Aggro on Rogues Solution

[primaeva]

That's why Warriors shouldn't get nerf

Hmm, that IS true-- if there was no taunt/aggro mechanic in the system and damage is the only way to generate aggro.

It isn't, however. In most other games the tanks get something that doesn't increase their damage, but rather, each point of damage generates more aggro than a DPS class to help them hold threat. This way they aren't given as much damage as a DPS is supposed to have, but can play their role of unkillable reliable tank.

Right now because of the system, the only way for warrs to hold threat is stacking Vorpal / Juggernaut / Ribbit and spamming CS-- which is highly random actually. The system needs to address this issue-- I'll be the first to agree that it's easier for a rogue/sorc to pile on the damage than a warrior holding aggro (and I don't even play warrior, I have a sorc/rogue).

[NiN]

My only option is running around and avoiding the bog attack from jarl but even after 10 secs of running around i still have aggro so i just give up at that time and manage to kite him but it gets annoying kitting on my ipad, i at least die 2-3 times every 10 runs.
I feel bad for whoever dies because of me running around but this really needs to be fixed IMO

[BodMaster]

Many Warriors are to worried about dealing damage to have a true tank build. Full buff build works wonders on keeping aggro no matter the situation.

[Jeff Williams]

Sure blame the warrior cause you cant play your toon and running around like a dumbass and possible resetting the boss isnt good either..best thing freaken take the death and come back let warrior regain aggro ...never run away with boss..

[primaeva]

Sure blame the warrior cause you cant play your toon and running around like a dumbass and possible resetting the boss isnt good either..best thing freaken take the death and come back let warrior regain aggro ...never run away with boss..

Hmm? Don't get it. Can't play toon would mean never getting aggro cos damage is low. If boss goes to him, isn't it something to do with the warrior? [Does not apply to second and third runs with warrior where you know his aggro stinks and thus should hold back on DPS.]

[Vystirch]

Um I play warrior and rouge Nd must say on behalf of the rouge that I want to kill bosses as quick as possible so I can kill them again even when I play warrior I want a rouge to help kill the boss fast. So I really want tanks that can hold agro! So my solution to the problem would be to through defense into the aggro equation. So the amount to dps times the amount of defense will equal the aggro number. Just my idea....

[Bless]

Its not a problem, therefore it doesn't need a solution.

[StompArtist]

Its not a problem, therefore it doesn't need a solution.

Never stopped anyone before!

[Raxin]

Good rogues pull aggro
Good warriors regain hate fast
Lets focus on the real problem why do people constantly link adds in elite then run into a corner say sorry and leave game at least clean up your damn mess

[Astrocat]

Never stopped anyone before!

[primaeva]

Its not a problem, therefore it doesn't need a solution.

Actually after messing around with a rogue and pulling aggro off warriors with rather less effort than on my sorc, I decided to run some tests. In about 50 Jarl runs (pug and running with a warrior who held most of my sorc aggro-- we did 1m05s Jarls before), I did not once fail to grab aggro from the warrior simply by spamming NB + AS + melee (no blades used even-- and no damage boosting pet.)

I dropped my rogues DPS to ~90 (from 150), boosted his HP to 1450, brought his armor to 440, and dropped points from Noxious Bolt to chuck into Smoke Bomb armor buff and dodge from the blades.

I ran about 30 Jarls and ended tanking about 28 of them after pulling off the aggro off the warrior and keeping my simple DPS rotation up (Noxious -> Aimed -> Melee Melee --> Noxiious --> Aimed). I kept aggro in all of these situations, and more than a few members of those groups were rather astounded that a rogue could hold aggro and survive the entire fight. Granted these were pugs, but I was running with pug-like DPS.

There IS a feeling that the top-tier warriors won't be able to keep pace with a top-tier rogue on aggro. The damage output on a single target is simply ridiculous and there aren't enough taunt cooldowns for warrs. Something needs to be done for their aggro gen. In the meantime, I'm wondering why I started with a sorcerer in the first place. It's far more fun to see a screenful of crits and three-digit figures pop up constantly on the screen.

[lonakana]

I've tried as a warrior and failed and succeded keeping aggro against jarl.
When I can keep aggro I have finished jarl in 55 seconds. I have the 3 taunt skills and somehow still fail...

Solution: obviously don't nerf any class, elite is tough enough. Give warrior op taunt abilities. That's what tanks r for.

When mobs or bosses can one hit kill rogues when they can steal aggro, makes it difficult for tanks preventing deaths.

Edit: my rogue has 199.3 dmg btw

[NiN]

Yeah no nerf needed but warrior need better taunt skills or rogues need a vanish skill.
If a warrior is not able to regain aggro after 5 secs all i do is kite jarl and it works but when my finger slips.
GAME OVER NiNNY!

