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    Quote Originally Posted by snakeeyes View Post
    This is the question what is the meaning of elite boss and elite maps if warior can finish the map faster without dying, because they kill boss only in 1-2-3 hits and then they finishes the map but the other need to clear the mobs, while killing the boss and always insta die, elite meaning is only for mage and specially rogue and not for warior.
    You are very wrong, as warrior we also die alot in those map, less for sure but we still harvest lot of death, make a warrior and try you ll see

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    Just remake Mausoleum or something similar, these raids (mecharydon/rahab/ekenta) along with normal maps where you can skip all mobs and just kill the mini bosses and then run to boss just make the map about who has the best damage proc at the time. Class balance won't matter if the current maps don't have reasons for all classes. Need more focus on mobs/longer time fighting groups of mobs, maybe add stuns/curse/healer mobs to every other group and make most of them need to be killed to spawn the boss.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PatD View Post
    And this is why you should ask to buff rogue and mage then, not nerf the one you say is happy, but even if you say so, to enjoy warrior doing one shot kill you need invest lot of gold to have very high stats, not all warrior can do that
    Same not all rogue is op even op rogue need warior what about the midle and low average rogue.

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    That "one shot" isnt it at all, need to charge the ultimate have to work on that limited time and if the boss or mini dodge it became a waste also the bosses are pushing back and spawning mobs making it easier to fail, so you arent objetive for each op war that makes it look easy to kill are 100 wars failing it and im incluyed

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    Can i ask what is the main reason why warior kill big boss kill in oneshot some warior can do damage polaris 80% hp of boss rip and nepta each damage done 10-20% hp of boss lost with 4-6x combo so they kill big boss easily?

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    Quote Originally Posted by snakeeyes View Post
    Can i ask what is the main reason why warior kill big boss kill in oneshot some warior can do damage polaris 80% hp of boss rip and nepta each damage done 10-20% hp of boss lost with 4-6x combo so they kill big boss easily?
    Rogues and mages can also do good dmg with their own procs to the boss like nepta if your problem is with Polar maybe the could nerf it to bosses but buffing the aoe to kill more mobs and 3 also it could give more importance to Neptaris weap and both items would lower their price

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    Quote Originally Posted by Necl View Post
    Rogues and mages can also do good dmg with their own procs to the boss like nepta if your problem is with Polar maybe the could nerf it to bosses but buffing the aoe to kill more mobs and 3 also it could give more importance to Neptaris weap and both items would lower their price

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    This is what we need to make map enjoyable no more 1 hit deleting boss, i see on video of encryption rogue its ok but not almost the same as neptas damage, nepta is 2nd most op damage in al but 1 hit delete the hp in elite endgame map is unfair to all. The problem is x6 str of rage.

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    Quote Originally Posted by snakeeyes View Post
    This is what we need to make map enjoyable no more 1 hit deleting boss, i see on video of encryption rogue its ok but not almost the same as neptas damage, nepta is 2nd most op damage in al but 1 hit delete the hp in elite endgame map is unfair to all. The problem is x6 str of rage.
    The problem is what u cant see it isnt easy as you think

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    @Devs here's what's happening now in zodias map elite,
    1. we depend on the damage of the warior and we do nothing but follow,
    2. we pretending that tha high damage to boss is us but in reality thats a warior damage.
    3. some warior best ms and damage left other player behind then greedy kill the mini boss one by one and then the big boss, they ruined other player enjoyment, i can follow him and do nothing just looting dont do anything but follow. but how about the other poor that cannot follow because one op war can 1 shot boss insta? Rog and mage cannot do that.

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    And because the map objective is to kill boss not to clear mobs, warior dominates endgame map. And about saying switch to war we all go to war, but not all the player like warior here is some example theres a player here in forum dont like dagger and he stick to bow, because just he dont want to use dagger just example the dagger is warior and bow is a rogue.

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    I hope i didnt ban here because of complaining and so many player here was angry about me because of complain, i hit also warior in my guild and friends because of complaining about warior, im done thanks.

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    Try playing as a warrior.

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    dont worry when u op(maybe when arc available) enough the war dont even have time to charge their ult no need to cry the war deleting the boss.

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    Don't mind me, I need 10 posts. This is ridiculous. XD

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    I find it funny that people see a awar ulti and one hit something and complain. I see more fails then successful one hits. When I run with good rogues and mages i can barely keep up. By the time I get to the boss my ulti isn't charged and I can't one hit anything. Ever since they buffed daggers rogues in pvp are op. I can't survive a strong rogue when dagger procs with jug or horn. Proc lasts longer then 3 seconds. Jug doesnt heal as fast as they do damage. So yeah an average rogue can take a tank out with the proc. At least if they just stand there getting hit by daggers. Anyone that thinks wars are to op should try running elite zodias and clearing mobs. Takes forever to kill anything.

