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  Click here to go to the first Dev post in this thread.   Thread: L115 Cap

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    Senior Member Absolize's Avatar
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    Default L115 Cap

    Hello everyone!

    As we all know the long awaited L115 cap has finally dropped and many people have fast capped and obtained some if not all of the new gear.

    I spoke to multiple people about what may need fixed going into this cap now, so we can avoid troubles going into the future of the long awaited 115 cap. Here today, I plan to compile some issues, suggestions & things to make the 115 grind a little more enjoyable and make the L115 gear easier to obtain for the average player.

    #1: Dragon Fang Buff

    - Many players I have spoke to (including myself) have noticed how long it would actually take to get the 115 gear if the fang drop rate stayed as it is. From myself experimenting personally, I have only seen 1-2 Fangs drop in a single run per person. I think it would be fair to buff the Fang drop rate to 5-10 Fangs per game considering how many it takes to craft the 115 gear and vanities. For players who do not have as much time to invest into the game anymore, I do feel this is necessary. Another option that I feel would help with the profitability, is having a platinum purchased elixer (15-25 platinum) that buffs the Fang drops from 5-10 to 15-20 or something along those lines.

    #2: Crafting Option for DemiGod Vanities

    - Considering the DemiGod vanities are all equipped as 2H weapons I feel there should be an option to craft those weapons into 1H variants because most players I think would prefer the 1H option with a vanity shield. Even if not, it makes the fast cap rewards so much better because we would have that freedom to do so! This suggestion is more so on preference, but I do feel this option should be in the game for players who aren't a huge fan of rocking the 2H look.

    #3: More Quest Slots

    - Considering with the new 115 cap having boatloads of daily and weekly quests to keep up on, I feel this option will help out players tremendously considering no one would have to cancel quests to accept other ones.

    #4: Damage Over Time (DoT) Skills

    - DoT Skills do help out in PvE modes but I noticed a issue in PvP modes they are not useful at all.
    - Mage's "Ice" Skill at L11 and L12 is extremely OP in a PvE setting the DoT effect can drop the bosses health down halfway with one single Ice use.
    - In addition to making DoT skills work better in PvP, some classes DoT skills do need a buff (from my experience, the Paladin's "Summon" skill is in need of a buff since it is the classes on DoT skill) as far as the other classes, I am unaware of but it is worth taking a look at.

    #5: Quest Bug

    - One of the quests send you to the second map "Molten Cave" to find the boss "Ambassador Ayn". However, Ambassador Ayn is located in the 3rd map "Platonius' Lair"

    #6: L115 Gear

    - All complete sets at 115 (Legendary, Elite, Mythical & Crafted Mythical) do not receive set bonuses. Each of these sets should be identified with a different set bonus.
    - There is no crafting option for 115 Mythical rings, amulets & 2h weapons.
    - The stats between the legendary, elite & mythical sets are not far off from each other. The sets need a big change in stats in order for it to be worth it to grind out the mythical gear.

    #7: Percentage Buffs/Debuffs

    - Armor % buffs show up on stats, damage % buffs do not.
    - Debuffs should do a percentage debuff instead of a flat number, for example, instead of a hit debuff doing -70 hit, it should do -70% hit to account for the new gear being well over 100% hit even if a -70 hit debuff is landed, it makes no difference. This will make PvP less dodge reliant and factor in the debuffs. This should be factored into every class so that everyone has a fighting chance! Debuffs being flat numbers have no effect in current PvP or PvE.

    #8: The Classic Fire Set Bug

    - The New Classic Fire Set has a bug to where if you are a certain distance from another player it will appear to be a silver armor instead of the new classic fire armor that you have equipped.

    #9: Drop Rates

    - From farming the new maps I've noticed the drop rates of the new mythical gear is extremely low and it is causing players to take advantage of pricing the equipment extremely high (300m for one part) which makes it very hard for casual players to afford gear if they don't have hours each day to farm.

