Rogue's rulez with 1,8k armor, 5k hp, 900dmg.. No point in endgame pvp... It's totally geared question.. :/Originally Posted by Zeus
Rogue's rulez with 1,8k armor, 5k hp, 900dmg.. No point in endgame pvp... It's totally geared question.. :/
Those stats are not possible in PvP and way over exaggerated.
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Then 600 dmg.. still deadly
Of course gear is important. But my point is, You can have less gear than an Arcane ring or Nekro/Sns user, and still have more than a 50/50 chance of winning. I take a person for example...
Recently got mythic daggers - an upgrade from my expedition recurve - I don't get 1 shot anymore, instead I 1 shoot (tested today) I've played since S2 and reached LB in S4, won 2 tournies so if I don't have skill I don't know who has. My so called skills weren't even used as I simply charged aimed. It's still 100% about the gear. I witnessed a mage with SnS and the pink gun completely destroy a mage with mythic gun and mythic gear.
However,
In team-fights or clashes it does aquire skill. It takes a large amount of skill to move around skillfully in clashes. To rush the rouges and mages (the back line), but not putting yourself in complete danger. Hiding behind the tanks and staying in range of the mage mana heals, the HoR range. You must utilize a good pet combination (SnS, SnS, SnS, Nekro, Nekro (Lol)). It takes good synchronization to coordinate the time to rush and the time to use razor effectivly. It DOES require skill. Maybe not as much as in the past, but definitely a great deal.
A random meet-up (1v1), with a random person, in a randomly joined game is purely based on the gear and luck. If a little rouge goes against a rouge with Nekro, Arcane Ring, Mythic Planar Pendant, 69 paragems & 10 Eyes. With daggers and full imbued set of potency. Well yes, you're going to lose because you're undergeared.
Last edited by Soundlesskill; 02-21-2015 at 12:17 PM.
One thing nobody is discussing is build. At end game I'm a somewhat undergeared sorcerer. I have no arcane ring and also lack the new mythic pendant. So while my damage is decent and I have a very high crit build, my health is down around 3700 while many sorcerers are running around with 5k health.
So what does that mean? It means that for me to win a fight, I have to be aggressive and attack fast. The longer the fight lasts, the more likely I am to lose. So when I choose my skills, I keep that in mind.
Because of my gear disadvantage, I cannot have a build where I am well rounded or else I will end up mediocre at everything. So instead I choose a build that gives me 1 or 2 really strong points, and then gives up ability in other areas. So for example, if I choose a build of Fire, Lightning, Clock and Shield and add in all the damage over time upgrades, I have a much easier time beating rogues and can often beat a fully geared arcane rogue 1-on-1. But against a curse mage, I'm toast. If I substitute Frost for Fire, then I do much better against warriors 1-on-1 as I can slow them down and kite them and inflict tons of damage. Against other sorcerers I'd be best using curse and no damage over time upgrades on the other skills.
Also, to make sure I can add all relevant passive points, I only spec 4 skills instead of 5 or 6 that most players do for flexibility. The result is a more specialized build, but a more powerful one.
I don't know how you were losing to legendary rogues lol. At your gear level you don't even have to charged aimed shot. Not to mention, you can tank 1 entire combo without dying. You shouldn't even need need your packs. While going 1 vs 1 with other rogues I personally don't even bother dropping packs. Instead I rely on rogues ridiculous damage output to just 1 hit.
Very true. I just recently changed my build from 30 points in str and 10 points in int to a pure Dex build simply so I have a shot at dropping maxed out rogues with a single combo. As of now, getting any more para and eyes is not a priority for me. Instead, I am trying to get an imbued will armor, which will then give me the tanking abilities of an arcane ring rogue.
Last edited by Kingofninjas; 02-10-2015 at 04:51 PM. Reason: spelling error
Perhaps it is so with mages. For any rouge aimed strike and shadow piercer is cruial. You can't simply choose and all-crit-build because you will be 1 shot from rouges who can easily survive your low-compared-to-their crit. You don't get to pierce before they crit you 5k KO.
Anyways, done with this thread and PvP. Back to farming!
Another thing to note... Lesser geared players can do really well in CTF. Learning to use walls there can even out the playing field some whereas TDM is more straight forward. You can use trees and Trull but I don't see it happen near as much as in CTF.
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Gear is still the largest factor.
Then skill (involves using your environment) and of course, like an annoyingl lot of things in this game, luck. Just an OK level of skill is required to wipe anything if you have arcane ring or Nekro (which means you probably have the rest of your gear maxed and well-gemmed, so overall even more of an edge).
Twinking used to be better before paragems and before people started opening OP arcanes like Singe, SnS, Maridos and Nekro there. Now it's not much better than endgame (but at least it's much cheaper).
