I challenge *you*!

[Laar]

I saw Physiologics guide to the advanced mechanics of PL, it's great. Anyway, it says that crit is a percentage and increaces the # of critical hits dealt out of the hits dealt total, not the # of times you hit in total. And what I also didn't know is that according to his tests, hit% only goes so far and does NOT lower the dodge rate if you compare it to 2 hit percentages that's over 100%.

[Fear]

Hmm I might be down...

[MightyMicah]

I saw Physiologics guide to the advanced mechanics of PL, it's great. Anyway, it says that crit is a percentage and increaces the # of critical hits dealt out of the hits dealt total, not the # of times you hit in total. And what I also didn't know is that according to his tests, hit% only goes so far and does NOT lower the dodge rate if you compare it to 2 hit percentages that's over 100%.

To my knowledge solely based on experience, the higher the crit, the less chance the opposing class has of dodging. That's why custom birds are good, and that's why mages used to slaughter birds fairly easily.

[Caiahar]

I challenge you to a Pokemon battle!

Lol sorry Micah, I had to xD

[Waug]

To my knowledge solely based on experience, the higher the crit, the less chance the opposing class has of dodging. That's why custom birds are good, and that's why mages used to slaughter birds fairly easily.

Crit and dodge r different things DAT don't interact with each other.

[MightyMicah]

I challenge you to a Pokemon battle!

Lol sorry Micah, I had to xD

Haha that was the pun intended!

Crit and dodge r different things DAT don't interact with each other.

Yes they do.

[Waug]

^ lo, it does not, just prove it then,testing is quite easy just don't change other parameters while testing specially hit% keep it significantly above 100 always.

[Zeus]

To my knowledge solely based on experience, the higher the crit, the less chance the opposing class has of dodging. That's why custom birds are good, and that's why mages used to slaughter birds fairly easily.

Gaunab and I did a test on this, it has no effect.

Of course, we could be wrong, but I was also a believer to the statements that you are making.

[Hardcorexd]

One thing you got wrong is that dps doesn't equal skill dmg. Everything else is fine :P

Nope u can try it out and find out yourself this is why demonic birds have more dmg then sanguine even doe sanguine has more dmg in auto but the dps makes everything different unless your dmg is pretty pretty low

[Caiahar]

One thing you got wrong is that dps doesn't equal skill dmg. Everything else is fine :P

Nope u can try it out and find out yourself this is why demonic birds have more dmg then sanguine even doe sanguine has more dmg in auto but the dps makes everything different unless your dmg is pretty pretty low

Read Physiologics guide to PLs advanced Mechanics.
DPS and Dmg are 2 totally different things. DPS is your weapon, DMG is your Skill Dmg.
Reason why Demonic birds are good is because their range. They can keep using auto (The DPS, because its their Xbow) in compare to Sanguine birds, who have high dmg, but cannot kite as well because sanguine bow is not 12m. And the skills (Blast Shot) will take the Skill Dmg into account. The DMG on the item will affect your skills.
Thats why whenever you equip a better bow than the one you have (Such as you have a 45 cheap bow but then you get a custom recurve, your blast shot and other skills are of course more powerful.
If your weapon has a better speed (Some have 1.0 speed, some have 0.7 speed) Then your DPS (Damage per second if you hadnt know) will go up.

Ex: A bear has a normal 1H sword. His sword is 0.7 speed (example) and has decent dmg. Therefore, his DPS is higher whenever he hits opponents with swords, and his skill Stomps dmg is okay/decent.
However, if he equips a 2H sword, 1.2 speed but much higher dmg, His auto attack will be much slower, but slightly more dmg. His Stomps dmg is very high though.
Thats why at certain levels bears prefer to use a talon rather than a bow/xbow, as a talon can do more DPS over time with auto whereas a bow would have more skill dmg, but less DPS.
Wow. That was so long lol.

