Unfair!!!---You knew it was coming!!

**Corpser** · 09-27-2011, 02:27 AM

Originally Posted by Neffy

If you have to work your butt off, then you should get something a little more than just a fancy crown. Tack some stats on that biznitch.

you worked for it as a crown (not vanity) then its a vanity it should have been one or the other. a vanity set bonus shoudl not be concidered or at least not one that gives pvp advantages. maybe give it an increase in luck ( Like big luck) but a little bit higher or the set should only work for pve.

Originally Posted by WhoIsThis

As mentioned before, it's noteworthy that everyone in this thread that has complained had weeks if not months to level to 56. A simple look at their join dates indicate this. Perhaps if you joined in September, you had zero chance of getting the crown of persistence. But nobody in this thread has. I suspect that most of the complainers here have been playing for much longer and were simply too lazy to do so.

Also this is an asumption alot of people could have been on holidays, or in my case wifi off. some people had stuff on and didnt get a chance to level its not there fault they still like the game. also alot of people complaining on forums are not active as much in game. just cause were on forums doesnt mean we are in game. (like me )

**WhoIsThis** · 09-27-2011, 04:19 AM

@Corpser

Not at all. There are many 56s from people who work full time jobs, have families, and the like. Many still managed to get to 56 within a month and this was on top of their regular work schedules. I know someone who worked 60 to 70 hours a week, had a baby, and still found the time to do it.

Bottom line is unless you just joined at the end of August, you have NO excuse. If you didn't get to 56... well getting to 56 just wasn't a priority for you.

**JaytB** · 09-27-2011, 04:33 AM

Originally Posted by Corpser

Also this is an asumption alot of people could have been on holidays, or in my case wifi off. some people had stuff on and didnt get a chance to level its not there fault they still like the game. also alot of people complaining on forums are not active as much in game. just cause were on forums doesnt mean we are in game. (like me )

Given that you have been playing this game for a long time already, wasn't 7ish months enough to reach 56? On top of that, I remember a post from a dev who stated that the lv56 cop would be part of a set in the future. Don't ask me to find it back, because it was a long time ago, but it was definitely posted. The way I see it, devs just awarded the people who spend time to (slowly) level to 56. It took me months to level all 3 of my main chars to 56, since I have a busy private life as well. And although I understand the reactions of people who didn't get it, I feel it's a reward towards the hardcore players, who spend either time or real life money to get to the previous level cap.

**Corpser** · 09-27-2011, 05:52 AM

Originally Posted by JaytB

Given that you have been playing this game for a long time already, wasn't 7ish months enough to reach 56? On top of that, I remember a post from a dev who stated that the lv56 cop would be part of a set in the future. Don't ask me to find it back, because it was a long time ago, but it was definitely posted. The way I see it, devs just awarded the people who spend time to (slowly) level to 56. It took me months to level all 3 of my main chars to 56, since I have a busy private life as well. And although I understand the reactions of people who didn't get it, I feel it's a reward towards the hardcore players, who spend either time or real life money to get to the previous level cap.

yes it may be an award but the set bonus should stay out of it fair enough vanity crown lets you were it permanently other people will be jealous you look unique (This is an award) however i am merley sugesting the set bonus doesnt add armor and instead changes away from a pvp bonus to just a pve bonus.

Originally Posted by WhoIsThis

@Corpser

Not at all. There are many 56s from people who work full time jobs, have families, and the like. Many still managed to get to 56 within a month and this was on top of their regular work schedules. I know someone who worked 60 to 70 hours a week, had a baby, and still found the time to do it.

Bottom line is unless you just joined at the end of August, you have NO excuse. If you didn't get to 56... well getting to 56 just wasn't a priority for you.

Yes some people may have found the time others may not have, keeping stats for a lvl 56 one is all good but giving an advantage over others is very unfair you may not see see it since you may already have the sets but really adding 10 armor is a very significant change its alot like the founders helm alot of people were mad about it having an extra 5 armor everyone that had one argued that it was fair, everyone else didn't. simply the stats should be change for something else besides armor.

**CrimsonTider** · 09-27-2011, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by WhoIsThis

As mentioned before, it's noteworthy that everyone in this thread that has complained had weeks if not months to level to 56. A simple look at their join dates indicate this. Perhaps if you joined in September, you had zero chance of getting the crown of persistence. But nobody in this thread has. I suspect that most of the complainers here have been playing for much longer and were simply too lazy to do so.

