Suggestion: Nerf gold income in Gauntlet

[ForumJunkie]

jajajaja wdf this man doesn't know how exactly must be, a little mistake in high wave and again wave 1, hedo is no hard to do, just wait his few seconds and hit zzZ


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This is the problem. Why do you guys think Gauntlet is hard? Yes, it's hard to find and get a decent geared, and knowledgeable player to clear a room by themselves and finish off the boss so that it is more efficient to run the gauntlet map and earn faster gold, but once you bypass that issue it all becomes too easy to farm in Gauntlet (just like any other map).

Yes, there are more risks with Gauntlet than Hedo, but if you have an OP party who knows what they are doing, that risk becomes lower and easier to avoid. The LB board shows this result and is proven by OP parties.


And oh, I was meming with the GIF. You completely missed the point of that post.

Maybe because you used Google Translate like MrWoon when reading my post.

[ForumJunkie]

3-4 waves in gaunt if u compare to 1 run in hedo? wdf .-. make a video and post ur link here, i bet ur truth


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Yes, it takes about 48 secs - 1 minute and (x) secs to finish 1 Hedo run. That's roughly 3-4 gauntlet runs if we are going to take the 25-26 secs that the people above have provided.

Keep in mind that some players can do both Gauntlet and Hedo portals faster with a full damage boost party and almost Spectral/HBBD-level gears.

[recilencia123]

This is the problem. Why do you guys think Gauntlet is hard? Yes, it's hard to find and get a decent geared, and knowledgeable player to clear a room by themselves and finish off the boss so that it is more efficient to run the gauntlet map and earn faster gold, but once you bypass that issue it all becomes too easy to farm in Gauntlet (just like any other map).

Yes, there are more risks with Gauntlet than Hedo, but if you have an OP party who knows what they are doing, that risk becomes lower and easier to avoid. The LB board shows this result and is proven by OP parties.


And oh, I was meming with the GIF. You completely missed the point of that post.

Maybe because you used Google Translate like MrWoon when reading my post.

You talk as if it were easy in wave 180 or more, for example being war you must do the proc activation well otherwise you will die from the massive damage of the mobs, and be careful that they do not give you that damage reduction or armor reduction and if you They give damage reduction, you will not be able to kill the mini and your friends when coming to the dragon can die since the damage it does is high, then once on the dragon you must taunt and be precise in the seconds if you spend a second the dragon will kill you being war and being with your gl active, a failure in high wave is a high possibility of dying, it is not as easy to kill in wave 4 or 10 than in 200 or 210 ._.
and sorry i didnt know ur omnipotent and see me using google translator


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[recilencia123]

Yes, it takes about 48 secs - 1 minute and (x) secs to finish 1 Hedo run. That's roughly 3-4 gauntlet runs if we are going to take the 25-26 secs that the people above have provided.

Keep in mind that some players can do both Gauntlet and Hedo portals faster with a full damage boost party and almost Spectral/HBBD-level gears.

im gonna take minim
25+25=50
hedo min is 48 ,
now max
26+26=52
hedo max 1 min
and u say 3-4 waves in ezg per one hedo apart of hedo remap is so fast with quest and ezg again wave 1 to 14 is no dragon


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[ForumJunkie]

Your whole point is that elite 81 wave map grants more gold than normal portal boss 86 map (and we alrdy discussed it). Normal hedourah is a type of a map which is closer to raha (by mechanics) than gauntlet. Does normal hedo grants more gold than normal rahab? Definitely yes. Does it grants more gold than elite rahab? From my experience, yes. Does it grant more gold than Gauntlet? No. What we should do now? Wait until devs release elite hedourah (or 86 wave map).

No, the point was that the Hedo map earns less gold compared to Gauntlet per hour. I am not talking about the drops. I know Hedo drops more than Gauntlet, but if we are skipping mini in Gauntlet and just talking about killing the boss to get faster runs in Gauntlet, then Gauntlet will earn more per hour than Hedo.

The point of my original post is per-hour earning potential, not the gold drop per boss run.

Yes, I guess I should just keep farming this broken gold farm zone (Gauntlet) until it gets nerfed.

Hedo op awaks - I let the rogs/sorcs with ~2k stats sets do p2 of hedo. With h sabra and lege sabra they were able to instaproc at p2 and finish it before proc gone. P1 actually was done by me and ~2.3k stat rog and we were doing it easily without much waiting for reduc gone too. With waiting, 2ppl with 2k stats should do p1 easily by looking at fact that I can do p1 solo with waiting.
EZG strategy - I said before that EZG isn't a hard map to run when you know how, but actually saving armor for boss isn't the only thing we do. It still needs more strategy and effort than raha/hedo.

And you still did 45 seconds with this party composition? Only a yes or no, please. Thank you.

"He's not lying" - "I am not saying it's not easy to run the Gauntlet portal." - you basically said that, which would mean that you actually think that Gauntlet needs some effort and then you agree with your friend who said that gaunt is easy.

To clarify, what I mean, it's not easy to run the Gauntlet portal if you do not have the gear, party, and knowledge. Once you have those three things, it becomes easy just like any other map.

Is gauntlet boring? For me it is up to 150 wave. But hedo and raha are even more boring than that.

I see.

Selective pt - yeah, it's normal that people who can run 1 map are more selective. Thing is that you mentioned gaunt farm per hour as a value for the people who are selective with their pt (heck I never made 11m+ in an hour as far as i remember, sorc struggles with gl on mini). Most people actually earn way less than that or they don't even run that map, cause they can't/no one good wants them in pt. How many active GOOD gauntlet runners are playing - not much. Hedo value 4-7m/h is probably for randoms too. I get 8m/h easily there with mid pt, with good pt could even try to hit 9m/h (8.5m/h is easily achievable). Ofc I have op gl, but my point is that difference between gaunt and normal hedo isnt that collosal as you said at the beginning.

