Feedback Request: No more Elite Dungeons

[Ebezaanec]

Instead of long and tedious dungeons, that requires a lot a time for the casual player... How about some dungeons similar to the Shuyal Dungeon. However, small mobs will spawn in short waves, instead of the boss itself spawning immediately.

Since the game's majority of players are casual players, the time spent conquering the dungeons should not be somewhat strenuous. These dungeons should not take a chunk of time to complete, but will still require effort to complete.

Just my opinion ofc.

[Bastok]

I am in favor of removing elite versions of maps. I know some people like them, but I'm not a big fan. They're too time consuming and there's barely any reward.

While I can't say I have ever enjoyed running elite maps, I can say that I have enjoyed casual farming with friends. Getting out there, killing stuff, having some laughs, getting egg drops. Those are some of the best times I've had in AL. To throw in those incredibly rare chances of getting awesome loot would be a great addition to the game.

I also like the idea of randomly spawning elite bosses in normal areas. I think that would be pretty exciting and help shake things up a little bit. Of course, they would have a higher chance of dropping that great loot, but it still must be rare.

Here's an idea I have to help add more diversity to these randomly spawning bosses. Add 3 levels of randomly spawning bosses. You could have that random boss that is harder and appears randomly throughout the map, you could also have the random elite boss that spawns in place of the normal boss for better loot drop chances, and you could also have the mega rare super elite boss. The super elite boss will randomly appear AFTER killing the boss at the end of the map. This boss will not only be super hard and require a good team to kill efficiently, but it also has a time limit that it has to be killed in. So say the super mega rare elite boss spawns, you have 5 minutes or so to kill him. If you kill him, you get the best possible loot drops, if the time limit expires, the boss runs away.

I think it would be exciting to have the possibility of random bosses popping up in your everyday farming. Super elite mega bosses with time limits would also help quench the thirst for the hardcore players.

Of course, I think there should also be at least one dungeon designed per campaign specifically for elite players. It's not a normal dungeon just vamped up in difficulty, it's a whole new dungeon with a specific strategy in mind and very difficult. This will be good for people who enjoy something very challenging, and it will also keep the leaderboard battles healthy for the fastest completion of the elite dungeon. Of course drop rates would be a tad higher than normal, but the dungeon will be for the more competitive players looking to challenge themselves and battle for leaderboard positions. Casual players won't feel like they're missing out if they decide to skip on a campaign's elite dungeon.

Of course you could keep the shorter arena battles and crates for the players would prefer to farm with their wallets over spending time out in the field.

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[Alhuntrazeck]

There. Just finished a 13 minute Elite Oltgar run and got...wait for it...that's right, crap. I have a 25% luck reroll elixir + the amulet so there must be something wrong. I'm suddenly all for the idea of doing away with elite maps, its so long and so rare that you get a drop, its just plain annoying.

[Rare]

Honestly, if elite difficulty and time went back to Dead City... Things would be fine.

[jazaajaba]

Awesome idea

[Morholt]

There. Just finished a 13 minute Elite Oltgar run and got...wait for it...that's right, crap. I have a 25% luck reroll elixir + the amulet so there must be something wrong. I'm suddenly all for the idea of doing away with elite maps, its so long and so rare that you get a drop, its just plain annoying.

40% reroll chance doesn't mean a sure thing of a reroll...

So, you think a 13 minute run was bad, huh? Well...at least the boss was there! You got exactly as you expected. The loot wasn't as desired, but at least you had the chance.

Consider how the new Elite Bael II is...do you REALLY want that for every map? If you read some more of the sub forums, you'll see MANY people are spending 4 or 6 hours straight of trying to just find him ONCE, and still NOT finding him. Do you really want to run a normal map for hours on end without fighting a single worthwhile boss? I'd much rather do a 10-15 minute elite map, get to fight a boss, and have a low chance at a super good drop (while having a good chance for a decent drop).

