Very Disappointed

[Anarchist]

Depending on how things go with the Ring, we may make other Arcane or Mythic rarity items craftable. The key word is "may". Only the ring is currently implemented to involve crafting.

The misty veil of the future hides what may be...

*Looks in his logic crystal ball*

If you do it for 1 and it works out ( why shouldn't it even work out? i mean if the devs make everything in order for it to work out and that is what they will do considering pros and cons it will work out for sure) then this system is probably going to be added to the other mythic/arcane rarity items for sure.

[chitgoks]

lol the goal for a business is to reap profits. so greed will always be there

[Kakashis]

Depending on how things go with the Ring, we may make other Arcane or Mythic rarity items craftable. The key word is "may". Only the ring is currently implemented to involve crafting.

The misty veil of the future hides what may be...

Then it's in everyone's best interest to not craft out a ring yet!

[GoodSyntax]

Hey Strat, it's been a while since we used to run together (about two seasons now), but if you ever need help farming any elite map, give me a shout and a party invite and I'll be happy to help you!

<3 Kalizzaa

[GoodSyntax]

And, as far as the scaled dungeon goes, I really like the idea, provided that the reward for the time and pot investment is suitable.

Frankly, I really should not be able to solo every elite map, let alone multiple times without too much drama. I've been able to run elite Inan solo consistently at 8 mins or so with a single plat revive, or around 12 minutes without a revivie. I have been asking for elite maps to be, for lack of a better word, more elite for a while now. With the supreme challenge should come supreme loot at a far better drop rate. On any given day, I will run anywhere from 30-50 elite maps, and most days, the best I have to show for it may be an EGP or two, which considering I'm blowing through about 3-4k pots per day, means I am lucky to break even most of the time.

I would really love to see a Master level setting for maps, where even the best parties may only be able to complete it at a 30% success rate. With the odds stacked so far against you, the drops should bevoutstanding - something with an average value of 300-500k, and the possibility of a Mythic or Arcane drop (perhaps at 5% and 1% respectively). I don't want to loot a Locked Crate on this map either. I want elite drops with a 100% drop rate because if the map is so challenging that the best parties will fail 7 times out of 10, then we should be rewarded when we succeed. I would also like these maps to disallow elixirs, since that adds to the challenge.

I had extremely high hopes that Undim Fields was going to be that map, and it still has potential, but the way it currently stands, it's not quite there. I'm picturing something where mob aggro range is doubled or tripled, mob density is roughly double and we could sprinkle in two or three random "normal" elite bosses that spawn either before the "Master" spawns, or during the fight with the "Master." Not for nothing, I would also like to see a "Master" that is tough to deal with. Strong like Truell, but faster and far more aggressive. There is something about grinding 10 minutes through a long run to the boss and then having a minute and a half fight that is a bit anti-climatic.

Furthermore, I would like the "Master" levels to be locked so that you can only access them once you have completed all Elite maps.

I think that this would provide a suitable avenue for the pro free players out there to be truly challenged, and provide a solid source of income so they can actually afford arcane gear and pets. As much as I would love to own a set of Razors, or Samael/Singe, 30-40 million seems so far out of reach for me, and I've had absolutely no luck popping crates. Give us a means to attain the best without buying our way into it, just getting lucky or spending most of our game time merching. This game is desperately missing incentive and reward for being skilled, and tactical and I think that this would be a means to that end.

[Limsi]

Spacetime Studios,

Give us a hard dungeon wherein not even a full arcane/mythic party can complete without a good strategy. What we wanna see would be a mix of players (legendary+mythic+arcane) who can finally come together as one with a unique strategy. Please give us a dungeon where it takes more than spamming pots to survive a wave. Remember when it took 30 mins to finish Bael back in season 1? Something along those lines would be appreciated.

As for the drops, please make the best drops available through bosses. I am selfish I know but it seems to me that those who farm hard never even get what they long for. Make the legendaries be better than the crate gear (pink) The Arcane Shard is a start and I must say i am indeed pleased with the decision!

[Roberto077]

I suggest people look up the laws of The Shadow Lairs in a game called Spiral Knights. They are a series of maps that grant you access (for each map beaten) to a place called Sanctuary where you can craft/get the best sets in the game. There is no luck involved in this, only skill.

[Limsi]

I suggest people look up the laws of The Shadow Lairs in a game called Spiral Knights. They are a series of maps that grant you access (for each map beaten) to a place called Sanctuary where you can craft/get the best sets in the game. There is no luck involved in this, only skill.

Omg definitely! + 10. Ran out of thanks sigh

[Roberto077]

Omg definitely! + 10. Ran out of thanks sigh

I still can't get over how little the game is based on luck. It's all running dungeons for money and then crafting increasingly power items to fight stronger enemies.