This is a good argument. Just an FYI. I know your gold loot stat (roughly) judging by your income in Gauntlet. Mine is slightly higher since I am earning more than you (my intention is not to shame or flex here). If you are curious how much gl I have, I am more than willing to send that info via PM.

Arrogant - it's not a false, I'm usually not serious with that. Guess just some people can't realize that I'm joking (at least with stronger players, with weaker players who say that they can play X map and then it turns out that they're completely bad - I can actually be bit more serious, but I had a reason in that case, cause someone lied to me).

Fair point. I hope that's the truth.

High waves/lb runs - actions speak louder than words. I don't care about any self-proclaims, cause basically everyone can say what he wants. If you think you can keep 15-19s waves, rarely miss gl on boss and run high waves -
ok, you can think like that, but for now you didn't prove it, so these words are meaningless.

I am open to doing some tests. Feel free to leave a message in the forum, and I will add you once I get your permission.

I didn't run rahab for a bit? Actually, I ran it few times, when I was desperate to run anything for gold, but had no people for gaunt. Afaik, current mini killers proc boss killer weapons on raha and then kill mini with that, so they can do damage to raha with procs tick too. Yeah, it was found long time ago, nothing new (wonder if some people still preproc at p1 and wait until mini killer kills mini fast, so they dont need to proc at p2). And yeah, I still managed to get more from hedo.
Can do gaunt faster than raha? Ofc, but you said you can do 3-4 waves at that time, which isn't true. EZG is better, but that map requires more from you.

The point of my original post is Gauntlet vs Hedo. Not Gauntlet vs Rahab. But thanks for the input.

"Assuming that rest of the player base is dumb" - well, basing on what I seen, I can say that other people on average have less knowledge about maps and finding strategies/tricks to make runs better. Maybe it sounds arrogant, but that's actually a fact and facts don't care about someones feelings.

You are comparing low/average players to yourself. Of course they will have weaker gears and less knowledge compared to you. You are not on their level. Well, this is just an advice, but maybe humble yourself a bit and stop belittling players even if it's a joke. Showing some empathy or some sympathy as well?

Maybe then players would be more, I don't know, more nicer to you? You may not believe this, but jokes are half-meant.

That Cinco's message was sent exactly 1.5 months ago, it's not that old.

Okay, good. Thanks for clarifying.

I want to know what the developers have to say about this now though.

[ForumJunkie]

As long as is not easy(need strategy) and not everyone can do it, gauntlet is fine. You need to focus on gauntlet. You can semi afk on e rahab/Hedourah.
How are you saying that ezg is the same to ERahabkor/Hedourah when 50% of the time you are just standing and you can still get gold when you die.
It's hard to find party on ezg (if you are talking about 9m per hr and after 1-2 run mostly people is done running). On the other hand finding party on e rahab and Hedourah is easy and you can farm gold early.

Op player prefer to play gauntlet because E rahab/Hedourah is boring.

You completely missed the point of my original post as well.

Furthermore, what is fun and what is boring is again subjective. And again, not the point of my original post.

[ForumJunkie]

At this point, I will ignore any comments/posts/responses that have nothing to do with the original point of my post.

I may humor some of it, but for the most part, I will start labeling it as a 'free bump.' Because I already wasted half of my day entertaining this nonsense and repeating the same thing repeatedly.

And, oh, it would be nice to get a developer to respond in this thread. An input from a dev would be much appreciated. Thank you.

[ForumJunkie]

Just throwing this in here from my "test" on hedo. With a decent not super op party 2.2k 2.4k 2.6k 3.2k stats I made 12.4M in 1 hr 26min on hedo. Looted 9 elders worth 100kea. I'm not stirring this pot I'm only putting my numbers in here. Yes I see were Gaunt can make more gold per hr but 1 mistake and it might not. Honestly now I see it as a little more risk little more reward and that seems fair.

Thank you for the input, Ultrarun. This info is actually accurate and more believable IMO.

If you don't mind me asking, how much is your gold loot? It's okay if you are not comfortable sharing here publicly. You can PM me in the forum.

And yes, you are right, Gauntlet can earn more but with one mistake it's all over. But that's rarely an issue with OP parties that you always play with (yes, it still happens, but less likely compared to pt randoms/pubs).

Still, the point of my original post is that Gauntlet earns more than Hedo, which you soft-vouch for with your statement above.

[AgentStonoga]

No, the point was that the Hedo map earns less gold compared to Gauntlet per hour. I am not talking about the drops. I know Hedo drops more than Gauntlet, but if we are skipping mini in Gauntlet and just talking about killing the boss to get faster runs in Gauntlet, then Gauntlet will earn more per hour than Hedo.

The point of my original post is per-hour earning potential, not the gold drop per boss run.

Yes, I guess I should just keep farming this broken gold farm zone (Gauntlet) until it gets nerfed.



And you still did 45 seconds with this party composition? Only a yes or no, please. Thank you.



To clarify, what I mean, it's not easy to run the Gauntlet portal if you do not have the gear, party, and knowledge. Once you have those three things, it becomes easy just like any other map.



I see.



This is a good argument. Just an FYI. I know your gold loot stat (roughly) judging by your income in Gauntlet. Mine is slightly higher since I am earning more than you (my intention is not to shame or flex here). If you are curious how much gl I have, I am more than willing to send that info via PM.



Fair point. I hope that's the truth.



I am open to doing some tests. Feel free to leave a message in the forum, and I will add you once I get your permission.



The point of my original post is Gauntlet vs Hedo. Not Gauntlet vs Rahab. But thanks for the input.



You are comparing low/average players to yourself. Of course they will have weaker gears and less knowledge compared to you. You are not on their level. Well, this is just an advice, but maybe humble yourself a bit and stop belittling players even if it's a joke. Showing some empathy or some sympathy as well?

