills to have less of an impact than lower level skills.

    Or, have an automatic % debuff to attributes in PvP, i.e. dodge stat in PvP is decreased for all classes by 15-20%.

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    Forum Legend Zeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Physiologic View Post
    At some point, whether it be Humania's release or another campaign release, skills will have to be completely revamped, especially for PvP since a linear increase in skills would really make PvP unfair(er). It would not make sense in PvP to have some classes be able to completely dodge attacks. I'd imagine they would do some inverse exponential increase to skills instead, having higher level skills to have less of an impact than lower level skills.

    Or, have an automatic % debuff to attributes in PvP, i.e. dodge stat in PvP is decreased for all classes by 15-20%.
    They'd need to lower a Mage's damage then too. It's really not fair that they can one combo any class. >.<
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    Senior Member Whirlzap's Avatar
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    Maybe they could just nerf critical, dodge, armor, damage, and hit all down respective balanced values.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Whirlzap View Post
    Maybe they could just nerf critical, dodge, armor, damage, and hit all down respective balanced values.
    What is "Respective Values", in evey cap there seems to be a class that is favored, pvp will also be a mess when all values become equal
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  13. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ixillicus View Post
    What if they are re-scaling the points so what you have for 6 points now, will take 7 after the update. So you can still achieve the same levels with your skills but... you can't have all of them maxed anymore.

    If that were the case, it would mess with peoples twinks, but not really affect end-game PVP.
    Why bother adding more skill points then? Maybe for future expansions I guess.

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    Senior Member Ixillicus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aedenos View Post
    Why bother adding more skill points then? Maybe for future expansions I guess.
    The idea is that if you can't max everything, your build plays a strategy. Currently at end-game, everyone has the same builds, so we're only competing with our gear and combos. And since most people have the same gear (assuming same class) then really its the combo/style. Having to choose which skills you can max adds a level of strategy and creativity for team play. It's why twinking is a challenge, although most builds are similar there, now.

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    I just took Sam's statement as him being funny. I didn't know it was a secret commentary on the future of Pvp. hehe.

    I've just dabbled in pvp in PL and in my opinion it sucks. DL pvp is lots better because of many of the reasons apollo talked about. What makes DL pvp fun for me is the lengthy battles and strategies involved. I have 1250 health and weapon attacks do 62 damage, skills do anywhere from 60-200 so you can see it takes several attacks to be defeated. In PL a bird has 500 health and drain does 600 damage. Because of this PL pvp "battles" are over way to fast. Also, people with the best gear have a tremendous advantage over others. I've seen players in DL pvp have 38 damage (because of how they do their passive abilities plus not having plat weapons) compared to my 60 who have really good stats because of their skill level. I don't see that in PL pvp.

    Imo, pl pvp can't be fixed. If u nerf any skills to rebalance pvp then pve will be impossible.

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    L2twinkbro^ come to low level for a better experience... Hehe... Seriously though, low level is a different kind of strategy then high level... If you know what you are doing you can succeed with gear that costs 1/10 the price of the pro gear... Plus there are hidden game mechanics in PL that alot of PVPers dont know about, good luck finding them. Dark lehends PVP is too easy.

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    If skills are nerfed, the mobs will need to be nerfed too.

    I like the idea of not being able to max every skill, because then you'll have to consider carefully which skills you really need. I think the lvl 7 skill cap will help, but maybe make all the skills have 10 ranks, but nerf them. The first 5 can be added in before level 65, and the last 5 can be added in after.

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    Mages are the everything class already IMO. With the bear's heavy armor and dodge and hp regen mages and birds will barely be able to hit their high damage. But birds could have a lot of dodge too. All bear dodge buffs added together currently add 28 dodge for birds it's 30 dodge. We'll just have to wait and see how it turns out.

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    Tournament & Ladder Leader Silentarrow's Avatar
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    * As defensive buffs like evade and taunt increase, the need for 4x elixirs decreases. Why? Survivability increases without elixirs, so more players won't need to buy them except for the purposes of leveling, which can be detrimental to STS's business
    Slow clap

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    Senior Member Moogerfooger's Avatar
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    All conjecture until the update comes out. Who's to say there isn't some sort of adjustment to the other classes' gear/skills to counter insane dodge, or skills nerfed like others have mentioned? Saying one class is going to be OP before anyone has seen it is silly....perhaps you fell into a vat of tasty mango mojitos???

    I love all the guessing game threads that pop up before update, and most of them end up being wrong or not quite right.
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    Forum Legend Zeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moogerfooger View Post
    All conjecture until the update comes out. Who's to say there isn't some sort of adjustment to the other classes' gear/skills to counter insane dodge, or skills nerfed like others have mentioned? Saying one class is going to be OP before anyone has seen it is silly....perhaps you fell into a vat of tasty mango mojitos???

    I love all the guessing game threads that pop up before update, and most of them end up being wrong or not quite right.
    Lol, bro, like I said, forewarnings/theorizing.
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