For those of you not familiar with what I'm talking about, this is the passage between the Shadow Lair and Sanctuary: http://youtu.be/7IZ1q4Gb2Vc

I was using crappy gear because I could. My teammates were using what is considered to be the best gear in the game.

[Anarchist]

And, as far as the scaled dungeon goes, I really like the idea, provided that the reward for the time and pot investment is suitable.

Frankly, I really should not be able to solo every elite map, let alone multiple times without too much drama. I've been able to run elite Inan solo consistently at 8 mins or so with a single plat revive, or around 12 minutes without a revivie. I have been asking for elite maps to be, for lack of a better word, more elite for a while now. With the supreme challenge should come supreme loot at a far better drop rate. On any given day, I will run anywhere from 30-50 elite maps, and most days, the best I have to show for it may be an EGP or two, which considering I'm blowing through about 3-4k pots per day, means I am lucky to break even most of the time.

I would really love to see a Master level setting for maps, where even the best parties may only be able to complete it at a 30% success rate. With the odds stacked so far against you, the drops should bevoutstanding - something with an average value of 300-500k, and the possibility of a Mythic or Arcane drop (perhaps at 5% and 1% respectively). I don't want to loot a Locked Crate on this map either. I want elite drops with a 100% drop rate because if the map is so challenging that the best parties will fail 7 times out of 10, then we should be rewarded when we succeed. I would also like these maps to disallow elixirs, since that adds to the challenge.

I had extremely high hopes that Undim Fields was going to be that map, and it still has potential, but the way it currently stands, it's not quite there. I'm picturing something where mob aggro range is doubled or tripled, mob density is roughly double and we could sprinkle in two or three random "normal" elite bosses that spawn either before the "Master" spawns, or during the fight with the "Master." Not for nothing, I would also like to see a "Master" that is tough to deal with. Strong like Truell, but faster and far more aggressive. There is something about grinding 10 minutes through a long run to the boss and then having a minute and a half fight that is a bit anti-climatic.

Furthermore, I would like the "Master" levels to be locked so that you can only access them once you have completed all Elite maps.

I think that this would provide a suitable avenue for the pro free players out there to be truly challenged, and provide a solid source of income so they can actually afford arcane gear and pets. As much as I would love to own a set of Razors, or Samael/Singe, 30-40 million seems so far out of reach for me, and I've had absolutely no luck popping crates. Give us a means to attain the best without buying our way into it, just getting lucky or spending most of our game time merching. This game is desperately missing incentive and reward for being skilled, and tactical and I think that this would be a means to that end.

Eh... from a mythic player point of view "hard extremely difficult maps even for mythics and arcanes but not that impossible cause if no one can complete it what is it usefulness?" seems to be exciting....

But from a legendary player point of view you are describing me Hell fire.


The current system aren't that bad actually now that i think about it, all we need is fresh goods to reactivate the market.. and they are coming mid march.

[falmear]

In the Dragon Enclave expansion, we are working toward a token system for the Crafting component of the Arcane Ring. Bosses will have a rare chance to drop Teeth currency that you'll need to get the recipe for the Arcane Ring. You'll still need to get your hands on an Arcane Shard that drops from a Locked Crate, but that shard can be used toward whatever Arcane item you want to craft. More at http://www.spacetimestudios.com/show...Mount-Rockhorn!

While this sounds good in theory, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Because how arcane items have been created. Whoever makes an Arcane Shard will craft the most expensive arcane item then sell it. But use the proceeds to buy the arcane then want and pocket the proceeds. No different then if they could only craft an arcane ring. If we had multiple arcane items of the same level then this would make more sense but we don't. What we have is a situation where we have one arcane item for lvl 26,31,36,41. Whats the point of crafting a level 26 arcane item? You can craft a level 41 item, sell for lets say 50 million. And buy 4 or 5 hooks. So I don't really see the benefit. Seems like a nice to have but in no way will help anyone now or in the future.

[Fyrce]

I like the Token systems. I hope arcane shards will also come from Elite Golden <whatever the new chests are called> and not just the Locked Crates.

In addition, I would still love if the Elite Maps were not just end game but graduated end game: So the maps up to Dead City can be run by L16+. Kraken by L21+. And so on, since they might be easy for an L36, but not so for the elite levels for which they were intended.

[Haligali]

I like the Token systems. I hope arcane shards will also come from Elite Golden <whatever the new chests are called> and not just the Locked Crates.

In addition, I would still love if the Elite Maps were not just end game but graduated end game: So the maps up to Dead City can be run by L16+. Kraken by L21+. And so on, since they might be easy for an L36, but not so for the elite levels for which they were intended.

An elite rooks would be hard for a lvl16, because brackenridge and ydra scaled to lvl25.