[primaeva]

Idea: Horn of Renew (or any other secondary) effect takes all aggro generated by each party member and redirects that amount to the warrior instead, for a duration similar to the heal over time.

This way it scales with the party and should leapfrog things quite far enough.

[ZeroBlu]

I do agree with yall but i just gotta say most warriors dont keep aggro (being one myself) because i think most ppl built their skill set for more damage...

[Montanabro]

Actually after messing around with a rogue and pulling aggro off warriors with rather less effort than on my sorc, I decided to run some tests. In about 50 Jarl runs (pug and running with a warrior who held most of my sorc aggro-- we did 1m05s Jarls before), I did not once fail to grab aggro from the warrior simply by spamming NB + AS + melee (no blades used even-- and no damage boosting pet.)

I dropped my rogues DPS to ~90 (from 150), boosted his HP to 1450, brought his armor to 440, and dropped points from Noxious Bolt to chuck into Smoke Bomb armor buff and dodge from the blades.

I ran about 30 Jarls and ended tanking about 28 of them after pulling off the aggro off the warrior and keeping my simple DPS rotation up (Noxious -> Aimed -> Melee Melee --> Noxiious --> Aimed). I kept aggro in all of these situations, and more than a few members of those groups were rather astounded that a rogue could hold aggro and survive the entire fight. Granted these were pugs, but I was running with pug-like DPS.

There IS a feeling that the top-tier warriors won't be able to keep pace with a top-tier rogue on aggro. The damage output on a single target is simply ridiculous and there aren't enough taunt cooldowns for warrs. Something needs to be done for their aggro gen. In the meantime, I'm wondering why I started with a sorcerer in the first place. It's far more fun to see a screenful of crits and three-digit figures pop up constantly on the screen.

Thank you for sharing. Do you know his build?

[Phoenician1]

Maybe I'm just not understanding the different philosophies being discussed here, but is it possible that what makes a good solo build warrior also makes him a less-useful damage sink in groups? For example, Taunt may be (and probably is) useful in a group-oriented warrior build, but for a warrior designed for soloing, it's pretty useless, isn't it? So a solo-build warrior wouldn't necessarily be useless, just less useful to your rogue than you would prefer.

[Montanabro]

Maybe I'm just not understanding the different philosophies being discussed here, but is it possible that what makes a good solo build warrior also makes him a less-useful damage sink in groups? For example, Taunt may be (and probably is) useful in a group-oriented warrior build, but for a warrior designed for soloing, it's pretty useless, isn't it? So a solo-build warrior wouldn't necessarily be useless, just less useful to your rogue than you would prefer.

Yes. In my experience there usually about 2 skills that change between a tank and DPSer. For example, if I'm soloing or level grinding in Kraag 3 I wouldn't have Horn of Renew.

[primaeva]

Thank you for sharing. Do you know his build?

Chest Splitter constantly off CD (not for disorient as he needs all the damage he can get to keep pace. He said he disorients for normal groups to reduce inc damage.)
Juggernaut up during initial seconds of the fight for maximum +str bonus.
He definitely has horn of renew as well.
And he works in smash into the rotation.

Vorpal Sword for the crit, I suppose.
Flap-Jack.

Close to 100 damage and 600+ armor, and about 2500 HP IIRC.

By the way-- I only ran with him when I was at 150~ DPS, but grabbing aggro wasn't hard at all. I only went to the 90+DPS build after he logged off, to test whether rogues could tank and hold aggro-- they most certainly can, and considering rotating between smoke bomb and blade dodge, they're quite efficient at it.

@Phoenician: There really isn't much point being a solo build once you hit cap and run elites to farm. With the possible exception of running Hauntlet for coins to get awesome pets, I can't figure out why an endgame warrior would be messing around in Kraag.

[Catwomann]

Ohk, first I am not quote versed with forums terminology so forgive me about that.

About agro( or is it aggro?), I am a rogue and I noticed that I quickly gain grab agro from a mediocre warrior, to prevent from from doing that I made another char and did some tests.

I firstly noticed that AIMED SHOT grabs agro more than NOXIOUS BOLT. Also u should keep ur dodge high as a rogue so even if u grab agro u can survive easily. At level I personally think u should have 1000-1500 health , 500-800 Intelligence. Ur dex should be very high so that ur dodge and damage is high. Also if u r so worried about deaths them always be with a warrior who has good gear and chest splitter cause that attack I think grabs agro better than any other skill in the whole game.

If u sometime accidentally grab agro, then stop attacking and try moving near ur warrior cause that is the fastest way the warrior will be able to grab agro again.

Not an expert but a pretty good player of this game.

Original acc - Catwoman - 14k+ kills, 600+ deaths.
New account - Cattwoman - 2k+ kills, 1 death.