    I do hope Cinco and STS take the time to consider these bug fixes/suggestions. My goal is to make this cap one of the better ones PvP and PvE wise to make sure the entire community is satisfied with the changes. Many of these suggestions are from other players in the community that I spoke to regarding the new 115 cap. Anyone I did not speak to regarding this thread, I encourage you to add your ideas below in case there were things that I have looked over and missed.

    Thank you everyone for reading, see you at 115!

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    Senior Member FFA's Avatar
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    "but I do feel this option should be in the game for players who aren't a huge fan of rocking the 2H look."
    Hey that's me.

    Well wrote Hook, I haven't personally had much time to grind the PvE side of things yet. That all went into fast capping, But I trust most of these issues were found by you or a reputable person. I am also curious to know what the situation on 2H weapons will be!

    I'm glad Cinco decided to make another cap, And I think we all should be very happy with that choice. Now I hope he will be able to add/fix all the suggestions he will get this cap. Thanks again.

    "Never mess with a man that can end you, from a different zip code."-Sniper

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    Great thread, Hook! I definitely think Dragon Fangs need a buff of some sort. With emphasis to #2 in this thread, I would love if we were given the option to craft our 2H Demigod weapons into 1H. I’ve spoken to many other players about them and although they love how the new weapons look, it would be preferred if they were 1H so we can wear it with some of our favorite shields. Perhaps Cinco can make a quest for us to complete which would give us the option to craft them. These are all great suggestions and hopefully they get implemented.

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    Love the thread, thanks Hook! Concise, straight-to-the-point and great feedback. I wanted to chime in with some thoughts and also share what I've heard from others as well.

    #2. Adding to your point, and I'm sure people will want to make this controversial even though it follows precedent (lol - as some are extremely hardcore for keeping them account-bound and are outspoken to keep things as they are). I think offering players the choice to craft into 1H would be pretty awesome though. Maybe something to the effect of crafting all 3 (or just 2 or just 1) DemiGod items into the 1h of your choice? I do think having the option to use platinum and craft any of those DemiGod items as tradable (just like we could craft into tradable Pfieffer, White Dragon/Blue Angel, for example) would be a positive. Having the badges/titles/achievements as account-bound are great as-is, too.

    And as Nihiliste said, maybe a specialized quest to make that happen would be best (and avoid confusion at the Forge).

    #4. As it is so OP, it probably needs to be at least looked at for a potential nerf, but 'ice' does act best against fire. Maybe there was some level of intentional OP-ness? Lol. Bird DoT is nowhere near as good, but it does damage - and like you said, I'll need to test other classes once I cap them.

    #6. Agreed on set bonuses - there is currently no set bonus for the uncrafted 115 mythic items, and we have yet to hear/confirm if there is a set bonus for any number of crafted 115 mythic either. I will say that the newer gear is definitely better than 110 mythic. I think elite 115 is also better than 110 mythic (and I'm sort of 50/50 if that is best or not).

    #9. I think everyone would agree they "want" the new mythic gear, but I honestly like for it to be "rarer" ...especially only a few days into the new campaign. I know lots of players spent lots of gold on XP elixirs and sets in order to grind, so being able to drop rare gear and sell at a premium (and prices will come down as more people play) is a benefit to playing. I think making DemiGods tradable would help players have the option to 'cash out' and make it easier to purchase new mythic gear, too.

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    I agree with all this firmly.

    ELITE

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    Quote Originally Posted by ignwizzywhite View Post
    Love the thread, thanks Hook! Concise, straight-to-the-point and great feedback. I wanted to chime in with some thoughts and also share what I've heard from others as well.