Maybe then players would be more, I don't know, more nicer to you? You may not believe this, but jokes are half-meant.



Okay, good. Thanks for clarifying.

I want to know what the developers have to say about this now though.

"No, the point was that the Hedo map earns less gold compared to Gauntlet per hour. I am not talking about the drops." - that's basically what I meant. Gauntlet gets you more gold than hour than hedourah, but the point is that gauntlet is an elite wave map and hedourah is just a normal boss map. Gauntlet requires more thinking (even tho it's still not much) than hedo and better gears and spending more time to get a pt and connections with runners - many other sorcerers which didn't build connections with other runners can't run gaunt as "often" as me with good rogs and wars, cause I already made connections with runners and they know that I usually can handle good farm runs. I had to spend time for building that connection, where on hedo you can basically get random people with kraken set and just 2k stat to run it.
I don't think that I can make 45-50s with 2k stats people, but 50-55s should still be possible if they're joining fast enough to my remap.
Three things - yeah, gauntlet isn't a hard map when you have these 3 things, but actually getting all of these 3 things isn't easy, it requires some effort, especially getting a good pt if you want to run hauntlet for the whole day.
Party - didn't you say that you alr got pt for gaunt? Anyway, if you're a rog/war (both recommended with glint set, for rog it's a must have), you can add me in game.
Humbling myself a bit - I actually know my place. I usually have more knowledge about average players (and average players with good gears), but I have less knowledge than people who are on the very top - and I'm fully aware of that. Main difference is that I'm not complaining on forum that some map grants more benefits than other maps (i mostly complain when something is actually unfair, like new pets for example). Instead of that, I just want to know how to imprpve myself to benefit more than average players and when I'm able to do that - I ask top players for advices, watch how they run these maps, trying to find out something about map etc, so it let me to be better at x map. That's a thing which usually upset me - people who are complaining insread of trying to imprpve themself (merchants with lots of saved gold complaining about gold farming maps are giving me headache too, but that's a different thing).

[ForumJunkie]

"No, the point was that the Hedo map earns less gold compared to Gauntlet per hour. I am not talking about the drops." - that's basically what I meant. Gauntlet gets you more gold than hour than hedourah, but the point is that gauntlet is an elite wave map and hedourah is just a normal boss map.

Thank you for clarifying what you meant and admitting that Gauntlet does INDEED earn more gold an hour than Hedourah lair. With that being said, the 'gauntlet being elite and hedo being normal' argument is not the main highlight of my original post. The main point of my original post is the fact Gauntlet is earning more per hour than Hedo by a huge amount, which you confirmed yourself with the statement above.

Gauntlet requires more thinking (even tho it's still not much) than hedo and better gears and spending more time to get a pt and connections with runners - many other sorcerers which didn't build connections with other runners can't run gaunt as "often" as me with good rogs and wars, cause I already made connections with runners and they know that I usually can handle good farm runs. I had to spend time for building that connection, where on hedo you can basically get random people with kraken set and just 2k stat to run it.

Yes, you are correct. It does require more thought processes than Hedo, but not by much (like you said yourself above). Again, this post is not about your capability as a player, how good your gears are, how much time you've dedicated to getting the appropriate gears, or how you do in team play. The idea of the original post is that I wanted to highlight that Gauntlet earns more gold per hour than Hedo (which you already admitted above).

I don't think that I can make 45-50s with 2k stats people, but 50-55s should still be possible if they're joining fast enough to my remap.
Three things - yeah, gauntlet isn't a hard map when you have these 3 things, but actually getting all of these 3 things isn't easy, it requires some effort, especially getting a good pt if you want to run hauntlet for the whole day.

Thank you. 50-55 secs is more reasonable than 45 secs. I will admit that it is not easy to get a party going for the gauntlet portal, but, that's only at the beginning. Once you get enough contacts in your friend list, your choices of who you can run with are endless (but that's just me. It might be different for you).

Party - didn't you say that you alr got pt for gaunt? Anyway, if you're a rog/war (both recommended with glint set, for rog it's a must have), you can add me in game.

Unfortunately, I am neither of those two classes.

Humbling myself a bit - I actually know my place. I usually have more knowledge about average players (and average players with good gears), but I have less knowledge than people who are on the very top - and I'm fully aware of that.

Respectfully, I doubt you are aware sometimes that you come off as condescending or arrogant to other people. Although, it is nice to see you change and admit that you do not know everything. This is some character development.

Main difference is that I'm not complaining on forum that some map grants more benefits than other maps (i mostly complain when something is actually unfair, like new pets for example).

So, if a farming map is broken (in terms of gold farm) and grants an unfair advantage over other farming maps, you would not file a complaint because it benefits you, right? That's what I understood from this statement.

That said, the right course of action for this issue is to have everyone get involved in a discussion. Get everyone's opinion and make a decision base on that.

Furthermore, I appreciate you giving an example of what you think is fair and unfair, but pet balancing and gold farm maps issues are different.

Instead of that, I just want to know how to imprpve myself to benefit more than average players and when I'm able to do that - I ask top players for advices, watch how they run these maps, trying to find out something about map etc, so it let me to be better at x map.

Good for you that you are trying to improve yourself more and expand your learning more about this game.

I genuinely respect you for being very hardworking and putting in a lot of passion in this game. By the way, just a friendly note, this is not sarcasm.