It sounds 'cool' to unite good and bad players...but it really isn't in practice. So...we spend 6+ hours looking for a spawn of an elite boss...just for us to be grouped with 3 players of the worst kind (bad gear AND simply bad at playing the game). However, they know what can happen from this rarely spawning boss...he is guaranteed to drop something super good! Oh, my! This means...they aren't going to be leaving the game any time soon. You might be waiting another hour in hopes of one or two of them leaving so that you can call in a friend (assuming that they are still only at this point...). Meanwhile, you pray you don't disconnect. Your loot elixir is going to be long gone by the time you find the boss (unless you purchase one with plat at the boss).
Personally, I like being able to make a team by checking out the stats of those around me and knowing that I'm with a good group and then going into a difficult fight, with a guaranteed boss there, with a lower chance of super good drops (while being able to make a handful of runs at certain elite bosses within the timespan of a reroll elixir).

I like the idea of a rare spawn of an elite boss on normal maps--it adds some spice and fun.
However, taking away elite maps is too much and just a bad idea.
Why can't we just have both? Elite maps and a rare elite spawn on normal maps.

[Alhuntrazeck]

Its clearing the mobs that are the problem. I don't like the idea of the random spawning Bael, but that's just me. If we had an arena with constant spawning mobs wave after wave until the boss is out...that would be better than long elite runs.

[Rare]

If the changes are going to be like bael ii, it will fail. Spawn rate is way too low. Several hours for me and no sighting.

Getting rid of elites is not the right thing. Just make the difficulty closer to season ii dead city.

Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk 2

[Taejo]

I think this weekend is just a preliminary test of ideas. But I agree, although Bael's loot table is decent, his current rarity does not balance out taking away elite maps.

EDIT: changed "justify" to "balance"

[Alrisaia]

Its clearing the mobs that are the problem. I don't like the idea of the random spawning Bael, but that's just me. If we had an arena with constant spawning mobs wave after wave until the boss is out...that would be better than long elite runs.

Part of what makes elite is the difficulty in getting to the boss in the first place... Removing that difficulty means the only difference between elite end game pve and non elite end game pve is the amount of time it takes for the run...

See many pugs running elite palm rock? Nope... That's a difficult run thus the drops from there have remained high value. We need difficult runs.

[Rajnikanth]

Part of what makes elite is the difficulty in getting to the boss in the first place... Removing that difficulty means the only difference between elite end game pve and non elite end game pve is the amount of time it takes for the run...

See many pugs running elite palm rock? Nope... That's a difficult run thus the drops from there have remained high value. We need difficult runs.

d reason i dnt run elite nodr is becoz of crappy drops i get.
i can do elite oltger in less then 10mins bt i hav to spam alot pots in this season. nd after killing him i get epic stuffs which is not worth selling.

i like bael 2 runs. atleast guaranteed pinks nd i dnt spam alot pots killing bael comparing running elite maps which is risky, costly nd very low chance of getting pinks which worth d pots i use.

[rushmore]

If the difficulty-increase implemented this weekend is a sign of how the game will progress from now on then consider arcane legends as a non-starter for new players. The whole mechanic has been changed, with solo farming slowed down to a crawl for casual players. Since the update on Friday this game is not fun anymore. I usually sink 6+ hours a day into it but this weekend I've hardly been on, due to the time/resources it now takes to complete even the lower level maps (and i know I'm not alone). Just remember... If you alienate the causal gamers and they quit, will the advanced/hardcore minority provide enough income to cover the losses? Think hard......

[darthdlo]

if we go with this we should add a revive skill to mages and add invite/boot option.

[dirtymageic]

I feel that the idea of cutting out elites would be a bad business strategy as not everyone is into PvP. I know many have grown sick of Mali/Kettle runs (as such)but it wouldn't be hard to revitalize the Breckenridge area. Throw three new weapons in the mix, a new pet and people will want to play it again. In addition a lot of success with elites depends on guild/player quality which as we all know...is a wide spectrum.