    #9. I think everyone would agree they "want" the new mythic gear, but I honestly like for it to be "rarer" ...especially only a few days into the new campaign. I know lots of players spent lots of gold on XP elixirs and sets in order to grind, so being able to drop rare gear and sell at a premium (and prices will come down as more people play) is a benefit to playing. I think making DemiGods tradable would help players have the option to 'cash out' and make it easier to purchase new mythic gear, too.
    I wanted to highlight this particularly because I do not feel the L115 gear should be considered a ďrareĒ thing. The thing we look for in PL is activity. Many casual players will not be motivated if the L115 sets are too hard to come by. I donít agree with the inflation in PL and I do think having a better drop rate for the items will fix this issue. Iíve been in situations where I didnít have gear to PvP like I primarily do, and it was very unmotivating and people werenít helping by selling them for ungodly amount of gold, we will have a lot more players active if the gear can be obtained easier.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Absolize View Post
    I wanted to highlight this particularly because I do not feel the L115 gear should be considered a “rare” thing. The thing we look for in PL is activity. Many casual players will not be motivated if the L115 sets are too hard to come by. I don’t agree with the inflation in PL and I do think having a better drop rate for the items will fix this issue. I’ve been in situations where I didn’t have gear to PvP like I primarily do, and it was very unmotivating and people weren’t helping by selling them for ungodly amount of gold, we will have a lot more players active if the gear can be obtained easier.
    Fair enough! I may be in the minority, but I rarely if ever PvP so I am firmly in the PvE realm of PL. Having rarer stuff actually motivates me to play more. I think the rarity of the vanity explorer drops helps, but to be fair there are tons of mythic drops already and it's only a week in. Also, they nerfed all of the Myx gold drops (which should help combat the inflation we are all experiencing) and it looks like the 115 campaign drops a solid amount of gold, so players will farm elite/mythic as they begin gold farming there.

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    I agree with everything you mentioned, Hook.

    I think that endgame sets shouldn't be extremely hard to obtain and craft, but moderate difficulty like previous caps. The amount of fangs that drop seems far too low, especially if mage ice skills that do dmg over time get nerfed and killing bosses becomes harder/more time consuming.

    I am fine with having vanities extremely difficult to get because they are not necessary for game modes like pvp, whereas crafted mythic gear definitely is, especially when each piece of the crafted gear has it's own individual proc that makes it so much better than other gear.

    If Cinco made mythic weapons that had a use specifically that were great for PVE but mediocre in pvp/not as useful then this would be less of a problem imo. Or if he made one set that was great for PVE and is difficult to obtain but mediocre in pvp and another set that is great in pvp and moderate difficulty to obtain but bad in PVE, then this would help to add more variety to farming and possibly retain more interest and activity over time in PL. Just my 2 cents.

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    Nobody has mentioned that the fast cap Demigod weapons should be able to complete the Halloween sets. The name of the items literally have the word "Dragkin Demigod" that makes them Dragkin weapons. The regular Dragkin weapons complete the sets, but are lesser. The Demigod weapons, you would think should complete the Halloween sets, but they don't. The Dragkin Demigod weapons are higher up than the regular Dragkin weapons. They are, after all, called Demigod, but they don't even complete the sets?!

    The meta of this cap involves the use of the Halloween sets which we have to use. What is the point of grinding for fast cap when the "Dragkin Demigod" weapons don't even complete our sets? People can see your badge if you fast capped yeah, but you can't even use the weapon you farmed hours to earn as a set piece. You have to wear the lesser regular Dragkin weapons over the higher time invested Dragkin Demigod weapons, what is the logic in that?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ifeast View Post
    Nobody has mentioned that the fast cap Demigod weapons should be able to complete the Halloween sets. The name of the items literally have the word "Dragkin Demigod" that makes them Dragkin weapons. The regular Dragkin weapons complete the sets, but are lesser. The Demigod weapons, you would think should complete the Halloween sets, but they don't. The Dragkin Demigod weapons are higher up than the regular Dragkin weapons. They are, after all, called Demigod, but they don't even complete the sets?!

    The meta of this cap involves the use of the Halloween sets which we have to use. What is the point of grinding for fast cap when the "Dragkin Demigod" weapons don't even complete our sets? People can see your badge if you fast capped yeah, but you can't even use the weapon you farmed hours to earn as a set piece. You have to wear the lesser regular Dragkin weapons over the higher time invested Dragkin Demigod weapons, what is the logic in that?
    I agree dragkin is in the name, it would be cool to see it count as 1 or 2pc of the dragkin sets

