Last edited by Physiologic; 01-17-2011 at 04:52 PM.
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DL: Stats and Skills Explained
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IGN: E͡ℭ͟ӈҿͥ͜lͣoͫղg level 56 Mega Mage/Sewer mage ~ EchelongX lvl 55 Dex Bird
Looking at your numbers I would guess that speed (or dps) doesn't necessarily affect the skill damage as much as the base damage of the equipped weapon, both high and low damage, does. Otherwise, there would be a much bigger increase when Sunblessed Bow is equipped in comparison to SentGun, but instead they're almost identical.
That's the one thing that sticks out right away.
I'll try to help look at the numbers a little bit more.
Thanks for your table
I'm really stumped at how weapon speed and damage affect skill damage, because the increase in damage is so different on all weapons. I'll probably play around with these numbers more later after dinner. Not sure if anyone's figured them out yet; too lazy to dig up old posts.
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Best bet is probably to try to figure it out based on void/cyber/sentgun since they all have the same speed. At least that'll take out speed from the equation (for the time being).
What's messing with me is how Sunblessed Bow can give Blast a high of 293 while SentGun gives Blast a high of 294. Perhaps here's a case where speed plays a part? It almost looks like there's some kind of cap to how much a skill can be increased, in terms of damage, regardless of future possible weapons? Ugh. I hope not.
Maybe the extra Dex and Crit from SentGun plays a role?
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Props for.... Having this much time on your hands ^.^
awesome... if you do in fact make a list of campaign armor values, it would need to be its own thread. very important facts there everyone wants to know.
though you summed up the armor values of the campaign into a single value... i cant remember the mob types there, but is it only mummies or something? going to plasma pyramid it is clear to see that the three different colored djin mobs have different armor values, even more pronounced in shadow caves.
404 - not found ...maybe one day...
Wow! Nice work!!! One rarely gets to see something this thorough and comprehensive. Thank you for all the testing, this is amazing!
Kalielle - level 56 mage | Kaley - level 55 roundup bear | Clusterstorm - level 55 rush paladin
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One thing I'd be curious to know is whether the conclusion in the last part of the analysis, about dps vs damage, changes once you factor in reduction in damage from armor. In theory a higher damage weapon is better than a lower damage one of equal dps against mobs with high armor. That's because the armor reduction is applied for every hit, so for the higher speed weapon the reduction is applied more times than for the lower speed one (since there are more hits). So my guess is that against mobs with high armor like in AO3, at some point a gun/bow may be better than a talon even against bosses.
Kalielle - level 56 mage | Kaley - level 55 roundup bear | Clusterstorm - level 55 rush paladin
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Have not gotten a chance to read through all the comments yet, but wanted to point a couple things out:
1) Dodge / Hit.
I posed this question to Cinco in the chat and the answer was that there is a roll for hit/miss and a separate roll for for dodge, but hit dodge can effect the first roll and hit percentage can effect the second. As to the full effect, he was not giving that information up, as the actual equations are 'proprietary'.
Also, Enemies DO debuff.
2) DPS / Damage
That section completely ignores the armor part, and what you want to take into account is effective dps.
Consider two weapons:
First has 50 damage and a speed of .5
Second has 85 damage and a speed of 1
So, basic dps is 100 on first, 85 on second.
But now consider an enemy with 30 Armor:
First is now (50 - 30) * 2 = 20
Second is 85 - 30 = 55
So the effective dps of the first is 20 and the second is 55.
This does not even take into account the effect of damage on skills, but that gets extremely complicated because of the two hand skill add nerf.
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It appears the dodge roll as Cinco stated is some set value unaffected by any other user factor, as it is nearly consistent in all three weapon sets in a huge sample size (n=500, n=500, n=500). The miss roll however is extremely variable in at instances where hit% is above 100, but does not correlate with hit% itself. Perhaps I haven't had a larger sample size to detect a change yet. And my work is to figure out such proprietary equations
Edit: Unless you meant he said DODGE in our stat window means it's a factor that influences enemy dodge, not our dodge? o.o
And the damage/DPS with enemy armor I will edit. I did not consider that a factor as I was editing the guide (see my previous comment on this thread) but thank you for providing more proof that armor does change things around!
Last edited by Physiologic; 01-18-2011 at 12:39 PM.
DL: Stats and Skills Explained
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Have noti. Read the entire post to see if this idea was made... but. What if it uses a system similar to dungeons and dragons. I.e. a dice roll of some sort. In d&d a 20 is always a hit. And a 1. Is a miss. Maybe there is a similar system?
The reported hit% was too consistent beyond a fixed 50/50 rate, so unless it was a dice that favors one side over the other sides...
In addition, I firmly believe that if you do indeed have a lower hit%, let's say around 50% (as opposed to 135% that I had), the number of either MISS or DODGE will be larger.
Last edited by Physiologic; 01-29-2011 at 11:09 PM.
DL: Stats and Skills Explained
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Wow! Amazing work... takes me back to research methods and stats classes in college.
-Addicted
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For maximum effective damage, it seems the ideal would be a long range, slow firing weapon, but with very high damage per hit. Furthermore, a significant critical hit percentage is more important than hit %.
Hypothetical question - what if crit were say, 125% - would each shot land a critical?
DL: Stats and Skills Explained
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PL: *NEW* Nuri's Hallows Archer Equips | PL Drop Rates | Post-GCD Sewer Vids | Farming Balefort Sewers | Archer Videos | PL Attributes | Enemy/Boss/NPC Compendium | Archer Guide | Lv 55 Archer Equips | Crafting Lv 55 Pinks | Ring List | Advanced Mechanics
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