For the elite elites though it would be nice for a guaranteed second boss if no one in party dies during first fight. Or how wild would it be if we could reroll a second boss. The person who rerolled the boss would then get the best loot in party since their first loot spawned second boss.

[Alhuntrazeck]

Oh yes a revive option for mage would be wonderful!












...not in PvP tho. Or you've got the next OP class.

[katish]

I wanna chip in, even if a bit late..

So I see most of the concern and discussions have been about the drop itens, rate and the economy. I would like to bring the playability back in the table. I enjoy playing elite because it's hard! I like that it requires strategizing, cooperation, time and effort. No, it's not casual.. that's why I like it, it requires skills.. trying to do elites with pugs just doesn't work.

But regular maps are casual enough and the proof of that is how many players we have logged on at any given time just doing their casual playing.. When I don't feel like comitting to elite I'll go play pvp, or help guildies unlock maps, do quests, run km3.. there are many many options out there!

EDIT: I forgot to add .. I think one of the reasons why we sort of lost the casual feeling of the game is because of all the 1 hit kills... I mean, nordr bosses still hit outside the red area and 1 shot kill most of us.. who wants to have to deal with that frustration? I mean, who actually runs nordr other than oltgar keep and crystal cavern?

I think the idea of having a loner elite boss in a regular map is interesting though.. it gives the average player a taste of what elite is like and it could attract more players into end game. Maybe even expand to have a mini elite oasis in regular maps.. like the spot where Bael II pops up in mt spyr.. make all that an elite area within a regular map.. so it wouldn't take as long as 15-30 min (average time for a pug to clear an elite map)..

And what Morholt said.. most ppl would never get invited to a random elite boss run because it'd be packed with a pug and no one would want to leave. Again, what he said.. why can't we have both?

Maybe a suggestion regarding elite maps.. make it so you don't have to be cap level to go to previous campaigns elite maps.. and then you can incorporate what energizeric suggested, having elite 16 gear drop from elite 16 campaign map, elite 21 gear dropping from elite 21 campaign map.. maybe lock the previous elite campaign maps to higher level players, so if you want to farm dead city elite you have to be within the designed level range (mean you can't be level 36 going into elite map design for lvl 26). This could potentially boost the interest of players having a twink for farming lower twink level items...

[ShadowGunX]

that is so cool, plz remove these stupid elite maps. or either make warrior as capable of tanking efficiently. the armour nd dodge is so PATHETIC to do elite, rofl i dnt want to talk about its dmg bt ok, bt we need more armour nd dodge, that is wat a REAL TANK

[Haligali]

40% reroll chance doesn't mean a sure thing of a reroll...

So, you think a 13 minute run was bad, huh? Well...at least the boss was there! You got exactly as you expected. The loot wasn't as desired, but at least you had the chance.

Consider how the new Elite Bael II is...do you REALLY want that for every map? If you read some more of the sub forums, you'll see MANY people are spending 4 or 6 hours straight of trying to just find him ONCE, and still NOT finding him. Do you really want to run a normal map for hours on end without fighting a single worthwhile boss? I'd much rather do a 10-15 minute elite map, get to fight a boss, and have a low chance at a super good drop (while having a good chance for a decent drop).

It sounds 'cool' to unite good and bad players...but it really isn't in practice. So...we spend 6+ hours looking for a spawn of an elite boss...just for us to be grouped with 3 players of the worst kind (bad gear AND simply bad at playing the game). However, they know what can happen from this rarely spawning boss...he is guaranteed to drop something super good! Oh, my! This means...they aren't going to be leaving the game any time soon. You might be waiting another hour in hopes of one or two of them leaving so that you can call in a friend (assuming that they are still only at this point...). Meanwhile, you pray you don't disconnect. Your loot elixir is going to be long gone by the time you find the boss (unless you purchase one with plat at the boss).
Personally, I like being able to make a team by checking out the stats of those around me and knowing that I'm with a good group and then going into a difficult fight, with a guaranteed boss there, with a lower chance of super good drops (while being able to make a handful of runs at certain elite bosses within the timespan of a reroll elixir).