Another thing which should be noted is most of the individuals are also not pvp regulars, where this "bonus" is most useful. I can't see where it affects pve that much and what little it does in both realms isn't a huge difference. Unlike the Founder's Helm, the bonus can only be used by end game individuals.

And I love Pastry's anology. Applies perfectly to this situation.

**WhoIsThis** · 09-27-2011, 09:33 AM

Originally Posted by Corpser

Yes some people may have found the time others may not have, keeping stats for a lvl 56 one is all good but giving an advantage over others is very unfair you may not see see it since you may already have the sets but really adding 10 armor is a very significant change its alot like the founders helm alot of people were mad about it having an extra 5 armor everyone that had one argued that it was fair, everyone else didn't. simply the stats should be change for something else besides armor.

I maintain that it was due to your own unwillingness to take the time and effort to do it. Nobody except perhaps the devs knew that there would be any reward other than a crown for doing it at the time. Whether you want to lie to yourself in believing otherwise is entirely your business. Fortunately for people like you, end game PvP is one where you can ask the other player to remove their set or refuse to duel with them. I know this was the case in low level twink warfare. I have nothing further to say to you.

@Crimson:

The bonus is useful in PvE as well. I have noticed since it that I have died less often. Pure ints especially have so little dodge that anything helps. I imagine that as a bear as your main, you probably won't notice much.

**Aikiebo** · 09-27-2011, 09:53 PM

Originally Posted by pastrychef:428330

Look, Aikiebo, here's an analogy that perhaps you can understand... You had a chance to marry a girl but you chose not to. Now, she's revealed that she's actually a princess and you're complaining to anyone who will listen how unfair she was to not tell you in advance that she was a princess from the get go.

Get over it, man. You missed your shot at it.

Hey, pastrychef.

Oh, wait a minute! I read this post super fast this am. I misunderstood. Are you saying I still got a shot at her? lol hahaha Woot!!! Look at me marry into money!!! Weeeee!!! lol

Actually, I'm just kidding, lol.

But I am giving you an opening. You can now snap back: No!! you don't get the princess or the crown!!! Hah!!!!

Seriously folks.......

Since you are the only person in this whole thread to talk down to me, I am gonna help you out. You have had problems with drawing analogies in the past. So, I'll try to help.

Your analogy falls flat. It doesn't work cuz it's backwards. So... let's see... Guy A is dating this woman who wears nothing but rags. So, he thinks hmmmm..... and breaks it off. Then Guy B, starts dating her. They get married, THEN everyone finds out she's a princess.

But I'm curious: how exactly did Guy B hear the "subtle hint" and "vauge rumor" in time to cash in (cha ching!!)

Could it be: Just before one of their dates he's walking around the village and he's standing in front of the "Ye Olde Crown" merchant stall and he sees this crown. He keeps thinking he's gotta get that, he's gotta get that. Then what, a little bird lands on his shoulder (picture orig Snow White) and wispers a "subtle hint" into his ear. He puts his fingers to his chin and say, "wow, that was subtle, but hmm........ I wonder". He continues down the road.

So, it's almost time for the date, so he goes into "Ye Olde Outhouse" and scribbled on the wall in the King's finest Olde Englif, is: "for a ROYAL good time, call, ........." and his girlfriends name and phone number*** is next. So, he thinks hmmm... how did this "vauge rumor" get started. He's thinking hmm......

subtle hint...........
vauge rumor...........
subtle hint............
vauge rumor.............

So, he decides he better marry her "just in case". So, now he's in a hurry to pick her up but he pauses and thinks..... what does that rumor mean about "good time" hmmm...... how did that part of the rumor get started. hmmmm............. Doh!!!! Well, you can't have everything when you marry for money, lol.

I'm sorry, but, I got to finish this latter, sorry. Didn't realize it was so late.

*** yeah, I know, like they had phones back then, lol.

**Wretch** · 09-27-2011, 11:29 PM

I personally hope this thread gets locked soon.... While there are some good debates, from what I have skimmed during breaks in my hectic days, there is completely too many of us fighting over something that is extremely trivial!

THIS IS A GAME!!!!!!!!!

Could I have received a founders helm or the crown of persistance?.....

Yes!!!! If I chose to do so... I did not.... I chose to actually do what I need and needed to do with my life outside of this wonderful game(s... If you include SL)!

Sorry for the semi rant! But with what I see and hear in game, in life, on TV, in the movies, at the store, so on and so forth.....

You have nobody to blame but yourself for your own actions AND inactions...

And most importantly!

LIFE is NEVER EVER fair.....

Now I please ask everyone that took the time to read this to look inside yourself and think...... Would I be best friends with myself if I never knew who this person I'm looking into is?????