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    i quit warrior because of only doing kill boss with that weapons and its main damage in party . its not warriors role
    all class of role is gone now . . almost warrior doesnt care how save party and they only focus how thay give damage but its not , however i know weapons force us to do this i play warrior again someday

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    All i gotta say is: Mage is love, mage is life

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    All these people saying one shot in relation to warrior are talking about a very small minority of warriors who have invested hundreds of millions into a full set slotted and high output pet.

    I've spent a good chunk of gold on gear /mythics 81 and I can't 1 shot sheet.

    So don't come here after you saw some warrior one shot a boss... And you can't.
    Similarly I seen rogues and mages do some insane numbers on mobs and bosses too, but I don't go around crying so much damage dealt, nerf em or boost wars.

    I never heard any of you here crying the same way when proc stacking was removed where tanks lost huge amount of gold while the mages and rogies profitted out of them in all the mob clearing done by tanks in evg USING PROCESS STACK. Just come in to kill boss and collect your monies.
    Stop making these threads and asking for a nerf / buff when you don't know the basics.

    Let the devs take care of em

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    I see a lot of people with bad takes so I'll give my thoughts here. I don't have all the expensive proc gear, I just play all three classes and grinded them to 81 so your ordinary player's opinion for what it's worth

    1) The experience of leveling is different than endgame by a whole lot, with not so good gear mages need to get carried through Misty Grotto, and simply do less damage than rouges. Aquarius changes Mages to be v strong. For warriors, with okay gear you do similar enough damage to an early mage... with WAY MORE damn survivability making the class feel way better. Rouges do the most damage but are squishy, I like where they are now, though they feel like superior mages until endgame

    2) Class identify for Warrior without looking at the raw numbers, my impressions and improvements:
    Warriors Juggernaut charged skill feels great to pull off, you "stand and deliver" massive sweeping cleaves and whirlwinds while being an absolute unit, it feels great.

    The other skills are rather lackluster, for example the Axe throw pull is a good spell utility wise but not feel wise, you chuck something at an enemy and it dies from afar in grinding lvl areas, or it's just a single targeted meh damage ability. I would prefer this ability to fire two projectiles, pull, and debuff, while doing less damage, think "get over here" as a utility spell. Rallying Cry and Vengeful blood both feel like duplicates of Juggernaut while going against warriors feel, warriors should be tanking and debuffing, not third rate healing and recovering mana and health. Buffing should be part of the mages core identity, and maybe one skill in rouge's kit. Having AoE taunts and debuffs replacement effects, ie taunts that *feel* like you're GRABBING enemy attention instead of the changing tracking effect we have now // and making other classes like mages low damage high AoE spells shine, or supporting rouges high single target on bosses further, where warriors shouldnt be oneshotting but being a team player, making other teammates feel good and saving their butts from the high dmg bosses

    3) Class identify for Mages without looking at the raw numbers, my impressions and improvements:

    Fireball is in a good place thematically and effectivity wise, Whirlwind felt like a movement only spell to me for the longest time until I tried the point blank upgrade without the dash. As an AoE spell I like point blank but it is ALSO very viable to not upgrade either point blank OR the dash for a frontal AoE cone stun. It feels bad to be slow, it feels bad to blast away warriors pulls, it feels bad to pinch points on your meh skill to put into generic flavorless passives (more on that later). Lighting is just plainly a bad spell, it takes rouges high damage and crit role, slaps a low cooldowns on it, and tells you to sink ten levels of points for "BIG number more good" hurr durr. Terrible/10. Ice Bolt, if you're not pulling mobs 2+ at a time, usually when you're grinding a place solo and failing the damage check, you NEED the single target freeze to spam your low damage AoE spells on a boss level health trash mob, it's role shouldn't exist. The flip side of this is similar to why I dislike lighting, dealing high single target with a low cooldown makes what I call a spam mage, where you run fireballs with 3s cooldowns, lighting w/ 3s, and Ice w/ 3s and a skill of choice. This built has significantly more damage than other specs while ruining class identity. Lightning should be plain deleted, mana for damage conversion spells feel gross, while Ice Bolt should be a small wave, say frost breath, similar to the frontal attack un-upgraded Gale Force. Gale Force is tricky, its like a redundant Fireball and I don't have any solid improvements for it.

