Ban the Midas Touch

[Valsacar]

Removing the AP will not mitigate scamming, it has nothing to do with scamming. It is just one, of many, ways people use to part a fool with his money.

There were scams long before these AP existed, and there will be scams after the leave. The only real difference between then and now is there are more players (good ones, and bad ones). Also the fact that scammers either don't get caught/punished, or just that we don't know that they do, makes it more attractive.

If you want to lower the risk of scamming, don't GIVE things to people and pay attention to the number of zeros in the trade window. STS has to do the rest, let people know (IG and on forums) when a scammer is caught and punished. Name and shame them, mention how they have been permanently banned, show that there really IS a consequence for your actions.

[Skaunared]

In the end, with or without the AP, people will still try to scam in different ways ( the magic 0, befriending players, etc. ). You see guys, scammers are not really afraid of what happens after successfully doing it coz there's not enough punishment against them. As gundamsone pointed out, some well known scammers are still active to this day LOLing at those they scammed.

I know a guild who got scammed 87m by one of their officers for this AP. So what happened after? Scammer Renamed and go on a shopping spree. I have a guildie who lend her mythic set to a so called "friend", then left and renamed, joined another well known guild, and TT his heart out against other players in PVP. Isn't that called INAPPROPRIATE BEHAVIOR? Sadly, despite of all the reports, nothing has been done.

I've never been scammed. I pity those who were scammed and never got their items back. I know STS can do something about this. Removing the Gold APs is not the ultimate solution against scammers, it is only a way to lessen the TEMPTATION. Devs tell us not to lend things and gold to other players, even to so called friends, it is our PART to do. So what does STS have to do on their part?

Ban scammers and return lost items/gold to their respectful owners.

In this way scammers will think otherwise, as they can get nothing good out of scamming.

[Joncheese]

Why i don't find the cs idea good: it is going to open the door for another type of scam. Just as you ask someone to lend you the money for the achievement, you can ask him to buy your item that you listed for 99 mil, 999k and 999 gold (current maximum price for auct items) telling him that you will support the fees for listing the item: 5 mil for listing it yourself and that you are going to give the other person 5 mil to list it back.

10 mil for listing fees is a small price to pay for the other 90 mil you get in return.

There arent any items over 18 million usually on the CS.... Most ive seen is the ridiculously priced Samael @ 40.000.000. That being said i can see what you're saying. Perhaps have the AP based on items you list, rather than what is bought. This way it will not encourage players to lend gold, but instead will encourage those to list items. No one is just gonna wanna waste gold.... Perhaps a solution?

Edit: Maybe not. Let me think a bit more. i walked away and thought about it and this wouldnt work.

[Skaunared]

Removing the AP will not mitigate scamming, it has nothing to do with scamming. It is just one, of many, ways people use to part a fool with his money.

There were scams long before these AP existed, and there will be scams after the leave. The only real difference between then and now is there are more players (good ones, and bad ones). Also the fact that scammers either don't get caught/punished, or just that we don't know that they do, makes it more attractive.

If you want to lower the risk of scamming, don't GIVE things to people and pay attention to the number of zeros in the trade window. STS has to do the rest, let people know (IG and on forums) when a scammer is caught and punished. Name and shame them, mention how they have been permanently banned, show that there really IS a consequence for your actions.

THIS!

[Joncheese]

In the end, with or without the AP, people will still try to scam in different ways ( the magic 0, befriending players, etc. ). You see guys, scammers are not really afraid of what happens after successfully doing it coz there's not enough punishment against them. As gundamsone pointed out, some well known scammers are still active to this day LOLing at those they scammed.

I know a guild who got scammed 87m by one of their officers for this AP. So what happened after? Scammer Renamed and go on a shopping spree. I have a guildie who lend her mythic set to a so called "friend", then left and renamed, joined another well known guild, and TT his heart out against other players in PVP. Isn't that called INAPPROPRIATE BEHAVIOR? Sadly, despite of all the reports, nothing has been done.

I've never been scammed. I pity those who were scammed and never got their items back. I know STS can do something about this. Removing the Gold APs is not the ultimate solution against scammers, it is only a way to lessen the TEMPTATION. Devs tell us not to lend things and gold to other players, even to so called friends, it is our PART to do. So what does STS have to do on their part?

Ban scammers and return lost items/gold to their respectful owners.

In this way scammers will think otherwise, as they can get nothing good out of scamming.

Excelletn post.

[eeknoh]

I just wanted to say I'm so pleased to be part of such a caring community. You guys rock. Whatever the outcome, and I hope they get rid of the AP altogether myself, I'm just happy to see all the constructive ideas posted in this thread, that shows how much people care about others well being.