[OdenTheJust]

New person in the thread wanting to share his opinion. I think that EZG gold should not be nerfed, at least not yet. Here is why. You stated in the beginning that EZG needs one of each class and the party needs to have good gear and good coordination to get to higher waves. I agree 100% with this and I think that is why it needs to not be nerfed. The game needs more places like this that reward players for coordination and teamwork and each class type serves a purpose. If all the best gold loot places were just boss only maps then why would anyone want to play as a warrior? It takes significantly higher quality gear for a warrior to be helpful in these maps and could be way more useful to the party if the war just switched to rogue. Maps like EZG increase the value of each class because only one class is allowed into each map and each person contributes to the overall goal. I will say that once the new maps and new portals are out that I agree it makes more sense that EZG should not be the most profitable place. One the elite maps are released they should either make more gold than EZG or EZG should receive a nerf to incentivize players to farm the new maps.

[ForumJunkie]

New person in the thread wanting to share his opinion. I think that EZG gold should not be nerfed, at least not yet. Here is why. You stated in the beginning that EZG needs one of each class and the party needs to have good gear and good coordination to get to higher waves. I agree 100% with this and I think that is why it needs to not be nerfed. The game needs more places like this that reward players for coordination and teamwork and each class type serves a purpose. If all the best gold loot places were just boss only maps then why would anyone want to play as a warrior? It takes significantly higher quality gear for a warrior to be helpful in these maps and could be way more useful to the party if the war just switched to rogue. Maps like EZG increase the value of each class because only one class is allowed into each map and each person contributes to the overall goal. I will say that once the new maps and new portals are out that I agree it makes more sense that EZG should not be the most profitable place. One the elite maps are released they should either make more gold than EZG or EZG should receive a nerf to incentivize players to farm the new maps.

I appreciate your kind, respectful, and thoughtful response and the perspective you bring to the discussion. It's clear that you value the uniqueness of the EZG (Elite Zodias Gaunt) and its rewarding nature when it comes to coordination, teamwork, and class diversity. You make some valid points about why it might not be the right time to nerf its gold income.

The idea that each class type serves a purpose and contributes to the overall success of the party in the EZG is a strong argument for maintaining its current gold income. This does indeed add value to each class, making players think strategically about class choices and gear optimizations. It's a unique aspect of the game that promotes diversity and cooperation.

You also bring up a crucial point about future updates and new maps. Once the new maps and portals are introduced, it's reasonable to expect that they should offer competitive or even better gold rewards compared to the EZG. This would encourage players to explore new content and keep the game fresh.

In light of this, it may be wise for developers to balance the gold income across different maps and portals as they expand the game. This could include either making the new maps more lucrative or considering a nerf to the EZG to incentivize players to explore the new content.

Your perspective highlights the importance of maintaining the distinct qualities of different maps while ensuring a balanced and engaging gaming experience. It's a valuable contribution to the ongoing discussion about game balance, and I hope the developers take these considerations into account when planning future updates.

Thank you for sharing your viewpoint.

[Ilove_Poopoo]

Only like 2 people in the game with 1.2k+ gl sets are capable of earning 13m per hour. Not just gl but the specific team required.

Hedorah is a braindead kind of map, literally just stands on the boss and spam. So it serves right that it should be earning less than Gauntlet.

Devs fault Elderwoods is dead, they offer nothing new of value. Nerfing gauntlet won't make people suddenly play Elderwoods.

Hedorah opens once every 3 days - and for the time it is closed, the game temporarily dies of activity. So, for the meantime Gauntlet is another map that keeps players occupied in the game. Shouldn't be nerfing maps without implementing a backup.

Vast majority of farmers are farming Elite Rahab/Hedorah considering how restrictive and hard it is to efficiently farm Gauntlet. I'll make the claim that most of the gold farmed attributed to inflation actually came from Elite Rahab/Hedorah, and not Gauntlet.

So... if you worry about inflation so much, wouldn't it be better to nerf Elite Rahab and Hedorah instead? I hope Cinco can release the stats of how much gold is farmed from Rahab, Hedorah, Gauntlet.

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[ForumJunkie]

Only like 2 people in the game with 1.2k+ gl sets are capable of earning 13m per hour. Not just gl but the specific team required.

Hedorah is a braindead kind of map, literally just stands on the boss and spam. So it serves right that it should be earning less than Gauntlet.

Devs fault Elderwoods is dead, they offer nothing new of value. Nerfing gauntlet won't make people suddenly play Elderwoods.

Hedorah opens once every 3 days - and for the time it is closed, the game temporarily dies of activity. So, for the meantime Gauntlet is another map that keeps players occupied in the game. Shouldn't be nerfing maps without implementing a backup.

Vast majority of farmers are farming Elite Rahab/Hedorah considering how restrictive and hard it is to efficiently farm Gauntlet. I'll make the claim that most of the gold farmed attributed to inflation actually came from Elite Rahab/Hedorah, and not Gauntlet.

So... if you worry about inflation so much, wouldn't it be better to nerf Elite Rahab and Hedorah instead? I hope Cinco can release the stats of how much gold is farmed from Rahab, Hedorah, Gauntlet.

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Thank you for your thoughtful reply. I appreciate the insight you've brought to this discussion, and I'd like to address a few points you raised:

1. Specific Players Earning High Gold: You mentioned that only around 2 players (I know one of them is you, Spectral) with 1.2k+ gl sets can earn up to 13m per hour. It's essential to realize that while this might be true, these individuals can still heavily influence the economy. Over time, even a small number of players accumulating vast wealth can create imbalances.

2. Nature of Hedorah Map: I understand your sentiment about Hedorah being a simpler map, and if that's the consensus, it does make sense for it to earn less. However, my main point was the disparity in earnings between Gauntlet and Hedorah. If the Gauntlet is too rewarding, it might disincentivize players from exploring other areas.

3. Elderwoods and Game Activity: I agree with you that Elderwoods has not brought the desired value to the game, leading to decreased activity. My suggestion wasn't to nerf the Gauntlet without providing alternatives. Instead, I believe that balancing gold earnings can be part of a broader strategy to keep all areas of the game active and appealing.