[Laar]

One thing you got wrong is that dps doesn't equal skill dmg. Everything else is fine :P

Nope u can try it out and find out yourself this is why demonic birds have more dmg then sanguine even doe sanguine has more dmg in auto but the dps makes everything different unless your dmg is pretty pretty low

Read Physiologics guide to PLs advanced Mechanics.
DPS and Dmg are 2 totally different things. DPS is your weapon, DMG is your Skill Dmg.
Reason why Demonic birds are good is because their range. They can keep using auto (The DPS, because its their Xbow) in compare to Sanguine birds, who have high dmg, but cannot kite as well because sanguine bow is not 12m. And the skills (Blast Shot) will take the Skill Dmg into account. The DMG on the item will affect your skills.
Thats why whenever you equip a better bow than the one you have (Such as you have a 45 cheap bow but then you get a custom recurve, your blast shot and other skills are of course more powerful.
If your weapon has a better speed (Some have 1.0 speed, some have 0.7 speed) Then your DPS (Damage per second if you hadnt know) will go up.

Ex: A bear has a normal 1H sword. His sword is 0.7 speed (example) and has decent dmg. Therefore, his DPS is higher whenever he hits opponents with swords, and his skill Stomps dmg is okay/decent.
However, if he equips a 2H sword, 1.2 speed but much higher dmg, His auto attack will be much slower, but slightly more dmg. His Stomps dmg is very high though.
Thats why at certain levels bears prefer to use a talon rather than a bow/xbow, as a talon can do more DPS over time with auto whereas a bow would have more skill dmg, but less DPS.
Wow. That was so long lol.

Very well explained. I'm glad I didn't have to type all that for him.

[Trenton]

Read Physiologics guide to PLs advanced Mechanics.
DPS and Dmg are 2 totally different things. DPS is your weapon, DMG is your Skill Dmg.
Reason why Demonic birds are good is because their range. They can keep using auto (The DPS, because its their Xbow) in compare to Sanguine birds, who have high dmg, but cannot kite as well because sanguine bow is not 12m. And the skills (Blast Shot) will take the Skill Dmg into account. The DMG on the item will affect your skills.
Thats why whenever you equip a better bow than the one you have (Such as you have a 45 cheap bow but then you get a custom recurve, your blast shot and other skills are of course more powerful.
If your weapon has a better speed (Some have 1.0 speed, some have 0.7 speed) Then your DPS (Damage per second if you hadnt know) will go up.

Ex: A bear has a normal 1H sword. His sword is 0.7 speed (example) and has decent dmg. Therefore, his DPS is higher whenever he hits opponents with swords, and his skill Stomps dmg is okay/decent.
However, if he equips a 2H sword, 1.2 speed but much higher dmg, His auto attack will be much slower, but slightly more dmg. His Stomps dmg is very high though.
Thats why at certain levels bears prefer to use a talon rather than a bow/xbow, as a talon can do more DPS over time with auto whereas a bow would have more skill dmg, but less DPS.
Wow. That was so long lol.

Yet why does demonic have more skill damage when sang has more bow damage? I know it isn't related to dps but still..

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

[Laar]

I thought bow damage and skill damage are the same thing? Doesn't bow damage affect skill damage?

[Trenton]

I thought bow damage and skill damage are the same thing? Doesn't bow damage affect skill damage?

Not according to demo and sang. Demo has more skill damage by far

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[Laar]

I thought bow damage and skill damage are the same thing? Doesn't bow damage affect skill damage?

Not according to demo and sang. Demo has more skill damage by far

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

Hmm thats confusing. Maybe the sangs auto bow damage is high but skill dmg is low? Idk

[Caiahar]

Read Physiologics guide to PLs advanced Mechanics.
DPS and Dmg are 2 totally different things. DPS is your weapon, DMG is your Skill Dmg.
Reason why Demonic birds are good is because their range. They can keep using auto (The DPS, because its their Xbow) in compare to Sanguine birds, who have high dmg, but cannot kite as well because sanguine bow is not 12m. And the skills (Blast Shot) will take the Skill Dmg into account. The DMG on the item will affect your skills.
Thats why whenever you equip a better bow than the one you have (Such as you have a 45 cheap bow but then you get a custom recurve, your blast shot and other skills are of course more powerful.
If your weapon has a better speed (Some have 1.0 speed, some have 0.7 speed) Then your DPS (Damage per second if you hadnt know) will go up.