Yay.

[Daddyblu]

In the end, with or without the AP, people will still try to scam in different ways ( the magic 0, befriending players, etc. ). You see guys, scammers are not really afraid of what happens after successfully doing it coz there's not enough punishment against them. As gundamsone pointed out, some well known scammers are still active to this day LOLing at those they scammed.

I know a guild who got scammed 87m by one of their officers for this AP. So what happened after? Scammer Renamed and go on a shopping spree. I have a guildie who lend her mythic set to a so called "friend", then left and renamed, joined another well known guild, and TT his heart out against other players in PVP. Isn't that called INAPPROPRIATE BEHAVIOR? Sadly, despite of all the reports, nothing has been done.

I've never been scammed. I pity those who were scammed and never got their items back. I know STS can do something about this. Removing the Gold APs is not the ultimate solution against scammers, it is only a way to lessen the TEMPTATION. Devs tell us not to lend things and gold to other players, even to so called friends, it is our PART to do. So what does STS have to do on their part?

Ban scammers and return lost items/gold to their respectful owners.

In this way scammers will think otherwise, as they can get nothing good out of scamming.

True they need to implement some rules regarding scamming. ( I know this guild - Officer of PF run away with the 87m)

Base on my experience a lot of online game use character roll back. if a owner report hack or account is scammed.
they will roll back every what happened last 24hrs or the date before you got hack / scammed.
By this way its not only scammer , also hacking will be minimize.
I sure it is very easy for easy to track Gold and lost or stolen items.

I just don't get it why its very hard for them to implement some rules knowing that this is an online game and as a human we intend to make friends.
So things cant be avoided that we let people lend out items.
STS i know you guys know about this, I just don't get it why you always wash hands an saying "that we have nothing to do if you lend out your gears / items".
I mean come on there are kids playing in the game witch can be deceived quickly.

Why not implement some rules before you lost all the trust of the consumer / players.

[Daddyblu]

Now lets go back to the Idea how to make this AP achieved in another method / way.

An Idea *

Lets change the way how to achieved the Great all wise Midas Touch.

Lets say you will achieved this by selling items on the auction.

Like your total over all auction sales would be worth 100m gold.

by this way no need to keep gold in your hands no hassle to other players. Its up to you how fast you farm and how many items you sold in auction. as long as your total sales reach 100m.

Reason
1.) no need to borrow gold
2.) i dont think you need to borrow items so you can sell in the auction tax will kill you.

anyone opinion are welcome to make this version better.

And for the players who already achieved they can keep the points and title.

Any more good ideas it will be morning EST admins will read soon.

[Justg]

We do have rules. We do perma-ban scammers. I personally banned about 50 last week.

The OP has a good point about the Gold APs. Both Sam and I have told you that we are listening.

In the meantime, be careful out there!

[ElfDreamer]

yeah i agree.. and ban the lower level when he have a midas touch archiv.

[Avshow]

cannot agree with this

think about alts...once one alt has the gold, all alts under same account all could have.

yeah i agree.. and ban the lower level when he have a midas touch archiv.

[Skaunared]

We know STS can do this. Hey, they created a great game for us to play, I know they are more than capable of helping those victims obtain their hard-earned gold back. I believe that STS can find the best solution against scamming. I still have faith in you guys, and I know some of us here still have too!

I don't blame that guild for lending one of their officers and trusting him, maybe all they wanted was for their members to have more APs so that they can improve their position on the Top Guilds List. Isn't that what a guild is for? Helping each other through thick or thin. They never knew that someone who they knew and trust for months had a ticking time bomb just waiting to explode.

[Daddyblu]

I got two ideas that well help

1.)

An Idea *

Lets change the way how to achieved the Great all wise Midas Touch.

Lets say you will achieved this by selling items on the auction.

Like your total over all auction sales would be worth 100m gold.

by this way no need to keep gold in your hands no hassle to other players. Its up to you how fast you farm and how many items you sold in auction. as long as your total sales reach 100m.

Reason
1.) no need to borrow gold
2.) i dont think you need to borrow items so you can sell in the auction tax will kill you.

anyone opinion are welcome to make this version better.

And for the players who already achieved they can keep the points and title.

Idea 2)

Guys,

Its normal, All online game there is a scammers and it happens.

Its sad to say but even if STS will block and banned all the accounts they will just make new ones why its very each to achieve level 36.

Suggestions 1

Make the level up more harder like lvl-1 1k exp/ lvl-2 2k / lvl-3=3k 25-2k or what ever ect ect.

we as players would like to deal with main accounts we rarely make deal with low level.

if its hard to make a high level character they wont risk or it will take time for them to scam again once it get banned.
one high level is banned it will take them 1 month or two month to make a new one.