4. Elite Rahab/Hedorah Farming: It's an interesting point you bring up about the source of inflation being primarily from Elite Rahab and Hedorah. If these are indeed the significant sources of gold influx, then it would make sense to review their gold drop rates. I would also be keen to see the stats released by Cinco to get a clearer picture.

5. Nerfing Maps and Game Activity: Your point about not nerfing maps without a backup is valid. We wouldn't want to create gaps in player activity. My hope is that by discussing this, we can find a balanced solution that keeps the game engaging and economically stable.

To conclude, my main goal is to ensure the longevity and health of the game's economy. I believe we both want the same thing, which is the best for the game and its community. Thank you for engaging in this discussion, and I look forward to further constructive conversations on this topic.

[AgentStonoga]

Thank you for clarifying what you meant and admitting that Gauntlet does INDEED earn more gold an hour than Hedourah lair. With that being said, the 'gauntlet being elite and hedo being normal' argument is not the main highlight of my original post. The main point of my original post is the fact Gauntlet is earning more per hour than Hedo by a huge amount, which you confirmed yourself with the statement above.



Yes, you are correct. It does require more thought processes than Hedo, but not by much (like you said yourself above). Again, this post is not about your capability as a player, how good your gears are, how much time you've dedicated to getting the appropriate gears, or how you do in team play. The idea of the original post is that I wanted to highlight that Gauntlet earns more gold per hour than Hedo (which you already admitted above).



Thank you. 50-55 secs is more reasonable than 45 secs. I will admit that it is not easy to get a party going for the gauntlet portal, but, that's only at the beginning. Once you get enough contacts in your friend list, your choices of who you can run with are endless (but that's just me. It might be different for you).



Unfortunately, I am neither of those two classes.



Respectfully, I doubt you are aware sometimes that you come off as condescending or arrogant to other people. Although, it is nice to see you change and admit that you do not know everything. This is some character development.



So, if a farming map is broken (in terms of gold farm) and grants an unfair advantage over other farming maps, you would not file a complaint because it benefits you, right? That's what I understood from this statement.

That said, the right course of action for this issue is to have everyone get involved in a discussion. Get everyone's opinion and make a decision base on that.

Furthermore, I appreciate you giving an example of what you think is fair and unfair, but pet balancing and gold farm maps issues are different.



Good for you that you are trying to improve yourself more and expand your learning more about this game.

I genuinely respect you for being very hardworking and putting in a lot of passion in this game. By the way, just a friendly note, this is not sarcasm.

Huge difference? I usually get no more than 25% more gold on gaunt than on hedo. Is that a noticeable difference? Yes. Is that a huge difference? No.
Is that wrong that Gauntlet earns more than Hedo, considering what you actually have to do to run "normal" gaunt runs and what you need to run Hedourah? From my thinking, the map which requires more from you should grant you more gold.
Choices - as I said before, if I had endless choices then I wouldn't spam in vault with every portal that I need someone (usually war) to join my pt - and I'm actually a person with decent connections and I still have to do that with every gaunt portal. Had plenty of situations where I was waiting in vault for like 1-2h with hope that someone will login to game, so I can run with him - and after that amount of time I was going off, cause none of my friends entered game. Even when someone enters game I have to pm him fast, because other good mage can steal him for his pt (happened plenty of times). Ofc I have situations where I have like 2-3 wars and rogs to run with, but situations when there's no war or rog to pt happens too, basically on every opened portal. Wasting 2h just to get 2h gaunt run vs 4h hedo or even e rahab run - I'm pretty sure that 4h these 4h of running hedo/e raha would benefit you more. Also, gaunt runs are more exhausting, after op run all people usually take some break, where on e raha/hedo people usually run till they're bored.
(I never changed, I was always like that lol)
"So, if a farming map is broken (in terms of gold farm) and grants an unfair advantage over other farming maps, you would not file a complaint because it benefits you, right?" - as basically stated many times, it's not an unfair advantage, considering how much effort you have to put to actually run it comparing it to raha/hedo.
Benefits me -Personal thing starts
I started as an average noob with just mid-decent gear at the beginning and I wasn't able to run most op e rahab runs with most op people at the beginning. I wasn't mad that better players were making more than me (one of them even replied in your thread), I was just curious how they were able to do that, so I could improve myself and start running best runs. Another example was with first hours of first hedo portal, where people with op mythic sets and mythic boss killer weapons were killing hedo in 1 proc (before realizing that kraken was able to do that too) - it obviously pissed me off that I can't do that, but instead of complaining in forum I was considering to sell my krak set and buy mythic set, so I could use hyperos (despite joking that I would ask Cinco to nerf hyperos dmg).
I wasn't able to run good gaunt runs for a long time, it actually took me a pretty long time to learn (I'm slow at learning) how to not die at wave 60 and how to save armor proc (ofc now we do more things than just saving armor, but thats how it started), but I didn't complain that others were making more gold than me, I just wanted to be able to farm like these people. With lots of practice and tips from other people, I just finally learned how to run it (and helped plenty of people with improving their gaunt after this).
So yeah, I'm actually trying to catch top players and play like them (at least on farm maps, cause for now im not interested in lb/timeds/pvp etc) instead of complaining at something which can be solved (by getting more connections/learning strategy/upgrading gear etc) without devs "help".