But the idea is not bad, lvl25 could enter elite brackenridge&ydra, lvl30 could enter elite dead city&kraken.

[Foebegone]

While this sounds good in theory, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Because how arcane items have been created. Whoever makes an Arcane Shard will craft the most expensive arcane item then sell it. But use the proceeds to buy the arcane then want and pocket the proceeds. No different then if they could only craft an arcane ring. If we had multiple arcane items of the same level then this would make more sense but we don't. What we have is a situation where we have one arcane item for lvl 26,31,36,41. Whats the point of crafting a level 26 arcane item? You can craft a level 41 item, sell for lets say 50 million. And buy 4 or 5 hooks. So I don't really see the benefit. Seems like a nice to have but in no way will help anyone now or in the future.

And that would be awesome right you just looted ARCANE!!! and its not HOOKS!!! yay ;p the market would adjust if ppl were never making hooks or the other items not saying for the better, everyone would make rings, then there would be a shortage of the others meaning prices fall slower. Personally I would like to see things costing a number of shards, say 10 then recipes can be reduced by season say by 2 shards down to a cost of 6. Even the possibility to disenchant to get half the shards back would be nice. This would lead to a more true token system as progression will be toward the shard cost and not be measured on how close you are to the recipe and a single luck drop.

On topic:

Farming elites in shayul is still profitable and with mythic set under 3 mil now quite achievable with no real money. the chests still go for a good price and you get the occasional Arc stuff which has a decent market value still.

[Roberto077]

Of course you're going to require locked crates... Please make them drop from elite bosses with the same if not greater looting rate.

[GoodSyntax]

Eh... from a mythic player point of view "hard extremely difficult maps even for mythics and arcanes but not that impossible cause if no one can complete it what is it usefulness?" seems to be exciting....

But from a legendary player point of view you are describing me Hell fire.


The current system aren't that bad actually now that i think about it, all we need is fresh goods to reactivate the market.. and they are coming mid march.

I disagree because a considerable percentage of the population in my guild are dying for something way more challenging than running Elite Undim and getting lucky with two Kroms.

I soloed all elite maps in full Legendary gear (albeit Elite Legendary items), so what I'm asking for isn't really that absurd.

And yes, Hell Fire would be appropriate here because it isn't all that elite if the majority of the capped population has every elite AP. I don't think it's unreasonable to want something more demanding on your skill and party strategy than what we currently have.

Truell is probably the most difficult, non luck based AP at this point because it takes skill and good teamwork to pull it off - and you can't cheat the system by having everyone run with Combo elixirs and spamming Samael AA.

[MoloToha]

Originally, AL was designed to be a pocket game in which instances take max 20-30 mins to complete, so, I think, you all shouldn't blame devs for easy elites. They see that there is a lot of hardcore players, so, I think, they will satisfy their wishes soon.

Talking about mythics, I have a good example which I heard from another guy at forum. In PL there is a Dragon armor. Some time ago it costed tens of millions. Then devs made it re-rollable, so it's price dropped under 2m. Of course, everybody wants to loot a mythic/arcane item, but if it all goes in that way, mythic will no longer be "mythic". Imagine that there is a hard map which takes 1h to complete, and boss has 1% chance of getting mythic item (just like most of players suggest). Then let's imagine that there are 1000 players who are strong enough to complete this map in 1h. During the day, they log in and make 2-3 runs (someone even more). It means that wheel of fate rolled 2000-3000 times. That is 20-30 mythics. 20-30 mythics per day means that they will become trash in a couple of weeks.

[GoodSyntax]

As opposed to the thousands of Locked Crates and Elite Goldens being opened every day?

The reason why the PL economy failed is because reroll mechanics always looted an item one level up in rarity (ie., Elite becomes Legendary) coupled with 100% reroll elixirs and Shamus/Thrasher elixirs. This meant that you cut down the run time by 50% and the worst possible loot you could get was an Epic rarity, and Legendaries would drop 30-50% of the time. AL does not have the same reroll mechanics and does not have such cheap listing fees to auction, so value degredation is not as much of a concern. Over in PL, junk items (and by junk, I literally mean junk Commons) sold for 7-10k and liquidated for 150g, so the valuation of the gold currency is not indicative to what we should expect here.

I would wager that AL does see 20-30 mythics created per day, and I personally know many players who have dozens of mythics (eggs, weapons, armor, etc.) in inventory and stash.