    Whew okay, sheilds and heals

    Sheilds first: it should be a warrior's job to keep aggro (not that it means much in the high DPS meta rn). That said Mage's sheilds would be a fantastic way to give allies a buff that mattered, perhaps not as strong as the individual shield of course, but people run pets for shields all the time and this would make mages feel better to play and useful when their damage output isn't the highest. Heals aren't worth discussing with pots sadly, put pots to auto and nobody cares.

    In general a new buff is needed exclusive to the mage class, one idea Ive had is stun/slow resist instead of the philosophy of every class gets an ability to remove it. "Free Spirited" or the like, paired with a movement buff instead of as a Mage having to spam Gale Forces to stay up with your party, as well as improving class utility as support.
    Please for the love of God rework Curse into a viable buff for your party!
    Time Shift is alright, no need to fix what isn't broken, though I must say running in to drop a Clock as a Mage feels bad because you're taking Warrior's work and nessisitating to throw that out the window to use your spell

    4) Class identify for Rouge without looking at the raw numbers, my impressions and improvements:

    Shadow Piercer and Razor shield are cool.
    SSS is mage's job, if this had a reduce hit chance by a % debuff instead of just damage and impact upgrades it would feel better, maybe a concussion swirl animation above heads
    Aimed Shot... okay where do I begin? Increased crit chance makes me like this spell as I am a big fan of skills that aren't simply trade mana for damage, however that said this is what this spell is. Given that this is rouge this is actually fine in my books.. if noxious bolt wasn't the same exact spell. If noxious bolt was reworked into a DoT "bleed" spell that reapplied on basic attacks (reopen wounds) up to a maximum duration, this would be a far better feeling effect for feel reasons as above and making basic attacks more useful.

    Shadow Veil could easily be reworked into one of the coolest skills, given that rouges are squishy, having an invincibility to aggro buff for 2-3 seconds with a critical buff would be stellar, debuffs should be warriors forte, group buffs sorcerer, and a self buff to not get killed and more damage is on theme for rouge

    Entangling Trap has such a cool placement animation holy sh*t! Great work
    From my playtesting of the skill the main use of it was to hope it proc'd the AoE mob pull and spam it, while running back and forth to hope it gets walked over. I like the skill it takes to have it trigger and area control, that's dope, but could be a hair larger area to pop and larger chance.

    My MAIN theory-crafted idea for rouge is Wounds/ or bleed for simplicity. I would like to see wounds be rouges main gimmick, not exchanging mana for damage. Imagine a class based proc that would reapply based on skills, say the dagger leap between enemies or basic attacks under the reworked the Shadow Veil (now giving 2-3 seconds of invis crit %+) have a chance to proc bleed, razor shield keeps the Wound debuff timer frozen while in effect (since this proc chance should be hard to proc and maintaining means damage), with Noxious bolt (now bleed bolt or whatnot) would reset to the maximum cooldown. This would make rouges have high single target dps while requiring an active playstyle, like a mini game that isn't press Aimed Shot Nox Bolt and wait until you can trade mana for damage again.


    PASSIVES

    Having the same ones for each class is boring, they have the potential to be so much more, for example the long idea of the Wounds on rouges, instead of being small improvements to stats or gold luck for crying out loud, masteries and passives could be builts for classes. For example, a thorn proc for mage that makes the reworked party Shield buff into a thorn sheild, reflecting back a portion of damage. Or say "Menacing Aura" for Warriors, basic attacks while in Juggernaut have a chance to taunt! So many damn cool opportunities instead of more movement speed and 3% crit! Masteries should remain small improvements to your favorite skills like cooldown or mana cost, though some Masteries are definitely better than others honestly


    For your average Joe who doesn't have millions or rich friends, making each class have a purpose/feel good to play/and effective TOGETHER would be much more an incentive to play in parties than class teams buffs. Having a unique build for your Toon would be the best thing that happened to this game, gear wouldn't need to have crazy procs to be relevant, but better stat procs as icing on the cake your character is, not the other way around. Your gear makes you, not your thought into how you spec'd your class. To recap my ideas are: Warrior's the one who helps keep everyone alive (with say aggro that changes to the highest dps so constant retaunts being useful) and debuffs, mages with buffs like sheilds etc and heals for a true support class feel (I don't even like pots period, feels bad to use like you're paying gold to play without a friend), and rouges with high dmg output and their wound DoT skills or otherwise, maybe a critical strike build. The conversation about class balance stems from the fact you don't have much incentive to play as a team if you have big number dmg, and some classes doing less damage than others (AS THEY SHOULD DAMMIT). If the classes worked together that raised the damage and effectiveness of the party as a whole there wouldn't be the bad feeling of "why am I playing this class if it sucks and is useless". Hence all the whining about this and that OP OP OP nerf nerf nerf. Balancing should come from class design first, items second. Love the game, any response if this is useful, considered, or unusable and why would be greatly appreciated Cinco This took a while to type haha