[ForumJunkie]

Huge difference? I usually get no more than 25% more gold on gaunt than on hedo. Is that a noticeable difference? Yes. Is that a huge difference? No.
Is that wrong that Gauntlet earns more than Hedo, considering what you actually have to do to run "normal" gaunt runs and what you need to run Hedourah? From my thinking, the map which requires more from you should grant you more gold.
Choices - as I said before, if I had endless choices then I wouldn't spam in vault with every portal that I need someone (usually war) to join my pt - and I'm actually a person with decent connections and I still have to do that with every gaunt portal. Had plenty of situations where I was waiting in vault for like 1-2h with hope that someone will login to game, so I can run with him - and after that amount of time I was going off, cause none of my friends entered game. Even when someone enters game I have to pm him fast, because other good mage can steal him for his pt (happened plenty of times). Ofc I have situations where I have like 2-3 wars and rogs to run with, but situations when there's no war or rog to pt happens too, basically on every opened portal. Wasting 2h just to get 2h gaunt run vs 4h hedo or even e rahab run - I'm pretty sure that 4h these 4h of running hedo/e raha would benefit you more. Also, gaunt runs are more exhausting, after op run all people usually take some break, where on e raha/hedo people usually run till they're bored.
(I never changed, I was always like that lol)
"So, if a farming map is broken (in terms of gold farm) and grants an unfair advantage over other farming maps, you would not file a complaint because it benefits you, right?" - as basically stated many times, it's not an unfair advantage, considering how much effort you have to put to actually run it comparing it to raha/hedo.
Benefits me -Personal thing starts
I started as an average noob with just mid-decent gear at the beginning and I wasn't able to run most op e rahab runs with most op people at the beginning. I wasn't mad that better players were making more than me (one of them even replied in your thread), I was just curious how they were able to do that, so I could improve myself and start running best runs. Another example was with first hours of first hedo portal, where people with op mythic sets and mythic boss killer weapons were killing hedo in 1 proc (before realizing that kraken was able to do that too) - it obviously pissed me off that I can't do that, but instead of complaining in forum I was considering to sell my krak set and buy mythic set, so I could use hyperos (despite joking that I would ask Cinco to nerf hyperos dmg).
I wasn't able to run good gaunt runs for a long time, it actually took me a pretty long time to learn (I'm slow at learning) how to not die at wave 60 and how to save armor proc (ofc now we do more things than just saving armor, but thats how it started), but I didn't complain that others were making more gold than me, I just wanted to be able to farm like these people. With lots of practice and tips from other people, I just finally learned how to run it (and helped plenty of people with improving their gaunt after this).
So yeah, I'm actually trying to catch top players and play like them (at least on farm maps, cause for now im not interested in lb/timeds/pvp etc) instead of complaining at something which can be solved (by getting more connections/learning strategy/upgrading gear etc) without devs "help".

I see where you're coming from, especially with the assertion about the 25% gold difference between Gauntlet and Hedo Lair. While this might not seem monumental in isolated runs, over extended play sessions and for the broader player base, it accumulates and can indeed lead to perceptible imbalances in the game's economy.

I recognize your dedication and the effort you've invested in mastering the Gauntlet. Your experiences in waiting for team members, competing for top players, and your journey of growth in the game are both commendable and insightful. I never meant to undermine that.

To revisit my initial post's intent: the issue isn't solely about the percentage difference in gold but about the larger implications it presents for game balance and participation. The suggestion to potentially adjust Gauntlet's rewards wasn't meant to discount the efforts of skilled players but to foster an environment where both the new content (like Hedo Lair) and the established ones (like Gauntlet) can coexist without one overshadowing the other significantly.

Your perspective on this matter, rooted in personal experience, is valued. However, we should also be cognizant of the broader game community's experience. Balancing aims to ensure a harmonious and equitable experience for everyone, from the elite players to those just beginning their journey.

I respect your resilience and approach to challenges, but my initial post came from a place of concern for the game's overall health and longevity. I hope we can continue discussing this in a constructive manner, valuing each other's insights and experiences.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, and I'm eager to hear more from you on this topic.


EDIT:

This is not relevant to my response to you, but I forgot to mention in my original post and I would like to just point it out that the reason why I earn 7m per hour in Hedo is because I use damage elixirs to speed up the the runs by having more burst damage potential. If I don't buy the elixirs, I roughly earn 8.5-9m (not counting loot since it only became valuable when the Halloween event came). In gauntlet, I roughly earn 12.5-13m (not entirely sure how much if loots are added) per hour.

This is with a gold loot of 1335% gl. With a full gl team, this can be boosted up to 1485% gl , but I am not going to use that because I rarely get this sort of team.

So, if we take the lowest value of gold farmed per hour and multiply that by 10 hours:

8.5 x 10 = 85m

12.5 x 10 = 125m

Low/High drops and missed gl drops calculated.

That's a 40m difference. That is huge. That's roughly 4.5 hours of farming time saved by running the gauntlet and not Hedo.

Furthermore, HBBD (a well-known OP war who runs the gauntlet portal often) told me that 5 hours for him in the gauntlet is 50m. He also mentioned that Hedo and Rahab are slower than Gauntlet and that Gauntlet Portal is far better. From what I recall, his gl is around 1100% gold loot.

[FrankfurtHBF]

Huge difference? I usually get no more than 25% more gold on gaunt than on hedo. Is that a noticeable difference?

Hedo value 4-7m/h is probably for randoms too. I get 8m/h easily there with mid pt, with good pt could even try to hit 9m/h (8.5m/h is easily achievable).

You mentioned that you farm ~8m/hour on Hedo with a mid-party. In Gauntlet it's ~10m/hour(of course, with that extra 25% loot difference you pointed out earlier). So, over 10 hours in the Gauntlet, you're making ~100 million and on Hedo it's ~80 million. That ~20m gap equals more than 2 hours of farming, which is such a colossal waste, don't you think? I say approximately because the 25% loot difference you’ve mentioned is slowly growing every time you loot gold according to the law of iterated expectation.