I like the idea of a rare spawn of an elite boss on normal maps--it adds some spice and fun.
However, taking away elite maps is too much and just a bad idea.
Why can't we just have both? Elite maps and a rare elite spawn on normal maps.

I agree with you, finding bael more time consuming than the hardest elite maps, and depends on pure luck. 100+ runs at normal windmoore/mount/crystal/skull so boring.
Also dont really like the arena, that is for rogues, elite bosses without mobs.
I like the challenge of elite mobs, they need crowd control.

[Obi]

Maybe it would be a good idea to have some elite mobs (dropping more - like 200 gold - for each killed mob) instead of an elite boss (in arena or spawning on normal maps)? Or a new challenge arena with just wave of mobs?

[Alrisaia]

I wanna chip in, even if a bit late..

So I see most of the concern and discussions have been about the drop itens, rate and the economy. I would like to bring the playability back in the table. I enjoy playing elite because it's hard! I like that it requires strategizing, cooperation, time and effort. No, it's not casual.. that's why I like it, it requires skills.. trying to do elites with pugs just doesn't work.

But regular maps are casual enough and the proof of that is how many players we have logged on at any given time just doing their casual playing.. When I don't feel like comitting to elite I'll go play pvp, or help guildies unlock maps, do quests, run km3.. there are many many options out there!

EDIT: I forgot to add .. I think one of the reasons why we sort of lost the casual feeling of the game is because of all the 1 hit kills... I mean, nordr bosses still hit outside the red area and 1 shot kill most of us.. who wants to have to deal with that frustration? I mean, who actually runs nordr other than oltgar keep and crystal cavern?

I think the idea of having a loner elite boss in a regular map is interesting though.. it gives the average player a taste of what elite is like and it could attract more players into end game. Maybe even expand to have a mini elite oasis in regular maps.. like the spot where Bael II pops up in mt spyr.. make all that an elite area within a regular map.. so it wouldn't take as long as 15-30 min (average time for a pug to clear an elite map)..

And what Morholt said.. most ppl would never get invited to a random elite boss run because it'd be packed with a pug and no one would want to leave. Again, what he said.. why can't we have both?

Maybe a suggestion regarding elite maps.. make it so you don't have to be cap level to go to previous campaigns elite maps.. and then you can incorporate what energizeric suggested, having elite 16 gear drop from elite 16 campaign map, elite 21 gear dropping from elite 21 campaign map.. maybe lock the previous elite campaign maps to higher level players, so if you want to farm dead city elite you have to be within the designed level range (mean you can't be level 36 going into elite map design for lvl 26). This could potentially boost the interest of players having a twink for farming lower twink level items...

I'm going to reply with some additional thoughts here.



So here goes. Last night I /partyinvite 000 and ran harbor and spur over and over again for two and a half hours.

I racked up over 1k kills from those two maps in that amount of time. Bael finally spawned for me and it was very exciting!

I promptly told my guild to get their cameras ready because I had found the Sasquatch! Because he's as elusive as Bigfoot we joke...

But... Because I had partyinvited 000 it apparently has the map locked and thus we didn't kill him. so i for the first time in this game rage quit.

That was really frustrating. Here's the deal, I like to be challenged. Farming for bael last night wasn't challenging in the slightest. I solo each map in under one minute and because I was running so fast I waSnt chatting or socializing at all either this it was like playing a single player game the whole time.

Additionally my lv 29 mage is geared in lv 26 pinks so anyone with a remote level of skill could do the same.

Why did we want to do this exactly? When I say we I mean the players because we agreed this would be a good change. Help me understand how elite bael spawning in regular maps has helped this game.

:-( sadly I say I don't want elites to go away. It's why I play, just make it more attractive to run them and people will do so.