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    Quote Originally Posted by AgentStonoga View Post
    Buff warrior in pvp
    Quote Originally Posted by Theroumag View Post
    I see a lot of people with bad takes so I'll give my thoughts here. I don't have all the expensive proc gear, I just play all three classes and grinded them to 81 so your ordinary player's opinion for what it's worth

    1) The experience of leveling is different than endgame by a whole lot, with not so good gear mages need to get carried through Misty Grotto, and simply do less damage than rouges. Aquarius changes Mages to be v strong. For warriors, with okay gear you do similar enough damage to an early mage... with WAY MORE damn survivability making the class feel way better. Rouges do the most damage but are squishy, I like where they are now, though they feel like superior mages until endgame

    2) Class identify for Warrior without looking at the raw numbers, my impressions and improvements:
    Warriors Juggernaut charged skill feels great to pull off, you "stand and deliver" massive sweeping cleaves and whirlwinds while being an absolute unit, it feels great.

    The other skills are rather lackluster, for example the Axe throw pull is a good spell utility wise but not feel wise, you chuck something at an enemy and it dies from afar in grinding lvl areas, or it's just a single targeted meh damage ability. I would prefer this ability to fire two projectiles, pull, and debuff, while doing less damage, think "get over here" as a utility spell. Rallying Cry and Vengeful blood both feel like duplicates of Juggernaut while going against warriors feel, warriors should be tanking and debuffing, not third rate healing and recovering mana and health. Buffing should be part of the mages core identity, and maybe one skill in rouge's kit. Having AoE taunts and debuffs replacement effects, ie taunts that *feel* like you're GRABBING enemy attention instead of the changing tracking effect we have now // and making other classes like mages low damage high AoE spells shine, or supporting rouges high single target on bosses further, where warriors shouldnt be oneshotting but being a team player, making other teammates feel good and saving their butts from the high dmg bosses

    3) Class identify for Mages without looking at the raw numbers, my impressions and improvements:

    Fireball is in a good place thematically and effectivity wise, Whirlwind felt like a movement only spell to me for the longest time until I tried the point blank upgrade without the dash. As an AoE spell I like point blank but it is ALSO very viable to not upgrade either point blank OR the dash for a frontal AoE cone stun. It feels bad to be slow, it feels bad to blast away warriors pulls, it feels bad to pinch points on your meh skill to put into generic flavorless passives (more on that later). Lighting is just plainly a bad spell, it takes rouges high damage and crit role, slaps a low cooldowns on it, and tells you to sink ten levels of points for "BIG number more good" hurr durr. Terrible/10. Ice Bolt, if you're not pulling mobs 2+ at a time, usually when you're grinding a place solo and failing the damage check, you NEED the single target freeze to spam your low damage AoE spells on a boss level health trash mob, it's role shouldn't exist. The flip side of this is similar to why I dislike lighting, dealing high single target with a low cooldown makes what I call a spam mage, where you run fireballs with 3s cooldowns, lighting w/ 3s, and Ice w/ 3s and a skill of choice. This built has significantly more damage than other specs while ruining class identity. Lightning should be plain deleted, mana for damage conversion spells feel gross, while Ice Bolt should be a small wave, say frost breath, similar to the frontal attack un-upgraded Gale Force. Gale Force is tricky, its like a redundant Fireball and I don't have any solid improvements for it.

    Whew okay, sheilds and heals

    Sheilds first: it should be a warrior's job to keep aggro (not that it means much in the high DPS meta rn). That said Mage's sheilds would be a fantastic way to give allies a buff that mattered, perhaps not as strong as the individual shield of course, but people run pets for shields all the time and this would make mages feel better to play and useful when their damage output isn't the highest. Heals aren't worth discussing with pots sadly, put pots to auto and nobody cares.