We conducted a test, and our results showed 9m/hour in Hedo and 13m/hour in Gauntlet. Again, these aren't approximate figures like the ones you threw out. These are meticulously calculated results. In our case, that's ~90m over 10 hours on Hedo compared to ~130 million in Gauntlet. That's a ~40 million gap, which can be converted into 4.5 hours of additional farm, based on our data. So, to reach the same gold amount on Hedo, I'll have to endure an extra 4.5 hours (assuming a 10-hour distance). Our calculations were conducted with 3k+ primary stat players and 1335gl set.

[ForumJunkie]

It would be nice to get input from a representative of STS or the developing team to share their thoughts or opinions on this.

This post has gathered 1.2+k views (more than the feedback Halloween Week 2 thread), and no STS representative or developer has made their presence known yet.

You can't simply lurk around. And, oh, it looks like there's some sort of discord group for Arcane Legends that I am unaware of. Can someone send me a link to that group so I can participate in that discussion, too?

I would much appreciate it. Thank you.

[AgentStonoga]

I see where you're coming from, especially with the assertion about the 25% gold difference between Gauntlet and Hedo Lair. While this might not seem monumental in isolated runs, over extended play sessions and for the broader player base, it accumulates and can indeed lead to perceptible imbalances in the game's economy.

I recognize your dedication and the effort you've invested in mastering the Gauntlet. Your experiences in waiting for team members, competing for top players, and your journey of growth in the game are both commendable and insightful. I never meant to undermine that.

To revisit my initial post's intent: the issue isn't solely about the percentage difference in gold but about the larger implications it presents for game balance and participation. The suggestion to potentially adjust Gauntlet's rewards wasn't meant to discount the efforts of skilled players but to foster an environment where both the new content (like Hedo Lair) and the established ones (like Gauntlet) can coexist without one overshadowing the other significantly.

Your perspective on this matter, rooted in personal experience, is valued. However, we should also be cognizant of the broader game community's experience. Balancing aims to ensure a harmonious and equitable experience for everyone, from the elite players to those just beginning their journey.

I respect your resilience and approach to challenges, but my initial post came from a place of concern for the game's overall health and longevity. I hope we can continue discussing this in a constructive manner, valuing each other's insights and experiences.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, and I'm eager to hear more from you on this topic.


EDIT:

This is not relevant to my response to you, but I forgot to mention in my original post and I would like to just point it out that the reason why I earn 7m per hour in Hedo is because I use damage elixirs to speed up the the runs by having more burst damage potential. If I don't buy the elixirs, I roughly earn 8.5-9m (not counting loot since it only became valuable when the Halloween event came). In gauntlet, I roughly earn 12.5-13m (not entirely sure how much if loots are added) per hour.

This is with a gold loot of 1335% gl. With a full gl team, this can be boosted up to 1485% gl , but I am not going to use that because I rarely get this sort of team.

So, if we take the lowest value of gold farmed per hour and multiply that by 10 hours:

8.5 x 10 = 85m

12.5 x 10 = 125m

Low/High drops and missed gl drops calculated.

That's a 40m difference. That is huge. That's roughly 4.5 hours of farming time saved by running the gauntlet and not Hedo.

Furthermore, HBBD (a well-known OP war who runs the gauntlet portal often) told me that 5 hours for him in the gauntlet is 50m. He also mentioned that Hedo and Rahab are slower than Gauntlet and that Gauntlet Portal is far better. From what I recall, his gl is around 1100% gold loot.

Gauntlet alone cannot disrupt the economy on its own. There are maybe 20, 25max active good gaunt runners and probably I'm the one who runs it the most (most of these good gaunt runners usually run gaunt no more than 3 times per day, at least when I don't sleep). Now compare it with the amount of people who run raha/hedo - there are probably hundreds of them and they definitely make more gold in total than these 20ppl in gaunt.
These map can coexist - I run both maps if they're not opened at the same day. Also, as I said before, Hedo map is a NORMAL BOSS map, where Gaunt is an ELITE WAVE map. Normal hedo should be compared to normal raha in that case (hedo is way better). Only reasonable thing you can do is to wait for elite elder woods content.
Balancing - there are currently 5 types of map farm (zodias maps-raha-e raha-hedo-gauntlet). Each of them require more and more gear/skill/strategy/connections from you. You can start as a sanctuary runner, but with your progress you can run gaunt. Unfair and unbalanced thing would be when a map which requires more from you was granting same/less amount of gold than a map which requires less from you.
13m from gaunt? Not even Spec passed 13m with recently found strategy (which I'm still not using, cause I'm not able to), it's either you lying or you're basing on some calculations which have little or nothing to do with actual runs (you would need to reach 7m score many times at first).
1335gl? You include pet passive, hb and pet aa? Current pet strategy for gaunt (especially for mage) is actually different. We focus on fastest clean and survivalibity, not highest drop per wave. Maximizing gold drop per wave doesn't make sense from another reason - if rogs and wars have a choice between a mage who focus on dmg and mage who focus on gl, they would rather run with dmg one - also, with focusing on gold drop, you have a higher chance of dying and starting from 0.
1485gl in total getting rarely with some pt just proves that you're not actively running gauntlet and you got these 13m numbers from nowhere, cause no one does that.
Wars/rogs with current strategy can actually get more than sorcerers from gaunt and I basically said it in different post why it looks like that.
If you're the mage I'm thinking about, then I actually know the real reason of making that thread and it's not just because it grants more gold than hedo.

[ForumJunkie]

Gauntlet alone cannot disrupt the economy on its own. There are maybe 20, 25max active good gaunt runners and probably I'm the one who runs it the most (most of these good gaunt runners usually run gaunt no more than 3 times per day, at least when I don't sleep). Now compare it with the amount of people who run raha/hedo - there are probably hundreds of them and they definitely make more gold in total than these 20ppl in gaunt.

That's a bold claim that the gauntlet portal cannot disrupt the economy alone.