Ex: A bear has a normal 1H sword. His sword is 0.7 speed (example) and has decent dmg. Therefore, his DPS is higher whenever he hits opponents with swords, and his skill Stomps dmg is okay/decent.
However, if he equips a 2H sword, 1.2 speed but much higher dmg, His auto attack will be much slower, but slightly more dmg. His Stomps dmg is very high though.
Thats why at certain levels bears prefer to use a talon rather than a bow/xbow, as a talon can do more DPS over time with auto whereas a bow would have more skill dmg, but less DPS.
Wow. That was so long lol.

Yet why does demonic have more skill damage when sang has more bow damage? I know it isn't related to dps but still..

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

Pls Trent don't ask me, I don't pvp at 61, you tell me.

[IGN Storm]

Is it okay if I use 51 gear on my 56? I could even respec so that my stats are identical to that of a lvl 51 bird

[MightyMicah]

Gaunab and I did a test on this, it has no effect.

Of course, we could be wrong, but I was also a believer to the statements that you are making.

It's my personal belief that there are a lot of hidden mechanics in this game. I'd be interested to see what kind of tests y'all did. I respect you both tons, but I just can't blindly accept that a mechanic I've treated as law for the past three years isn't. There's just too much that goes unexplained in my opinion.

[MightyMicah]

Read Physiologics guide to PLs advanced Mechanics.
DPS and Dmg are 2 totally different things. DPS is your weapon, DMG is your Skill Dmg.
Reason why Demonic birds are good is because their range. They can keep using auto (The DPS, because its their Xbow) in compare to Sanguine birds, who have high dmg, but cannot kite as well because sanguine bow is not 12m. And the skills (Blast Shot) will take the Skill Dmg into account. The DMG on the item will affect your skills.
Thats why whenever you equip a better bow than the one you have (Such as you have a 45 cheap bow but then you get a custom recurve, your blast shot and other skills are of course more powerful.
If your weapon has a better speed (Some have 1.0 speed, some have 0.7 speed) Then your DPS (Damage per second if you hadnt know) will go up.

Ex: A bear has a normal 1H sword. His sword is 0.7 speed (example) and has decent dmg. Therefore, his DPS is higher whenever he hits opponents with swords, and his skill Stomps dmg is okay/decent.
However, if he equips a 2H sword, 1.2 speed but much higher dmg, His auto attack will be much slower, but slightly more dmg. His Stomps dmg is very high though.
Thats why at certain levels bears prefer to use a talon rather than a bow/xbow, as a talon can do more DPS over time with auto whereas a bow would have more skill dmg, but less DPS.
Wow. That was so long lol.

Well put! I would have to say that is a rule. However, like most rules there are exceptions. And there's one small thing you didn't factor in.

That thing is critical. If you have a higher base damage (not dps) then you are capable of hitting even higher Crits. Due to the way this game's armor mechanic works, (to my knowledge) that actually is a huge deal. On the surface it seems as if this wouldn't matter but I believe this game calculates the actual damage of the skill before it subtracts the the damage mitigated by the armor.

Example:
You have 100 base damage, and your opponent has 50 armor.
When you shoot, you'll deal 50 damage, unless you crit, in which case you'll do 150 damage. (200-50 mitigated by armor)
Now suppose you have a weapon twice as fast with half the damage.
You have 50 base damage and your opponent still has 50 armor.
When you shoot, you'll deal 0 damage, except when you crit, in which case you'll deal 50.
However, because your weapon is twice as fast you can pull off two attacks which means you'll deal 100 damage assuming they both crit. That's still less than before. In this case, it would be better to choose the one with higher base damage.

Now, I'm aware that armor (and crit I think) doesn't work quite how I displayed in the example, but the concept behind it still remains. Also there are some weird weapons that for whatever reason have higher skill damage than others that have greater dps/base damage. An example would be the L30 banjo hammer deal compared to the L30 iceberg frozen long sword.

Anyways...

[Zeus]

It's my personal belief that there are a lot of hidden mechanics in this game. I'd be interested to see what kind of tests y'all did. I respect you both tons, but I just can't blindly accept that a mechanic I've treated as law for the past three years isn't. There's just too much that goes unexplained in my opinion.

Mages have over 100% critical, so we tested on a bear (me) the ability of a mage (gaunub) to hit through a bear's dodge. The results were roughly the same unbuffed or buffed on 100 attacks with a 2-3% difference at most.