**Suntv** · 09-28-2011, 02:12 AM

I think all this discussion is kick-started by the fact that both items give a bonus when used together. If the bonus was seperated those who didn't get the crown still would get a bonus from the shield. STS gave all existing PL players all the time in the world, from June 'till September, to reacht 56 with their 4x elixer. Don't complain if you haven't got one. I don't have a lot of time to play due to work and real life, but I still managed to get all 3 crowns (str, dex, int).

Should the crown be available in plat store? No...
...but if they make it available it should cost 1200 platinum (twelvehundred, no typo). One of my crowns I got by non-stop using 4x elixers and it costed 1200 plat from lv 1 to 56 in 40 hours. That was the fastest route for a new player to reach for a crown.

In the end there will be new players joining who eventually will be lv 61. They don't have the crown, but my guess it that STS will be working on a new vanity helmet that maybe available with a new level cap or just in the new vampiric world.

**Corpser** · 09-28-2011, 02:35 AM

Originally Posted by WhoIsThis

I maintain that it was due to your own unwillingness to take the time and effort to do it. Nobody except perhaps the devs knew that there would be any reward other than a crown for doing it at the time. Whether you want to lie to yourself in believing otherwise is entirely your business. Fortunately for people like you, end game PvP is one where you can ask the other player to remove their set or refuse to duel with them. I know this was the case in low level twink warfare. I have nothing further to say to you.

Wether or not it was my unwillingness or not is entirley my bussniess not yours in fact i did try i really wanted a crown matter of fact i had some huge family issues my wifi has been off for most of my time on forums i had no actual warning. It was turned off about a week after i reached lvl 55. i also have worked and school minimizing my actual amount of time i could actually go in game. and from my experience people with end game stuff dont care much in pvp (are those that do) but alot of them just wanna win. The believe they earned it and as a result they will wear it no matter what i say (agian this is only some).

from what i can see you actually have the set bonus? if so i can see why you still want it. people get something then special bonus is given they will try and keep it and constantly argue for it.

i dont understand how you cant see the side of the coing im talking about, i can see yours. people earned it they deserve it, but serously please be open to mine andother peoples opionins try and understand it. all me and you are doing at the moment is argueing.

**pastrychef** · 09-28-2011, 05:56 AM

@ Aikiebo:

Don't bother finishing. If you still don't understand, chances are pretty good that you'll never understand and I'm not going to waste time attempting to explain. Please use your energy to continue to annoy the princess in to giving you another shot at marriage.

**WhoIsThis** · 09-28-2011, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by pastrychef

@ Aikiebo:

Don't bother finishing. If you still don't understand, chances are pretty good that you'll never understand and I'm not going to waste time attempting to explain. Please use your energy to continue to annoy the princess in to giving you another shot at marriage.

There seem to be lots of excuses here. Not gonna bother either. The other poster is sadly mistaken if they think that many end game players don't care about PvP.

We all have busy lives. I'm a university student, and yet I found time to get 2 characters to 56, despite my health not being in great shape. Both of these posters probably live in urban environments, which are places where internet is readily accessible. A friend of mine once wanted to get in shape to run a marathon as did his friends. He noticed something. At lunch, he ate, stretched, and ran. He did reasonably well considering it was his first marathon (after a year of training). His friends didn't. He noticed something. If you didn't do well, maybe it just wasn't a priority. Eating, socializing, hanging out, Facebook, TV, etc. gobbled their time.

As mentioned repeatedly in this thread, nobody except maybe the devs knew what was coming. I assume though that these people here will try to make 61 anyways as 66 may hold something.

**Navygreen** · 09-28-2011, 02:46 PM

Ok, maybe I need to do more than skim this thread.

Man, those analogies are confusing me.

**StompArtist** · 09-28-2011, 03:15 PM

Originally Posted by Navygreen

Ok, maybe I need to do more than skim this thread.

Man, those analogies are confusing me.

Feeling like a mole in a cloud?

**Ixillicus** · 09-28-2011, 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by pastrychef

@ Aikiebo:

Don't bother finishing. If you still don't understand, chances are pretty good that you'll never understand and I'm not going to waste time attempting to explain. Please use your energy to continue to annoy the princess in to giving you another shot at marriage.

Sorry, but the princess is in another castle. :P

**CrimsonTider** · 09-28-2011, 03:42 PM

Originally Posted by StompArtist

Feeling like a mole in a cloud?

I hate those beetle throwin, Mario shrinking, pains in the you-know-what!