Based on what you said, you have 20-25 players (who meet your standards in running the Gauntlet portal) that you can contact and play within the portal consistently (this is neglecting the other groups that you have not encountered because they have not met your standards or they just do not run with you). If we take those 25 players and say they farm at least 8-10m an hour in 5 hours, we are looking at a collective income of 1B - 1.25B within 5 hours only. If we calculate that too, let's say 10 hours, then you are looking at 2B - 2.5B gold collective income. This is just based on YOUR experience. If we count OTHER players' experiences (not just your experiences), those numbers can potentially be higher than what was said.

There are more than 1,000+ players in this game who are playing actively. At least also take that into account when you apply those numbers in Gauntlet rather than counting a select few.

Although, I cannot definitively say because I do not have the data to support this claim. Only a developer would know this, so I asked that the developers to share their information and opinions about this matter.

These map can coexist - I run both maps if they're not opened at the same day.

If they are not opened on the same day, of course, you will run the ONLY open portal. BUT if ALL five portals (rahab, hedo, ekenta, and mech and gauntlet), are opened, then you would choose to play the Gauntlet portal, correct? Why is that? I do not want you to say, 'Because the rest of the portals (except Gauntlet) are a braindead map,' and that Gauntlet requires you more. No, that's not the reason. The reason (multiple people already said this above) why Gauntlet is preferred is that it earns more / can earn more than the other portals. Many players have said this in private chats, guild chats, and forums, and they even made videos on YouTube saying that this map is suitable for farming gold. (For example, this is one of many videos out there stating this fact: https://www.youtube.com/watchv=ymMs4...annel=CurvieAL)

Also, as I said before, Hedo map is a NORMAL BOSS map, where Gaunt is an ELITE WAVE map.

Alright, understood. So, if I suggest that the Gauntlet bosses be buffed in terms of HP and difficulty, you would not be against it, right? Because the bosses there are squishier than the Hedo boss despite that the Gauntlet portal is considered an 'elite' status and Hedo being [normal].

Only reasonable thing you can do is to wait for elite elder woods content.

No, it is not really the only thing I can do. I can suggest or provide feedback as well before that content is released. That's what I can do. And that's what this thread section is for.

Balancing - there are currently 5 types of map farm (zodias maps-raha-e raha-hedo-gauntlet). Each of them require more and more gear/skill/strategy/connections from you. You can start as a sanctuary runner, but with your progress you can run gaunt. Unfair and unbalanced thing would be when a map which requires more from you was granting same/less amount of gold than a map which requires less from you.

Yes, Gauntlet does require more teamwork and gears for you to run it efficiently to earn gold, but that obstacle is not impossible or difficult to achieve than what you make it sound like. Once you do bypass those barriers, then running the Gauntlet map is easy. Correct? Albeit, not all players have the skills, consistency, or patience to run the Gauntlet LB to reach 41m points like you do, but players can still easily and comfortably make a lot of gold in the Gauntlet portal if they meet all the requirements.

You've even tried to resolve the party issue by making a post recruiting OP players to farm Gauntlet with you efficiently, here:

https://www.spacetimestudios.com/sho...ns-(0-17-0-21)

13m from gaunt? Not even Spec passed 13m with recently found strategy (which I'm still not using, cause I'm not able to), it's either you lying or you're basing on some calculations which have little or nothing to do with actual runs (you would need to reach 7m score many times at first).

In a private conversation with Spectral in-game, he himself said that he could potentially earn 13m an hour or more in the Gauntlet portal. Well, what can I say, it's up to you and others to believe my information or decide not to.

1335gl? You include pet passive, hb and pet aa? Current pet strategy for gaunt (especially for mage) is actually different. We focus on fastest clean and survivalibity, not highest drop per wave. Maximizing gold drop per wave doesn't make sense from another reason - if rogs and wars have a choice between a mage who focus on dmg and mage who focus on gl, they would rather run with dmg one - also, with focusing on gold drop, you have a higher chance of dying and starting from 0.

Yes, 1335 gold loot. Yes, this is with a full gl pet. Hotbars exist. It's not impossible, it's just you've probably never tried it yet. You can compensate for lost damage by using damage elixirs and boost your survivability by using elixirs and buffs that do. And I don't mind using elixirs since I can easily earn a lot of gold to get them.

1485gl in total getting rarely with some pt just proves that you're not actively running gauntlet and you got these 13m numbers from nowhere, cause no one does that.
Wars/rogs with current strategy can actually get more than sorcerers from gaunt and I basically said it in different post why it looks like that.

I am not just pulling out numbers from my butt. You just refuse to believe it's possible and that someone has tried it other than yourself.

Yes, you are correct, I do not run Gauntlet constantly. Mostly because I run with my friends on the other portals, which I found more fun and suitable for my gameplay and time, BUT that doesn't mean I've never attempted Gauntlet.

I have been invited by players capable of running Gauntlet with no problem. And from my experience, I was able to earn approximately 11.5-12.5m in an hour, but I could have probably gotten more [12.5-13m] if I sold the loots that I've gotten from those runs and converted the tokens I'd earned in the vendor shop.

If you're the mage I'm thinking about, then I actually know the real reason of making that thread and it's not just because it grants more gold than hedo.

I am not sure what you are talking about, and it sounds like it will be off-topic again.

My reason for making this thread was CLEARLY stated in the original post on page 1 to the top of the page. No hidden agenda on my part. I've been transparent about what I've wanted from the very start.

It doesn't matter who I am. What matters is we focus on the issue, which is that Gauntlet earns more gold than the other portals available in the game. And that this is taxing the economy of the game in the long term.

We are NOT here to compete and argue.

---

Also, if you don't mind me asking, please format your responses more cleanly. It hurts reading your responses because it's just all over the place and without any proper formatting.

Finally, please stop repeating the same thing again and again. I've already addressed some of the same issues on your posts multiple times, and it just keeps looping around.

Thank you.