Finally, you assume that people would just farm this type of map to death. I didn't know that many farming parties for Elite Skull Cove when it was the baddest, most challenging map around. Actually, just putting together a Cove run was difficult, as was Rooks Nest when that was the worst of the worst (pre-nerf of course). Runs there took 40-60 minutes for a solid party, and most who completed it, did so once, never to return again. If an uber map is that challenging, it is nothing more than a gold/platinum sink (via pot expenditure and revives) for those that enjoy tough runs - I don't think that thousands of players will be lining up for a 60 minute long run that consumes thousands of pots for the <1% chance at a mythic; it would be easier and more cost effective to just pop crates.

[Limsi]

As opposed to the thousands of Locked Crates and Elite Goldens being opened every day?

The reason why the PL economy failed is because reroll mechanics always looted an item one level up in rarity (ie., Elite becomes Legendary) coupled with 100% reroll elixirs and Shamus/Thrasher elixirs. This meant that you cut down the run time by 50% and the worst possible loot you could get was an Epic rarity, and Legendaries would drop 30-50% of the time. AL does not have the same reroll mechanics and does not have such cheap listing fees to auction, so value degredation is not as much of a concern. Over in PL, junk items (and by junk, I literally mean junk Commons) sold for 7-10k and liquidated for 150g, so the valuation of the gold currency is not indicative to what we should expect here.

I would wager that AL does see 20-30 mythics created per day, and I personally know many players who have dozens of mythics (eggs, weapons, armor, etc.) in inventory and stash.

Finally, you assume that people would just farm this type of map to death. I didn't know that many farming parties for Elite Skull Cove when it was the baddest, most challenging map around. Actually, just putting together a Cove run was difficult, as was Rooks Nest when that was the worst of the worst (pre-nerf of course). Runs there took 40-60 minutes for a solid party, and most who completed it, did so once, never to return again. If an uber map is that challenging, it is nothing more than a gold/platinum sink (via pot expenditure and revives) for those that enjoy tough runs - I don't think that thousands of players will be lining up for a 60 minute long run that consumes thousands of pots for the <1% chance at a mythic; it would be easier and more cost effective to just pop crates.

Exactly my point. I don't recall a lot of parties even trying to kill Elite Bloodhammer/Bael (Pre-nerf) if it wasn't for A.P. Those who ran in hoping to loot the Kraken Skewer would find it very impossible to form a party just by waiting for PUGS. Remember when malison was worth 700-1m + way before the nerf was conducted? - Pure heaven for hardworking players as opposed to those who simply pop up crates.

While I understand the never dying "STG is a business which needs to run through fundings", there's no harm in even trying to reward those who would prefer the good ole' almost impossible farming. These are the types of dungeons which will separate those who play casually and would see the game as a past time killer and those who spend time to sit down and get all fired up with some hardcore farming. While we have the elite golden chests to provide non spenders with mythic and arcane items, it's still a different feeling of having to loot what we want directly after killing a boss.

Opening chests are no different from opening crates - both are considered as gambling.

[MoloToha]

As opposed to the thousands of Locked Crates and Elite Goldens being opened every day?

The reason why the PL economy failed is because reroll mechanics always looted an item one level up in rarity (ie., Elite becomes Legendary) coupled with 100% reroll elixirs and Shamus/Thrasher elixirs. This meant that you cut down the run time by 50% and the worst possible loot you could get was an Epic rarity, and Legendaries would drop 30-50% of the time. AL does not have the same reroll mechanics and does not have such cheap listing fees to auction, so value degredation is not as much of a concern. Over in PL, junk items (and by junk, I literally mean junk Commons) sold for 7-10k and liquidated for 150g, so the valuation of the gold currency is not indicative to what we should expect here.

I would wager that AL does see 20-30 mythics created per day, and I personally know many players who have dozens of mythics (eggs, weapons, armor, etc.) in inventory and stash.

Finally, you assume that people would just farm this type of map to death. I didn't know that many farming parties for Elite Skull Cove when it was the baddest, most challenging map around. Actually, just putting together a Cove run was difficult, as was Rooks Nest when that was the worst of the worst (pre-nerf of course). Runs there took 40-60 minutes for a solid party, and most who completed it, did so once, never to return again. If an uber map is that challenging, it is nothing more than a gold/platinum sink (via pot expenditure and revives) for those that enjoy tough runs - I don't think that thousands of players will be lining up for a 60 minute long run that consumes thousands of pots for the <1% chance at a mythic; it would be easier and more cost effective to just pop crates.

PL was just an example of how items drop in price once their drop rate is increased, there is no need to dive into re-roll mechanics of PL, etc. Skull Cove, huh? Who needs a junk armor with stats, equal to Sealord one and a staff which drops at 1/100500 rate? Bad example. People ran it just to show how badass they are (The same thing with Hall of Valheim). And who says that a hard map should drop only mythics at a miserable chance? There will be more various loot table, and there will be items, which can compensate pots and plat spent in battle. You reduce all to lockeds. All you say is just a typical locked spammer logic.