This was exactly what I was gonna say.
Twink was better place to play pvp with regular gears. But now pets and para gem changed all. (But I think it's still better than end game.)
Honestly, at end game if you are not well geared(even full Full Mythic is not well geared now.), you can't even survive from one combo of rogue.
In both place, skill let you survive longer, but still gears and pets are more important, especially nekro now.
Aegis
If a rogue has nekro, I don't think they need even an ounce of skill to wreck most teams. I once was against an arcane ring imbued vest, possibly helm nekro rogue who was literally standing in 1 spot spamming arrows with the occasional pierce like it was an elite map. I did not even see aimed being charged. Yet, my team got completely wrecked simply because I did not have the damage to break nekro shield. What end game PvP needs is a mythic ring to bridge the gap between the current mythic ring and arcane ring.
Gear is major but still i find skill very important.
I was in a 1v1 ctf room with me and another mage. This mage had from what i could tell wild talisman (saw it proc) mythic armor/helm, blood ruby, frost gun, and slag. Compared to my gear of expe gun, mythic armor/helm, silver hoop of brut(epic), and eerie necro or brut and slag.
The difference in gear is a pretty big gap is pretty big as you can see. However in the 16 encounters that we face,. I won 7 of them. Reason was this guy had little skill when environment came into play and often i would gale stun him and kill him while he didn't have a shield up or bait him into using his shield and then running away counting the seconds until the shield would be broken, or just stunlock him out of the blue. He was me before i observed some rogues fighting and using the notches on the side, using packs properly etc. and by watching these rogues fight i learned a lot about the environment.
However he still beat me more than i beat him so i would say gear was a critical play here.
Caabatric. The one nub sorcerer you wont forget.
I really loled at this post having one aimedZeus is right, I done twinking and currently end game pvp, Twink is gear based, not that much skill needed. End game is all skill, Its all about skill in end game, gear doesnt need to be tip top to be good
Also end game is something me and many would recommend to try.
shot is called skills and using repeated curse fire light =no skill lolz?
siddhantsingh<turbo>(lvl41mage)
lukepvp(retired)(lvl25tank)
sidpvp<nvm>(lvl15mage)
gear>skills these days in clashes skills may play an important role the views based here are being said by most players who own paras go ask players who dont own para and u will get better opinion
siddhantsingh<turbo>(lvl41mage)
lukepvp(retired)(lvl25tank)
sidpvp<nvm>(lvl15mage)
Thanks for sharingPerhaps it is so with mages. For any rouge aimed strike and shadow piercer is cruial. You can't simply choose and all-crit-build because you will be 1 shot from rouges who can easily survive your low-compared-to-their crit. You don't get to pierce before they crit you 5k KO.
Anyways, done with this thread and PvP
The problem is that if you get crit 5k there's not Mich that will save you, unless you have an extremely heavy strength build. In that case you will be very hard pressed to get a enough damage to kill. The fact is, that 5k crits are not as rare as one may think, so the only response that rogues who are not maxed out have is to hope that they can kill before they get 1 hit.Perhaps it is so with mages. For any rouge aimed strike and shadow piercer is cruial. You can't simply choose and all-crit-build because you will be 1 shot from rouges who can easily survive your low-compared-to-their crit. You don't get to pierce before they crit you 5k KO.
Anyways, done with this thread and PvP
What people forget is this is a 6 button game and while skill is not that hard to get for those willing to learn, gear is. There is so far your skill will take you. From my experience geared players will also be pretty skilled because who put in the effort to get high gear will also put in the effort to get some skills which isn't that hard.
In pvp there are many factors for winning, ravager mentioned gear, skill and luck but you have to also consider ping which is especially important in pvp and team synergy.
I am a tank and i can say gear is pretty important in ctf clashes where you have to be able to take huge amounts of damage while inflicting some damage upon your enemy too, having very high armor but no damage won't help you in hard clashes.
I find some teams hard to beat because they bring together all the above: gear, skill, good ping and good synergy, luck not so much when you have all the rest.
What i mean by synergy is: knowing your teammates very well, all their strngths and weaknesses, knowing what they will do and how, knowing how to react to their actions.
My opinion on twinking is this: In twinking you can get by with less of everything, less gear and skill. All twinks that i talked to say it is easier to twink than endgame, that fights are more laid back. In endgame one mistake can kill you.
If you are just starting out then don't get discouraged by what i said. You can have a good time in pvp. If you don't have the best gear and skill thwn don't be bold. Don't gang others for easy kills or trashtalk and people will notice and help you out rather than joining against you with the purpose of ganging you back. Of course you will have the long time gangers who gang no matter that but you can't do anything about those.
Nice post I'm a end game pve player. If I get a hold of a arcane ring or neckro through farming then I will take more time towards end game twinking.
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