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Just revert back to what it was before global Nerf thing happened.
Nerf rogue damage by 10% in PvP but give them back armor.
I am pretty sure rogues will cry more.
Rogues only need 25% damage reduction in razors but make it to not be stackable with Nekro shield and such, its just to survive without nekro since a rogue without nekro is just food for 3 mages, Rogues are going to replace nox with razors and 25% is nothing compared to 55% plus rogues are going to lose damage as well from losing nox so it should be fine no?
Nekro offers 40% damage reduction. I'm able to survive Mage rush with Nekro shield. As long as tank covers and sorcerer covers, I can easily survive the rush while Nekro shield is up. What I cannot survive though is as soon as Nekro shield drops and rogues have no protection. Even if tanks and sorcerers are covering with heals, I as a rogue, will not survive. Adding extra HP does not help with this - I've tried HP builds.
That's why I say damage reduction will help. It will help insure that a rogue does not get one combo'd as soon as Nekro drops. As I said, class balance shouldn't rely on a pet. Currently, rogue heavily relies on Nekro to do anything in PvP. Other classes can use pets like Korruption and SnS, but a rogue cannot use anything but Nekro.
50% DR for razor is an overdose, but 25% will be enough to help you survive. Now, are you going to be able to brush off the rush? No, it'll still hurt like hell. But, if you're smart and think quickly, that 25% DR will help you live through it, to the next heal and get the Nekro shield.
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I believe I heard nekro was 40% and it's not this way, mages rush once nekro shield is down, rogues need to sync this 25% with nekro to survive and it's not 100% guarantee chance to survive anyways lol.
Sorry ik this question was not to me but tried to help out giving info
Doesn't relying on a skill like razor shield in the first place backfire on the glass "cannon" concept?
2 of 4 skill slots are used up for non-"cannon" skills on a "glass cannon"
Where does the "cannon" come in play in this?
On another note, i'm still trying hard to understand how this "buff" increases rogue survivability exactly. Just curious.
well in random tdm's mage team pretty much flattens rogue team in my experience, when they are grouped and similar gear to you thats what i was trying to tell, on your case equal team with mix, yea you can survive
about the coverage you are right its painful to wait AA cooldown and only thing you can do is hide until you get the nekro shield up.
i agree it provides some coverage between AA's and its pretty usefull about not being food. Its just the damage loss concerned me, i never changed 4 pvp skills from 31 cap i personally cant foresee the effect of losing your one damage skill
well to see, we need to get the DR first hear us vroom:P
imo, any skill and upgrades should have additional/improved effect whenever we charge it. if the game is moving toward mindless tapping game, people will indirectly encouraged to use makro/auto-tapping/auto-clicker
i think you should add some improved effect to charged one, either in damage reduction, dot protection, or reduce the effectiveness of non-charged one, and keep the charged one as it is
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The idea is that you offer the rogue flexibility in deciding how much "glass" and how much "cannon" they want to be.
Why do you want all rogues to play the same way and be equally squishy?
With razor shield you drop one offensive skill (usually noxious bolt) for one defensive skill. Means you become less cannon and less glass. It's a theoretically decent trade-off. People give noxious bolt less credit than it deserves. I've killed a number of people with nox poison many times, and it's useful as a second ranged attack when you need to keep your distance. So here is a significant damage handicap taken by the rogue when she swaps to razor shield. Problem is that currently, apart from stun immunity, damage reduction is too little to make up for the loss in damage capability. So less cannon, but not much less glass.
I would like to give the suggestion by Zeus a try. Take away KDR during testing I don't think any rogue will mind. I don't know if other classes will be as accepting of this though.
Why do we fall? So that we can rise again.
Interesting discussion....
I cringe whenever an improvement to a certain skill is proposed and everyone posts "well nobody uses that skill anyway so it doesn't help...."
That itself is a sign that the discussed skill needs improvement. There should be a full variety of skill combinations that top players use. If most of the top players are all using the same build, then that indicates some balance issues among the various skills.
What annoys me about this particular discussion is that when given the opportunity to improve survivability at the expense of damage, rogues always complain that they don't like it. What Zeus is proposing sounds very reasonable. If you want better survivability, then you should have to be willing to substitute an offensive skill for a defensive skill. It appears the issue at hand here is that the rogue's defensive skill is inferior. If that is the case, then it needs to be improved to make it worthwhile to use.
As a Mage, I have 2 of my 4 skill slots using defensive/support skills (shield and heal). There is no reason a rogue cannot do that same thing. Even with only 2 offensive skills, a rogue is still going to cause much more damage than a sorcerer since the rogue's skill cool down is 2 seconds compared to 3-4 seconds for a Mage.
I agree, that a rogue will still do more damage than a sorcerer when comparing two skill builds. However, since the sorcerer heal is so powerful, it pretty much outheals the damage. That's why, I'm glad you agree with me, about the survivability buff. It's not too much. If you're still not careful, you will die as 25% is not a huge difference.
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