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    Quote Originally Posted by ignwizzywhite View Post
    Fair enough! I may be in the minority, but I rarely if ever PvP so I am firmly in the PvE realm of PL. Having rarer stuff actually motivates me to play more. I think the rarity of the vanity explorer drops helps, but to be fair there are tons of mythic drops already and it's only a week in. Also, they nerfed all of the Myx gold drops (which should help combat the inflation we are all experiencing) and it looks like the 115 campaign drops a solid amount of gold, so players will farm elite/mythic as they begin gold farming there.
    Also fair, but yeah, motivation I feel like for the average player we need the gear to be obtained easier. The vanities I understand them being rare because itís not needed to PvP like Dolloway mentioned, but a lot of the community enjoys PvP and sets need to be distributed in order for those players to continue. I consider myself a ďaverageĒ player that doesnít have unlimited time to play, therefore I want to be able to do what I like (PvP) when I do play. If gear is impossible to get, itíll be hard to stay motivated. But I do understand your outlook.

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    I also agree with the notion that 115 cap weapons "should" be tradable, just solely based on the context of all past releases and items. I also think there should be a set bonus for the crafted version of myth, at the very least a visual effect

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    If it has not been mentioned yet, iíd like to throw my 2 cents in and say that i think demigod weapons should complete a vanity set and get a cool set bonus
    i love set bonus effects.

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    amen on the 115 sets need stat bonus for wearing set . and of course they need to be extremly more op than the counterpart elites and pinks


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    Another thing is to make it to where you see every quest an npc has available at once. In some places, if you want to get certain quests ( applies to any campaign ) you have to accept others before you get the quest you want. Oktal is an example, I had to accept 3 daily quests from Riksa before I was able to reach the 4th quest that showed up which was the storyline quest. This also can confuse new players as some will be lost at this point when they see that Riksa has a quest that isn't part of the storyline and they may just wander around or ask how to get the quest. We should not have to accept multiple quests just to get to the one we need and or want.

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    a good point to add will be adding bonus set stats RELATIVE to their attributes . Dex for "nuke", Int for "support" . Str for "tank" .


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    Quote Originally Posted by Absolize View Post
    Also fair, but yeah, motivation I feel like for the average player we need the gear to be obtained easier. The vanities I understand them being rare because itís not needed to PvP like Dolloway mentioned, but a lot of the community enjoys PvP and sets need to be distributed in order for those players to continue. I consider myself a ďaverageĒ player that doesnít have unlimited time to play, therefore I want to be able to do what I like (PvP) when I do play. If gear is impossible to get, itíll be hard to stay motivated. But I do understand your outlook.
    Dude it is not even one week into, and cs is already full of mythic gear. It is normal that new endgame items are somewhat expensive at beginning of a new cap.

    Drop rates are very ok, since platonious can be cleared in a very short time by a decent team, AND drops pretty much gold too so it is the new go to zone anyways. In a month prices will be down to like a quarter of what they are now.

    The elite stuff is insanely cheap and only has slightly worse stats btw so at least for pve its very ok. Endgame PvP always was for non-poors. Just play honor.

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    A very interesting thread indeed.


    1#: Dragon Fang Buff

    From a farmers point of view, I am thoroughly enjoying the challenge of crafting and the current drop rate of dragon fangs. It actually gives farmers something to aim towards.

    By capping and completing the sets within a week really is pointless. It only benefits pvpers because in order to pvp they require the best gear quickly before others to gain a huge advantage mythic crafted sets have over elite 115 sets.

    Once pvpers have their sets they won't farm anymore. How does increasing dragon fang drops promote any spending of platinum at all?

    I like the idea of a paid platinum elixir that increases the amount of fangs one can loot.



    #2: Crafting Option for DemiGod Vanities

    STS have already created these fast cap vanity 2 handed items, by adding the option to craft these vanity items in to 1 handed weapons

    This requires 3 new vanity items, which means more cost to sts without any reward for them

    Currently around 224 different characters have fast capped. If you want this option perhaps adding an additional cost of 50 to 100 platinum (or more) to have this option? To promote platinum spending.



    #3: More Quest Slots


    I agree that more than 5 quests are currently required, perhaps increasing quest numbers to 10 or 15 will suffice.