See one of the problems is - it is very easy to make a 36 account it will only take 3-5days Max.

On the past online game i played Ragnarok PH way back 1997-2006 the scamming less or very very rare.
level cap was 99 and we only make deal with 99 players or well know twinks that already made a name.
it take 2 months to reach level cap.

Suggestion 2

Once get caught of scamming and hacking ect. ect. account should be permanent banned including device.

Note all players should do Screen shoot while trading.

If you notice one Zero is missing then Screen shot it and your chat conversation.

[wvhills]

i haven't ever had more than 6 million so it doesn't matter to me. haha.

[Daddyblu]

i haven't ever had more than 6 million so it doesn't matter to me. haha.

this comment make me laugh. its about scamming not 6million :P

[WoofCookie]

I got to 50 mil without help, the 100 mil however would have been long time in the process. I got lucky and my guild hooked me up. During the day we all got midas nobody got scammed to my knowledge but then again we all were trusted individuals. However scamming is in the nature of humans and for many their stories didn't end well. I think a 100mil AP is kind of "ego-stroking" and better APS could be added;

To not just complain I'll provide a few additional APS;

25k PVP Kills (Angel of Death)
50k PVP Kills (God of War)

100 DM Kills
1000k DM Kills
5k DM Kills
10k DM Kills
25k DM Kills
50k DM Kills

This is just PVP:

Money AP make it go to the max 25mil.

1 mil Filthy rich
10 mil Goldfinger
25 mil Midas Touch

MErch AP:

1 MErch
10 Auctioneer
50 (Wallstreet or (broker)


Myth

How about making a "Full Myth" AP 5/5
Call it - Rock Solid or Blessed or something like that

I can go on for days!

I agree however that the 100 mil is a complete ego stroke and should be nerfed.

[Rare]

STS i know you guys know about this, I just don't get it why you always wash hands an saying "that we have nothing to do if you lend out your gears / items".

Because it sets a TERRIBLE precedence. People are already complaining that STS doesn't get rid of the scammers now (and rightfully so). Imagine if they had to investigate specific items that were stolen and where they might have gone to. ESPECIALLY gold.

[Skaunared]

Because it sets a TERRIBLE precedence. People are already complaining that STS doesn't get rid of the scammers now (and rightfully so). Imagine if they had to investigate specific items that were stolen and where they might have gone to. ESPECIALLY gold.

So who would investigate? They are the only ones that have the power and capability to see each and every transaction on every account related to scamming cases. I know that with enough proof, they can return the lost items back to the victims and ban the scammer. I know it is hard, but it is possible. Things like these are also done on other MMOs, so I can't see the point why they can't do it here.

As the dev stated at the post above, they do perma-ban scammers. I also do hope that they can return those lost gold/items back. This serves as a warning to those who scammed or who will try to do so in the future.

[Rare]

We do have rules. We do perma-ban scammers. I personally banned about 50 last week.

The OP has a good point about the Gold APs. Both Sam and I have told you that we are listening.

In the meantime, be careful out there!

Just a suggestion Justg. But maybe posting a list of those that are banned (weekly? monthly?). Not only does it put those people on blast and let scammers know you mean business, but it also helps the community feel at ease knowing that things are happening.

As it stands now, we have no idea if a player was banned unless they come to the forums and break forum rules to talk about their ban. For all we know they could have just changed their name (which I know has happened on a number of occasions).

Like Valascar said above, send a message that it won't be tolerated.

[Rare]

So who would investigate? They are the only ones that have the power and capability to see each and every transaction on every account related to scamming cases. I know that with enough proof, they can return the lost items back to the victims and ban the scammer. I know it is hard, but it is possible. Things like these are also done on other MMOs, so I can't see the point why they can't do it here.

As the dev stated at the post above, they do perma-ban scammers. I also do hope that they can return those lost gold/items back. This serves as a warning to those who scammed or who will try to do so in the future.

Nobody will investigate. That's why they say they WILL NOT give your items back if you give them away.

It is hard. And it is possible. But its not realistic. And its not worth it from a resource standpoint. That's why STS says "No". Its YOUR responsibility to keep control of your things. Don't lend things you aren't willing to lose forever. To anyone. Its YOUR responsibility. And I don't think STS should waste their time returning items. The people that loaned them should learn from their mistakes and the "scammers" should be banned.

Out of curiousity... what other Mobile MMOs do it? IMO, its a perfectly valid disclaimer.

EDIT: I mean the general you. Not you personally.