    In general a new buff is needed exclusive to the mage class, one idea Ive had is stun/slow resist instead of the philosophy of every class gets an ability to remove it. "Free Spirited" or the like, paired with a movement buff instead of as a Mage having to spam Gale Forces to stay up with your party, as well as improving class utility as support.
    Please for the love of God rework Curse into a viable buff for your party!
    Time Shift is alright, no need to fix what isn't broken, though I must say running in to drop a Clock as a Mage feels bad because you're taking Warrior's work and nessisitating to throw that out the window to use your spell

    4) Class identify for Rouge without looking at the raw numbers, my impressions and improvements:

    Shadow Piercer and Razor shield are cool.
    SSS is mage's job, if this had a reduce hit chance by a % debuff instead of just damage and impact upgrades it would feel better, maybe a concussion swirl animation above heads
    Aimed Shot... okay where do I begin? Increased crit chance makes me like this spell as I am a big fan of skills that aren't simply trade mana for damage, however that said this is what this spell is. Given that this is rouge this is actually fine in my books.. if noxious bolt wasn't the same exact spell. If noxious bolt was reworked into a DoT "bleed" spell that reapplied on basic attacks (reopen wounds) up to a maximum duration, this would be a far better feeling effect for feel reasons as above and making basic attacks more useful.

    Shadow Veil could easily be reworked into one of the coolest skills, given that rouges are squishy, having an invincibility to aggro buff for 2-3 seconds with a critical buff would be stellar, debuffs should be warriors forte, group buffs sorcerer, and a self buff to not get killed and more damage is on theme for rouge

    Entangling Trap has such a cool placement animation holy sh*t! Great work
    From my playtesting of the skill the main use of it was to hope it proc'd the AoE mob pull and spam it, while running back and forth to hope it gets walked over. I like the skill it takes to have it trigger and area control, that's dope, but could be a hair larger area to pop and larger chance.

    My MAIN theory-crafted idea for rouge is Wounds/ or bleed for simplicity. I would like to see wounds be rouges main gimmick, not exchanging mana for damage. Imagine a class based proc that would reapply based on skills, say the dagger leap between enemies or basic attacks under the reworked the Shadow Veil (now giving 2-3 seconds of invis crit %+) have a chance to proc bleed, razor shield keeps the Wound debuff timer frozen while in effect (since this proc chance should be hard to proc and maintaining means damage), with Noxious bolt (now bleed bolt or whatnot) would reset to the maximum cooldown. This would make rouges have high single target dps while requiring an active playstyle, like a mini game that isn't press Aimed Shot Nox Bolt and wait until you can trade mana for damage again.


    PASSIVES

    Having the same ones for each class is boring, they have the potential to be so much more, for example the long idea of the Wounds on rouges, instead of being small improvements to stats or gold luck for crying out loud, masteries and passives could be builts for classes. For example, a thorn proc for mage that makes the reworked party Shield buff into a thorn sheild, reflecting back a portion of damage. Or say "Menacing Aura" for Warriors, basic attacks while in Juggernaut have a chance to taunt! So many damn cool opportunities instead of more movement speed and 3% crit! Masteries should remain small improvements to your favorite skills like cooldown or mana cost, though some Masteries are definitely better than others honestly


    For your average Joe who doesn't have millions or rich friends, making each class have a purpose/feel good to play/and effective TOGETHER would be much more an incentive to play in parties than class teams buffs. Having a unique build for your Toon would be the best thing that happened to this game, gear wouldn't need to have crazy procs to be relevant, but better stat procs as icing on the cake your character is, not the other way around. Your gear makes you, not your thought into how you spec'd your class. To recap my ideas are: Warrior's the one who helps keep everyone alive (with say aggro that changes to the highest dps so constant retaunts being useful) and debuffs, mages with buffs like sheilds etc and heals for a true support class feel (I don't even like pots period, feels bad to use like you're paying gold to play without a friend), and rouges with high dmg output and their wound DoT skills or otherwise, maybe a critical strike build. The conversation about class balance stems from the fact you don't have much incentive to play as a team if you have big number dmg, and some classes doing less damage than others (AS THEY SHOULD DAMMIT). If the classes worked together that raised the damage and effectiveness of the party as a whole there wouldn't be the bad feeling of "why am I playing this class if it sucks and is useless". Hence all the whining about this and that OP OP OP nerf nerf nerf. Balancing should come from class design first, items second. Love the game, any response if this is useful, considered, or unusable and why would be greatly appreciated Cinco This took a while to type haha
    I don't think you understand warrior skills bruv...

    Axe throw "meh damage"!??? It's the highest dealing skill a warrior has and one you can't miss in any loadout.

    Venge and rally cry jugg duplicates??? Vengeful cry is way different as makes you a damage dealing monster instead of a tanking boi, and rally cry is a war tank skill based on armor, not health and rally cry is a skill for team based play while jugg works on yourself.

    Learn the class before discussing it's balance thanks

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