**Rare** · 09-28-2011, 03:56 PM

Originally Posted by JaytB

On top of that, I remember a post from a dev who stated that the lv56 cop would be part of a set in the future. Don't ask me to find it back, because it was a long time ago, but it was definitely posted.

I definitely remember that. Until you mentioned it just now I forgot about it.

Speaking of busy people... I work 50-60 hours a week, have two 18mo olds, and a pregnant wife (come on fellas, you know how that is) and I still managed to get 2 1/2 to 56. And the third character (Aedenos) I didn't even start until about 3 weeks before the level cap raise.

ATL

**Chant** · 09-28-2011, 04:03 PM

Apologies in advance if I sound rude?!?! To those of you who are complaining about the L56 helm not being available anymore, shame on you!!! If you're a forumer, you should have known that the helm was going to be taken away. As for the bonus, this was unexpected for me too. Making the helm available for plats is a slap in the face for people who grinded and kept the PL community active (hosting runs, farming, replenishing CS inventory, etc...). This is a BAD idea!!! "I'll wait for the next level cap so I can buy the L61 shield for plats too". If you convert the players time versus plats, even 200 plats for the helm is unfair.

It's also an insult to some players like myself when I read post such as "I didn't have plats to level to 56." I leveled 3-56s using only gold elixirs. So, please refrain from using plats as an excuse. Or comments such as, "I didn't have TIME to level to 56." Players had monthssssss to get "at least one character" to 56 with or without a busy schedule. Keep in mind that there are exceptions.

In my opinion and I highly wish Devs would do this, there should be a "Vanity Helm Quest" (***additional 83K xp at end game) and a "Vanity Shield Quest" (***additional 100K xp at end game) to players that missed out. Since characters stops earning xp when it reaches level cap, Quest should only be available at that time so XP can be earned for quest purposes only. Players can only do this quest one at a time so xp doesn't count for both quest. If you have already earned the vanities prior to a new level cap, then you don't have this optional quest available to you. This will allow current, new, and future players to acquire it yet be fair as to how older players earned theirs. ***less the xp from 55-56 and 60-61*** (I forgot how much it was.)

**Prestige** · 09-30-2011, 01:41 PM

They will probably come out with something better hopefully in the future. But I think everyone should have the opportunity to earn something that has major stat enhancements. Example founders and prestige level equips. I have a founders but I feel that it is unfair to those who didn't have the opportunity to get the founders helm (maybe rename the helm for a certain amount of time played). The same thing applies to COP. Now if these vanities were just statless it would be a different situation. I'm not saying everyone should have every vanity, but most games that I have played let everyone have the opportunity to get the best gear in the game no matter how old the player. They usually have a statless or near statless equip serve as collector items instead. Hopefully, STS will do something about both of these helmets to make gameplay fairer.

**Wonderjuice** · 09-30-2011, 03:20 PM

You can retrospectively give benefits to people; but you cannot retrospectively punish people or deprive of their stuffs with new changes.
This is because people punished retrospectively will feel more unjust and unreasonable than people who did not get benefits of new changes.
This is to make a society happier and more peaceful.

They provided COP for the people who had patience to become 56; they provided Shield to people who had patience to become 61.
I spend 6 months to make it to 56 and got a COP. I was really proud of it even if it didn't wear a nice set. Cop was an indication for my achievement and patience. The point is that by removing 84k experience requirement between 55 and 56, we were kinda punished. We lost xps we had gained before. The COP and set bonus was an only compensation for our lost xps. Many people could be very upset and disappointed if they didn't get this benefit and compensation for their loss of xps.

The people who did not get or try to get COP did not lose anything. They just lost their opportunity to achieve the item. An opportunity lost because of the changed design cannot be claimed. That opportunity to achieve COP was never been theirs.

Only problem is how about the people who had gained some xps but failed to reach 56 before the new change. These were given opportunity for six months. Only people who didn't really have opportunity is the people who started this game a few weeks before the new map released. This is like claiming for opportunities to get Droid antennas, Christmas items, Halloween vanity items, etc.

So, STS should make a best choice under the circumstances. The choice should be the one which makes the majority of people happy; however, the choice cannot help sacrificing some people who started this game a few weeks before the new map.

But, If STS really wanna make everyone happy, it may want to give people, who didn't really have chance, an opportunity to gain the crown of "persistence." Making reaching 55 to 56 difficulty again, which require 84k again, and giving COP again by a fallen prince in Sewer may be too late because a month passed and many passed the line already. Only possible way for this matter is the quest as many people said. But why STS should develop new quests spending more time and money?