    #6: L115 Gear


    Currently you can only craft the, helm, armor, 1 handed weapon and shield only.

    The ring and amulet as well as 2 handed weapons need an option to craft as well.



    #9: Drop Rates

    I really like the drop rate being rare as it is right now, it does force players to buy classy looter platinum elixirs 60 platinum per hour, to assist in getting the new Mythics.

    This rate drop rate, forces players to actually grind and farm hard to get the new Mythics as well as rare class based vanity items.

    But for pvpers or those casual type of players, this drop rate is so low, it will certainly put most players off, and they will not want to put the time and effort into obtaining the new Mythic sets.
    Last edited by Fwend; 11-24-2022 at 05:57 AM.

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    I would have to agree with buffing the Dragon Fang tokens but only up to 5 tokens max, an elixir for increase chance to get more is a good idea too. Also STS should add tokens on weekly quests rewards too.
    Haven't farmed that much myself but the new gears drop rate looks fine based on CS listings. If the devs decided to increase it more I'm afraid after like 3months or so, no one would runs in the new campaign again after obtaining the new gears. We need more rare loots, its time to make the best weapons, vanities and pets lootable in the new campaign for everyone instead on the limited timed events.

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    Great write-up!

    Responding to the OP specifically (and not the other posts in this thread yet...)

    - Dragon Fangs
    These are definitely meant to be a steady slow grind. You will inevitably have max tokens. Between now and then I do plan to offer big batches of Dragon Fangs as rewards - but they will eventually lose all value. For now I would recommend that you do the daily quests and that you choose the 5 Dragon Fang reward instead of the Legendary Gold chest or the XP (which you'd obviously ignore if you are already capped). With this plan in mind I would be open to considering an additional Dragon Fang reward added to all of the Weekly quests - this should be rather easy to do in the short term.

    - Demigod Vanities
    There are no 1H versions of these guys. I will consider making time in the schedule to add them at some point in the future... but since these collectibles are specific to Fast Cap 115 I am going to find it very hard to justify allocating the resources as time keeps on slippin' into the future ;-)

    - Quest Slots
    Hard no here after lots of consideration. While building 115 we talked a lot about maintaining social friction in towne and the Quest Log limits (while patently annoying) are the perfect thing for this. If I were trying to grind with peak efficiency I would want to take as many quests as possible (like we allow in AL) so I understand the request. Unfortunately I've got experience in these matters that points me to 'hard no.' Apologies :-)

    - DoT Stuff
    We should have a separate thead that dives deeply into the effects of new Rank 11 and Rank 12 skills so we can hammer out the balance issues outside of the other usability and content considerations for 115. I'll set this up as a forum post here in General and we can go to towne with observations and suggetsions.

    - Quest Bug
    Fixed in the next update.

    - L115 Gear
    These are not meant to have set bonuses. The stats are (in general) very high but the variance between Legendary, Elite and Mythical pieces is not extreme... on purpose. You're not meant to use only the Mythical stuff; Legendary and Elite item combinations are meant to be useful. Applying individual sets to these would break that design and give us a carbon copy of the last cap.

    - % Buffs
    When the stat influences what happens during combat it won't show up here. For instance if it's adding a percentage to your damage, it's going to affect damage done; not potential damage (and thus it is not showing as a different number in your stats). I'll go over these again and see what can be done to make them more clear.

    - Classic fire.
    I'll check into this. Sounds like we're doing that thing where we use a simple appearance at distance. This could be fixed with a change to your quality options in the short term? Not sure. Otherwise it's about getting into the appearance itself and making sure it doesn't have some sort of "low quality" version to which it switches at distance. I'll take a look ;-)

    - Drop Rates.
    Yep. Low. The reasons for this are a.) even if you grind casually over the course of the next few months you will acquire everything, b.) vast majority of PL players running 115 are well-stocked with gold and can afford the odd piece here and there, and c.) these can remain desirable rewards for one or two future events so long as they remain rare.

    Thanks for your feedback and I do hope you enjoy the Dragkin Terror!!

    Best wishes!
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